VOOM is BLASTING OFF!!! - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by keithaxis
Wanman, the component cable will never, never have reduced resolution.
I wouldn't bet your life on that one.

The same scenario occurring with HDCP DVI DVD players could easily spill over into the HD STB's for Sat and cable.


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post #92 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 10:51 AM
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Rent the box and you can always cancel, should they ever decide to downres component. But according to VOOM, there are currently no plans for downres.
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post #93 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by bfdtv
Rent the box and you can always cancel, should they ever decide to downres component. But according to VOOM, there are currently no plans for downres.
I already am a V* subscriber....happy one at that.

I just don't believe in blanket statements with no basis to support it.


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post #94 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 10:59 AM
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I agree with Motjes2 here.
HDPC is on on the DVI interface from my SA3250 box from Time Warner cable. Big deal, everything works correctly.
Now there may be the "potential" for problems, but I just have not seen them...

Quote:
Originally posted by motjes2
pradike,

with you it is a never-ending story. Give it up man. In the world of statistics your sample is limited and does not represent the hypothesis - HDCP flag on, therefore I will cancel because I cannot watch HD anymore.

Yes, it caught everybody by surprise and some were not affected and some were not happy. I guess you prove your point. Let's move on to the real discussion on topic since this whole thread has gone on a different dirrection.

good luck to you....
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post #95 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 11:00 AM
 
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Bill, you are correct. Anyone that thinks they know what the future holds regarding V*'s decisions isn't one to be bothered with. Absolutely should never be employed without the necessary foundation to prove oneself on that note.

bfdtv, I am aware of this option and was waiting on Mike Parker's transcoder solution. It will be a $700 investment, but I would be more than ticked if I spent the $700 and find out six months down the line something changed to the YPbPr transport on the Voom service.

Of course, the same thing could happen with DirecTV, too, but my cost there was $99 as it included RGBHV to begin with. That was convenient. :)

And keithaxis, you didn't 'put me in the same light', but rather you insinuated the two personalities on AVS were one of the same. There is a difference.
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post #96 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 11:05 AM
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Wanman,

Doesn't Digital Connection sell a ~$100 component to RGB transcoder?
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post #97 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 11:07 AM
 
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bfdtv, I do not know. My last experience with a Component to RGVHV transcoder (Jey Digital) for HD bandwidth failed and decided to find/wait for one of quality. I reached the same obstacle with D* in their HD TiVo, too. FOr some odd reason that Hughes solution only included a DVI-D and not a DVI-I like in their new HD-STB, which did include a DVI-I connector.
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post #98 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Doesn't Digital Connection sell a ~$100 component to RGB transcoder?
That's $250, not $100. The cheap ones do not have sufficient bandwidth for 1080i, and the $250 one represents the bottom of the barrel for these types of transcoders. A good one, like Extron, goes for $849, though they can be had for a little over $600 if you shop judiciously.

Anyone who doesn't believe that HDCP is a problem is only burying his head in the sand. HDCP is designed to stop piracy, but it just so happens that in the process we can and most likely will lose some other things like:

1. "Fair use rights" - The broadcast flag can be set to to allow "copy once", "copy x number of times", or "copy never" at the discretion of the IP owner. Can you say "pay per view" as being the ONLY method of someday watching premium movies in HD?

2. The broadcast flag can also be set to do other things even more invasive, but heh, it hasn't happened yet, so why should we worry...:rolleyes:

3. Downrezzing of analog outputs is inevitable. Hollywood wants to close the "analog hole" as quickly and tightly as possible, though they will have a hard time closing it soon due to the proliferation of non HDCP compliant equipment out there.

I have to side with WanMan here - I own a very expensive 9" CRT projector as my primary display device, and I have no intentions of downgrading to a digital display in the near future (though the X1 is fine for my bedroom :) ), so the downrezzing of analog outputs is a very real concern to me as well.

The HDCP problem is real and it is here, and by the time you recognize the implications it brings with it, it will be too late.
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post #99 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 11:54 AM
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Source

Shops
March 26, 2004
By Andrew McMains

NEW YORK Cablevision Systems has contacted agencies about advertising and direct marketing duties for its Voom high-definition TV offering, sources said. Estimated billings are $50 million.

The incumbents are Interpublic Group's Lowe (advertising) and The Sloan Group (direct), both in New York. Those shops won the business in a review less than a year ago.

Search consultancy Matchworks has issued RFPs on Cablevision's behalf, according to sources. The New York-based consultancy referred calls to the Jericho, N.Y. client, which could not immediately be reached.

Lowe and Sloan were part of an eight-agency IPG team from that won consolidated marketing services duties on the brand in May 2003. At the time, IPG bested teams from WPP Group (led by J. Walter Thompson) and Omnicom Group (led by TBWA\\Chiat\\Day).

It is unclear whether the incumbents will participate in the process. Lowe and Sloan could not immediately be reached.
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post #100 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
1. "Fair use rights" - The broadcast flag can be set to to allow "copy once", "copy x number of times", or "copy never" at the discretion of the IP owner. Can you say "pay per view" as being the ONLY method of someday watching premium movies in HD?
I think you need to re-read the FCC ruling on the subject. They've already indicated what limitations can be placed on various types of programming.

Quote:
3. Downrezzing of analog outputs is inevitable. Hollywood wants to close the "analog hole" as quickly and tightly as possible, though they will have a hard time closing it soon due to the proliferation of non HDCP compliant equipment out there.
The FCC has already prohibited downrezzing for most content on cable providers. DirecTV wants the FCC to rescind this provision.
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post #101 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 12:31 PM
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I think you need to re-read the FCC ruling on the subject. They've already indicated what limitations can be placed on various types of programming.
Would you be kind enough to give us a synopsis of those limitations, in layman's terms, please? I fall asleep trying to read the FCC rulings.

Quote:
The FCC has already prohibited downrezzing for most content on cable providers.
Until when? Forever?
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post #102 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 12:48 PM
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Maybe the HDCP conversation can be taken to another thread. This is not unique to Voom, it is not something that will be fixed by Voom (or any of the individuals here), so like every thread that gets hijacked by 5C, HDCP, etc., can you play elsewhere. HDCP was promised (or damned) to be on the Voom STB in a subsequent software release. Now it's there. I admire everyone for their philosophical fortitude in not buying plasma panels with HDCP, etc., because they are standing on principle. I hate to be pragmatic, though I am not trading liberty for safety per the old Ben Franklin line, but I doi like HD content, lots of it, so my principles are compromised.

Tim

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post #103 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 12:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Does Anyone Know If VOOM is GOING PUBLIC anytime soon?

just trying to find their ticker symbol on nasdaq....

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post #104 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 12:52 PM
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VOOM is owned by Cablevision but there are rumors that it will be spun off as a seperate entity soon.

You measure your TV in INCHES? How cute! 9.16 Ft Diagonally, Yeah, Baby!
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post #105 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 12:54 PM
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Check the Pink Sheets :)
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post #106 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by technoreid
How are the other channels in regards to picture quality???

And is content really that weak??

Thanks, technoreid
-----------------

Picture quality of non-HD channels very good, comparable to D*. But I have a widescreen TV so my screen has the black bars on the sides when the feed is not HD 16x9 format.

The Ultra channel is mostly fashion shows, and repeats of the same fashion shows. The Moov channel is like watching a sreen saver with background music. Good if you just want to chill out, but otherwise does not really add any value. I think they can do without these two channels. Hopefully these are just place-holders until they get other programs online, like ESPN HD, oh pleassse Voom, give me ESPN HD.

I did not mention that I also have the latest software. The channel change time is still slower compared to D*. And I did experience two lock-ups when pressing the Voom button on the remote.

Calling Voom now to find out if phone line needs to be connected. This seems to be one of the unknowns as brought up somewhere in this forum.
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post #107 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bob Sorel
Until when? Forever?
My bet is that until you projector dies of old age. In other words, long enough.
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post #108 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by WanMan
bfdtv, I do not know. My last experience with a Component to RGVHV transcoder (Jey Digital) for HD bandwidth failed and decided to find/wait for one of quality. I reached the same obstacle with D* in their HD TiVo, too. FOr some odd reason that Hughes solution only included a DVI-D and not a DVI-I like in their new HD-STB, which did include a DVI-I connector.
Hey WanMan, next time your bulb blows out, take the money that you would use to buy a replacement bulb (you might have to add a little) and go buy the smallest inexpensive direct-view set you can find that is HDCP compliant. Then if you get on eBay, there's guys selling plans for $9.99 that will turn that small TV into a 150" projected image with no loss in PQ, for about $10 worth of parts from Home Depot! :D
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post #109 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 02:59 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by motjes2
Source

Shops
March 26, 2004
By Andrew McMains

NEW YORK Cablevision Systems has contacted agencies about advertising and direct marketing duties for its Voom high-definition TV offering, sources said. Estimated billings are $50 million.

The incumbents are Interpublic Group's Lowe (advertising) and The Sloan Group (direct), both in New York. Those shops won the business in a review less than a year ago.

Search consultancy Matchworks has issued RFPs on Cablevision's behalf, according to sources. The New York-based consultancy referred calls to the Jericho, N.Y. client, which could not immediately be reached.

Lowe and Sloan were part of an eight-agency IPG team from that won consolidated marketing services duties on the brand in May 2003. At the time, IPG bested teams from WPP Group (led by J. Walter Thompson) and Omnicom Group (led by TBWA\\Chiat\\Day).

It is unclear whether the incumbents will participate in the process. Lowe and Sloan could not immediately be reached.
First, thanks everyone for tolerating me thus far. :D And my three-hour nap helped a lot in enjoying my day off. Woo-Hoo! Bob Sorel is stating the things that I am concerned about.

Now, in replying to what motjes2 just posted ... $50 Million, huh? They could have spent $50 Million up on BUYING 50,000 customers!

Tim:
Quote:
Maybe the HDCP conversation can be taken to another thread. This is not unique to Voom
Its directly related to my comments and concerns as to why Voom is not taking off for me.
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post #110 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by motjes2

There will be big surprises in the coming months. The only thing I can tell you is that VOOM will blow EVERYBODY away by October 2004 if all their plans are succesful (there is a method to their madness, believe me. I was stunned of what I heard). So stay tune because V* is for real.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Quote:
Originally posted by rollerfink
Can you give us any hints besides the HDDVR?
No hints?
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post #111 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 03:51 PM
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Quote:
Maybe the HDCP conversation can be taken to another thread. This is not unique to Voom, it is not something that will be fixed by Voom (or any of the individuals here), so like every thread that gets hijacked by 5C, HDCP, etc., can you play elsewhere. HDCP was promised (or damned) to be on the Voom STB in a subsequent software release. Now it's there.
Good point, and absolutely correct, Tim! As much as I would love to continue this conversation, it is not unique to Voom and therefore qualifies as being off-topic. Whoever first mentioned that HDCP had been turned on was correct in doing so, but the rest of us (me included) are guilty for continuing down that path afterwards.
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post #112 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 04:23 PM
 
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Its was probably introduced by me in my concern regarding another facet of Voom that is pushing me away from Voom than pulling me towards Voom.
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post #113 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 07:50 PM
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Do really believe that D* will not close the black hole as well. They all will when they are forced too. So prepare for it.
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post #114 of 305 Old 03-26-2004, 08:01 PM
 
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I do not believe one way or another. This is the reason why I expressed my concern. One should also ask this of Dish Networks as their HD DVR solution includes Firewire. Talking about rocking the boat.
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post #115 of 305 Old 03-27-2004, 04:55 AM
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I dont think any will close the hole unless they are made too legally. I could be wrong but thats what I think the situation will be, unless maybe V* could somehow gain more HD channels, more movie material from disney over the others D*, dish etc in exchange for closing it early.
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post #116 of 305 Old 03-27-2004, 05:05 AM
 
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So, do you think Voom was legally Voom was legally made to close the digital portion while not D* or E*?
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post #117 of 305 Old 03-27-2004, 06:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by WanMan
So, do you think Voom was legally Voom was legally made to close the digital portion while not D* or E*?
That obviously didn't happen, so why did they do it? The timing is what I don't understand - maybe it will become more clear in the near future. If it was driven by pressure from the content provider - which one? I think it is only coincidence that it happened just prior to the edition of Encore & Playboy. You know if HBO, SHO and especially Starz didn't demand it, then it would be a non-issue for Encore. I can't imagine Playboy was the driver.

So who are they talking to - or what are thay planning - that prompted them to do this now? The only content more valuable than what is shown on the premium channels is PPV. D* doesn't have a problem with offering HD PPV without HDCP.

If there is no pressing reason to activate HDCP, Voom would have to be a bunch of idiots to "voluntarily" activate it just for the hell of it. Even if they believe that is where things are heading, why wouldn't they wait until it was necessary? The way they have been marketing Voom, they seem to be trying to eliminate any possible reason to not try the service (assuming they are ferverishly in negotiations with ESPN, SciFi, and Fox News :) ). To voluntarily throw up a potential roadblock for some subscribers, on it's face, doesn't make sense.

So there are only 3 options that I see:

1) They are planning to add some unique content, or some unique delivery system where the content providers are requiring HDCP before they are allowed to implement it.

2) They are a victim of timing. The existing premium movie channels are requiring HDCP in order to provide their HD channel - and they will require the same from D* and E* once their contracts come up for renewal.

3) Voom suits have their heads placed firmly up their asses.
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post #118 of 305 Old 03-27-2004, 06:38 AM
 
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They obviously do not know the meaning of solidarity. Does their parent company (Cablevision?) also have HDCP enabled?
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post #119 of 305 Old 03-27-2004, 06:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by WanMan
They obviously do not know the meaning of solidarity. Does their parent company (Cablevision?) also have HDCP enabled?
No....which is further evidence that there has to some external reason for it. Unless Option #3 above is the case.
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post #120 of 305 Old 03-27-2004, 06:58 AM
 
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I know the #3 option very well. I work for a large corporation and it amazes me at the decisions that are made most of the time. Nothing worse than old farts too ignorant to make the decision, but allowing them to be persuaded by those that also don't know jack about the subject at hand, but can sell s__t on a shingle to old farts in-power.
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