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post #1 of 14 Old 03-22-2012, 12:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Long time lurker of the forums (finally registered earlier this month), but now I need help on my own setup.
I'm building a new condo and want to get the wiring done.
I haven't decided on the system but figure I need to get the wiring right to begin with.
I've read a bunch of stuff including posts here and at other places. Please excuse my newbie diagram and questions.

Attached are my plans.

In a nutshell....
Speaker locations:
-Master bedroom.
-Master bathroom.
-Terrace (off the master bedroom).
-Livingroom
-Kitchen
-Guest bedroom
-Garage

Audio zones:
Zone 1
-Master bedroom
-Roof terrace (sub-zone off master)
Zone 2
-Master bathroom
Zone 3
-Livingroom
-Kitchen (sub-zone off livingroom)
Zone 4
-Guest bedroom
-Guest bathroom (sub-zone off bedroom)
Zone 5
-Garage

Video Zones:
Zone 1
-Master bedroom (one outlet)
Zone 2
-Livingroom (two outlets, one on each wall. Only one active at a time).
Zone 3
-Guest bedroom (one outlet)

Inputs:
-Two directv receivers (possibly a third)
-Computer (HDMI)

HDMI output to the video locations.
To the livingroom I will want 7 channel out.
Would I run hdmi to a local audio receiver and then local receiver to 7 channel speakers in livingroom?

Ideas? Suggestions?

Thanks!!

 

Condo AV Layout 3-8-2012.pdf 303.3564453125k . file
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post #2 of 14 Old 03-22-2012, 12:42 PM
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Diagrams look good, and a damn fine first post!

Some thoughts:

1) Think about moving your wiring closet to your mechanical room if there's space. May be easier to mount stuff on the walls, and get wiring in/out of that area instead of under the stairs.

2) Don't use in-ceiling speakers in your great room for L/C/R. Bring them down to at least in-wall height.

3) Surround locations don't look correct for 7.1 in the great room.

4) Also for the GR, use your surround speakers for whole-house audio (using a speaker interrupt/switch), or just take a line-level output from the WHA system to your surround receiver.

5) Master bedroom - think about moving the speakers to flank the head of the bed, then you can set up for a future surround receiver (same speaker interrupt concept as the Great Room), in addition to WHA.

6) Why a pocket door on the guest room?

7) With only 3 video zones, and DirecTV, you might just use individual receivers for all three, and the whole-house-DVR feature to share content. Much simpler/cheaper than distributing HDMI. (But yes, pre-wire to allow for it!) The computer could be a simple HDMI splitter/extender depending on where you want to use it.

8) From a pre-wire perspective, wire for video capability on the terrace and in the garage. "Rooftop party for sporting event"?


Jeff

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post #3 of 14 Old 03-22-2012, 02:10 PM
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One tidbit I'd like to add that I just decided to do is in regards to your master bathroom. It is kind of a waste of a zone to dedicate to just your bathroom. You should consider making that a sub-zone off of your master and have each room off of an independent volume control with your keypad simply being a master. That way you can have volume in the bathroom if someone is trying to sleep in the bedroom and you can relocate that zone elsewhere if needed, maybe a better choice is the terrace on its own zone.
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post #4 of 14 Old 03-22-2012, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dankuz View Post

One tidbit I'd like to add that I just decided to do is in regards to your master bathroom. It is kind of a waste of a zone to dedicate to just your bathroom.

I'd disagree with that, as long as you're not out of zones. Only takes one mistake to make using it too early in the morning a "non starter".

I think you want full control (keypad/volume/zone control) in the bathroom, as you're very likely to want to select sources, see the metadata, etc.

Regardless, home run all of the rooms (even the subzones) so that you can change your mind either way later...

Jeff

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post #5 of 14 Old 03-23-2012, 07:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Jautor,
Thank you for the suggestions. A couple of follow-ups if I may:
1 - Unfortunately I don't have room.
2 - Should I use in-wall even if the furniture will be in the middle of the room? I thought it might be too far away, but didn't really know where to place the speakers. I attached the floor two drawing with furniture. Would you still use in-wall given you now know where the furniture will be?
3 - Does this look better?
4 - Hadn't thought of that...can you point me to a specific product that you've used? I googled it but I'm not sure that's what you were referring to.
5 - Good idea
6 - Plans called for it. The condo is very modern in styling and since this is on the first floor near the entrance I guess it makes a "statement". To me I was indifferent.
7 - After getting ideas from you and others I've decided not to distribute video at this time (but plan for it!!).
8 - I added video to the terrace after doing the diagram. Had not considered the garage. That's a good one.

Dankuz,
Thank you for the input. My thoughts for the zone in the bathroom...I want to listen to news while getting ready in the morning but the SO wants to listen to a talk radio program. Terrace...I didn't want the terrace on a different zone because of the close proximity to the bedroom. I figured if I was entertaining on the terrace I wouldn't want to listen to something different in the bedroom.

 

AV Layout - 2nd Floor With Furniture.pdf 222.763671875k . file
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post #6 of 14 Old 03-23-2012, 09:25 AM
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Yes, put the L/C/R speakers in-wall surrounding the tv. You want your primary sound sources (L/C/R) to be in line with your video so that the audio has the appearance of coming from the screen. Placing it out front in ceiling as you have diagrammed will disconnect the audio from the video - your eyes will be seeing the picture forward, but hearing sounds above.

Tag Jeff - you're up!
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post #7 of 14 Old 03-23-2012, 09:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Mike,
Thank you. What about the surround l/r and back l/r? The surround l/r I don't have a wall so I don't see a lot of choice here. I could put the back l/r in the wall with the window, but the window covers a large part of the wall (floor to ceiling).
Any thoughts on that?

Thanks!
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post #8 of 14 Old 03-23-2012, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hanewb View Post

2 - Should I use in-wall even if the furniture will be in the middle of the room? I thought it might be too far away, but didn't really know where to place the speakers. I attached the floor two drawing with furniture. Would you still use in-wall given you now know where the furniture will be?

Yes. As Mike said, for theater audio, you want the sound to come from the same place as the image, so getting the front speakers closer to the screen is always better. For surrounds, it's common to have difficultly finding places for these in non-dedicated spaces. Just be consistent - all surrounds in the ceiling or all in-wall - not a mix.

EDIT: Dangit - Mike beat me again...

Quote:
3 - Does this look better?

Yes, but the 'rear surrounds' look too close together.

But what is the "other" big TV in that room on the opposite wall?

Quote:
4 - Hadn't thought of that...can you point me to a specific product that you've used? I googled it but I'm not sure that's what you were referring to.

NuVo has an interrupt device (LSI24), and for other systems, a triggered speaker selector would do the same job. Here's a wiring diagram:



Jeff

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post #9 of 14 Old 03-23-2012, 01:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Again, thank you for the information.

The "other" big tv on the opposite wall is actually a window that I thought would have a table (dark blue rectangle) in front, however I forgot the window is floor to ceiling. The table is a no go.

For the local source interrupt/speaker switch...I would select two speakers from the seven correct? Presumably the ones in the ceiling. Should the switch be located near the local a/v receiver? I would then run speaker cable from the control pad over to the switch which is near the local a/v receiver. Is the cat5 from control pad to switch for future use? I'm glad you told me about that because I would have missed this wiring entirely.
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post #10 of 14 Old 03-23-2012, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hanewb View Post

For the local source interrupt/speaker switch...I would select two speakers from the seven correct? Presumably the ones in the ceiling. Should the switch be located near the local a/v receiver? I would then run speaker cable from the control pad over to the switch which is near the local a/v receiver. Is the cat5 from control pad to switch for future use? I'm glad you told me about that because I would have missed this wiring entirely.

For whole-house audio systems with keypads (NuVo, perhaps others), the cat5 link is the trigger for the interrupt. When the keypad "zone" is on, the trigger is set to move the switch to the whole-house audio source. When off, the switch is in the 'local' source mode.

And yes, I'd use it for the surround channels if they're in the walls/ceiling. Although for a primary area, I'd get the line-level output for that zone routed to the A/V receiver instead. That way you'd just use the keypad to select a source, and your AV receiver does the rest (and you use all your speakers, and the better amp in your receiver).

I do that in my main area as well. Although I didn't put a keypad in that zone, and wish I did (I guess I could consume an unused cat5 line). But now, with either the iOS control or a wireless keypad, there are plenty of options...

Jeff

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post #11 of 14 Old 03-26-2012, 09:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hanewb View Post

The "other" big tv on the opposite wall is actually a window that I thought would have a table (dark blue rectangle) in front, however I forgot the window is floor to ceiling. The table is a no go.

I hope you've considered window treatments for that window - if it's directly opposite your viewing location, you may wind up with significant glare from the window when watching TV.

Good luck and let us know how everything turns out!
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post #12 of 14 Old 03-26-2012, 07:01 PM
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Thank you for posting. I was starting to get frustrated trying to design my home. Your requirements and design took all the frustration out of the planning process. Got my game face back on!
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post #13 of 14 Old 03-26-2012, 07:23 PM
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Thanks Jeff. Maybe I don't need a Nuvo KP in my FR, just use the iOS app for those rare times I would use it.

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

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post #14 of 14 Old 04-02-2012, 05:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the help.

Construction is moving along.

I will have treatments on that window. I'm in a downtown/urban area with another building very close so I don't want any peepers haha.

I decided to use the line-level output for the main viewing area. After reading the comments and researching I feel that will give me the best sound to that area.

Again thanks.
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