Hey Verizon : Where are the new HD channels? - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 01:40 PM
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Hey! Ho! Great news for you customers!!

All 4 Discovery Networks are going to be added on 10/26. This according to a thread over at BBR: http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r192...ew-HD-channels
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post #182 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bfdtv View Post

Verizon is relatively unique among cable systems in their design.

They have two SuperHeadEnds (SPEs), one for redundancy. These SPEs aggregate all digital cable content using fiber, dozens of big ugly dishes (BUDs), and a warehouse full of receivers, SD MPEG-2 encoders, and commercial insertion equipment.

The SPEs send the MPEG-2 video via SONET to video hubs (VHOs) in each region. I don't know the current count, but I believe there are now somewhere between 7 and 13 VHOs. The VHOs modulate the MPEG-2 channels from the SPEs into RF (QAM) for delivery to the home. A section of RF (QAM) spectrum is reserved for locals. The VHOs receive the local networks from broadcast affiliates in the region (typically via fiber) and modulate them onto the reserved QAM channels. The combined QAM signal is sent via fiber to each Verizon central office in the region with guide data.

Your local office receives that modulated QAM video from the VHO and combines it with voice and high-speed data. From there is sent to your home via fiber.

Verizon has 135 6MHz channels available between the CO and your home. The problem, as I alluded to above, is that the VHOs and COs evidently have the hardware to support only 103 of those 135 channels today. Depending on the VHO, anywhere from 54 to 63 of those channels is allocated to QAM, with the rest allocated to analog. The oldest VHOs may have 54 slots available for QAM while newer VHOs may have 63.

More comprehensive upgrades are apparently required to upgrade the VHOs and COs to use the remaining 32 channels, so for now, Verizon is working to eliminate the analog channels. It's not a matter of just switching off an analog channel and switching on a QAM channel because both use separate equipment at the VHO and CO; hence, new equipment must be installed in every VHO and CO.

Each QAM slot provides a minimum of 38.8 Mbps usable. Verizon currently allocates 7-9 SD channels per QAM and 2 HD channels per QAM. The average FiOS system probably uses 52-53 QAM slots today.

Verizon's first step may be to make all VHOs and COs capable of using 63 QAM slots, because the newer VHOs are already capable of that. Verizon rolls out channels nationally, not regionally, so some in newer FiOS markets are probably stuck waiting for older markets to upgrade their equipment.

Updated Friday, October 19

Verizon responded to this post on Engadget with, Ben, there is no "technological limitation in our video hubs and central offices. In our fiber system it is just a matter of adding new equipment to increase capacity. That's certainly true.

The problem is that the equipment upgrades necessary require many months of work. In some cases, building upgrades are required because Verizon didn't include storage space for that equipment in their plans. Verizon is relying on contractors outside the company to perform many of these upgrades, which slows the process. It is possible some timetables have changed recently, but as of three months ago, Verizon engineering did not expect to have the capacity necessary to add most of the new DirecTV HD channels for another year (i.e. 4Q 2008). This information was supplied by employees working in the FiOS TV engineering department under Frank B.

There is now talk that Verizon will eliminate the analog channels by June or July, which would free up capacity for about 80 new HD channels. Whether management will authorize the resources necessary to make this happen is unknown.

A different FIOS engineer contacted me and explained that there are problems at the CO that are simply a matter of cost. I haven't had time to completly understand what he told me, but I'll paraphrase it here till I have time to research it.

Basically he says it's a limitation in the PON cards in the OLT and that they need to be upgraded from an oc card to an oc3. He explains that customers have to share these cards.

Again, I don't really understand what he is saying here, but I'm working on it.

This seems to sync with what Matt Stomp says on OneTRAK.http://www.onetrak.com/ShowArticle.a...ookieSupport=1

Quote:


Verizon would have no capacity problems shipping the extra HD channels from the national headends through to the regional service offices to local central offices. The issue is the QAMs in the central office.

Verizon would need an additional 24 QAMs on top of the 30 it currently has at each central office to handle another 48 HD channels. Figure $1,000 as a ballpark cost for a QAM today. Adding another 24 QAMs at any central serving office would cost $24,000.


Ben
How good could it be if it isn't HD?
Engadget HD
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post #183 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sansri88 View Post

Hey! Ho! Great news for you customers!!

All 4 Discovery Networks are going to be added on 10/26. This according to a thread over at BBR: http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r192...ew-HD-channels

Not sure I buy this, but if true (and hopefully it is), that pretty much makes you wonder about many other posts to the contrary. The post right above mine tries to explain all the reasons why there won't be much new HD.

This is kind of reminding me of the days when I had D* and everyone had their own rumors from some 'inside source' about all the new HD that was coming. Of course it never did until just a few weeks ago. It got to the point where it almost became comical. I'm rapidly getting to the same point here...new rumors every day that run contrary to the rumors of 24 hours ago.
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post #184 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Not sure I buy this, but if true (and hopefully it is), that pretty much makes you wonder about many other posts to the contrary. The post right above mine tries to explain all the reasons why there won't be much new HD.

This is kind of reminding me of the days when I had D* and everyone had their own rumors from some 'inside source' about all the new HD that was coming. Of course it never did until just a few weeks ago. It got to the point where it almost became comical. I'm rapidly getting to the same point here...new rumors every day that run contrary to the rumors of 24 hours ago.

Well, last week I posted on BBR that an email from Discovery Communications specifically mentioned Verizon for the new HD channels, and that they would be coming soon. You can see my thread here: http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r192...HD-coming-soon

I posted that on 10/11.
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post #185 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 04:17 PM
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Sansri, YOU may be the guy that's got it right! I really hope so.
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post #186 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 04:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Sansri, YOU may be the guy that's got it right! I really hope so.

Thanks, I hope I'm right even though FiOS isn't available in my area yet.

To those that question the integrity of the email (I was attacked because people said it was a generic response) I specifically mentioned Comcast in my original email to them, and got back Verizon in the response.
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post #187 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 06:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Sansri, YOU may be the guy that's got it right! I really hope so.

Verizon has stated that there would be HD additions before the end of the year, but that they would be "few" or "limited" or something along those lines. My only fear is that with A&E, the History VOD developments, and now the four Discovery channels, we might have hit the end of the road until mid-2008.

Oh well, so much for CNN. But maybe HD-VOD is is showing progress?
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post #188 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 06:42 PM
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But I think few of us would have thought we'd get as many as 6 new HD channels so quickly based on so many of the posts here. I would not classify 6 new HDs as "few". So I will continue to watch for actual developments as opposed to the never ending rumor mill. As I said before, this used to drive me and many others nuts when I had D*. Everyone thought 'their source' was the correct one when in fact almost nobody's was for years. Once I ignored the "oh, I heard D* will be adding 2 new HD channels next week" rumors, I was much better off.
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post #189 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 11:26 PM
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well its no rumors anymore with D*. they have delivered every thing including hd chans exactly when they said they would. the most they've ever delayed is a week or 2, so there is no reason to believe they won't have vod next month (prob hdvod too before fios considering dtv's emphasis on hd) and more hd chans in 2 mo. in dec. to add to what is already 2x that of comcast & fios.
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post #190 of 287 Old 10-19-2007, 11:31 PM
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kept our one bill also with fios internet, home phone & dtv triple play.

we'll come back to fios tv in 3 yrs maybe if their iptv plans work out & if its superior to the competition.

meantime instead of waiting infinetely for an hd chan here or there that may or may not come in who knows how long you can have them all now on dtv.
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post #191 of 287 Old 10-20-2007, 12:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quatre View Post

well its no rumors anymore with D*. they have delivered every thing including hd chans exactly when they said they would. the most they've ever delayed is a week or 2, so there is no reason to believe they won't have vod next month (prob hdvod too before fios considering dtv's emphasis on hd) and more hd chans in 2 mo. in dec. to add to what is already 2x that of comcast & fios.

kept our one bill also with fios internet, home phone & dtv triple play.

we'll come back to fios tv in 3 yrs maybe if their iptv plans work out & if its superior to the competition.

meantime instead of waiting infinetely for an hd chan here or there that may or may not come in who knows how long you can have them all now on dtv.

cool. enjoy the dish. no one cares. bye now...
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post #192 of 287 Old 10-20-2007, 12:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by URFloorMatt View Post

Verizon has stated that there would be HD additions before the end of the year, but that they would be "few" or "limited" or something along those lines. My only fear is that with A&E, the History VOD developments, and now the four Discovery channels, we might have hit the end of the road until mid-2008.

Oh well, so much for CNN. But maybe HD-VOD is is showing progress?

HD VOD is indeed progressing. found tonite that there's one VOD movie in HD.

ok-it's "Delta Farce". had to start with SOMETHING I guess.

Didn't think to check the Subscriptions tab for any HBO-HD, SHO-HD, or STARZ!-HD on demand.

Matt you really want to see Larry King in HD? you're a brave man!

"increasing vision is increasingly
expensive"- R. A. Janek
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post #193 of 287 Old 10-20-2007, 02:27 AM
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Would just be happy if they'd turn off the 5c or whatever they use
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post #194 of 287 Old 10-20-2007, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by CHolleman View Post

cool. enjoy the dish. no one cares. bye now...

I care
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post #195 of 287 Old 10-20-2007, 12:27 PM
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I have not been able to confirm the addition of these channels on 10/26 with my media contact at Verizon. I will call on Monday to see if they have any more info. Keep checking weatherscan as that was were the announcement for A & E showed up. I know for a fact that the complaining about the lack of new HD has awoken their mangement from their slumber on this issue. I for one can wait for CNN-HD.
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post #196 of 287 Old 10-20-2007, 10:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HDntheCity View Post

Matt you really want to see Larry King in HD? you're a brave man!

If quantity is an issue, I want diversity in my HD programming. That means networks like CNN-HD, Fox Business HD, and Cartoon Network HD are more valuable than the same old crap (TBS, more educational programming, etc.).
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post #197 of 287 Old 10-20-2007, 10:56 PM
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The nice thing about a channel like CNN-HD is you can tune in every day and there is unique content. Very little content is repeated. A number of other new HD channels now have very little content, and they repeat the content they do have over and over during the week.

CNN has 60+ hours of HD per week, and most of it is unique, with Lou Dobbs (6-7pm), Larry King (9-10pm), and Anderson Cooper 360 (10-11pm) in HD on weekdays. Presidential debates and forums are in HD too, as are documentaries and specials.
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post #198 of 287 Old 10-21-2007, 12:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bfdtv View Post

CNN has 60+ hours of HD per week, and most of it is unique, with Lou Dobbs (6-7pm), Larry King (9-10pm), and Anderson Cooper 360 (10-11pm) in HD on weekdays. Presidential debates and forums are in HD too, as are documentaries and specials.

Speaking of presidential debates can someone with a Verizon contact tell them North and Central New Jerseyians are still pissed we don't have MSNBC, and are missing debates because of it. (missing next weeks)
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post #199 of 287 Old 10-21-2007, 07:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bfdtv View Post

The nice thing about a channel like CNN-HD is you can tune in every day and there is unique content. Very little content is repeated. A number of other new HD channels now have very little content, and they repeat the content they do have over and over during the week.

CNN has 60+ hours of HD per week, and most of it is unique, with Lou Dobbs (6-7pm), Larry King (9-10pm), and Anderson Cooper 360 (10-11pm) in HD on weekdays. Presidential debates and forums are in HD too, as are documentaries and specials.

I never watch cable news except when there's a big story going on. but I may tune in more regularly if it's HD.
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post #200 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by eric.exe View Post

Speaking of presidential debates can someone with a Verizon contact tell them North and Central New Jerseyians are still pissed we don't have MSNBC, and are missing debates because of it. (missing next weeks)

I believe that is because Cablevision has an exclusive contract with MSNBC in the New York / Jersey area and has nothing to do with Verizon
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post #201 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 09:06 AM
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Originally Posted by redskins4life View Post

I care

the point of what i said was directed towards Quatres pointless and unconstructive statements. great, directv FINALLY got their new HD channels. it's only taken them two years of telling people "soon" to get there.
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post #202 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 09:38 AM
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I believe that is because Cablevision has an exclusive contract with MSNBC in the New York / Jersey area and has nothing to do with Verizon

Cablevision does have a MSNBC exclusive in those areas until some time in 2008, apparently. The 'problem' is that Verizon lacks MSNBC in areas of NY and/or NJ where Cablevision doesn't offer service.
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post #203 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davdev View Post

I believe that is because Cablevision has an exclusive contract with MSNBC in the New York / Jersey area and has nothing to do with Verizon

So does that mean D* doesn't have it in those same areas? If they do, how were they able to get it?
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post #204 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 10:05 AM
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cool. enjoy the dish. no one cares. bye now...

I usually am not this harsh, but wake up. With out D* we would have NO leverage with Verizon. Remember, competition is the consumers best friend. I want to know about ALL options and keep them open. I also switched from D* a few month ago. Already, I have had outages on ESPN and ESPN2....it was in my entire area. Even Comcast lost the channel in HD during the Florida State game.
This NEVER happened when I had D*....so I ain't completely sold on Verizon yet.

Did anyone else have this outage on the HD station ESPN2 Florida state game?

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post #205 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 10:20 AM
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Phillip Swann says the Verizon HD expansion is coming -- but it is coming next spring.

http://www.tvpredictions.com/verizon102207.htm
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post #206 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 10:54 AM
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I think alot of this "number of HD stations" is being blown out of proportion....I think it should be focused solely on "HD content"......You could have 250 HD stations, but if 90% is stretched 4:3, then I'll stick with a provider that has good SD PQ.

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post #207 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by mikelets456 View Post

I think alot of this "number of HD stations" is being blown out of proportion....I think it should be focused solely on "HD content"......You could have 250 HD stations, but if 90% is stretched 4:3, then I'll stick with a provider that has good SD PQ.

I think you are over-reacting to the news that TBS-HD is all stretch-o-vision along with A&E-HD and History Channel also stretching stuff. Most of the new HD channels do not stretch their SD. The key is whether the prime-time programs that people want to watch would be available in HD on the recent HD start-ups. Sci-Fi, FX, USA all have scripted series which have been shot in HD for years. The stuff on CNN-HD coming out of the NYC studios is in HD. Those four channels along with the sports HD channels would be a good priority set to add. The issue is whether Verizon will sort through the HD channels and if they do indeed have room to add a few more before "next spring", will add those that provide a higher HD value.

Given that Verizon just gave us A&E-HD, which I would vote for as the most useless HD channel out of the 20 current national HD channels on Fios, I suspect not and that it instead will be driven by the order of the signing of the agreements for HD carriage with the cable nets.

As for swanni, there is nothing in that article that is new info. We have been getting these rumblings of no "major" expansion of HD channels for some time until next spring or summer after Verizon has shut down the analog channels in favor of digital QAM channels. Perhaps by "major' expansion, Verizon means the ability to add all the new HD channels to match the D* expansion. Does not necessarily preclude them from adding a few more, which bfdtv has indicated is in the works. One problem I can see is that the schedule for shutting down the analog channels may be way too optimistic as it only takes one or two local government boards to throw a monkey wrench into it by demanding a delay. Verizon will also have to do a major channel re-shuffle before they can add all the HD channels as there is not room for all of them between 820 and 860. That requires at least 30 days notice to the customers and a lead time before that to prepare mailings and notices.

Verizon is not talking on a official basis, or at least, not in anything other than in generalities, which is probably a reflection of their corporate culture as a phone company, so we will have to pick through the tea leaves of internet rumors on when, if any, HD channels are going to be added.
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post #208 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 12:34 PM
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afiggatt,

Thanks for the post. BTW, I hope the Discovery stations pan out by friday.

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post #209 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fredfa View Post

Phillip Swann says the Verizon HD expansion is coming -- but it is coming next spring.

http://www.tvpredictions.com/verizon102207.htm

I hate to say it, but I agree with his assessment at the end of the article.
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post #210 of 287 Old 10-22-2007, 01:11 PM
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I hate to say it, but I agree with his assessment at the end of the article.

How much bandwidth do those games take up? I believe it's minimal. Also, if the rumored 5 HD stations are added by week's end, that's VERY promising because it was rumored that little to nothing would be added until spring.

Please people, I had D* for years and I heard the same complaints over there for years. It's a game of leap frog and Verizon WILL catch up. I hate to say this, but you know there are other choices out there, right? Why complain...if it's that bad then simply switch. I mean come on....if your really that ticked then just go to D* or your other local cable company. I choose to wait. My D* dish and hardwiring is still in place and if Verizon does not do anything in a reasonable amount of time then I'll leave. Cable in my area (Comcast) has very few HD channels....not even worth it IMHO.

So complaining won't do a thing....it's good to speculate, write to verizon, etc. But if you want alot of HD now, we all know what we have to do.

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