HD over Composite - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 07-18-2010, 12:31 PM - Thread Starter
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I have recently added an HD LED TV in my library with both a composite cable (from an Elan 8.6) and an HDMI cable (from a Denon AVR-5308CI). Oddly enough, the composite seems to handle HD just fine. For some material, it is almost more pleasing to the eye than the HDMI output from the BluRay player. Yes, I can apreciate that the HDMI is technically superior and has more detail, but sometimes the detail is subjectively less attractive to the eye (or maybe that it is MORE attractive and therefore distracting). This has been the opinion of several persons who have seen an A/B test.

The new TV is about 45' from the AV equipment but the cables (from Blue Jeans cable) seem to perform well at a distance (I also ran some tests with the TV is the same room with shorter cables with the same results).

Now, I realize that composite standards have much lower bandwith and that there can be issues with dot crawl, etc., but I am hard pressed to understand what allows me to get an excellent 16:9 high def. picture from a cable that almost everyone universally says cannot carry HD. Is it the cables? It can't be the Denon because I get similar results from the BluRay or STB running directly to the Elan.
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post #2 of 12 Old 07-18-2010, 01:02 PM
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Perhaps you've confused Composite (single yellow connector) which CANNOT carry HD, with Component (three connectors, R/G/B) which CAN carry HD just fine.
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post #3 of 12 Old 07-18-2010, 01:12 PM
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It is really simple, you are not getting an HD image over composite. And what you like is what you like.
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post #4 of 12 Old 07-18-2010, 03:02 PM
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If you are using just one cable, then it is composite. If you have three cables, it is component.

Anyone who understands television technology knows that composite can not carry HD. Composite is limited to a 480i signal. It's hard to believe you prefer the poor resolution and artifacts of a composite picture to HD, but if so, then you certainly don't need to waste money on a BluRay Player or HD service from your cable or satellite provider.

Do you prefer the sound of a 78 record to that from a CD?

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post #5 of 12 Old 07-18-2010, 09:36 PM
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Assuming you are confused between component/composite, and therefore are not legally blind , the reason you may see a difference (and a preference) of component vs. HDMI on the same set is likely that the TV has input-specific video settings. It may be that the brightness/contrast/color temp/etc. is significantly different (perhaps still set up in sales floor super-bright mode) than the other.

(and my apologies if you are actually legally blind...)

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post #6 of 12 Old 07-19-2010, 08:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crutschow View Post

Do you prefer the sound of a 78 record to that from a CD?

78, maybe not, but a 33.......that's a sweet sound

(yes, I'm one of those crazies. And the biggest difference is usually in the mastering)
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post #7 of 12 Old 07-20-2010, 07:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimre View Post

Perhaps you've confused Composite (single yellow connector) which CANNOT carry HD, with Component (three connectors, R/G/B) which CAN carry HD just fine.

No, I am not confused. It is a single composite cable vs HDMI.
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post #8 of 12 Old 07-20-2010, 07:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Colm View Post

It is really simple, you are not getting an HD image over composite. And what you like is what you like.

I do not normally prefer an inferior image rather I appreciate some content with less detail for the same reason that I prefer some French impressionist art to some by Dutch masters. It depends on the specific content.

Although it might so simple that I am not getting an HD image, I am getting an image that is far better than I would expect with composite AND I am getting it with 16:9 format.

This subjective evaluation is not just mine as I have several others that were taken back by the level of detail.

It would be nice to evaluate this more objectively. Any suggestions?
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post #9 of 12 Old 07-20-2010, 08:57 AM
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Well, a SD picture can look pretty good if you have a good digital source, and the 16:9 format can be transmitted with an SD signal, so that's not a criteria for the picture being HD.

So it sounds like you just prefer a picture with less detail. I prefer a picture that looks as close to real as possible, which means HD or better. You can objectively determine which picture has higher resolution but there is no real objective criteria for a preference.

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post #10 of 12 Old 07-20-2010, 09:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jautor View Post

Assuming you are confused between component/composite, and therefore are not legally blind , the reason you may see a difference (and a preference) of component vs. HDMI on the same set is likely that the TV has input-specific video settings. It may be that the brightness/contrast/color temp/etc. is significantly different (perhaps still set up in sales floor super-bright mode) than the other.

(and my apologies if you are actually legally blind...)

Jeff

My eyes are getting much worse, but I just did another A/B test and the composite source still looks better in many respects. It might very well be that input-specific video settings are different for the two sources but looking at a news program with a consistent banner line on the bottom, I see that the letters are as clear or clearer using composite (no, not component). Maybe part of the problem is that the HDMI picture is not what it should be (45' is a long haul). As mentioned before, though, I had done some testing moving the LED TV closer to the source and saw similar results using shorter cable.

I appreciate those that say HD is impossible over composite as that has always been my opinion, but how can one objectively explain the relative merits of the composite source and/or demerits of the HDMI source. Is there device or technique that can tell me what the resolution is? How can I objectively evaulate these sources?
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post #11 of 12 Old 07-20-2010, 09:41 AM
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^^^

you should be able to determine the resolution of the incoming signal by hitting 'info' or 'display' on the TV remote
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post #12 of 12 Old 07-20-2010, 10:24 AM
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It does sound like something odd is going on with the HD display. Have you tried the component inputs with HD to see how that looks as compared to the HDMI?

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