Volume Control Causing Protect Mode - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 10 Old 08-30-2013, 01:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Hello AVS Members,

Hopefully the experts out there can provide an answer... just replaced my old AVR which was blown due to my B speaker being wired to an outdoor volume control and then to the speakers(1pair). During its one year of use with the B outputs, the only way I could only way I could keep my B output from triggering protect mode was to not increase the AVR volume too high. Well, I recently had a pool party and I'm assuming the protect mode failed and because by the end the AVR not only shut down but fried. Keep in mind prior deciding to continue to use the VC, I did conduct a series of trouble shoots prior to choosing to simply monitori the master volume as the solution. i.e. swapping A with B and the biggest diagnostic for me was to bypass the volume control altogether and ofcourse in doing so I could set the master to max without triggering protect mode. So I ended up gettting another VC, but still the same issue, thus decided that the only solution is to simply monitor the master VC... well that is until it recently fried. Fwd... I replaced the the fried AVR with a Marantz SR5007 w/Zone2. The main zone sound is phenomenal! However when setting up Zone2 by assigning the surround back outputs to Z2 AND purchasing a brand new 300WATT VC. I STILL HAVE THE SAME ISSUE!mad.gif I'm not sure what to do now and fear my only option at this point is to re-pull 100ft+ of cable. Again, it has the same symptoms as the previous setup. I thought that since my previous system functioned fine by simply bypassing the VC, I can safely rule out a short in the wire and chalked it up to a poor VC, but as mentioned knowing this I purchased a brand new 300W VC. So, I guess what I am getting at is CAN THERE STILL BE A SHORT EVEN THOUGH THE AVR PROTECT MODE IS NOT TRIPPING WHEN BYPASSING THE EXTERNAL OUTDOOR VC. The last troubleshoot is to pull out the multimeter and test the resistance and continuity of all four speaker leads (Left/Right; AMP to VC and Left/Right; VC to Speakers).

Thanks in advance for your input!biggrin.gif
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post #2 of 10 Old 08-30-2013, 03:08 AM
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How many outdoor speakers, and what brand/model?

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post #3 of 10 Old 08-30-2013, 11:58 AM
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Almost certainly the result of low impedance from the connected speakers. If you were using A+B, you were already at a 4-ohm load assuming both pairs were 8-ohm to begin with. You need to look at the impedance of each pair of speakers and what the amp/AVR is rated to take.

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post #4 of 10 Old 08-30-2013, 01:13 PM - Thread Starter
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I am running 1pair of OSD Audio AP490's rated at 100watts each with a resistance of 8ohms. The VC as OSD-OVC300 Self-Impedance Matching 300W set at 1X.
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post #5 of 10 Old 08-30-2013, 01:45 PM
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Well, that setup sounds fine. Yeah, time to break out the meter and check for shorts - look at the speaker terminals, too, a few strands could be shorted.

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post #6 of 10 Old 08-30-2013, 01:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jautor View Post

Almost certainly the result of low impedance from the connected speakers. If you were using A+B, you were already at a 4-ohm load assuming both pairs were 8-ohm to begin with. You need to look at the impedance of each pair of speakers and what the amp/AVR is rated to take.

Thanks for the input, however that was my previous setup that fried. The new set up is utilizing a Marantz SR5007 of which I can assign via the internal AVR setup to the surround back output to Zone2 and unlike an A/B output configuration. The Zone2 utilizes a separate internal amp to power the assigned output, thus maintaining the resistance at 8ohm. For testing purposes, I'm going to try setting the VC to 3X. Note the VC has both 1X and 2X on the same setting, which is why I am not choosing to go with a 2X setting. If it continues to trigger protect mode, I will be utilizing a multimeter to conduct individual tests for each of the 4 speaker leads to check resistance and continuity.
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post #7 of 10 Old 08-30-2013, 01:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jautor View Post

Well, that setup sounds fine. Yeah, time to break out the meter and check for shorts - look at the speaker terminals, too, a few strands could be shorted.

Will do and thanks again!
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post #8 of 10 Old 08-30-2013, 01:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neurorad View Post

How many outdoor speakers, and what brand/model?

I am running 1pair of OSD Audio AP490's rated at 100watts each with a resistance of 8ohms. The VC as OSD-OVC300 Self-Impedance Matching 300W set at 1X.
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post #9 of 10 Old 08-30-2013, 06:32 PM
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After checking the speaker terminals for shorts, I'd call OSD, and have them help troubleshoot their products. You may be replacing those outdoor speakers next.

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post #10 of 10 Old 09-09-2013, 11:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Well Gentlemen,

To my embarrassment, after doing some troubleshooting, I found I apparently mislabeled my wiring on the left channel outputs and inputs. Causing me to reverse loads, which I'm assuming is why the protect mode did not trigger immediately until I increased the volume (power) to a level that the AVR/Amp did not like. At the very least the symptoms I experienced will help others who may experience the same issue. Again, I'm assuming reversing the input and outputs of the channel allowed power to flow to a certain limit, but attempting to go beyond that limit/threshold caused it to trigger protect mode and although it ran this way for a year, what I was ultimately doing was killing my AVR/Amp slowly. I'm sure there is a technical term for this..

Configuration: 1 pair of speakers connected to Speaker B or Zone2 with an external VC in between AVR/Amp and outdoor speakers

Symptoms:
-With the external VC set to the appropriate impedance setting (1x or 2x), you attempt to slowly increase the master volume to max (external VC minimum level, but still connected between AVR and outdoor speakers) on the AVR/Amp. It triggers protect mode but will not if you simply keep it at a lower volume or below the threshold. I did this for a year, all that time assuming it was the quality of the VC.

Troubleshoot:
-Bypass the external VC and run your AVR directly to the outdoor speakers and are able to increase the volume to max (slowly). Note, you don't necessarily need an actual audio signal to conduct this test. The fluctuation in power/current by manipulating the master volume control on the AVR/Amp will still be apparent and by this method you reduce risk of damaging the speakers or angering your neighbors.
-Take a multimeter and test the continuity by setting it to "continuity" which is indicated by a sound wave symbol (side-way hashed pyramid)... or if your multimeter does not have this setting you can do this via the ohm setting by simply setting up the multimeter appropriately for measuring ohms. Next take one of the channel speaker leads (pos and neg) most likely at the AVR/Amp end and connect/twist the pos and neg together (no connection to AVR/Amp). Then on the opposite end of that same speaker lead (both are bare and not connected) take the testing leads of the multimeter and connect one to the positive and one to the negative of the speaker lead. If the multimeter reads 0, then your wire has no resistance (no breaks in the wire). After confirming, do the same for the other lead. If both leads read 0, then your wires are fine and no need to re-pull all that wire.

Solution:
Now that you've determined the culprit is the external VC or connections. DOUBLE CHECK YOUR LEADS AGAIN at your external VC and retest the output leads (external VC to Speakers) by using a small D battery, label them and then check again. Then verify and confirm the left and right input leads (from AVR/Amp), label them and check again. Once you are 100% on output and input leads proceed with making the connections to the external VC... ins to ins and outs to outs.

Result: If you made the same mistake I did, and were due diligent in the steps as described under "Solution". You should now be able turn the master volume control on your AVR/Amp to max without issue. However, if it does cut out... then it most likely is the external VC.

Please note, statements made are simply my opinion and by no means should be looked upon as an absolute solution. Just a man who wanted his tunes to play cleanly and loudly as he wishes without issue and/or limitation.

Take care fellas!biggrin.gif
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