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Old 09-25-2014, 08:54 PM - Thread Starter
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HDBaseT 2.0 & 1Gb Ethernet

I understand that HDBaseT can also carry a 100Mb Ethernet channel over the same single CAT cable as the video, audio and 100W power. Supposedly, the alliance back in 2010 said that in the future 1Gb Ethernet will be supported. However, it seems even 2.0, for which there are not even any devices yet, does not support it as the following link only lists 100Mb.


http://www.valens.com/products/vs2311


So my questions are:


1) Does 2.0 indeed not support 1Gb?


2) Is anybody running two Ethernet cables? One for HDBaseT and one as a backup or other functions like 1Gb Ethernet?


3) Would it make sense to run one optical and one Ethernet to each port? How much more expensive is fiber cable vs. Ethernet? If you have run fiber cables can you point me to the source/product you used?


4) Why is USB included in the standard? What are the applications? Maybe remote PC? The PC sits in a separate room and you simply hook up a mouse and keyboard through USB and the video signal comes on the TV? Such a solution would be very appealing to me.
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Old 09-25-2014, 10:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mujudu View Post
1) Does 2.0 indeed not support 1Gb?
I don't believe so, and there really isn't a lot of need for it in HDBaseT applications, since the devices attaching to the receiver are only 100Mb-capable in most cases.

Quote:
2) Is anybody running two Ethernet cables? One for HDBaseT and one as a backup or other functions like 1Gb Ethernet?
Yes, running multiple cat5e/cat6 wires to each location is a good idea for those reasons, and that cat5e is good for lots of other AV applications as well.

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3) Would it make sense to run one optical and one Ethernet to each port? How much more expensive is fiber cable vs. Ethernet? If you have run fiber cables can you point me to the source/product you used?
No. Run more cat5e/cat6 instead. Lots more expensive, and even more expensive if you try to actually use it. Unnecessary for residential usage.

Quote:
4) Why is USB included in the standard? What are the applications? Maybe remote PC? The PC sits in a separate room and you simply hook up a mouse and keyboard through USB and the video signal comes on the TV? Such a solution would be very appealing to me.
Remote PC is the primary use case (think commerical / education markets), but it may be useful for gaming platforms where the sensor package is USB...

Jeff

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Old 09-25-2014, 10:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Jautor, thanks a lot for your response. I am interested in 1Gb not for connecting a TV to the network (I rather use a setup box in a central location) but for connecting a PC. However, considering the new application with USB I probably will:


* Run a single CAT 5e/6 for the TV on one wall
* Run a single CAT 5e/6 to another wall for a PC monitor, mouse and keyboard connected to a central computer.


With the above there is no need for 1Gb as the central computer will have that connection. Does that sound like a reasonable setup? Would you still recommend two CAT runs to each of the two outlets for a total of 4? If so why?
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Old 09-26-2014, 07:14 AM
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Originally Posted by mujudu View Post
With the above there is no need for 1Gb as the central computer will have that connection. Does that sound like a reasonable setup?
You're placing a bet on HDBaseT with USB to be a viable remote solution - while it may be, it's not going to be cheap, and may have other limitations we're not aware of yet. I would certainly wire for other KVM-over-category products, but you should also look at the cost of these products in general.

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Would you still recommend two CAT runs to each of the two outlets for a total of 4? If so why?
Yes, cat5e/6 cables are very inexpensive, and yet very useful for a number of other applications (including a phone line!). The most obvious thing a second cable can be used for is a second Ethernet device...

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Old 09-26-2014, 10:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Jautor, you make some very good points regarding 2.0. Our renovation/extension is going to start in about 6 months. Hence I was hoping devices will be available but as you said at what cost/compromises/limitations? I was looking at some mouse/keyboard extensions over Ethernet but there are not too many solutions. Still there are some like the link below and various KVMs over Ethernet.


http://www.lindy.com.au/cat5e-6-usb-...mouse-extender


Considering this, do you think it is still adequate to run just one CAT cable to each location in each room, i.e. one for the TV and one for the PC? For the PC I would use HDBaseT for the video and the Ethernet port for the keyboard/mouse.
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Old 09-27-2014, 12:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mujudu View Post
Considering this, do you think it is still adequate to run just one CAT cable to each location in each room, i.e. one for the TV and one for the PC? For the PC I would use HDBaseT for the video and the Ethernet port for the keyboard/mouse.
Adequate? Perhaps. My recommendation, no. Run at least two cat5e/cat6 wires to each display location. I would also run at least two to any primary drop in a room (if you have multiple drops, then a single cable at other locations is fine).

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Old 10-02-2014, 03:20 AM
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Hello - I am in a similar situation, but have already wired the home. I wanted centralized av gear and pcs. I ran 4 cat6 cables to every possible tv location and an empty conduit. This has been a good approach for me.

I am interested in hdbaset 2.0 - I do have the hdbaset 1.0 point to point sender/receiver from Altona. I want to simply cabling and want to use the built in USB for remote pc control via wireless keyboard and mouse. I use the Logitech backlit wireless keyboard and the unifying wireless receiver that connects via USB. Today I am using a USB extender over cat6, but want to use a single platform for future tv's.

I also like how hdbaset 2.0 is paying attention to all the layers in the osi model - would think that would help with quality of signal.

A little frustrating that hdbaset 2.0 was announced over a year ago - little product to date.
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Old 10-03-2014, 10:10 AM
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Also waiting for HDBaseT 2.0

Have wired my 1920's house we have rehabbed with at least 2 (sometimes more) to each drop, for a share and perhaps connect another computer or other device to ethernet.

Waiting, waiting . . . for new HDBaseT

- Phil
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Old 10-03-2014, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Philip Klein View Post
Have wired my 1920's house we have rehabbed with at least 2 (sometimes more) to each drop, for a share and perhaps connect another computer or other device to ethernet.

Waiting, waiting . . . for new HDBaseT
Just curious - what exactly are you waiting for? What functionality do you need that's not already covered by the existing HDBaseT gear?

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Old 10-03-2014, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by jautor View Post
Just curious - what exactly are you waiting for? What functionality do you need that's not already covered by the existing HDBaseT gear?
My understanding is that 2.0 is a more integrated product, needing less associated electronics, having greater switching capability. I expect to get a 4x4 or so switch and I am hopeful that a 2.0 switch will be cheaper, more functional. Maybe using the power over Cat6 capability. Much of it just a belief that 2.0 will have less kinks that 1.0.

- Phil

Last edited by Philip Klein; 10-03-2014 at 01:26 PM.
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Old 10-03-2014, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philip Klein View Post
My understanding is that 2.0 is a more integrated product, needing less associated electronics, having greater switching capability. I expect to get a 4x4 or so switch and I am hopeful that a 2.0 switch will be cheaper, more functional. Maybe using the power of Cat6 capability. Much of it just a belief that 2.0 will have less kinks that 1.0.

- Phil
I wouldn't expect any 2.0 product to be cheaper than a 1.0 - certainly not if it contains "more features". I'm not sure what would be more integrated or have less components in a typical AV setup comparing the two. And what "kinks" are there in 1.0?

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Old 10-03-2014, 01:39 PM
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mujundu – 4 x CAT6 to each Room is our norm (and use different coloured cables to make quick identification much simpler).


Philip Klein – heat is an issue already when using PoH to power Zone Receivers, powering Displays will be a nightmare. I’m with jautor re cost - I don’t see our design team in Atlanta/Taipei getting too excited about HDBT 2.0 offering a significant cost reduction.

Our experience has been to stick to the basics (HDMI, RoutedIR, Broadcast IR, PoH, EDID and HDCP management) and avoid over complicating the Matrix as other devices are far better at dealing with some of the more ‘esoteric’ features.

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Old 10-04-2014, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Joe Fernand View Post
mujundu – 4 x CAT6 to each Room is our norm (and use different coloured cables to make quick identification much simpler).


Philip Klein – heat is an issue already when using PoH to power Zone Receivers, powering Displays will be a nightmare. I’m with jautor re cost - I don’t see our design team in Atlanta/Taipei getting too excited about HDBT 2.0 offering a significant cost reduction.

Our experience has been to stick to the basics (HDMI, RoutedIR, Broadcast IR, PoH, EDID and HDCP management) and avoid over complicating the Matrix as other devices are far better at dealing with some of the more ‘esoteric’ features.

Joe
The Octava HD4xSTPMX certainly does the basics well, however, to me it sounds like Phillip Klein was referring to existing infrastructure in terms of integration. I know I already have multiple switches some with dedicated networks for devices (IP cameras and control systems [door locks, lighting control] and others serving generalized connections (computers, printers, wireless AP, NAS, distributed music, etc.).

To me the benefit of spec 2.0 is the presumed lower cost of the matrix/switch (which is depicted as a switch simply directing T-packets and which I presumably already have adequate version of, although details seem scarce [what would be considered adequate low latency / meet the hardware demands]), along with some refinements of the capability (longer distances [4k over Cat6], usb, etc.). I especially like the usb for the remote PC control.

In this scenario the transmitter and receiver presumably cost more but could be put together in a huge number of variations since it would support multipoint and a/symmetric/partial connections and could be altered at any time.

I have not seen any hardware announcements yet so it's hard to speculate, but I would love to know if hardware vendors were planning on a box which would transmit a single source or if there would be boxes which accommodate multiple sources as with the current matrixes. The Valens demo I saw simply had a single transmitter and receiver. I would also love to know if the newer version would generate less heat, could be cooled passively. With reported volume production of the Colligo chipset in October hopefully products will be forthcoming!

Also waiting, waiting.
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Old 03-06-2015, 05:34 AM
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HDBaseT 2.0

Has anyone seen announcements/time tables on actual product releases for HDBaseT 2.0 gear? I know Valens announced their new chips sometime back. I also saw Kramer Electronics introduced new 2.0 receivers/transmitters at the beginning of Feb, but I did not see a release date in the press release. A couple of Gefen's new products look very 2.0-"like" in terms of feature set, but it was not apparent to me that they are part of the branded HDBaseT ecosystem. What about others manufacturers? Thanks!
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Old 04-09-2015, 01:14 AM
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I have not seen any 2.0 product shipping that provides the promise of the new spec. The spec was announced 1.5 years ago - really draws into question the viability of this platform for distribution. I really like the approach and use hdbaset extenders currently, but have not seen any products that support usb integration, "matriced video", etc.

Admittedly I am not as close to the day to day activities as others and welcome someone pointing my to a full spec'd hdbaset 2.0 extender....
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