Reviews for REDACTED on HDNet Movies..PLEASE, POST ONLY if you have seen the movie - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 09:37 AM - Thread Starter
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sad as it is,

since we can't have a civilized thread discussing the movie REDACTED,

i thought i would at least post this link to the reviews

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/10008755-redacted/
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post #2 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 09:50 AM
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I tried to watch but it was so bad I could not, did not see enough to give any comment except maybe say I have a predisposition to abstain from movies that can harm our military.
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post #3 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 10:25 AM
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I agree. I found the film to be very disturbing and portrays the American military negatively. This documentary-style movie could easily be used as propaganda by Muslim extremists to incite an already unstable, uneducated and confused culture against American soldiers in the Middle East. I wonder what DePalma's motivation was to release this movie now, considering we have troops in Iraq. Regardless of anyone's political view about the war in Iraq, our troops would be better served by not releasing this film to the world while we are there. Had it not been on tv, I would not have gone to see it in the theaters.

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post #4 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Actuary555 View Post

I tried to watch but it was so bad I could not, did not see enough to give any comment except maybe say I have a predisposition to abstain from movies that can harm our military.

I recorded it last night but haven’t watched it yet. I agree whole heartedly with your feelings ...but I will give the hack, DePalama, the respect that he isn’t giving the US Armed services, by watching it. This is solely to quell the vile spit from the closed minded blowhards that think one has to shoot heroin, in order to comment on it.

Then... I'll give my review.

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post #5 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by richiephx View Post

This documentary-style.

This is an unfortunate subterfuge. It is NOT a documentary but there are those that will think they are seeing actual footage of Nesse, or Big Foot, or an evil empire.

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post #6 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 12:08 PM
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Only watched the first half, recorded the 2nd half when Pushing Daisies came on.

In that first half, I didn't really care much for it. I thought the FX TV series, Over There, did a much better portrayal.

The film image did look pretty spectacular in HD, at least for the non-camcorder shots. There was that one shot early of that bead of sweat rolling down the soldier's face. You could see all the stubble on his face easily.
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post #7 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 04:41 PM
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I watched this and was disappointed that HDNet would be associated with a film like this. I realize that this film is based on a true event, but those solders are in prison where they belong now and this is not normal behavior by our brave troops.

I guess my biggest surprise was the underlying "rumbling" that our troops are all monsters and anyone who would go along with this were monsters too. Mr De Palma has the right to produce what he feels, but I also have the right to the not pay and see it. I am glad I didn't waste my money at the theater and I do not plan on recommending anyone see this film. Sorry. Just not my cup of tea.

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post #8 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 04:58 PM
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I will not watch it and from everything I've heard I've lost a lot of respect for Mark Cuban.

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post #9 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 05:32 PM
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I just hope to god that this movie doesn't cause harm to any of our troops! I'm really not sure I even want HDNet anymore.
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post #10 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 06:55 PM
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So THIS is why HDNet doesn't want to be in an optional second service tier!

Bob Simandl ... somewhere near St. Louis
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post #11 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 07:16 PM
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I tried watching it for a few minutes but gave up. It is such a badly made movie even if you ignore the subject. As soon as I saw it was a Magnolia movie, I suspected it would be almost unwatchable and it was.
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post #12 of 49 Old 11-15-2007, 08:59 PM
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Is this one of those HDNet premiers that if you missed it you're out of luck for six or seven months? I just got an HD DVD player so I've been out of the loop on programming. As to all the hatefull comments, hasn't HDNET been doing the State of the Union address for the last couple of years? I find that repulsive so I don't watch it.
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post #13 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 04:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiomagnate View Post

As to all the hatefull comments, hasn't HDNET been doing the State of the Union address for the last couple of years? I find that repulsive so I don't watch it.

I watch the State of the Union address no matter who is delivering it. I also watch both the Democrat & Republican debates. I wish more Americans did.

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post #14 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 04:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiomagnate View Post

Is this one of those HDNet premiers that if you missed it you're out of luck for six or seven months?

No, it is one of those HDNet premieres that if you missed it you can go to your local multiplex next week and pay $10 to see it (honestly). In my opinion, save your money. You haven't missed anything. It isn't that good of a film.

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post #15 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 05:13 AM
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If one believes that the real-life incident dramatized by this film is the only one of it's kind, an isolated incident, and is mollified by those men being in prison, so now we can get on with the noble job of bringing American-style democracy to a country that desperately wants it, then you're being especially naive. Just like we never would have heard of Abu Grahib had a digital camera not been involved (they've since been banned, of course), there is likely a whole lot more of this kind of atrocity going on that we haven't heard a thing about. Certainly, there is great good being done by dedicated Americans, who comprise the majority of those over there. But the Army is missing it's recruiting goals badly and has relaxed the standards significantly, so there are more bad apples getting in, and thus more chances for this kind of thing to happen. And history shows us that even good men, placed in a hellish environment, can reach the end of their mental and emotional ropes and do horrible things. Up to a quarter of returning servicemen suffer from some aspect of PTSD.

The larger goal of this film, though, is to show a part of that war - the effect on average Iraqis - that Americans never get to see since the information flow has been so well-managed by the military. This war has been hell on them, fully a sixth of the population has either fled their homes or is trying to get out. The civilian casualties have been estimated to be well over 100,000. The people live in constant fear; 80% of the remaining population wants us to leave. If we did, it is my belief that they would step up and solve their problems internally because they would have to. Our presence there just gives all sides an object to hate and props up a disfuctional national government that lacks to will to compromise.

This movie is important if it gets people to think about the consequences of our invasion and occupation that have been well hidden from them. Most Americans have sacrificed nothing for this war; the same can't be said for the Iraqis. Well done, HDNet; thank you for producing and showing this film. As one can see from the comments on this thread, it was terribly necessary that someone step up and do something like this.
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post #16 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 05:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foxeng View Post

No, it is one of those HDNet premieres that if you missed it you can go to your local multiplex next week and pay $10 to see it (honestly). In my opinion, save your money. You haven't missed anything. It isn't that good of a film.

Hope Cuban is happy. After this film is used for propaganda in the Middle East, it will probably cost the lives of some American service men.

Now I sort of hope that HDNET is in an extra cost tier on D*. That will allow me to vote with my wallet on Cuban's placing of politics above the safety of our men and overall good of our country.
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post #17 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 05:32 AM
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Well said, archi.

Quote:
Originally Posted by audiomagnate View Post

Is this one of those HDNet premiers that if you missed it you're out of luck for six or seven months? I just got an HD DVD player so I've been out of the loop on programming. As to all the hatefull comments, hasn't HDNET been doing the State of the Union address for the last couple of years? I find that repulsive so I don't watch it.

As was mentioned, it was a once and done. Like many movies, they end up on HDNET at some point in the future. Being as Mark Cuban stepped up to the plate and presented the exclusive on this one, I think the odds would be good you can see it in a year or two.

Yes, many of the comments are unfortunate. However, it is their right to express them even though I think they are misdirected. Hopefully, they don’t cause harm to our troops.

A squirrel has been eating my tomatoes, so I took my AK-47 and shot him with an armor-piercing bullet. Unfortunately, it also went through my neighbor's car and his neighbors SUV before being stopped by a propane truck filling his neighbors tank. Half of the neighborhood is now gone, but so is that damn squirrel.
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post #18 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 05:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlb View Post

Hope Cuban is happy. After this film is used for propaganda in the Middle East, it will probably cost the lives of some American service men.

Now I sort of hope that HDNET is in an extra cost tier on D*. That will allow me to vote with my wallet on Cuban's placing of politics above the safety of our men and overall good of our country.

In fact, you may want to save some of your vitriol against the production company. DePalma was incensed that the final montage of real Iraqi faces was itself "redacted" by the producers (they said they would need releases from the people shown, or their families if they were dead), thereby robbing the film of it's intended powerful ending - the face of the real Iraq impacted by this war.
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post #19 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 05:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AUDIOMAGNET View Post

As to all the hatefull comments, hasn't HDNET been doing the State of the Union address for the last couple of years? I find that repulsive so I don't watch it.



What hate? The only I hate that’s apparent here is from Brian Depalma and Mark Cuban towards the US.

Regarding your joke, this is not funny nor logical since the STOU is on many channels.

Larry

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post #20 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 05:50 AM
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Originally Posted by LL3HD View Post

What hate? The only I hate that's apparent here is from Brian Depalma and Mark Cuban towards the US.

Regarding your joke, this is not funny nor logical since the STOU is on many channels.

Uh, I think you're responding to the wrong quote/post.

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post #21 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 05:55 AM
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Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

... you're being especially naive.

...our invasion and occupation that have been well hidden from them.




Would you be interested in seeing a movie that showed how the US and our troops have helped the Iraqi people?

Or do you think that hasn't happened?

Do you actually think that this small incident is occurring many times over?

Larry

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post #22 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxman View Post

Uh, I think you're responding to the wrong quote/post.


Larry

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post #23 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 06:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LL3HD View Post




Would you be interested in seeing a movie that showed how the US and our troops have helped the Iraqi people?

Or do you think that hasn’t happened?

Do you actually think that this small incident is occurring many times over?

Of course not, Larry. As I mentioned in my post, there is great good being done, or at least tying to be done by the vast majority of American servicemen and contractors over there. They're doing the best they can in a very difficult situation. And we hear about those things all the time (especially if we watch the FNC). What we don't hear much about is the effect of the war on average Iraqis; they've been living in hell the last 4 years. And just like Abu Grihab (sorry about the spelling) was certainly not the only isolated incident of prisoner abuse happening theater-wide (and none of the superior officers who permitted, if not ordered, that behavior have even been accused, much less convicted), it's also not logical to assume that the events of this movie are equally isolated, especially when there are similar reports floating around from other returning servicemen. The recent Blackwater atrocity (not an isolated incident either; there have been hundreds of similar events reported) is "endangering our troops" far more than this little movie will. For democracy to work, all sides must be heard. DePalma has tried, with this film, to put a human face on the Iraqi tragedy. To think that this will suddenly cause Muslims to view the U.S. in a bad light is rather comical. They live this war every day, unlike most Americans. They also see the 14 permanent military bases (ringing the oil fields) as well as the half-billion dollar U.S. embassy under construction while they beg for water and electricity to be available a couple of hours a day.
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post #24 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 07:13 AM
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Ok ... now that all the points, knee-jerk reactions and counter-points have been made, perhaps it's time to close it before it gets out of hand ... and I loose my will to resist.
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post #25 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 07:47 AM
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Since this thread is about reviews...

http://movies.nytimes.com/2007/11/16...reda.html?8dpc

NY TIMES
Rage, Fear and Revulsion: At War With the War

By A. O. SCOTT
Published: November 16, 2007

Brian De Palma's Redacted, a prizewinner in Venice and a polarizing selection at film festivals in Telluride, Toronto and New York, is one of a slew of new American movies that try to deal with the war in Iraq and related matters. Their moods and methods vary widely Redacted is furious and confrontational; Robert Redford's Lions for Lambs is pedagogical and talky; Paul Haggis's In the Valley of Elah is mournful and unsettled but I find myself drawn, in each case, to more or less the same conclusion. I am glad the movie was made, and I wish it were better.

In the case of Redacted such ambivalence may seem strange, since the film traffics in, and clearly means to provoke, strong, unbalanced emotions. Its dominant notes are rage, fear and revulsion. Mr. De Palma's premise, implicit in his choice of title and stated in many interviews and public pronouncements, is that the truth about Iraq has been edited and obscured, kept away from the American public. Debatable as this claim may be, Mr. De Palma has tried to fill the gaps in our understanding to bring us face to face with what we have been unable to see or unwilling to acknowledge with a collage of raw images and angry arguments.

An unrivaled master of showy cinematic technique, he has made a film whose governing conceit is that it is not a film at all but rather a palimpsest of found video culled from consumer-grade camcorders, surveillance cameras, cellphones and Web sites. (There are also snippets from a French documentary, a mischievous parody complete with portentous music and solemn narration.) Redacted takes us on a tour not only of the battlefield, but also of the modern media environment, where no moment goes unrecorded and where everyone is, at least potentially, a filmmaker.

Angel Salazar (Izzy Diaz), a soldier in an especially dangerous part of Iraq, dreams of a career in Hollywood and imagines that his video diary will be his ticket to fame. When he isn't turning the camera on himself, he shoves it in the faces of his comrades in arms and in the process captures their boredom and belligerence. He also reveals them to be figures familiar from just about every platoon picture since the 1940s.

There's the bespectacled egghead (Kel O'Neill), his nose buried in a book; the square-jawed, earnest Boy Scout type (Rob Devaney); and a pair of brutes (Daniel Stewart Sherman and Patrick Carroll), whose volatility will spark the film's central dramatic event.

This horrific, premeditated act the rape of a teenage girl, who is killed along with her family is based on a real atrocity that took place in Iraq last year. (The insurgent bomb and the beheading that frame this episode are also, obviously, grounded in reality.) The rape also recalls Casualties of War, Mr. De Palma's grievously misunderstood 1989 film about a similar incident in Vietnam. Both films walk a delicate line between moral investigation and exploitative sensationalism, and in both cases the measure of Mr. De Palma's artistic seriousness is his willingness to ask not only what it means to take part in an act of murderous sexual violence, but also what it means to represent it and to watch the representation.

The problem with Redacted is that the representation is an unwieldy hodgepodge of brutal naturalism and self-conscious theatricality, its potential power undermined by schematic storytelling and clumsy acting. What those handheld, low-definition recording devices capture is less unvarnished reality or a persuasive simulacrum of it than dinner theater or underrehearsed made-for-television drama.

The script stuffs the characters' mouths with talking points that are no less schematic for being rendered in a profane, macho, pseudomilitary vernacular. And most of the actors, many of them appearing for the first time in a feature film, lack either the skill or the directorial guidance to endow their characters with a full range of credible motives and responses.



Its formal novelty aside, Redacted rarely hits the audience with a genuine shock or a clarifying insight. It churns through a set of ideas and emotions that are confusing and unpleasant, to be sure, but also, by now, dispiritingly familiar. This is not entirely Mr. De Palma's fault, though I think he may have misdiagnosed the condition of the audience, which is not lack of information about Iraq but rather a pervasive moral and political paralysis. The information is out there confusing and painful, yes, but nonetheless available for discussion and analysis.

And now what? What are we supposed to do? Support the troops? End the war? Push ahead to victory? Stand up for what we believe? These are slogans, not actions.

Making a movie, of course, is a way of doing something, and I am grateful that Mr. De Palma brought such conviction to the task. Redacted is certainly a painful document of its time, a record of anguish, confusion and uncertainty. And if Mr. De Palma has in the end failed to transcend those feelings or to address them with the clarity and freshness of perspective that art requires and that the times so desperately demand, the failure is hardly his alone.



Redacted is rated R (Under 17 requires accompanying parent or adult guardian). It has abundant obscenity and scenes of extreme violence.

REDACTED

Opens today in New York and selected cities.

Written and directed by Brian De Palma; director of photography, Jonathon Cliff; edited by Bill Pankow; production designer, Phillip Barker; produced by Jason Kliot, Simone Urdl, Joana Vicente and Jennifer Weiss; released by HDNet Films and Magnolia Pictures. Running time: 90 minutes.

WITH: Izzy Diaz (Angel Salazar), Daniel Stewart Sherman (B. B. Rush), Patrick Carroll (Reno Flake), Mike Figueroa (Sgt. Jim Ross), Ty Jones (Master Sgt. Sweet), Rob Devaney (Lawyer McCoy), Kel O'Neill (Gabe Blix), Zahara Al Zubaidi (Farah) and Bridget Barkan (Judy McCoy).

Larry

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post #26 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 08:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

...To think that this will suddenly cause Muslims to view the U.S. in a bad light is rather comical. .

Quite the contrary, do you recall how the Muslim world reacted to several denigrating comic strips. There were riots and people were killed. I think it's naïve to assume that this is not going to incite young influential Muslims. They don't all hate us but this certainly will persuade rage. The anger should be directed at those that committed the atrocities and are being punished for it.

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post #27 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 08:11 AM
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We (the coalition) are the good guys.

Peace.

A.L.a.E.o.t.U.S., as proven 3/21 - never forget.
Defend liberty.
Knowledge isn't Truth; it's just mindless agreement.
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post #28 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

If one believes that the real-life incident dramatized by this film is the only one of it's kind, an isolated incident, and is mollified by those men being in prison, so now we can get on with the noble job of bringing American-style democracy to a country that desperately wants it, then you're being especially naive. Just like we never would have heard of Abu Grahib had a digital camera not been involved (they've since been banned, of course), there is likely a whole lot more of this kind of atrocity going on that we haven't heard a thing about. Certainly, there is great good being done by dedicated Americans, who comprise the majority of those over there. But the Army is missing it's recruiting goals badly and has relaxed the standards significantly, so there are more bad apples getting in, and thus more chances for this kind of thing to happen. And history shows us that even good men, placed in a hellish environment, can reach the end of their mental and emotional ropes and do horrible things. Up to a quarter of returning servicemen suffer from some aspect of PTSD.

The larger goal of this film, though, is to show a part of that war - the effect on average Iraqis - that Americans never get to see since the information flow has been so well-managed by the military. This war has been hell on them, fully a sixth of the population has either fled their homes or is trying to get out. The civilian casualties have been estimated to be well over 100,000. The people live in constant fear; 80% of the remaining population wants us to leave. If we did, it is my belief that they would step up and solve their problems internally because they would have to. Our presence there just gives all sides an object to hate and props up a disfuctional national government that lacks to will to compromise.

This movie is important if it gets people to think about the consequences of our invasion and occupation that have been well hidden from them. Most Americans have sacrificed nothing for this war; the same can't be said for the Iraqis. Well done, HDNet; thank you for producing and showing this film. As one can see from the comments on this thread, it was terribly necessary that someone step up and do something like this.


I hate to assume, but I will here anyway, that Depalma, Cuban or you have never been in or worked around the military, let alone combat. You could not be more wrong about your talking points, but than again, I guess a website or newspaper is more honest the soldier with his/her feet on the ground.
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post #29 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by IAM4UK View Post

We (the coalition) are the good guys.

Peace.


To paraphrase Obi-Wan Kenobi:

".....from a certain point of view".

Look...I love my country. I really do. That being said, I hate the current administration. Not because they are Republican (although the GOP that was once great - the Goldwater days - no longer exists. Got hijacked by Bible thumpers & mega corporations). But because of the utter lack of intelligent leadership and honesty. One giant Bush/Cheney/Condie bungle/lie after another. Iraq being the biggest.

Why did we invade them again? They had WMDs? Where are they? Harboring terorists? Well, they are now that Saddam is gone!

We should have stayed in Afghanistan, found & killed Bin Laden, and kept on tracking/taking out Al Qaeda and it's ilk.

What did we do instead? We invade Iraq. A country that had ZERO to do with 9/11 (the call to war in the 1st place). Why? So W. could get done what Daddy failed to do (and had the foresight NOT to do?) or 'cause that mean old Saddam Hussein put a hit out on Pops?

Or maybe 'cause there's a s**tload of oil under Iraqi soil that's just waiting to get pumped into American SUVs and filtered thru the wallets of a few rich Bush buddies?

This entire war has been a failure. Even the most ardent Bush supporter - a very lonely crowd these days--must see who badly the administration has handled...well...everything! If you don't.....well..forget it. No need to insult idiots.

Just remember, "When Clinton lied....NO ONE DIED!" (and no...I am not a Democrat...or Republican. Call me a rationalist)

Money does not buy happiness. It can, however, buy you a giant boat that you can pull up alongside happiness. - David Lee Roth

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post #30 of 49 Old 11-16-2007, 08:30 AM
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Yes, jwebb. The certain point of view is known as "objective reality."

A.L.a.E.o.t.U.S., as proven 3/21 - never forget.
Defend liberty.
Knowledge isn't Truth; it's just mindless agreement.
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