Is there a diffrence between HDMI over single Cat 6 versus dual Cat 6 units? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 17 Old 11-20-2013, 01:34 PM - Thread Starter
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I see that there are units that have single and there are units that have dual Cat 6 inputs. Is there a difference between the two? I thought it's better to get the dual Cat 6 unit for possible redundancy but a rep at Monoprice told me there is no difference. Any thought?
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post #2 of 17 Old 11-20-2013, 01:54 PM
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i believe the only difference is distance. See what others say though
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post #3 of 17 Old 11-20-2013, 02:02 PM - Thread Starter
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The Monoprice rep evens says that the single Cat 6 units are actually better than the dual cat 6 units. It does not make sense to me.
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post #4 of 17 Old 11-20-2013, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
I thought it's better to get the dual Cat 6 unit for possible redundancy

There's no redundancy
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post #5 of 17 Old 11-20-2013, 08:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluetv View Post

The Monoprice rep evens says that the single Cat 6 units are actually better than the dual cat 6 units. It does not make sense to me.

The single cat5e HDMI extenders are mostly based on the HDBaseT technology now (there are a few that aren't, but won't be as feature-rich, either). The dual-cable solutions are less-sophisticated signal extenders, which need both wires to have enough signals to extend all wires in the HDMI cable. HDBaseT works differently, by serializing the HDMI signals at higher speeds, and they add in other features - RS232, 100Mb Ethernet and IR repeating as well.

So yes, the single-cable HDBaseT solutions are actually superior to all the rest, but are not the cheapest solutions. However, if your'e running wire, you should run multiple category wires to display locations, so you have options and have wire in place for future use.

And as SAM64 said, there's no redundancy in any of these solutions. The two-cable extenders need both to operate, period.

Jeff
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post #6 of 17 Old 11-20-2013, 08:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks all. I learn something today.
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post #7 of 17 Old 11-22-2013, 08:19 AM
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+1 what Jautor said.

Dual Cat's does not mean redundant. In fact, dual cat's means less fault tolerance because there's twice the chance that a cable can go bad. Running dual cables and using a single cable solution is building in fault tolerance because if a cable goes bad, you can use the other.

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post #8 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 08:30 AM
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I actually thought HDBaseT required 2 cat5e/6 cables. Can someone link to a good single HDBaseT unit? I'll be doing some runs in my house soon and was planning on doing 2 drops per display location for hdbaset.
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post #9 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 09:05 AM
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HDMI over Dual CAT - requires minimal processing of the HDMI signal and in most cases leaves the Video and Audio untouched – you will usually run into distance/bandwidth limitations once you go out past 35m and ideally you want to use CAT6 and no breaks in the cable runs. Some designs will cater for HDMI + IR + PoC.

HDMI over single CAT (Non-HDBaseT) – are a complete lottery as you have no way of knowing how the signal has been squeezed over the single CAT cable.

HDMI over HDBaseT – requires a single CAT cable (again the better the quality of cable the less prone the system will be to cable length limitations). HDBaseT is a transmitter and receiver chip which you add to HDMI – the system ‘modulates’ the HDMI signal to run over a single cable and can also support 10/100 Ethernet, IR and PoC. There are two versions HDBaseT (max cable run 100m) and HDBaseT-lite (max cable run 60m). It is a very stable system – though does produce a fair bit of heat so needs careful engineering/installation.

HD over LAN – requires a single CAT cable and requires the use of dynamic compression. Can be utilised in conjunction with a managed or non-managed Gigabit Switch to form a ‘low cost’ Distribution or Matrix which is ideal for Digital Signage/Corporate use where you can ‘afford’ to give away a bit of image quality in return for big cost savings.

Here at Octava Inc. we have HDMI over Dual CAT, HDMI over HDBaseT, HDMI over HDBaseT-lite and HD over LAN solutions to meet different system design requirements.

Joe

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post #10 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdizzle View Post

I actually thought HDBaseT required 2 cat5e/6 cables. Can someone link to a good single HDBaseT unit? I'll be doing some runs in my house soon and was planning on doing 2 drops per display location for hdbaset.

I would run two cat5e/6 drops to each display location regardless (since they can be used for lots of other purposes), but HDBaseT is a single-category cable technology. Any product using HDBaseT will use one cable - but as Joe noted, there are also single cable solution which are NOT HDBaseT.

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post #11 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jautor View Post

I would run two cat5e/6 drops to each display location regardless (since they can be used for lots of other purposes), but HDBaseT is a single-category cable technology. Any product using HDBaseT will use one cable - but as Joe noted, there are also single cable solution which are NOT HDBaseT.

I was gonna run multiple drops anyway. I was gonna have the cat6 be the transport for video, db9, IR, and data. If hdbaset only needs one, that just means one less drop to for me to have to fish behind my walls.
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post #12 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by bdizzle View Post

I was gonna run multiple drops anyway. I was gonna have the cat6 be the transport for video, db9, IR, and data. If hdbaset only needs one, that just means one less drop to for me to have to fish behind my walls.

Choose the correct HDBaseT product and you can get all of that (HDMI, RS232, IR and 10/100 Ethernet) on a single cable... And then you'll still have a spare! smile.gif

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post #13 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Fernand View Post

HDMI over Dual CAT - requires minimal processing of the HDMI signal and in most cases leaves the Video and Audio untouched – you will usually run into distance/bandwidth limitations once you go out past 35m and ideally you want to use CAT6 and no breaks in the cable runs. Some designs will cater for HDMI + IR + PoC.

HDMI over single CAT (Non-HDBaseT) – are a complete lottery as you have no way of knowing how the signal has been squeezed over the single CAT cable.

HDMI over HDBaseT – requires a single CAT cable (again the better the quality of cable the less prone the system will be to cable length limitations). HDBaseT is a transmitter and receiver chip which you add to HDMI – the system ‘modulates’ the HDMI signal to run over a single cable and can also support 10/100 Ethernet, IR and PoC. There are two versions HDBaseT (max cable run 100m) and HDBaseT-lite (max cable run 60m). It is a very stable system – though does produce a fair bit of heat so needs careful engineering/installation.

HD over LAN – requires a single CAT cable and requires the use of dynamic compression. Can be utilised in conjunction with a managed or non-managed Gigabit Switch to form a ‘low cost’ Distribution or Matrix which is ideal for Digital Signage/Corporate use where you can ‘afford’ to give away a bit of image quality in return for big cost savings.

Here at Octava Inc. we have HDMI over Dual CAT, HDMI over HDBaseT, HDMI over HDBaseT-lite and HD over LAN solutions to meet different system design requirements.

Joe

Thanks for the clarification Joe. All this time I though HDMI over dual CAT was the same as HDMI over HDBaseT.

Is this device HDMI over HDBaseT or HDMI over CAT?

http://www.monoprice.com/Product?c_id=109&cp_id=10914&cs_id=1091402&p_id=10681&seq=1&format=2
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post #14 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by jautor View Post

Choose the correct HDBaseT product and you can get all of that (HDMI, RS232, IR and 10/100 Ethernet) on a single cable... And then you'll still have a spare! smile.gif

Which product does all of that? It'd make my life a million times easier.
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post #15 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by bdizzle View Post

Which product does all of that? It'd make my life a million times easier.

Here's an example:

http://www.atlona.com/HDTX-RSNET.html

CREATOR: gd-jpeg v1.0 (using IJG JPEG v62), quality = 90


But you can use the HDBaseT site's certified product list to see all the available ones with RS232 / IR / Ethernet...

http://www.hdbaset.org/products_list

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post #16 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jautor View Post

Here's an example:

http://www.atlona.com/HDTX-RSNET.html



But you can use the HDBaseT site's certified product list to see all the available ones with RS232 / IR / Ethernet...

http://www.hdbaset.org/products_list

Thanks for the reply. After I hit reply, I saw the link on hdbaset.org and found the products.

The extender just extends HDMI cable past it's native length correct? I assume I'd need a matrix to get full video distribution.
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post #17 of 17 Old 12-11-2013, 07:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdizzle View Post

Thanks for the reply. After I hit reply, I saw the link on hdbaset.org and found the products.

The extender just extends HDMI cable past it's native length correct? I assume I'd need a matrix to get full video distribution.

There is no "native length". I can tell you HDMI was created with a max. 6-foot length in mind. Having said that, there are passive HDMI cables in the 75-foot range & active ones up to around 125 feet. I would never use anything like that. Anything over 50 feet; we spec an extender every time. HDBaseT is the way to go these days.

Yes, you would want a matrix, preferably with HDBaseT outputs, for full video distribution.
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