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post #1 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 11:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi, don't know if this is the correct place for this question...

So I am setting up a classroom with 25 monitors and have seen that using cat5e is no problem. Well I have been having problems. It's one monitor splitting the image to the other 25 monitors.

I am using solid utp cat5e cable.

I ran all the cat5e to a patch panel punch down 568B. At the other end I have it terminated to keystone jacks. I am using an RJ45 to vga (HD15) adapter to connect everything.
I can't post url's so if you go to eforcity . com and search POTHRJ45AD03 you will see what I'm using.


From the patch panel I have 2 foot patch cables with the RJ45 to vga adapter plugging into a 16 port VGA 300Mhz splitter

monoprice .com search 4087

I am using flat panel monitors with a native resolution of 1360x768 and have tried moving it down to 1024x768 and it's a little better but the main issue is a lot of ghosting.


Thanks
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post #2 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 01:46 PM
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Quote:


have seen that using cat5e is no problem

That's the problem.
VGA requires at least 3 75 Ohm coax cables to carry RG and B.
You're using 110 Ohm twisted pairs, the impedance mismatch is causing signal reflections (ghosting).
If you must use cat5, use the proper baluns to balance the unbalanced video signals and properly match the cables characteristic impedance.
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post #3 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 02:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the replies.

Mark I don't know electrial terms at all. So please bear with me. I understand that the cat5e ohm is 110 and you are saying that is 35 Ohm over the vga spec.

What baluns could I use? Something like a ferrite?

I need a low cost fix for this.

Thanks!
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post #4 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 03:33 PM
 
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post #5 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 04:30 PM
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You used Monoprice in a commercial setting? Ugh.
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post #6 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 04:59 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cshepard View Post

You used Monoprice in a commercial setting? Ugh.

Some people do. And your point is.
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post #7 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 06:22 PM
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Quote:
you will need multiple dual-head video cards.

He's feeding the same thing to 25 monitors, he needs a distribution amp, not a switcher, and the correct cabling or the proper baluns, not an expensive vga over ip device or multiple video cards.


Quote:
What baluns could I use?

Google "VGA over cat 5 BalUn"
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post #8 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 06:24 PM - Thread Starter
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I did make the cable from the instructables.com site and same issues. All the other options there are too expensive, the person doesn't want to spend money (of course).

at $180/each for the extenders that would come out to $4500.



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post #9 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 06:35 PM
 
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Yes, it is not cheap. You want to do something that really is only used really in certain circumstances. Back in the day when computers were expensive, yes, you would see multiple monitors split off With the advent of terminal software like Teamviewer, DLP & LCD projectors, Whiteboards, it is easier to do through IP applications, or face to face with a projector, than having each individual sit at a desk with you expecting them to always be watching what the instructor wants them to see, when they can look up on the wall at the projector showing the same thing on a screen.
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post #10 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 07:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post

He's feeding the same thing to 25 monitors, he needs a distribution amp, not a switcher, and the correct cabling or the proper baluns, not an expensive vga over ip device or multiple video cards.




Google "VGA over cat 5 BalUn"

I googled that and there are a ton of different options.

Does anyone have any recommendations on one's they have used?
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post #11 of 31 Old 04-10-2012, 07:10 PM
 
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Already gave you a couple. If you find any more, they will be pretty much the same as already pointed out in this thread. Here are some more if you are bored with the current choices http://audio-video-supply.markertek....00&isort=price BTW, they go as high as $38k.
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post #12 of 31 Old 04-11-2012, 06:16 AM
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Quote:


Here are some more if you are bored with the current choices http://audio-video-supply.markertek....00&isort=price BTW, they go as high as $38k.

Greg, why do you bother?
You provided a link to a bunch of matrix switchers, not BalUns. No BalUn is 38K.

Daryl, it might be cheqaper for you to replace the cat 5 with coax, if you don't want to spend the money on BalUns.
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post #13 of 31 Old 04-11-2012, 07:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post

Greg, why do you bother?
You provided a link to a bunch of matrix switchers, not BalUns. No BalUn is 38K.

Daryl, it might be cheqaper for you to replace the cat 5 with coax, if you don't want to spend the money on BalUns.

Thanks Sam64. I was thinking about coax but didn't know how that would work.

I would still need a splitter capable of 25 monitors; also what would I do have some other coax adapter to vga?

Thanks
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post #14 of 31 Old 04-11-2012, 07:36 PM
 
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NEW: COMPONENT & VGA OVER COAX TRANSMITTER The VPN-11 and VPN-12 are a transmitter and receiver for component or computer graphics video signals. The VPN-11 converts the incoming signal to a 12-pin terminal block for transmission over coax cable and the VPN-12 converts the signal back into a component or computer graphics video signal.
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INPUT:1 Y, B-Y, R-Y or RGB on 3 RCA connectors; 1 XGA on an HD15 connector (not simultaneous)OUTPUT:1 RGBHV or Y, B-Y, R-Y or RGB on two 6-pin terminal block connectorsMAX. OUTPUT LEVEL:2.3VppBANDWIDTH (-3dB):450MHz, (fully loaded)DIFF. GAIN:0.05%DIFF. PHASE:0.04 Deg.K-FACTOR:0.1%S/N RATIO:74dB @ 5MHzCROSSTALK (all hostile):-42dB @ 5MHz, XGA into YUVCONTROLS:1 input selector pushbuttonVIDEO COUPLINGCPOWER SOURCE:12V, 100mADIMENSIONS:12cm x 7.15cm x 2.76cm (4.7' x 2.8' x 1.08'), W, D, HWEIGHT:0.3 kg. (0.67 lbs.) approx. (each)ACCESSORIES:Power supply, mounting bracket (each)OPTIONS:RK-T1, RK-T3, 19 inch rack adapters, Kramer BC-3X2T7S cable

http://www.prosecuritys.com/vpn-11.html

http://audio-video-supply.markertek.....x=0&IMAGE.y=0
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post #15 of 31 Old 04-13-2012, 07:04 AM
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Quote:


I was thinking about coax but didn't know how that would work.

VGA contians 5 signals, R, G, B, H and V.

google for "vga to coax breakout".
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post #16 of 31 Old 04-15-2012, 10:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys
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post #17 of 31 Old 04-15-2012, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post

That's the problem.
VGA requires at least 3 75 Ohm coax cables to carry RG and B.
You're using 110 Ohm twisted pairs, the impedance mismatch is causing signal reflections (ghosting).
If you must use cat5, use the proper baluns to balance the unbalanced video signals and properly match the cables characteristic impedance.

It sometimes depends on the application. I ran three 100foot shielded CAT5 lines for VGA in a security system. The display was 12 to 16 cameras per screen.

For that application, the artifacts caused by the cable were secondary to the poor quality video images being provided in the first place.

Now at home in my HT monitor wall I did use 5x 75ohm mult cable.

Glimmie's HT Page
Being redone - comming soon!

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post #18 of 31 Old 05-17-2012, 03:02 PM
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Sorry to bump an old thread, but I have a similar question.

I want to extend the monitor signal from a laptop. Monitor only, no mouse keyboard etc.

The wiring is existing in the house, and is plain Cat5, not Cat5e, but otherwise very good condition, modern cable. It's a homerun between both locations, no splices. The run is 100' or so.

I have seen the "VGA over Cat5" adapters on MonoPrice. Would this be okay in my application?

Do I even need to use VGA? I have not bought the display yet. Would I be better off buying a TV and using "HDMI over Cat5" ? Or maybe DVI?

Really, the only thing that is set in stone is the cable. Everything else I've yet to buy. I could get any adapters, any display, any laptop.

Thanks guys.
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post #19 of 31 Old 05-17-2012, 07:26 PM
 
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Why do you want to tether the laptop to a monitor, unless it is sitting in one place. If it has svideo or vga output, you can do it that way. Otherwise, what in particular are you wanting to do with the laptop, that you want to put it up on a hd set?
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post #20 of 31 Old 05-17-2012, 09:35 PM
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Yeah, would be helpful to know what you're trying to accomplish...

But you'll definitely have better luck with a VGA extender than an HDMI one. VGA signals will be much more forgiving with the "non-e" cat5.

Jeff

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post #21 of 31 Old 05-18-2012, 09:52 AM
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Thanks for the info on VGA vs HDMI. VGA will be easier anyway, as I may end up using an existing LCD monitor I have.

The main goal for the remote monitor will be to view a Megapixel IP cam feed. It will have other duties as well, like weather info etc. It will be mounted in a strategic spot in the house. It will be used as reference only, and will not need to act as a workstation in any way.

The laptop will not be 'mobile', and will not get much direct use. Hard to explain... It will act as a 'server' if you will, and it will be in a somewhat remote location. I will access it regularly via remote desktop. Everything is on the same network, all hard line, no wireless.

Laptop instead of desktop/server for a whole slew of reasons.

I have done all of this before, with great success. The only thing I didn't do before is the remote monitor. It was the only thing missing in my prior application. This time, all the components will be even better (cam quality, software, server etc)

I don't expect a perfectly clear, vivid, full high definition picture on this remote monitor. I won't be watching movies or anything. I just want a normal picture that I can view a higher end IP cam feed on, some desktop gadgets, and maybe some other things. No audio.

Think I will be okay with a regular 21" LCD monitor and Monoprice Cat5/VGA adapters?
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post #22 of 31 Old 05-18-2012, 03:52 PM
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For the OP, why not use some form of meeting / desktop sharing software (Lync, Skype, Communicator, Live Meeting, Go to Meeting, etc., etc.)? Use your existing Cat5e infrastructure and share the teacher's desktop. Not everything has to have a HW solution.
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post #23 of 31 Old 05-18-2012, 03:52 PM
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Klaus,
Can you use the existing Cat5 to pull Cat5e?
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post #24 of 31 Old 05-18-2012, 09:38 PM
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Not really. It would be a huge pain.

From what I've read, regular 5 should work. I hope so.
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post #25 of 31 Old 05-20-2012, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg_R View Post

Klaus,
Can you use the existing Cat5 to pull Cat5e?

Update, looks like it's not an issue. I haven't had a chance to make it out there to verify the cable till tonight. I just figured all along it was regular Cat5, not sure why. I feel better now

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post #26 of 31 Old 05-20-2012, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Klaüs View Post

I just figured all along it was regular Cat5, not sure why.

So, you ASSUMED...

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post #27 of 31 Old 05-21-2012, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jautor View Post

So, you ASSUMED...

Yes, I assumed it was just Cat5

So you guys think I will be good to go with the Monoprice VGA over Cat5 units in my application??

Edit: Nice theater build pics Jautor
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post #28 of 31 Old 05-21-2012, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Klaüs View Post

So you guys think I will be good to go with the Monoprice VGA over Cat5 units in my application??

Price is certainly right - I was going to suggest the MuxLab products, but at 1/2 the street price, that's the one to try. Make sure it supports whatever resolution you're going to use first, though.

Quote:
Edit: Nice theater build pics Jautor

Thanks!

Jeff

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post #29 of 31 Old 05-21-2012, 12:29 PM
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Honestly, I don't care about the price near as much as I care that it works.

Think I might be better off with the Muxlab stuff? Like this?

http://www.smarthome.com/78050/Video...-500040/p.aspx

http://www.smarthome.com/78051/Video...-500042/p.aspx
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post #30 of 31 Old 05-21-2012, 01:16 PM
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Monoprice is good about returns, AFIAK (I've never had to send anything back), but the MuxLub gear, in general, is rock solid.

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