who do I call to install ethernet cables? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 32 Old 05-02-2012, 06:34 PM - Thread Starter
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I tried 3 electricians and none of them will touch it, do I call an A/V company, the cable company, not sure who to call? I have a 4 story home and would like to utilize a newly constructed chase to run ethernet/cable into 3 bedrooms and my living room. Will probably install the panel in the basement and run up to all the rooms. does that make the most sense?
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post #2 of 32 Old 05-02-2012, 06:47 PM
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I'd call some local AV companies, and ask if they do that sort of thing. Also, consider other cables you might need in the future, e.g. for wireless access points, in-wall and in-ceiling speakers, keypads, tablet docks, cameras (front door?), lighting control, motion sensors, surround sound, kitchen TV.

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post #3 of 32 Old 05-03-2012, 06:46 PM
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post #4 of 32 Old 05-03-2012, 06:47 PM
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What are you connecting to the Cat5e cables? I mean, what are you intending to use the wiring for?
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post #5 of 32 Old 05-03-2012, 06:54 PM
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The OP said they are going to be for Ethernet.
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post #6 of 32 Old 05-03-2012, 07:02 PM
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Those must be UNION electricians and/or geezers who don't know what Facebook is ^)

Solution: FREE. Explanation: I will have to charge$ you.

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post #7 of 32 Old 05-03-2012, 07:03 PM
 
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The reason that the electricians will not do it, is because it is not a large enough job for them. Same for IT Networking companies. And do not even think about calling Best Buy. You need to either talk to your local mom & pop computer shops, or do it yourself. For four runs, it would not be that hard to do it all yourself.
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post #8 of 32 Old 05-04-2012, 03:32 AM
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All the AV installation companies in my area do resi networking too. At least all the ones with websites. Not sure of the trunk slammers on craigslist.

A few years ago, one of the local AV Installers quoted me a price of $100/cable, retrofit.

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post #9 of 32 Old 05-04-2012, 05:27 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neurorad View Post

All the AV installation companies in my area do resi networking too. At least all the ones with websites. Not sure of the trunk slammers on craigslist.

A few years ago, one of the local AV Installers quoted me a price of $100/cable, retrofit.

Was that terminating, testing and hooking up your equipment, or just pulling the raw cable? I do it for a meal or a six pack of good micro-brew beer for friends. I ended up getting out of doing computer & networking work for people other than close friends, due to got tired of them either not paying for the small work that I did for them, or wanted the bare min.

Money can not be made in pulling four drops, unless you make the price high enough (ie $100 per drop), in order to break even for your time. Most of those guys get paid around $15 that pull the drops, and most jobs take no more than maybe two hours max, unless it is a huge job, then it can take weeks to complete. When I did it for a company back in the 90's, I was taking home some good money, which also included the company paying for hotels.
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post #10 of 32 Old 05-04-2012, 07:46 AM
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Do anybody think those guys who camp out at Home Depot pull cat5?

Once I got a guy to help me move, 1 hr+ and I offered him $20, but he complained so I gave him $30 just to feel sorry for the old guy. The stupid was answering his cell calls! WTF.

Solution: FREE. Explanation: I will have to charge$ you.

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post #11 of 32 Old 05-06-2012, 10:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys. I'm kicking myself now as they did not put wood in as a particition between where the electrical lines went, and where I plan to put my cat5/6 cables, doh! Oh well, I guess I have to go with the more expensive, more difficult, shielded cables? I'm picturing putting some type of "hub" in the basement near my electrical service and chase. Then running wires from all the upper rooms into the basement where they connect to the "hub" (cable line/modem/router)? Thinking of doing the Apple system whereby I'll have Airport Express in a few of the rooms, so I can go hard wire or wireless throughout the house, does that make sense? The chase is drywall but rest of home is plaster, and I get nervous attempting those cuts on my own.

I guess I'll try A/V companies on Angies List, I just moved to Ohio and have zero contacts for anything, and hope to get some good people to help. Would a cable installer touch something like this?

Aside from running ethernet/cable jack into each room for cable/internet, what else should I plan to do so I don't look back with regrets?

Lastly, what type of "hub" do I look for and what wires on monoprice are recommended? I'd like to at least get all my components together so I jump on install as soon as I find someone.
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post #12 of 32 Old 05-06-2012, 11:26 AM
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try here instead: http://www.cedia.net/
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post #13 of 32 Old 05-06-2012, 11:37 AM
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You may have some luck with a local security (alarm) company, it also won't hurt to stalk the cable aisle at your local home depot or lowes... Thee usually have contractor cards placed some where in there too.

Another tactic is find out where the home builders are and stalk a wire puller from there (the guy not the company). You local it guy may have the chops, but don't bet on him.

PS these days they are called 'switches' not hubs. Also you should carefully supervise your Internet installer so they don't mess things up. (that is another person you could probably contract on their day off)
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post #14 of 32 Old 05-06-2012, 02:14 PM
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How large is the chase? Are Romex cables also in this chase, retrofit? Or was the chase built around the stapled Romex?

If the Romex is in one corner of the chase, you may be able to confine the LV cables into another corner with 2" conduit.

I retrofitted 4 runs of 2" LV conduit into an existing chase, basement to attic. A challenge, but not impossible.

+1, check the CEDIA website for experienced installers.

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

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post #15 of 32 Old 05-06-2012, 04:38 PM - Thread Starter
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The Chase is a rectangular shape, but on one side is an out of service chimney, and the new electrical. Not sure if its romex, but its new electrical wire. The cavity I want to use for the internet/cable is about 5" x 7" (excluding wood/drywall), but need to squeeze a 4" sewage pipe in here as well. But should be enough space for 3 drops?

Here is a rough sketch of the chase from above, just did it on excel real fast, blacked out area is chimney, area below is for electrical wire, and thin line is not there, its open, just using that as a visual to show the 5x7 space I've identified.
bedroom 1 will enter side of chase, and run perpendicular to electrical and hit open chase cavity. bedroom 2 comes from the right and drops right down chase, and bedroom 3 is where the chase ends in the attic, so will be a straight drop down.

 

Chase from above.pdf 144.451171875k . file
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File Type: pdf Chase from above.pdf (144.5 KB, 5 views)
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post #16 of 32 Old 05-06-2012, 06:15 PM
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I think a few Ethernet cables will fit in there just fine. The custom installer that you find on the CEDIA website will take care of it, no problem.

If you're interested in turning it into a big drawn-out project, then DIY. If not, pick up the phone tomorrow.

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

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post #17 of 32 Old 05-06-2012, 07:31 PM - Thread Starter
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do I need to run cable line from switches to each room, or can I do a splitter in chase that runs to each room? trying to cut down on excise wires.

can you direct me to the correct wiring/plates/switches needed on monoprice?

thanks so much!
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post #18 of 32 Old 05-06-2012, 07:44 PM
 
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modw220, keep it simple. Pull the four runs of ethernet to a central point. That means that if you have CATV & telephone all where the breaker panel is, that means pull your ethernet there also.

I have both my telephone & catv coming in where my breaker panel is, and have a 3 foot A/V rack that I have two shelves attached to, and a patch panel. All of my drops are to the patch panel, and on a shelf near the patch panel on the rack, sits my RG for ATT U-Verse & the Netgear GS-108 switch.

If all it is is four drops period, get a Single gang box, that you can place a six Keystone wall plate on to, and that way you can use the keystones as your "patch" panel. Put in two "blanks" that there are not the two keystone jacks. From the "Patch Panel", then you can run patch cords to a switch, or use the patch panel if you are going to use HDMI over ethernet.

I tend to pull everything to a central point. Only time that I would place a switch up on another floor, is if I wanted to not pull very long runs down to the main panel, so that everything is kept simple. That would mean if it is two or three floors, you would have a switch on each floor, then from there a run of ethernet would be from that floor to the main switch that has no other feeds attached to it. Now of course the catch is, you would be using "smart" switches for all of this, not "dumb" switches which are typical in the majority of home installs.

For yours, use a single dumb switch, and pull everything to a central point.
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post #19 of 32 Old 05-06-2012, 08:11 PM
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Learn how to terminate Ethernet cables. It's easy, with keystone wall plates and female connectors.

Skip the pre-made cables.

In the 'home run' location / wiring closet, punch down to a patch panel. There, use pre-made patch cables to connect to the switch.

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

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post #20 of 32 Old 05-08-2012, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mod220 View Post

Thanks guys. I'm kicking myself now as they did not put wood in as a particition between where the electrical lines went, and where I plan to put my cat5/6 cables, doh! Oh well, I guess I have to go with the more expensive, more difficult, shielded cables?

Don't' worry about it and just use standard CAT5E cable.

1) Wood would have been useless as an electrical shield in the first place.

2) Ethernet is pretty much immune to interference from power cables. It's rather high frequency and electrically balanced transmission.

3) The NEC doesn't like low voltage cables run directly with power cables for safety reasons but in a retrofit job it's OK.

4) Shielded CAT cable can cause other issues due to the higher capacitance and if the shield is not terminated properly, it does nothing anyway.

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post #21 of 32 Old 05-08-2012, 11:58 AM
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IIRC, you can't use the monoprice cat6 keystones in the 6-hole plate. Fitment issue.

I think Leviton connectors and keystone plate work, though, for the 6.

Can't guarantee it, though.

If you use Leviton from Home Depot, easy returns.

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

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post #22 of 32 Old 05-08-2012, 05:13 PM - Thread Starter
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called several A/V companies, and they all said they won't touch it. Apparently they're tired of 3am calls from "my internet doesn't work" customers. I'm tempted to do it myself, but afraid I'll screw it up. so just to confirm:

Cable company runs line into my basement where it connects to a modem. modem then goes to a wireless router, which then goes to switches (or do I want router on 1st or 2nd level?). I then run lines from my basement up the chase to each bedroom. I also run individual cable lines up the chase for each bedroom. I cut holes in the walls and attach plates holding both cat5e and cable connections. I'm assuming I'd also put a WAP on each level?

overall is that the plan?

as far as running ethernet parallel to electrical lines, is that okay or no?
cat5e vs cat6?
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post #23 of 32 Old 05-08-2012, 05:14 PM - Thread Starter
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anyone have pictures of their setup?
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post #24 of 32 Old 05-08-2012, 05:35 PM
 
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I posted one some time before. I have a pic over at diychatroom.com You should be able to see the picture without signing up. http://www.diychatroom.com/f11/my-ne...set-up-117707/ Don't ask where I got the rack from. It has been about twelve years since I got it off of ebay. It is a 3 foot a/v rack that is made out of steel. I have two shelves in it. A deeper one at the bottom that has become a catch all, due to I no longer run a server for testing websites & databases on my network.

As for punching down, it is really easy to do with the keystones. Just get the ones from Lowe's or Home Depot. The wiring is all cat-5e with my network, and as for the two different colored patch cords. The white ones are for the three U-Verse set tops, the red is for computer & media. All media goes to the switch, which is a Netgear GS-108.

Believe it or not, I started with a rack mounted 10/100 switch and only four drops, and when we moved into this place, it has evolved into 9 drops, and everything else is WiFi. I can get at least 100 feet from my house before the WiFi drops, so I do not worry about the Uverse RG being in the basement.
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post #25 of 32 Old 05-09-2012, 11:57 AM
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Here is where I got mine: http://skeletek.com/index2.html
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post #26 of 32 Old 05-09-2012, 06:13 PM
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Lots of pics, and additional help, at cocoontech forums. Very helpful group.

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

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post #27 of 32 Old 05-10-2012, 11:29 AM
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Without knowing anyone in your area your best bet is probably Angie's List. You might also put the word out at your work that you are looking for some basic network retrofit work to be done in your home and would be willing to compensate someone for their time. Many guys in computer oriented jobs have had to wrangle a network in their time (like myself) and end up with sufficient skills to do a basic network installation.

A basic 4 network drop installation isn't in any way "complex" from a technical standpoint, it's being creative with pulling the wiring through walls and crawlspaces that eats up your time.

As far as pictures of installations, when I bought my 1979-vintage home 4 years ago I went slightly overboard pulling a wired network but I regret nothing! Having the option to plug in anywhere in the house (and the garage) and have access to a Gigabit network without Wi-Fi headaches was very much worth the 5 weekends spent in the attic.

Everything on my network is pulled back to central patch panels and then cross-connected to a Gigabit switch.




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post #28 of 32 Old 05-10-2012, 01:08 PM
 
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KingLeerUK, have you noticed that someone stole all of your patch cords.
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post #29 of 32 Old 05-10-2012, 07:01 PM
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Nah, that's the only drop he ever uses. The rest is wifi.

J/K, I have probably 40 runs of cat6 retrofitted myself, about 12 of which are run to a switch for Ethernet.

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

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post #30 of 32 Old 05-10-2012, 07:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post

KingLeerUK, have you noticed that someone stole all of your patch cords.

Yes, but I made them pay.

Dearly.

The original picture was taken during initial installation, this is what it looks like in use.

Yeah... I have far too much stuff networked for a house.
LL

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