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post #1441 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 12:29 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Sensitive Lewis:


Reigning F1 world champion Lewis Hamilton has hit back at Charlie Whiting for singling him out over the course of the Australian grand prix weekend.
Following the world champion’s claim that drivers are not consulted on rule changes, F1 race director Whiting revealed that a key meeting was actually held at the Barcelona tests “but he (Hamilton) didn’t come”.
“It’s interesting that Charlie complained about me,” Hamilton is now quoted as responding, according to Kolner Express newspaper.
And quoted by Speed Week, Hamilton added: “It was true that I was not there (at the meeting) in Barcelona. I was at a meeting with the Mercedes engineers.”
“It is also very rare that anything is implemented as a result of our observations at such meetings,” he insisted.
“At most of the ones I’ve been to, Sebastian Vettel is the only one who talks. So why do I need to be there? I can read about what has happened later.
“I can only say it again that the decision-makers should consult us more,” Hamilton continued. “For example, we have only one clutch lever now, but did the starts become more difficult? No they did not.”
“For sure I’ve never been asked about the problem of following the car that is in front of you, which was a problem in Australia,” he added.
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post #1442 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 12:32 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Kind of amazing:

The engine, gearbox and monocoque aboard Fernando Alonso’s otherwise-mangled McLaren-Honda survived his famous crash in Melbourne last Sunday.
Marca, a Spanish sports daily, estimated the damage caused by the shattered carbon-fibre and other disposable components at EUR 300,000, after Alonso barrel-rolled through the gravel after a 300kph impact with Esteban Gutierrez.
But the report said the only real damage to the actual chassis was the mounting points of the suspension, meaning it could return to service later this season.
“The engine and gearbox were also spared,” added Marca, which is good news for Alonso amid the tight long-life restrictions on those components.
Max Mosley, the former FIA president, said the most important thing is that F1’s safety advances saved Alonso’s life.
“Those sort of serious racing accidents, you do expect the driver to walk away,” he told the Times. “That wouldn’t have been the case 20 years ago.
“It was quite an impressive crash,” added Mosley. “I am very much in favour of the halo. Eventually they will come up with a solution. It’s the sort of thing that ought to be done.”
Meanwhile, Italy’s Autosprint reports that the engine aboard Kimi Raikkonen’s flaming Ferrari last Sunday has apparently also survived, as it was reportedly a turbo overheating problem.
“If we had seen on the telemetry that it was a problem with the power unit,” confirmed team boss Maurizio Arrivabene, “we would have asked Kimi to immediately turn it off rather than have him return to the box.”
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post #1443 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 03:41 AM
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As predicted, the jackwads ruining.......I mean RUNNING the sport just can't stop themselves when it looks like there is the slightest chance that common sense might prevail.

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ec...ampaign=buffer

#JB17
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post #1444 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 03:46 AM
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Niki playing games?

“It was the most exciting grand prix that I have seen for three years at least,” declared Lauda. “I think it was the best grand prix of this era.”
Talk about being damned by your own words.
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post #1445 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 07:05 AM
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Niki playing games?


Niki Lauda has slammed claims which have emerged in the media suggesting that Mercedes is still sandbagging, one race into its 2016 Formula 1 championship campaign.
It was rumoured the dominant champions of 2014 and 2015 held fire on its full performance potential over the winter, and Red Bull’s Helmut Marko charged even after Melbourne that Mercedes could actually have “lapped the field”.
The suspicion is that, amid the political goings-on, a close battle between Mercedes and Ferrari will calm suggestions the current ‘power unit’ era has been an abject failure.
But when asked if Mercedes was really worried about being beaten by Ferrari in Australia, F1 legend and team chairman Lauda insisted: “I was very worried.”
“We almost lost to them, did you not see it?” he is quoted by La Repubblica, whose reporter agreed that the gap between the two top teams in Melbourne appeared to be small.
“Ferrari threatened to win the race, there is no ‘but’ about it,” Lauda charged.
As for claims Mercedes is exaggerating the closeness of the gap for the sake of the show, he answered: “Rubbish. The truth is that there was no gap at all between the two cars. It was only the red flag that saved our life otherwise they would have won.
“It was the most exciting grand prix that I have seen for three years at least,” declared Lauda. “I think it was the best grand prix of this era.”
I really really doubt that this is true, I mean the ability to lap the field. Yes they clearly sandbagged during winter testing. Hamilton's pole position was 2.5 seconds quicker than last season! That's an almost incredible jump year to year with no major change in formula (and yes the tire compound was softer, but they're also running higher pressure). Yet Ferrari was only off 8 tenths this year, compared to 1.4 last year. They're closer, not further away.

You think they convinced both Lewis and Nico to flub their starts and then push back through the field to win on purpose to make things appear better than they are?? Yeah frickin right.
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post #1446 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 07:08 AM
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This may be the best thing you read about F1 today:

https://joesaward.wordpress.com/2016...-when-to-stop/

Edit: His last line…calling for the owners to act….sounds great on paper, but the last time that was tried, one team accepted a massive recurring payoff to scuttle the breakaway. Why would anything different happen today?

Edit 2: In this case, he is perhaps not calling for a new breakaway, but I don't really know what else the teams could do.

#JB17

Last edited by BGLeduc; 03-24-2016 at 07:42 AM.
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post #1447 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 07:26 AM
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Originally Posted by oink View Post
Kind of amazing:

The engine, gearbox and monocoque aboard Fernando Alonso’s otherwise-mangled McLaren-Honda survived his famous crash in Melbourne last Sunday.
Marca, a Spanish sports daily, estimated the damage caused by the shattered carbon-fibre and other disposable components at EUR 300,000, after Alonso barrel-rolled through the gravel after a 300kph impact with Esteban Gutierrez.
But the report said the only real damage to the actual chassis was the mounting points of the suspension, meaning it could return to service later this season.
“The engine and gearbox were also spared,” added Marca, which is good news for Alonso amid the tight long-life restrictions on those components.
Max Mosley, the former FIA president, said the most important thing is that F1’s safety advances saved Alonso’s life.
“Those sort of serious racing accidents, you do expect the driver to walk away,” he told the Times. “That wouldn’t have been the case 20 years ago.
“It was quite an impressive crash,” added Mosley. “I am very much in favour of the halo. Eventually they will come up with a solution. It’s the sort of thing that ought to be done.”
Meanwhile, Italy’s Autosprint reports that the engine aboard Kimi Raikkonen’s flaming Ferrari last Sunday has apparently also survived, as it was reportedly a turbo overheating problem.
“If we had seen on the telemetry that it was a problem with the power unit,” confirmed team boss Maurizio Arrivabene, “we would have asked Kimi to immediately turn it off rather than have him return to the box.”

It seems that the only luck Kimi has is bad luck.
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post #1448 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 08:07 AM
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post #1449 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 08:20 AM
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OMG, F1 has ignored black Robert Downey Jr's famous advice...

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post #1450 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 08:30 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I really really doubt that this is true, I mean the ability to lap the field. Yes they clearly sandbagged during winter testing. Hamilton's pole position was 2.5 seconds quicker than last season! That's an almost incredible jump year to year with no major change in formula (and yes the tire compound was softer, but they're also running higher pressure). Yet Ferrari was only off 8 tenths this year, compared to 1.4 last year. They're closer, not further away.
No one has more to lose if the current regs change than MB.
There are hundreds of millions euros at stake.

On paper, Ferrari is closer than last season, but the gap is still enough to easily win another championship.
Only MB really knows what their powerunit is capable of.
And I prefer to be cynical when it comes to their public pronouncements.


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As predicted, the jackwads ruining.......I mean RUNNING the sport just can't stop themselves when it looks like there is the slightest chance that common sense might prevail.

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ec...ampaign=buffer
Talk is cheap, ain't it?

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Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post
This may be the best thing you read about F1 today:

https://joesaward.wordpress.com/2016...-when-to-stop/

Edit: His last line…calling for the owners to act….sounds great on paper, but the last time that was tried, one team accepted a massive recurring payoff to scuttle the breakaway. Why would anything different happen today?

Edit 2: In this case, he is perhaps not calling for a new breakaway, but I don't really know what else the teams could do.
From the link:
"Mr Marchionne, Mr Zetsche, Mr Ghosn and the rest of you, the time has come for revolution."

I think what Saward is missing here is Mr. M, Z, and G are all CEOs of huge corporations, not sports promoters.
They are in the business of making $$$ too, just like Bernie and his bunch.
I doubt very much they have any altruistic thoughts to save F1 from itself.



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It seems that the only luck Kimi has is bad luck.
It has been like that every since he came back to the Scuderia.
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post #1451 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post
This may be the best thing you read about F1 today:

https://joesaward.wordpress.com/2016...-when-to-stop/

Edit: His last line…calling for the owners to act….sounds great on paper, but the last time that was tried, one team accepted a massive recurring payoff to scuttle the breakaway. Why would anything different happen today?

Edit 2: In this case, he is perhaps not calling for a new breakaway, but I don't really know what else the teams could do.
Be careful what you wish for. It would be an ugly messy break with some teams breaking away and others staying. Look what happened to open wheel racing in the US after the CART/IRL split. Its improved in the last few years, but still a shadow of what it was 25 years ago.
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post #1452 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 09:03 AM
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Be careful what you wish for. It would be an ugly messy break with some teams breaking away and others staying. Look what happened to open wheel racing in the US after the CART/IRL split. Its improved in the last few years, but still a shadow of what it was 25 years ago.
I thought his quote about "throwing the money changers out of the temple" was a clever turn of phrase, but the problem is that the money changers OWN the temple; the teams are just furnishings.

But to his calling for a revolution, can what is ailing F1 be fixed with anything less? Maybe you do have to kill it to save it.

We know that those currently controlling the sport will never act for the betterment of the sport itself. So, to the point made by the GPDA, unless the governance of the sports changes radically, will anything really change?

Solving whatever it is that is ailing F1 is truly a Gordian Knot, but knee jerk rules changes are clearly not the way.

#JB17
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post #1453 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 09:13 AM
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I thought his quote about "throwing the money changers out of the temple" was a clever turn of phrase, but the problem is that the money changers OWN the temple; the teams are just furnishings.

But to his calling for a revolution, can what is ailing F1 be fixed with anything less? Maybe you do have to kill it to save it.

We know that those currently controlling the sport will never act for the betterment of the sport itself. So, to the point made by the GPDA, unless the governance of the sports changes radically, will anything really change?

Solving whatever it is that is ailing F1 is truly a Gordian Knot, but knee jerk rules changes are clearly not the way.
I really don't know what the best solution is. Near as I can tell: the FIA is a sporting organization that sold out its rights to revenue from F1 to a for profit group for a short term cash windfall. When the teams balked that they would be getting a smaller cut of revenues they threatened to quit, but then Bernie convinced them to stay by essentially bribing Ferrari, McLaren, and Red Bull to stay in. The smaller teams were told "tough ****", leave and we'll just run 3 car teams. Renault has now been given a similar if smaller payment. It stinks, and given the more stringent rules in the EU compared to the US I'm surprised there hasn't been a lawsuit yet.

If there is a split I could just maybe see the 4 manufacturer teams breaking away to form their own series. I can't see RB joining them though. Then we'd probably have F1 being the Red Bull show and some new series that is Ferrari/McLaren(Honda)/Renault/Mercedes and their respective B teams heading out on their own. It would be a closed "racing league" with no one but those 4 teams ever having a chance at winning. A huge drop in available money as they're in a price war over circuits and TV contracts. Although if the manufactures think the series helps them sell road cars, well they'll run a team at a big loss. It could ultimately be a good thing, or a disaster.
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post #1454 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by lobosrul View Post
Be careful what you wish for. It would be an ugly messy break with some teams breaking away and others staying. Look what happened to open wheel racing in the US after the CART/IRL split. Its improved in the last few years, but still a shadow of what it was 25 years ago.
You read my mind! Before the internecine warfare that led to the nasty CART IRL split, Indy car racing was a big deal in the US and the Indy 500 really was "The Greatest Spectacle in Racing." Ever since that split, though, American open wheel racing has become just one more minor league racing series. I hope that the F1 powers that be have the good sense not to commit the same sort of suicide.
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post #1455 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 09:50 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post

But to his calling for a revolution, can what is ailing F1 be fixed with anything less? Maybe you do have to kill it to save it.

We know that those currently controlling the sport will never act for the betterment of the sport itself. So, to the point made by the GPDA, unless the governance of the sports changes radically, will anything really change?

Solving whatever it is that is ailing F1 is truly a Gordian Knot, but knee jerk rules changes are clearly not the way.
Revolution + Big Money = 0


Band Aids will be applied....that's about it.
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post #1456 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 09:52 AM
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If they are going to keep this cluster f format, at the very least, they should at least let flying laps count. They count when the normal clock expires, so why not this one?
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post #1457 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 10:20 AM - Thread Starter
 
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This pretty much sums up F1 at the moment:




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post #1458 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 10:33 AM
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Anyone who hasnt seen "APEX: The Story of the Hypercar" its a must see. Very cool.
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post #1459 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 10:41 AM
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If they are going to keep this cluster f format, at the very least, they should at least let flying laps count. They count when the normal clock expires, so why not this one?
The problem with that is how long do you keep that up? The person in the relegation slot improves their time... do you then give the next person in the relegation slot their flying lap? What if they improve their position? How many time can it get bumped along? I would be okay with this if they let it keep going until the end of the qualifying session with the checkered flag marking the final laps that will count, but it could be confusing.

I can't imagine the insanity that is going to result if there is a weekend where it rains during qualifying or the track is wet and drying during qualifying.

The real problems with this format are that it:
1) is really designed to catch people out for the sake of sticking faster cars further back in the grid for "excitement" and "interest". These teams have put a lot of money and effort into making their cars the best... so you try to turn it into professional wrestling instead of a legitimate outcome?; and
2) ignores the fact that the cars are not on track for the entire session for a good reason. For running the fastest lap, the tires are only good for a lap or two - maybe three, so what's the point of driving around on a constant flying lap if you are just going to get slower and endanger the car and its components in the process?

If they really want to stick with this format, Pirelli needs to give them a special qualifying tootsie roll pop tire that just gets better and better the more you wear it down. Put that on the cars and every car will be out there sliding around for the full session to try and get their tires ready for their final run. I suppose that could turn into a debacle as well with everyone doing burnouts and purposely understeering to scrape rubber off of the tires.
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post #1460 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 11:16 AM
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Anyone who hasnt seen "APEX: The Story of the Hypercar" its a must see. Very cool.

Agreed. Lots of old reused info/footage, but presented well. It's cool to see the different makes and how their vision/design is different from the other cars in the segment.

It's also disappointing, as it reminds me that I will never have the pleasure of owning one of those extraordinary machines.
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post #1461 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 11:28 AM
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I suppose that could turn into a debacle as well with everyone doing burnouts and purposely understeering to scrape rubber off of the tires.
Got my vote.
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post #1462 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 11:47 AM
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This pretty much sums up F1 at the moment:




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKrZtUcuhN0
The budget to film that promo could probably keep Manor on the grid for an entire season.

#JB17
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post #1463 of 4254 Old 03-24-2016, 01:44 PM - Thread Starter
 
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The budget to film that promo could probably keep Manor on the grid for an entire season.
More stupid spending from people who are completely out of touch.
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post #1464 of 4254 Old 03-25-2016, 06:29 AM
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Doing the same thing again and expecting a different result used to be known as the classic definition of insanity. Now it's simply called "F1-normal."
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post #1465 of 4254 Old 03-25-2016, 07:16 AM
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Doing the same thing again and expecting a different result used to be known as the classic definition of insanity. Now it's simply called "F1-normal."
Buxton was a cheerleader for the new format, but now admits it is unworkable. But instead of saying let's stick with what we had, he proposes another idea to artificially jumble the grid.

https://willthef1journo.wordpress.co...fixing-a-hole/

Another lame attempt to fix what is not broken.

#JB17
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post #1466 of 4254 Old 03-25-2016, 07:41 AM
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Buxton was a cheerleader for the new format, but now admits it is unworkable. But instead of saying let's stick with what we had, he proposes another idea to artificially jumble the grid.

https://willthef1journo.wordpress.co...fixing-a-hole/

Another lame attempt to fix what is not broken.
I don't see it as "lame" at all. I actually like the idea, though I might tweak it a bit.

One of the challenges with the format that they've been using for the past few years is that a driver can get caught in traffic that spoils his lap, and there's not much the team or driver can do to prevent it. Buxton's proposal solves that problem.

As a driver, one of my favorite qualifying systems was one we used when I was in karts. We went out in 4-kart groups, separated by roughly 1/4 of the target lap time. The group got 1 out lap, three flyers, and one in lap. Separated by a 1/4 track distance, you almost never had a traffic issue - and if you did, it was because you were way faster or way slower than the other guy. Groups were selected by series points, so generally you were with other drivers of similar capability (though one-offs got stuck with the backmarkers...sorry).

Two laps would have been enough, and one might be OK for F1. The point is this - it distills it down to the essence of what race qualifying should be, IMO. Driver and car against the track for one single lap, with no other distractions or intervention. Bring your "A" game and show us what you've got. Over-cook it and lose a second in one corner? Tough - start from the back.

Qualifying, IMO, is not racing. It requires a separate, distinct skill set that is every bit as interesting and challenging as racing, and I'd like it see it return to a position of real prominence without the faked-up drama of the current F1 bizarro world.

JMO, YMMV.
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post #1467 of 4254 Old 03-25-2016, 03:48 PM
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Breaking News!!!!

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#JB17
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post #1468 of 4254 Old 03-26-2016, 08:26 AM
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Originally Posted by MauneyM View Post
I don't see it as "lame" at all. I actually like the idea, though I might tweak it a bit.

One of the challenges with the format that they've been using for the past few years is that a driver can get caught in traffic that spoils his lap, and there's not much the team or driver can do to prevent it. Buxton's proposal solves that problem.
Agreed, I'm not seeing the problem with his proposal. You get one lap off of a random draw (after the out lap), everyone runs the same tires, the drivers are separated enough to avoid traffic, and on the off-chance there's a rainout, red flag or whatever cancelling the rest of the session the remaining slots are set by fastest practice times.

It's never going to be 100% fair, but qualifying should always be about a one lap run to do your best time IMO. If you screw it up or you have different conditions due to rain etc., tough. That's why you do a random draw for the runs, and it adds that variability to the mix to get the chance that someone good might get screwed and have to claw his way back to the front. But it won't be because of traffic or sandbagging.

Last edited by slowbiscuit; 03-26-2016 at 08:36 AM.
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post #1469 of 4254 Old 03-26-2016, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MauneyM View Post
I don't see it as "lame" at all. I actually like the idea, though I might tweak it a bit.

One of the challenges with the format that they've been using for the past few years is that a driver can get caught in traffic that spoils his lap, and there's not much the team or driver can do to prevent it. Buxton's proposal solves that problem.

As a driver, one of my favorite qualifying systems was one we used when I was in karts. We went out in 4-kart groups, separated by roughly 1/4 of the target lap time. The group got 1 out lap, three flyers, and one in lap. Separated by a 1/4 track distance, you almost never had a traffic issue - and if you did, it was because you were way faster or way slower than the other guy. Groups were selected by series points, so generally you were with other drivers of similar capability (though one-offs got stuck with the backmarkers...sorry).

Two laps would have been enough, and one might be OK for F1. The point is this - it distills it down to the essence of what race qualifying should be, IMO. Driver and car against the track for one single lap, with no other distractions or intervention. Bring your "A" game and show us what you've got. Over-cook it and lose a second in one corner? Tough - start from the back.

Qualifying, IMO, is not racing. It requires a separate, distinct skill set that is every bit as interesting and challenging as racing, and I'd like it see it return to a position of real prominence without the faked-up drama of the current F1 bizarro world.

JMO, YMMV.

I agree and your last sentence is telling. If they weren't trying to improve the drama of race day, then it could be what it should be and a stand alone event.

To me, Indy used to be the most exciting qualifying in racing. A lot of that was due to bump day and the drama from teams and drivers missing the race. That really doesn't come into play in F1.

Maybe using your kart qualifying, they could do it right and still have a show. Each driver could have three laps (in, out, and timed) in the first session. Then go back to the pits and adjust as necessary. A second session of the same to see if the driver can improve on his time or not.

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post #1470 of 4254 Old 03-26-2016, 11:18 AM
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As for the qualifying at the Melbourne race. I guess that the F1 people never saw a bicycle track race. One of the pack race's eliminates the last competitor about every minute (every second lap). So there are lots of tactics & strategy going on. You don't want to waste energy leading the pack early in the race. Position near the end is what is important.

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