Problems running a RF Modulator to another room. - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 31 Old 10-17-2013, 09:17 PM - Thread Starter
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I have one Directv receiver running two TV's. To do this I just got some splitters for the RCA's and ran 3 to my TV and the other 3 to the modulator. On the other end of the modulator of course is the coax cable which goes under the house and into another room where I've had a 21" LED TV. The 21" TV had a little static in it, but I figured I'd fix all of that when I bought the new one. Well today I acquired a RCA 31" LCD tv and hooked it up the same way. The screen is VERY dark and still has some static. I thought it was the modulator since it was a really cheap and older one so I purchased a GE which helped a little, but not enough. What can I do?
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post #2 of 31 Old 10-17-2013, 10:33 PM
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Try skipping the splitter and plug the rca cables right into the modulator and see if the picture improves. Are there any splitters in the coax? Is the coax terminated properly? Also what model of receiver?
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post #3 of 31 Old 10-18-2013, 11:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Try skipping the splitter and plug the rca cables right into the modulator and see if the picture improves.
Nope.
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Are there any splitters in the coax?
Nope.
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Is the coax terminated properly?
Yes
Quote:
Also what model of receiver?
H24700


EDIT: I brought the TV with the poor picture into the living room where the receiver is and hooked the RCA cables directly to it, worked fine. Then I hooked the RCA splitters back into the receiver and ran them to the TV, worked fine. Finally I hooked the RCA's to the RF modulator and ran a short piece of coax to the TV with the bad picture, same outcome as it had in the bedroom. So it has to be something to do with the rf modulator, but with me trying two different rf modulators idk what else to do.

EDIT(again): I hooked the old modulator back up and the picture was view able, but still really crappy as compared to the other tv I had in the bedroom. I'm guessing I need a better modulator, but idk what kind.
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post #4 of 31 Old 10-18-2013, 04:42 PM
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I stock a bunch of cheap philips modulators and never had issues. Try the modulators coax out to another TV to rule out the tuner on the TV itself
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post #5 of 31 Old 10-18-2013, 05:21 PM
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To do this I just got some splitters for the RCA's and ran 3 to my TV and the other 3 to the modulator.

You're double terminating the video signal, that's why it's dark. You can't just passively split a video signal this way, you need to use a distribution amp, or lift the termination resistor in the modulator.
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post #6 of 31 Old 10-18-2013, 06:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Could you recommend a good distribution amp that would fit my needs?
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post #7 of 31 Old 10-18-2013, 07:21 PM
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you should be able o find something on ebay or amazon.
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post #8 of 31 Old 10-18-2013, 09:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Just search for a distribution block with coax on both ends?
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post #9 of 31 Old 10-18-2013, 09:37 PM
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Originally Posted by ZQ8 Blazer View Post

Just search for a distribution block with coax on both ends?
Distribution AMP.
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post #10 of 31 Old 10-18-2013, 10:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Sorry. that's what I meant. So any distribution amp with coax in and coax out should do the job?
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post #11 of 31 Old 10-18-2013, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post

You're double terminating the video signal, that's why it's dark. You can't just passively split a video signal this way, you need to use a distribution amp, or lift the termination resistor in the modulator.

He said he tried bypassing the RCA splitter and it didn't help.
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post #12 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 06:11 AM
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Originally Posted by acesat View Post

He said he tried bypassing the RCA splitter and it didn't help.

Where does he say that?

He said when he disconnects one of the loads form the passive 'split' the picture improves....as it should.
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post #13 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by ZQ8 Blazer View Post

Sorry. that's what I meant. So any distribution amp with coax in and coax out should do the job?

A video distribution amp.
Not an RF amp.
Coax is a type of cable that can be used for RF signals as well as base band signals.
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post #14 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post

Where does he say that?

He said when he disconnects one of the loads form the passive 'split' the picture improves....as it should.

Post #3, after first block of quotes
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post #15 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 08:50 AM
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Worth asking, but are you using the HDMI output of the DirecTV receiver? If not, then have you considered going to a different DirecTV receiver?

The H12 receiver is a standard definition box which offers composite video output with analog audio (yellow/red/white RCA connections), and has a BUILT IN MODULATOR. So, you can feed other TVs from the modulator directly on the box itself. No external modulation is necessary and you don't have to split the video signal.



Considering the price, it may just be worth it to pick one up to use instead of dealing with all this other headache.

Worth saying, you should try the TV you want to use and connect it to the modulator locally with the modulator connected directly to the DirecTV receiver you currently have. No splitters, no long RF cables, just a short point to point connection with the modulator in between.

If the image looks great, then you can start adding things one-by-one until you lock down into what is causing the issue.

I mean, it's really unusual in a home for a RF cable to go from one room to another location, so I want you to be 100% that is all that it does - as you said "coax cable which goes under the house and into another room" - just want to be sure that's a point to point connection.

Now, keep in mind this is all standard definition TV and not HD if you are just using the composite video outputs. Also keep in mind that standard definition, modulated to RF, is about the worst possible video signal you can get. So, any HDTV really will miss out on potential quality with this stuff.

If you are set on all this modulated stuff, then you may want to consider a quality used agile modulator...

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=composite+video+modulator&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.Xagile+modulator&_nkw=agile+modulator&_sacat=0

Blonder Tongue is commercial grade stuff used in major installations and any pricing under $50 on their modulators is ridiculously low with very high quality.

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post #16 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 12:03 PM - Thread Starter
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I tell ya what, I'll draw up the exact setup I have when I get home and post it here. That will probably be much easier to understand.
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post #17 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acesat View Post

Post #3, after first block of quotes

Maybe you should quote it for me.
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post #18 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 02:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Here's my setup.


And these are the splitters I'm using.


I'm not very concerned with the picture quality of the tv in the bedroom, because we hardly watch it. As long as it's SD quality then I'm fine with that. I just want to be able to see the picture and not something very dark.
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post #19 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 03:29 PM
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You don't need to run composite video to the main TV since you have component video connected. That will at least remove one big potential source of problems by eliminating the simple Y-splitter from the video chain (even though you've said you tested without it).

What brand/model modulator are you using? Assuming it's a simple channel 3/4 modulator, you should try "the other channel" if the unit has a switch for that... Just in case there's local interference.

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post #20 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 03:32 PM
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You have the TV and modulator connected in parallel, you have two 75 Ohm terminations in parallel when there should only be one. This is why the picture is dark.

Why are you feeding the tv with composite as well as component video? Just unplug the composite input and the tv connected to the modulator will be brighter.
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post #21 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 03:34 PM
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Then I hooked the RCA splitters back into the receiver and ran them to the TV, worked fine. Finally I hooked the RCA's to the RF modulator and ran a short piece of coax to the TV with the bad picture, same outcome as it had in the bedroom.

Was the TV still connected to the splitter when you connected the modulator?
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post #22 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 04:57 PM
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If you want this to work, then do what I said to do above with your testing.

Oh, and there is not reason to run composite video AND component video to your larger TV. I don't understand that at all. If your TV is HD, why not use HDMI? If it only has component video, then run component video (red/green/blue) and analog audio, but don't run composite video. That's redundant.

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post #23 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post

Maybe you should quote it for me.
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Originally Posted by acesat View Post

Try skipping the splitter and plug the rca cables right into the modulator and see if the picture improves.
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Originally Posted by ZQ8 Blazer View Post

Nope.

As others have pointed out, OP should remove the yellow splitter as a matter of principle. He said he already tried that but maybe there was a miscommunication.
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post #24 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 06:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys, for some reason I thought you had to use the yellow composite cable while using the component cables.
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What brand/model modulator are you using? Assuming it's a simple channel 3/4 modulator, you should try "the other channel" if the unit has a switch for that... Just in case there's local interference.
GE 37361
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You have the TV and modulator connected in parallel, you have two 75 Ohm terminations in parallel when there should only be one. This is why the picture is dark.
So how do I fix this???
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Just unplug the composite input and the tv connected to the modulator will be brighter.
I don't fully understand, if I unplug it then there won't be any connection between the receiver and the modulator.
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Was the TV still connected to the splitter when you connected the modulator?
Yes. I've tried it with and without the splitter.
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Oh, and there is not reason to run composite video AND component video to your larger TV. I don't understand that at all. If your TV is HD, why not use HDMI? If it only has component video, then run component video (red/green/blue) and analog audio, but don't run composite video. That's redundant.
The TV in the living room only has one HDMI input and that's being used by my PS3.
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If you want this to work, then do what I said to do above with your testing.
I brought the tv from the bedroom into the living room and hooked it up directly to the receiver, still has a dark picture.
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post #25 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 07:30 PM
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White/Red is for audio. Green/Blue/Red is for component video, Yellow is for composite video. If your main TV is using component video (Green/Blue/Red) then you can unplug the Yellow from the back of the TV since it's redundant and potentially causing the issue. Try plugging only the yellow from the receiver into the modulator, no splitters or any other anythings. Then see what kind of picture you get on the other tv.
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post #26 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 08:01 PM - Thread Starter
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To my dismay this did not work.
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post #27 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 09:19 PM
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Just unplug the composite input and the tv connected to the modulator will be brighter.
I don't fully understand, if I unplug it then there won't be any connection between the receiver and the modulator.

Unplug the composite input to the tv, plug it into the modulator instead.
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Was the TV still connected to the splitter when you connected the modulator?
Yes. I've tried it with and without the splitter.

So, with the receiver connected to the modulator only, the picture is still bad?
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I brought the tv from the bedroom into the living room and hooked it up directly to the receiver, still has a dark picture.

This is the first time you've mentioned this
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post #28 of 31 Old 10-19-2013, 10:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Unplug the composite input to the tv, plug it into the modulator instead.
Did that earlier and got no change.
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So, with the receiver connected to the modulator only, the picture is still bad?
Correct
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This is the first time you've mentioned this
Sorry I thought I had said it.
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post #29 of 31 Old 10-20-2013, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZQ8 Blazer View Post

I brought the tv from the bedroom into the living room and hooked it up directly to the receiver, still has a dark picture.
Now we are getting somewhere.

I'm going to go with this as what you did, and I would like you to confirm it. I'm also going to ask that if you didn't do it this way, that you do it this way JUST FOR TESTING.

1. Bring your TV in from the other room, set it next to the modulator/DTV box.
2. Unplug EVERY wire from the DTV box.
3. Plug the yellow RCA wire (composite video) from the DTV box into the modulator without any splitters or anything else.
4. Plug the red/white RCA wire (analog audio) from the DTV box into the modulator without any splitters or anything else.
5. Plug the modulator into your TV with a piece of RG6 coaxial cable.
6. Turn your TV on and make absolutely sure your TV is on the right channel.
7. Tell us if the image is dark or looks good.

If this is what you did, then you said the image was still dark. Then, it's your modulator which isn't doing a good job and I would recommend you check the links from my prior posts to the Blonder Tongue units which are in a different class of quality than the GE box you are using now.

If there is no splitter used with the composite video signal, than I see the issue as being in the setup of your TV or in the modulator itself.

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post #30 of 31 Old 10-20-2013, 04:16 PM - Thread Starter
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It's still very dark.
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