will cable boxes and satellite receivers stop having component video outputs anytime soon?? - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 19 Old 04-25-2014, 04:44 PM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
blue21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 4
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10

hi im new and i have a question ( maybe a really foolish one)

does any one her think or know if cable boxes and satellite receivers will stop having component video outputs anytime soon  now that almost everything has hdmi  im also curious about this because i want to get  a ELGATO EYE TV HD RECEIVER to watch tv on my mac but it only supports component video and if cable boxes and satellite receivers stop having them then it will be useless .
 
blue21 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 19 Old 04-26-2014, 09:09 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
wajo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 14,050
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
Liked: 134

You've got two things going for you with RGB output retention:

 

1. The so-called "analog sunset" law, which only applies to Bluray players and recorders, specifically prohibits the disabling of analog outputs on cable and satellite boxes, as described here.

 

2. RGB can be in two formats, analog YPbPr or digital YCbCr, the latter being the format used to produce commercial DVDs. Also, many HDTVs are digital YCbCr capable. So the digital aspect of RGB may help retain those outputs.

 

However, I haven't found any prohibition against cable and sat companies simply NOT INCLUDING Component outputs



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
wajo is offline  
post #3 of 19 Old 04-26-2014, 12:14 PM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
blue21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 4
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10

so its safe to say the cable and sat boxes will keep having componet video outputs for the year to come??

blue21 is offline  
post #4 of 19 Old 04-26-2014, 02:22 PM
AVS Special Member
 
olyteddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,324
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 102 Post(s)
Liked: 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue21 View Post

so its safe to say the cable and sat boxes will keep having componet video outputs for the year to come??
The only thing that's safe to say is that if you have component outputs on the device you have now they won't turn them off.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
(Just as big an idea thief as)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
olyteddy is offline  
post #5 of 19 Old 04-26-2014, 03:50 PM
Advanced Member
 
Mark12547's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Salem, Oregon, United States
Posts: 620
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 140 Post(s)
Liked: 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by olyteddy View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue21 View Post

so its safe to say the cable and sat boxes will keep having componet video outputs for the year to come??
The only thing that's safe to say is that if you have component outputs on the device you have now they won't turn them off.

 

True. It wouldn't surprise me if some future model kills "unpopular" outputs to save money, possibly leaving only composite video and HDMI, or even just HDMI.

 

For example, the Roku 3 (the top-of-the-line Roku product), XBox One, and Apple TV all have only HDMI output for the TV, saving the costs of supplying other video outputs. When engineering a product that will have hundreds of thousands of units made, saving a ten cent part here and a solder joint there adds up, and with the popularity of HDMI ports for HDTV, the trend is towards having just HDMI output for the high-definition signal for the TV. Also, by having fewer (or just one) outputs allows for simpler design and potentially shorten time from concept to delivery.

 

So it wouldn't surprise me at all if future HD boxes from cable companies have only HDMI output. Also, if content providers start insisting that any new boxes deplyed by cable companies don't have component video (which doesn't have a standard form of copy protection, unlike Magnavision for composite video and HDCP for HDMI), this may come about sooner rather than later.


My very humble setup:
Man Cave:Vizio E500i-A1 "Smart TV" (50-in 1080p 120Hz LED/LCD, has Netflix app.), Blu-ray players (Sony BDP-S3100, old LG BD390), Roku (the original model: N1000), PC (Windows 7), Comcast Internet (25Mbps/5Mbps).
Bedroom:LG 32LV3400-UA TV (32-in 768p 60Hz LED/LCD), HD DVR (Motorola RNG200N), Xfinity Comcast cable (Digital Starter Package), DVD/VHS player.
Mark12547 is offline  
post #6 of 19 Old 04-26-2014, 04:20 PM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
blue21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 4
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10

oh ok i see thankyou everbody for your help 

blue21 is offline  
post #7 of 19 Old 04-26-2014, 08:19 PM
AVS Special Member
 
blueiedgod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Amherst, NY
Posts: 1,557
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 78 Post(s)
Liked: 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue21 View Post

i want to get  a ELGATO EYE TV HD RECEIVER to watch tv on my mac

Why re-invent the wheel?

Windows 7 natively supports encrypted and copyright protected cable through a CableCARD tuner, provides the TV listing guide, and allow you to record and playback TV shows on up to 6 TV screens across home network.

6 TV's in the house on FiOS and we only pay $4.99/month to connect them all!!! Power to the CableCard and WMC7!!!
blueiedgod is offline  
post #8 of 19 Old 04-26-2014, 09:20 PM
AVS Special Member
 
olyteddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,324
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 102 Post(s)
Liked: 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueiedgod View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by blue21 View Post

i want to get  a ELGATO EYE TV HD RECEIVER to watch tv on my mac

Why re-invent the wheel?

Windows 7 natively supports encrypted and copyright protected cable through a CableCARD tuner, provides the TV listing guide, and allow you to record and playback TV shows on up to 6 TV screens across home network.
Because he has a Mac? biggrin.gif


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
(Just as big an idea thief as)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
olyteddy is offline  
post #9 of 19 Old 04-26-2014, 09:36 PM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
blue21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 4
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10

i did consider a cable card tunner  and run windows on my imac with bootcamp  but the thing is that imac uses  DisplayPort for the video connection between the mainboard and the display and windows media center does not consider displayport as hdcp compliant for some reason .

blue21 is offline  
post #10 of 19 Old 04-27-2014, 05:17 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Ken.F's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: West Rockhill, PA
Posts: 1,767
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 83 Post(s)
Liked: 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue21 View Post

i did consider a cable card tunner  and run windows on my imac with bootcamp  but the thing is that imac uses  DisplayPort for the video connection between the mainboard and the display and windows media center does not consider displayport as hdcp compliant for some reason .
I don't think the sat/cable companies will be doing away with component video connections on their STBs for a while. I don't know how many of their customers have TVs with component video and no HDMI, but it's probably more than they want to lose. I can imagine what would happen if they told those customers they had to buy a new TV to continue service.

Forum tip: Don't format your text color black. It's very hard to see by members that use the black forum skin.

Ken.F is offline  
post #11 of 19 Old 04-27-2014, 06:58 AM
AVS Special Member
 
blueiedgod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Amherst, NY
Posts: 1,557
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 78 Post(s)
Liked: 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by olyteddy View Post

Because he has a Mac? biggrin.gif

You mean he has an Apple OS in a PC? Unless he has an old Motorola based Mac, what he has is a PC that just happens to be loaded with an OS other than Windows. Very easy fix. Similar to what someone with a flavor of Linux be.

6 TV's in the house on FiOS and we only pay $4.99/month to connect them all!!! Power to the CableCard and WMC7!!!
blueiedgod is offline  
post #12 of 19 Old 04-27-2014, 06:59 AM
AVS Special Member
 
blueiedgod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Amherst, NY
Posts: 1,557
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 78 Post(s)
Liked: 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue21 View Post

i did consider a cable card tunner  and run windows on my imac with bootcamp  but the thing is that imac uses  DisplayPort for the video connection between the mainboard and the display and windows media center does not consider displayport as hdcp compliant for some reason .

Doesn't your "Mac" have expansion slots? PCIe, perhaps? A $10 video card can fix that easily.

6 TV's in the house on FiOS and we only pay $4.99/month to connect them all!!! Power to the CableCard and WMC7!!!
blueiedgod is offline  
post #13 of 19 Old 04-27-2014, 07:57 PM
Member
 
East Glenn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueiedgod View Post


Unless he has an old Motorola based Mac, what he has is a PC that just happens to be loaded with an OS other than Windows. 

 

LOL Now that's funny. :D Sad, but funny. :D

East Glenn is offline  
post #14 of 19 Old 04-28-2014, 05:56 PM
Advanced Member
 
Mark12547's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Salem, Oregon, United States
Posts: 620
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 140 Post(s)
Liked: 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken.F View Post

I don't think the sat/cable companies will be doing away with component video connections on their STBs for a while. I don't know how many of their customers have TVs with component video and no HDMI, but it's probably more than they want to lose. I can imagine what would happen if they told those customers they had to buy a new TV to continue service.

 

One site I saw while Googling had an old article that mentioned 3 million HDTVs lacked HDMI but had component video. Some of those TVs may have died by now, but that would presumably still leave a lot of customers that cable companies don't want to arbitrarily turn away.

 

On the other hand, I just came across a post on the Comcast Forums in the X1 section complaining that the latest box installed at that person's location had HDMI and RF NTSC (SD), but no component output. (link). That message was dated February 13, 2014, so it's only 2.5 months ago.

 

I suppose one could argue that the pre-HDMI HDTVs (if they were indeed TVs and not "monitors") had NTSC tuners so they would work with newer limited-outputs boxes, but that wouldn't be ideal. (In the above-mentioned thread, one person suggested a HDMI-to-component-video converter, and I would add: be sure it handles DHCP and you have a money-back guarantee in case the cable box and the converter won't work together.)

 

I think the only really safe thing to state is that if your current box has component video that works, then you currently have component video that works. (I doubt the cable company would send a software update that disables them, but they could, or force them to downgrade to just 480p or 480i. And if the box ever needs replacing, the replacement might lack component video.)

 

On the other hand, that box with its component video might out-last the box it will be connected to. (E.g., my first-generation, first-model Roku is now on its third TV.) Sometimes one ends up over-analyzing and fretting over something that finally just doesn't happen. (One commentator said that of all the bad things in his life that he worried about, only 10% actually happened. That is a lot of wasted worry.)


My very humble setup:
Man Cave:Vizio E500i-A1 "Smart TV" (50-in 1080p 120Hz LED/LCD, has Netflix app.), Blu-ray players (Sony BDP-S3100, old LG BD390), Roku (the original model: N1000), PC (Windows 7), Comcast Internet (25Mbps/5Mbps).
Bedroom:LG 32LV3400-UA TV (32-in 768p 60Hz LED/LCD), HD DVR (Motorola RNG200N), Xfinity Comcast cable (Digital Starter Package), DVD/VHS player.
Mark12547 is offline  
post #15 of 19 Old 04-28-2014, 07:13 PM
Member
 
JackRyan900's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 56
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 11

Pace makes the majority of the boxes.  If they decide to do it, they will remove those connections on boxes.  But then you lose a very large customer base, that does not subscribe to HD channels, still have older tv sets that do not use HDMI, or distribute the video to a non-hdmi capable projector.  Now of course there is nothing to state that the providers could just go in and write the code to block any output to the analog jacks.

 

But what would be the point in disabling something that is a huge cash cow for providers still.  Same goes with making having HD a luxury, not rolled into the package.  They want people to upgrade to HDTV's, is why they give you the choice of paying for that service or not.  Same with the analog jacks being on the boxes.  They know as I stated above, not every setup is the same as another.

JackRyan900 is offline  
post #16 of 19 Old 04-29-2014, 09:04 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
wajo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 14,050
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
Liked: 134

 

They *can't* disable existing analog outputs on cable/sat boxes.

 

Quote from article:

 

"The analog outputs of cable or satellite TV set-top boxes, including receivers or DVRs, are sometimes improperly associated with the analog sunset. In the United States, the FCC has a regulation, 47 CFR 76.1903, that explicitly prohibits the disabling of analog outputs on cable and satellite set-top boxes.... "

 

One exception granted: analog outputs can only be disabled for "newly created VOD, or video-on-demand services wherein first-run movies are made available before release on disc."

 

 

47 CFR 76.1903: http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/76.1903



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
wajo is offline  
post #17 of 19 Old 04-29-2014, 10:56 AM
Advanced Member
 
Mark12547's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Salem, Oregon, United States
Posts: 620
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 140 Post(s)
Liked: 119

I didn't know that.

 

However, that regulation doesn't seem to address whether or not an analog output, such as component video, could be downgraded to just SD quality. Have you come across anything that addresses that.


My very humble setup:
Man Cave:Vizio E500i-A1 "Smart TV" (50-in 1080p 120Hz LED/LCD, has Netflix app.), Blu-ray players (Sony BDP-S3100, old LG BD390), Roku (the original model: N1000), PC (Windows 7), Comcast Internet (25Mbps/5Mbps).
Bedroom:LG 32LV3400-UA TV (32-in 768p 60Hz LED/LCD), HD DVR (Motorola RNG200N), Xfinity Comcast cable (Digital Starter Package), DVD/VHS player.
Mark12547 is offline  
post #18 of 19 Old 04-29-2014, 11:10 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
wajo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 14,050
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
Liked: 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark12547 View Post
 

I didn't know that.

 

However, that regulation doesn't seem to address whether or not an analog output, such as component video, could be downgraded to just SD quality. Have you come across anything that addresses that.

 

I've read nothing but suspect the gov just nixed the "disabling" option. However,I suspect they've given mfgrs lots of wiggle-room in the words ... "so as to prevent its output through any analog or digital output authorized or permitted under license, law or regulation governing such covered product."

 

We'd have to know what OTHER "licenses, laws or regulations" apply, and what outputs are "authorized or permitted," and what "covered products" means in this regard, and the definition of "the" etc. etc. :D 



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
|
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
wajo is offline  
post #19 of 19 Old 04-29-2014, 11:21 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Ratman's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Collingswood, N.J.
Posts: 14,457
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 167 Post(s)
Liked: 286
Buy, enjoy and use what's available today. When "stuff" is sunsetted or about to become obsolete, worry when it happens. It's not worth chewing your fingernails to the nubs IMHO. tongue.gif
Ratman is offline  
Reply Cable, Digital Cable - Non-HDTV

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off