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post #271 of 2580 Old 01-25-2008, 05:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Unless Monsters HD has changed dramatically from when Voom was still a DBS service - I'd stack that single channel up against almost any other single mainstream channel. Personally, I'd pay close to HBO money for that channel.
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post #272 of 2580 Old 01-25-2008, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CPanther95 View Post

Unless Monsters HD has changed dramatically from when Voom was still a DBS service - I'd stack that single channel up against almost any other single mainstream channel. Personally, I'd pay close to HBO money for that channel.

It has changed. They run a 3 movie loop for each day. We could use some new movies.
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post #273 of 2580 Old 01-26-2008, 06:35 AM
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Originally Posted by CPanther95 View Post

Unless Monsters HD has changed dramatically from when Voom was still a DBS service - I'd stack that single channel up against almost any other single mainstream channel. Personally, I'd pay close to HBO money for that channel.

I agree 100% with you. Monstershd has went down hill the last few months. It almost seems they have lost their budget. I hope that isn't the case.
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post #274 of 2580 Old 01-26-2008, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Vampz26 View Post

D*'s HD lineup hasn't fully 'matured' yet, so most folks see no reason to switch from E* until it does...

Oh - have you gotten the 4th quarter results already?

While I don't profess to know if DISH's churn will even be higher than it was last quarter, or what the gross and net sub numbers for both will be - I believe it will be a fantastic quarter for DirecTV, and a 2nd consecutive down quarter for DISH. They as much as said so in the last quarter's conference call.

We shall see in maybe 2-3 weeks when the numbers come out.
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post #275 of 2580 Old 01-27-2008, 06:22 AM
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Originally Posted by ScoBuck View Post

Oh - have you gotten the 4th quarter results already?

While I don't profess to know if DISH's churn will even be higher than it was last quarter, or what the gross and net sub numbers for both will be - I believe it will be a fantastic quarter for DirecTV, and a 2nd consecutive down quarter for DISH. They as much as said so in the last quarter's conference call.

We shall see in maybe 2-3 weeks when the numbers come out.

I wouldn't be surprised if you are correct. Look if I have decided to go D* you know the nail is on the E* coffin.

However to attribute those to the new HD channels, D* must show a much better net sub gain, and much larger share of high end receivers' subs, and E* has to show much worse churn and a reduction of HD subs.

It is a tall order to reach.
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post #276 of 2580 Old 01-27-2008, 10:25 AM
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Well, I finally upgraded to Dish HD a few days ago, and I love it already. This is my first HD experience, so I can't compare it to D*, but I think the pq is great. Even on my locals....I was using rabbit ears to get my locals before, and I think the quality is just as good.

As far as programming, I think the voom channels are cool, but I can see where they would get repetitive and boring, just like HBO, Cinemax, etc. IMHO all channels show the same crap over and over, we just have to decide how much of the different kinds of crap we want to pay for. I've had the AT250 pack for the past 4years without any premiums, and I haven't missed a thing. (Of course I would get the HBO pkg just for The Sopranos and canxld it between seasons....)

As far as channel count, I know E* will be lagging behind D*, but the competition is so fierce between the two, that E* will catch up in time. I'm willing to be patient, although getting that damn USA and SCI FI HD up and running would make the wait alot easier! F/X would be great, too!

This is just 2 cents from a regular HD viewer, not a crazy a/v or E* maniac, for what it's worth.
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post #277 of 2580 Old 01-27-2008, 02:30 PM
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I've been a dish network customer for 3 years now. Been fairly happy with them. Originally went with them because of more HD channels. About 3 months ago I got the urge to switch to Directv. I called Dish and told them I was going to and explained to them why. They said more HD is on the way, just wait. Finally after 3 months they announce at CES that they are adding more channels. Now I want to know what channels. It doesn't make sense to me that you can announce a number but no one knows what is being added. How did you know the number if you do not know what channels are coming? I'm tired of waiting, Directv installers coming on Friday. Kind of sad since I have been a fairly happy customer but the Directv kool0aid is looking a lot sweeter right now. The one thing to remember is when Directv said they were increasing the number of HD channels, they presented a list of what was being added. This sounds more to me that Dish is just trying to buy some more time so customers like me don't starting drinking Directv's kool-aid.
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post #278 of 2580 Old 01-27-2008, 03:43 PM
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The main reason for me to switch to D* is actually not about the new HD channels, but the E* 4-tuner lease policy. To get the 3rd and 4th HDDVR my cost would be around $1,000. I have not been able to convince E* they need to ditch that policy.

With D* I will get 4 HDDVRs for $536, $99 each for the first two from D*, $169 each for the other two from Costco. That combined with the AAA member special I am getting $30/mo. off for the first year, $10/mo. off for the second year, not to mention $50 off for autopay, $50 off from friends referral, another $50 off for paying with a certain credit card. On top of that I get free showtime for one year.

Now you can understand that new HD channels became almost an afterthought, yet ultimately I have figured that for at least 2008, maybe even into 2009, E* will not be able to come close to D*'s HD offering. The switch becomes a no brainer.
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post #279 of 2580 Old 01-27-2008, 05:25 PM
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Hmmm AAA discount? Does E* offer any kind of monthly discounts? Oddly, I didn't think of asking.
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post #280 of 2580 Old 01-27-2008, 05:29 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacmyoung View Post

The main reason for me to switch to D* is actually not about the new HD channels, but the E* 4-tuner lease policy. To get the 3rd and 4th HDDVR my cost would be around $1,000. I have not been able to convince E* they need to ditch that policy.

With D* I will get 4 HDDVRs for $536, $99 each for the first two from D*, $169 each for the other two from Costco. That combined with the AAA member special I am getting $30/mo. off for the first year, $10/mo. off for the second year, not to mention $50 off for autopay, $50 off from friends referral, another $50 off for paying with a certain credit card. On top of that I get free showtime for one year.

Now you can understand that new HD channels became almost an afterthought, yet ultimately I have figured that for at least 2008, maybe even into 2009, E* will not be able to come close to D*'s HD offering. The switch becomes a no brainer.

Now is that D* equipment your talking about...is that a lease? When I switched to E*, I got the HD-DVR for about 250 while D* was hawking the HDTivo for 699. I take it the "you own IT so we own YOU" policy isn't in effect anymore?

As for whether or not E* will be able to come close to D*'s HD offering by2009, I'm still waiting for D* to come close to what D* says they are offering in 2008! As I've said, thats all I'm really waiting for. And quite honestly, (and I readily acknowledge, to each their own here...) if D* were to offer some compelling HD programming centered around the fine arts, such as GalleryHD, TreasureHD, or EquatorHD, that would really be enough for me (Hence my interest in whats on SmithsonianHD)
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post #281 of 2580 Old 01-27-2008, 07:00 PM
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D* has been leasing for a while now. Their HDDVR upfront cost has gone down just most recently to $99, up to two if you are an AAA member.

If VOOM is your thing, I can't say you will get it from D* anytime soon. I will miss World Cinema once I switch, but I need 4 HDDVRs, whoever can give them to me for less will get my money, everything else is just icing on the cake.
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post #282 of 2580 Old 01-27-2008, 10:30 PM
 
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Originally Posted by jacmyoung View Post

D* has been leasing for a while now. Their HDDVR upfront cost has gone down just most recently to $99, up to two if you are an AAA member.

If VOOM is your thing, I can't say you will get it from D* anytime soon. I will miss World Cinema once I switch, but I need 4 HDDVRs, whoever can give them to me for less will get my money, everything else is just icing on the cake.

No one can blame you...I choose to remain a one TV household so I don't have the hardware needs to worry about. But I'll give you a lot of credit, you made the move when it was right for you, and now you have something more in your hands than just a 'promise', ya know?

Seriously though, do me a favor and let us know what its like on the other side. Smith-HD and MGM-HD are of interest to me personally, but I am literally dying for some impartial feedback around here...you just may be the one person capable of giving it! Start a thread and hopefully the mods in their infinite wisdom give you a sticky, because your feedback, given that its without prejudice, may be just what this forum needs...

Cheers!
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post #283 of 2580 Old 01-27-2008, 11:38 PM
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So both are still charging for Equipment? They expect you to pay out of pocket money and pay a $5.00 Month DVR fee?

Wow, guess I wont be switching from Cable before my locked in rate expires (8-08), and if they ever expect me to come back, they better forget about equipment expense altogether, cause I refuse to go that route ever again, and another thing....they still use the 61.5 Sat? Yeah, I want to put up 2 Dishes again on my new Roof ...not going to happen.

I am getting pretty darn close to going OTA only, as its getting out of control price wise, and in the end you never get what you really want without adding this or adding that. Same old argument.

Give me 5 alacart SD Channels, 10 alacart HD Channels including one Premium(HBO etc) and my RSN in HD for $30.00 a Month and I am happy, but nope, never going to happen.
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post #284 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 06:00 AM
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Originally Posted by bigrushhead View Post

So both are still charging for Equipment? They expect you to pay out of pocket money and pay a $5.00 Month DVR fee?

Wow, guess I wont be switching from Cable before my locked in rate expires (8-08), and if they ever expect me to come back, they better forget about equipment expense altogether, cause I refuse to go that route ever again, and another thing....they still use the 61.5 Sat? Yeah, I want to put up 2 Dishes again on my new Roof ...not going to happen.

I am getting pretty darn close to going OTA only, as its getting out of control price wise, and in the end you never get what you really want without adding this or adding that. Same old argument.

Give me 5 alacart SD Channels, 10 alacart HD Channels including one Premium(HBO etc) and my RSN in HD for $30.00 a Month and I am happy, but nope, never going to happen.

You can lease up to 2 HDDVRs from E* without putting up any front money, beyond that is what I have to pay up.

Vampz26, I am not an expert in A/B comparison but will try to be objective. Now if E*'s TV2 on its HDDVR can be HD capable I will not have to go through the trouble to switch. Even if E* can somehow lease me two more HDDVRs, the monthly DVR fee is still not competitive with D*. D* charges only one DVR fee per account, E* wants the DVR fee per receiver. It can get expensive.
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post #285 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 07:32 AM
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I think upfront costs are BS too and that's what keeps me away from D* at this point. Did E* just start the leasing of the 2nd HDDVR for free? I put together a dish package with them earlier this month and they wanted to charge me for a 2nd HDDVR. If I remember right I could get up to 4 standard receivers for free, but not HDDVR's.
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post #286 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by jacmyoung View Post

You can lease up to 2 HDDVRs from E* without putting up any front money, beyond that is what I have to pay up.

Vampz26, I am not an expert in A/B comparison but will try to be objective. Now if E*'s TV2 on its HDDVR can be HD capable I will not have to go through the trouble to switch. Even if E* can somehow lease me two more HDDVRs, the monthly DVR fee is still not competitive with D*. D* charges only one DVR fee per account, E* wants the DVR fee per receiver. It can get expensive.

D* may only charge one DVR fee per account, but jeez your paying, what 600bucks to get two DVR's? I think I'd rather pay the two DVR monthly fees vs eating that much up front money.
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post #287 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 08:00 AM
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Originally Posted by scott72 View Post

D* may only charge one DVR fee per account, but jeez your paying, what 600bucks to get two DVR's? I think I'd rather pay the two DVR monthly fees vs eating that much up front money.

I thought D* was only charging $99 up front per HD DVR ?
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post #288 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigrushhead View Post

So both are still charging for Equipment? They expect you to pay out of pocket money and pay a $5.00 Month DVR fee?

Wow, guess I wont be switching from Cable before my locked in rate expires (8-08), and if they ever expect me to come back, they better forget about equipment expense altogether, cause I refuse to go that route ever again, and another thing....they still use the 61.5 Sat? Yeah, I want to put up 2 Dishes again on my new Roof ...not going to happen.

I am getting pretty darn close to going OTA only, as its getting out of control price wise, and in the end you never get what you really want without adding this or adding that. Same old argument.

Give me 5 alacart SD Channels, 10 alacart HD Channels including one Premium(HBO etc) and my RSN in HD for $30.00 a Month and I am happy, but nope, never going to happen.

The premium by itself is like $15/month. Otherwise that $30 isn't too unreasonable.
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post #289 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 08:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by guffy1 View Post

I thought D* was only charging $99 up front per HD DVR ?


D* charges $199 per HD DVR, but every 6 months you can get one for $99 (without haggling).

As far as the lease fee, it is offset by the dropping of the $5 mirror fee. You pay one or the other - never both (on an individual receiver).

I don't know about other areas of the country, but D* and E* blow away my local cable company for equipment rental/lease/mirror fees.
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post #290 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by jacmyoung View Post

I wouldn't be surprised if you are correct. Look if I have decided to go D* you know the nail is on the E* coffin.

However to attribute those to the new HD channels, D* must show a much better net sub gain, and much larger share of high end receivers' subs, and E* has to show much worse churn and a reduction of HD subs.

It is a tall order to reach.

Exactly why I say we need to see the numbers - due out shortly.
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post #291 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 08:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scott72 View Post

I think upfront costs are BS too and that's what keeps me away from D* at this point. Did E* just start the leasing of the 2nd HDDVR for free? I put together a dish package with them earlier this month and they wanted to charge me for a 2nd HDDVR. If I remember right I could get up to 4 standard receivers for free, but not HDDVR's.

No officially only one free HDDVR, but many got the second after some haggling. I got my second free 622 over 18 months ago.

D* HDDVR is currently $99 for the 1st one, some of us got the second one at $99 too. Like CPanther95 said, once an established D* sub you can get $99 HDDVR deal from time to time.

The worst case go to Costco and get one added on for $169, D* will include free installation for you.
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post #292 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 09:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Numbers are just as likely to reflect the ignorance/gullibility of the public.

D* was extremely effective against cable during their 2-3 year "HD waiting period" with their "100% Digital" message. If you asked most people about picture quality, they'd say D*'s was superior. Any D* sub who has watched an SD program on SciFi HD and compares it to SciFi (SD) sees just how poor "digital" can be.
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post #293 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 09:45 AM
 
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Numbers are just as likely to reflect the ignorance/gullibility of the public.

Thats kind of what a successful marketing campaign is...
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post #294 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 10:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Yep. 50% get your message out. 50% get people to do what you want them to do.
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post #295 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 10:22 AM
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Numbers are just as likely to reflect the ignorance/gullibility of the public.

So you are also saying that they might also reflect reality.
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post #296 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 10:31 AM - Thread Starter
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D* will certainly get a well earned HD bump with this recent rollout (we all better hope so) - but the competition has time to respond. The vast majority can't afford, or have no desire, to switch providers everytime a provider has a more appealing offering.
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post #297 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by CPanther95 View Post

D* will certainly get a well earned HD bump with this recent rollout (we all better hope so) - but the competition has time to respond. The vast majority can't afford, or have no desire, to switch providers everytime a provider has a more appealing offering.

I tend to agree with what you say here for sure.

And that has nothing to do with a bias. It has to do with the facts that sales of HDTVs are WAY UP, including millions of first time buyers. Those are the people that have lots of questions, and in the huge mega-stores like CC and BB - they will be guided by a $300 savings on the TV as well as the other new customer offers from D* (and commisssions to the CC and BB store clerks), and the now reduced price of the HD-DVR. It has to do with Oct-Jan being the PEAK TV buying season, culminating with the SuperBowl. It has to do with the unfortunate circumstances that had DN's sats get delayed last year -and also the mounting frustration since DN is not being as forthcoming about it's plans as they should be at this time. So, without having any need to lay blame, it just appears that the cards have been dealt at this time to favor DirecTV.

And in the opposite, it those don't give DirecTV a kick-ass quarter, that will say just as much the other way. I just don't expect for that outcome. And as I have been saying, I await the results.
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post #298 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by ScoBuck View Post

...give DirecTV a kick-ass quarter, ...

Judging from the recent D* stock upgrade and performance you may be right that people on the inside already got the word what a kick-ass quarter D* got in Q4.

I have another reason to inclined to think that way, the new D* installs are backed up by nearly two weeks in my region, but of course it may just be that no one wants to install for D* since they pay so little. Simply does not make ends meet for ya in California.
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post #299 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 12:07 PM
 
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I tend to agree with what you say here for sure.

And that has nothing to do with a bias. It has to do with the facts that sales of HDTVs are WAY UP, including millions of first time buyers. Those are the people that have lots of questions, and in the huge mega-stores like CC and BB - they will be guided by a $300 savings on the TV as well as the other new customer offers from D* (and commisssions to the CC and BB store clerks), and the now reduced price of the HD-DVR. It has to do with Oct-Jan being the PEAK TV buying season, culminating with the SuperBowl. It has to do with the unfortunate circumstances that had DN's sats get delayed last year -and also the mounting frustration since DN is not being as forthcoming about it's plans as they should be at this time. So, without having any need to lay blame, it just appears that the cards have been dealt at this time to favor DirecTV.

And in the opposite, it those don't give DirecTV a kick-ass quarter, that will say just as much the other way. I just don't expect for that outcome. And as I have been saying, I await the results.

So I take it that we are all in agreement that any growth experienced by any service provider is the end result of successful marketing just as it always has been?

After all, joe average who's actually the one purchasing their first HDTV really has no clue what sats are being launched, what PQ is, or how much content or what kind of content is on these channels. They can only go by what they hear, which is usually provided by the advertising...

Now...last I checked this was the topic:
"Dish Network to add 24 HD channels in 2008 - 40 HD channels for $30 a month (no SD)! "

Hmmm....I see no reason to hijack this thread when there is still plenty of valid topical information to discuss...

Like for example: Will anyone consider this $30 dollar HD option from E* a lower cost opportunity to perhaps evaluate both D* and E*side by side for a while? Thats what I'm currently considering. I'm just trying to figure out if its worth it or not...
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post #300 of 2580 Old 01-28-2008, 12:20 PM
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Not without the RSN's, in my opinion.
Rammitinski is offline  
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