Best non-proprietary touch panels? - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 131 Old 10-20-2005, 03:54 PM
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Dunno yet. We'll see soon. First is to see if they are appropriate in terms of just being able to run our software, then we'll dig deeper.

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post #92 of 131 Old 10-20-2005, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiblesolutions
... the only deal was for an IT pro for a local firm who acted as enabler for his boss ( for whom I was to do the work on a " basic system " that some how became--with no help from me-- anything but basic ) to steal 7500 dollars from a job that was priced at 28k and included no programming line item. And it had more programming in the end then most of the jobs I obtian on my own. That skummy enabler still lurks here and other than making mention that evil exists and affects my bottom line I make no reference to him or his boss.
Whoa, master of hyperbole - put a rest to it.

There are two sides to every story.

Another POV is that there's a customer who had real concerns about the job ever being completed - functionally, and in a timely fashion.

Simply put, there was a disagreement between you and my boss regarding the completion of the job.

In the end, you chose to walk away without completing the job - which by any means was a right of yours.

It's sad that you have to resort to name calling.
It's unbecoming.

Life is short. Enjoy!
Andrew.
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post #93 of 131 Old 10-20-2005, 04:57 PM
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AILimited,

You might want to add this to your list of touchscreens:
http://www.dynamism.com/u50/

Having used a ViewSonic VA150 on my system, I would only add that the WinCE/ce.Net based units probably would not be an ideal solution for you.

Currently, I am running a full function, super quiet, small form factor WinXP PC connected to an in-wall USB touchscreen running MainLobby.
Good thing about this setup is that I have already upgraded the PC twice since I originally set it up.
The only issue is startup time. I usually leave the PC on 24hrs, using WinXP's built in power management.
It's usually ready for use 5-10 seconds after touching the screen.

Life is short. Enjoy!
Andrew.
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post #94 of 131 Old 10-20-2005, 05:07 PM
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What did you find to be a problem with the CE.Net devices? If it was performance, that might have to do with MainLobby's high overhead (being flash based.) That wouldn't necessarily be a problem with more efficient systems. We are also talking about clients here, not the main controller.

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post #95 of 131 Old 10-20-2005, 07:00 PM - Thread Starter
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And which USB panel are you using?

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post #96 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 04:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midi-guy
Whoa, master of hyperbole - put a rest to it.

There are two sides to every story.

Another POV is that there's a customer who had real concerns about the job ever being completed - functionally, and in a timely fashion.

Simply put, there was a disagreement between you and my boss regarding the completion of the job.

In the end, you chose to walk away without completing the job - which by any means was a right of yours.

It's sad that you have to resort to name calling.
It's unbecoming.
Andrew:
Please share. Tell the other side publicly. I give you my permission. What did not work? Was it not supposed to be a basic system as in play, stop pause transport control? Did not Audiotron, Gefin DVI switchers and on and on? Please inform everyone and more importantly me what imcompetance I am guilty of?

Was there a programming line item? Did we not do significant extras? Such as? Running DVI cables and repeaters after the job was wired. Running additional cables to the Kitchen for the display you provided. Running additial component video cables to rooms that you designed for composite video? How much additional programming was in fact done and for Free.

Share. Tell everyone. I am sure everyone would love to know how incompetant I am. I certainly would. To my knowledge there are only issues with your HTPC which was your issue. Issues with the Audiotron were supposed to be off my plate and on yours. The only issue was with the recessing hardware that came with the Crestron touch panel that meant we could not line up on the existing single gang lighting switch. The theif had have his electrician move the box two inches becasue he never authorized me to perform the DAMAGE. Since there were no plans and no one marked the walls, I made a mistake and cut speakers into one room in the wrong location. Given that that the house had to be painted and the damage we needed to perform to get from the basement to the attic I doubt that patch cost 7500 dollars. Probably cost nothing. Getting component video,, new RF and network wires, Speaker lines, control lines and DVI cables from the basement to the attic only requires 1/2 inch holes? Right?

Free installed RF network. Free terminated computer network ( you were supposed to do that. ) Additional rack. Mis-specificied equipment by you. Theater system speakers that moved from where the speaker wires were in the wall into the ceiling. I suppose you could have moved them without channeling through the wood. No one said anything and the wife of the theif was informed of everything, including the mistakes with respect to speaker cutouts.

Tell Andrew. Do Tell. I'd love to hear the other side. I'd love to see if you are as dishonorable as the theif you call boss. I did everything I in the proposal and more. Basic system? Do tell what the system became. Did it work Andrew? Not you horrid and illegal HTPC but everything else? Did I not write the serial strings for you horrid HTPC? Did they work? No idea. You claimed it did. Oh, yes some equipment problem witht the Niles Amp that was part of YOUR specification ( remember this was a Gloria system when you designed it ) and as I recall your phone call to me, "what ever you did fixed the problem. "

You are a full time IT pro and a part time enabler of theives. Perhpas you more than a part time enabler. Ever have equipment problems in the office? As I recall you supplied quite a few cables that had problems and sent new ones.

Do Tell, Andrew. Do TELL. I am sure you still have my phone number. Why would I bother to call you? I told you from my first meeting with your boss the theif that I found you honorable and him dishonorable. You claimed I had only to come to know him. Lie or truth? Tell Andrew. Do it here or contract me off line. I grant you my permission. I'd love to understand why I received no money of labor nor for the ML-500s ( that did come in late because they were new and Crestron was late delivering them. My fault? ). Why I was not paid for the extra days wiring and for the materials. Time and materials was the basis not to exceed X number of days. Save for the Kitchen. Do tell. Andrew. Do tell. Until then you are scum and your boss more scum.

I missed the last line. I walked away? What was not done. Installing the equipment in the theater in the cabinet that was not there? Did anyone call to tell me to come back? Last I heard from you--only you as the theif would never speak to me-- the was a probem with the Niles amp and that problem was fixed. Only other issue was about source code and I told you from the beginning that I grant a liscence to use my code and give the compiled files but not the source code unless agreed upon at the beginning of the job. As this job never contained any line item for programming I would be damned if I'd give it away for free. Do tell, Andrew. I have never walked away from any job. Ever. I took a year off, when I had a partner, to fix his issues. I asked for payment. You said " [the theif] and you did not work it out? Were you not supposed to be paid when equipment came on site?" "He disappeared while I was working." When you called and informed me of problems they were promptly taken care of. No one called. I did not walk away. You enabled your theiving boss to steal. Plain and simple. The little I understand about Nigeria --I'd like to know which side of that cultural divide you fall. I walked away!! Now you lie. If there were problems or anything more to do you guys only needed to call. You sure did with respect to the amp. My calls back to check on the jobs status were never returned. My only refusal was to do more extra work so you installed and terminated the display and wires for the kitchen display. It was never in my proposal and as I was owed significant money for extras already why do more work for which I new, evidently correctly, that I would not be paid.

What took so long? The additional changes you made? We showed up on time ( more or less. The job was in Bedford and required between 60 and 90 minute drive depending on traffic ). Some of the Crestron equipment specified was not released on time. It took, I believe an additional two weeks for the ML500s but as soon as they came on market they were in his home and worked. He was never there, even on weekends. He never spoke to me. I was too lowly, evidently. His job was done timely to the extent I had any control of it. As soon as he said put in the rear speakers they were installed. "I thought wewere waiting for the ceiling to be done? asked little old me. " NO PUT THEM IN." They went in.

Tell me not of his fears but of the real mistakes and errors. Tell me of the times we did not show up. Tell me if we did not wire the home in the time specified. Oh yes. I told him time and materials between 2 and four days. He choose to hear 2 days and it took 3.5 days. You boss is a theif and I may have been mistaken about your integrity. But I would love to hear a list form you of my errors of omission or comission. Late. Examples. I fear there is no other side save that you are still enabling a theif to steal from others. Which makes you an accessory of a sort, does it. If I screwed up detail it. Do it publicly if you'd like or privately should you prefer. I have never walked away from a job and I certainly did not walk away from that job. I also performed that work within a reasonalbe time period and with respect to events I could control. If a product did not exist it could not be installed. Once it was available it was. More lies. So tell everyone about my lies and deceptions, Andrew. Prey, tell

I apologize for the above. It is personal and of interest to me and has no business in this thread. I will not delete it as a) I'd love an answer. b) I think you DIYs need to see the scum that we deal with and c) if I am as incompetant as was suggested then let it be stated publicly. The fact is that this job grates on me more than any other in which I was beaten out of a final payment because I knew the theif was a theif. But I though Andrew an honorable man and he suggested that his boss, though difficult could be managed by him. I believed him.
It was Andrew's design. We only executed it. I would love to know what I did wrong or how I abandoned this job. If you don't call me am I just supposed to show up and ring the bell?

Simply put there was a disagreement between the theif and me with respect to the completion of the job? What was not done? The extras for the Kitchen? Why should I perform extra work if I am not to be paid of for which we cannot agree on a price for that work? That does not abrograte one from paying for the work done and the material provided as part of the contract. What was not done? Please tell. What was not done.

Alan
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post #97 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 05:46 AM
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I read midi-guys post last night and hoped for a response from Alan and upon waking up today can only say that man on man, did Alan not disappoint! I have only ONE comment Alan. I believe it is "thief", not "theif" ;). Otherwise, if I was a smart ass, which of course I am not, I'd say "you go girl". So I will only say interesting reading. It's ashame when programmers and subs have to deal with something like this. I was speaking to another programmer just the other day that related how his day had been spent showing up to a job that had been scheduled (and he was assured was ready), only to find out that none of the equipment was installed yet. So with drive time his entire day was wasted. Far too common type of occurence unfortunately. I suspect the same guy who told him to show up would be peeved as hell if he was sent a bill for a days worth of missed work.

p.s. I guess I had more than one comment after all.
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post #98 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 06:09 AM
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This is why it is probably best not to deal with other forum members.. except me of course.
Did you count how many times Alan told him to "do tell".
He must have been really pissed off when he wrote that. I'll bet his typing hands were flying on that keyboard making tons of tpying errors.

JOE
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post #99 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 06:19 AM
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I liked the comment about Nigeria.
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post #100 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 09:49 AM
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WOW! Don't hold back now!

What was the thread title again?
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post #101 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 10:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Richardson
WOW! Don't hold back now!

What was the thread title again?
"Install your own TV in the kitchen!"

AI Limited
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post #102 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QQQ
I liked the comment about Nigeria.
Q,
What exactly did you like about that comment?

Alan,
What's there to tell, really?.
For an unexplained reason, you say I'm scum.
Now, I'm a liar. Where's the lie? I just don't get it.

In the project, did you recommend any changes? Were some of those changes accepted?
Was the final BOM the same as my original proposal?

Big deal, we had some discussions and the project evolved.

The way I see it, no one put a gun to your head during the project.
You could have said no, and just implemented the original spec.

You talk about incompetence. I never mentioned such a thing.

In your line of work, effective communication is essential.
The fact that you do not think your client had concerns about the completion of the job is telling.

Life is short. Enjoy!
Andrew.
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post #103 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AI Limited
And which USB panel are you using? A Dynamism brand or other?
Nothing fancy:
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicati...433&CatId=1449

Life is short. Enjoy!
Andrew.
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post #104 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midi-guy
Q,
What exactly did you like about that comment?
I misunderstood it. I thought it was a reference to all the spam E-mails we receive that say "I am a diplomat from Nigeria and I have a million dollars for you". I'm paraphrasing of course and it may even be some other country they come from. I thought it was another way that Alan was calling your boss a thief.
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post #105 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 02:27 PM - Thread Starter
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The U50 is cool, but so far I like the one that will survive a 3 ft drop test the best (Zykronix Pantera). My son just gave my MX-800 the 6 ft chuck test. It survived. I emailed Zykronix for more information through their website about a week ago. No response.

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post #106 of 131 Old 10-21-2005, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midi-guy
Running the same with XLobby...
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post #107 of 131 Old 10-23-2005, 07:58 PM
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Andrew:
[quote=midi-guy]let's read what you wrote:
Whoa, master of hyperbole - put a rest to it.[quote]

Did this job not begin as a Niles Gloria system? Did it not evolve into the same system with the lone addition of a PAD8 as it was less expensive to add one pad8 then 2 Glorias to this sysetm? How then did component video and a Geffin DVI switcher enter this system? I was supposed to wire for 1-12 data drops. How then did I not only have to do that --but I had to move them in 2 instinces and then custom wire a 24 port switch? And did that switch need to be replaced becuase it failed? How supplied that switch? Why was it my reponsibility to fix that?

[quote=midi-guy]There are two sides to every story.[quote]

And what is the other side to this story. I performed the work and the system works. You imply that there are valid reasons for which I was not paid but have yet to put forth any.

[quote=midi-guy]Another POV is that there's a customer who had real concerns about the job ever being completed - functionally, and in a timely fashion.[quote]

There are many parnoids in the world. Am I to be held to the phantasies of every parnoid in the world? You slyly imply--but never state-- that there were real issues of compliance that would justify the theif not paying his bill. What was performed late? The various changes you forced upon the job on those midnight sessions the two of you had? What functinal issues occured? I'll name them. There were issues with the Audiotron that were directly related to your playing with the code. Like many DIYs you could not help tinkering with the software and you failed to remove the connection to your computer. What happens when you leave a terminal emulation program open and you remove the computer?

The other issue had to do with the HTPC you supplied. During my 2 months on this job it never worked. But this was your baby. I only had to provide the switching. When did the switching not work?

You imply malfeaseance and you provide inuendo for incompetance ( as in I did not show up and the system did not work ) but such was not the case.

[quote=midi-guy]Simply put, there was a disagreement between you and my boss regarding the completion of the job.[quote]

What was not finished? The only disagreement was if I was obligated to perform ever more uncompensated work. It appeared that the theif, I suspected at your suggestion, ( he always followed your suggestions and why would a sane individual expect anyone to perform work without compensation for which was not part of the original contract explicitly or implicitly? The only disagreement was your boss not paying his bill for the work that was done. And my not providing him with the source code for a job he never paid for programming? There was never any disagreement over the job being finished. Our ( Andrew and my ) last conversation was to tell me of a problem with the cheap Niles amp and then your telling me that the problem was evidently solved by what ever fix I employed.

[quote=midi-guy]In the end, you chose to walk away without completing the job - which by any means was a right of yours.[quote]

I chose to walk away? I finished all of the work and no one ever called me back when the cabinets showed up. All the time I was there talk of coffered ceilings in the Living room and some cabinet to be installed at some later date occured. I saw plans but no other work man. Was I supposed to knock on the door on a trip to Katanah Sommers, or Bedford? The system worked and I had completed every item on the proposal. What more was there to do?

[quote=midi-guy]The way I see it, no one put a gun to your head during the project.
You could have said no, and just implemented the original spec.[quote]

Such as not terminating the wires in the Kitchen or installing the additional display? Which you now use as evidence of my not finishing the job. What we have here is not my crying for doing more work then contractually obligated to perform but for not getting paid at all for any of the work I performed. Did I receive no money? No. We received a part of the money for running the wire ( the theif payed for only 2.5 days so he beat us out of 1day ) and for some of the equipment we provided. But given all of the additional work performed and the fact that the system worked when I left what might be the reason for not paying any of the labor to install the system? Why did he not pay for the remotes? Why did he not pay for the extra days to rewire the system.


[quote=midi-guy]It's sad that you have to resort to name calling.
It's unbecoming. [quote]

I called no names originally but stated facts. The one job that I obtained here resulted in my not being paid for no reason I can decern other than the theif understood that a small guy cannot afford to sue for $7500 dollars. Did you not connect the wires in the Kitchen for which I was supposed to be paid as an extra and for which I refused to do without being compensated? I think even those DIYs here would agree that it is not unusual for a contractor not to perform work for which he in not contractually obligated and for which the client does not wish to pay him.

Did you not continually alter the design once the job began? Did the Tv in the gym not change? Did we not rewire for that new TV? Was there wiring for video in the kitchen in the original proposal? How about the guest bedroom? Was the office not supposed to get video via the nework? How then did serial digital RGB cables wind up in all of those rooms? Was DVI in the orginal contract or was that not added after work had commenced?

Did we not run all of those serial digital cables and DVI cables after the fact? Did we not have to connect to a KDS 8x3 that was added to the system at the last minute? Think terminating 8 wires for 8 sources and w3 outputs does not add to the installation time? If you did none of this then who? Did you misidentify some of the speakers? Were they not less expensive versions to the correct models we actually installed and for which we were never paid?

You have implied that the theif was justified in not paying for the remotes, any of the installation labor and for the 2500 in extras. ( Does 650 dollars seem excorbatent for 1000 ft of serial digital cable? $250 for 750 feet of RG6 and 200 for 500 ft of line level stereo cable and 200 750 ft of CAT5E. ) In a finished home might it take 2 days to run RGBHV serial digital cable, data, control, RF and DVI to a location on a foundation wall and accross a finished basement? Might it take time to run a DVI cable from the basement to the attic and drill a hole large enough for a DVI connector to fit and pull that connector through a wall full of insulation? And what of the additional DVI cable that we had to pull for the GYm?
What of the new speakers for the kitchen? Did they not have to be relocated? Did we not do it and was it us or the wife of the theif who asked that those speakers be moved to those new locations?

I may have over reacted to your comments but I think even Max Spivak --who never has a kind word for a pro--might agree that you provoked them with your insinuations that the theif was justified.

Why was it that I was never paid for the work I did? Not why was I not paid more but why was not the fees agreed upon paid? If there is an other side of the story please supply it. Otherwise, I think I accurately discribed what happened. I was screwed by a theif and I think you can be justly described as an enabler.

However, should you be able to pursuade the theif that he should pay his bill I will happily edit out the word theif and enabler. Think it likely? Neither do I? Peaps it Nigeria the wealthy expect contractors to pay them to work in their homes. I think most people expect to pay for work performed and if additional work is required they realize that it will reqire additional payments. Why is it I think you and I know what happened. I told you many times that I would have had a better feeling had you hired me to work in your home. It was largely based upon your knowledge of the theif's personality and your recomendation that he would pay his bills that I took the job. It is sad that you value your integrity so little that you would stoop to justify the actions of a dishonorable man for behavior that while not unheard of cannot be considered moral. I think what I said was accurate and I will leave it to this jury--if with Max Spivack sitting on it-- to determine if you did not enable the theif and in suggesting that he had valid reasons for not paying if you are not indeed scum.

I think this has gone about as far as it can. I rest my case. What is it I can win? How does one solve this puzzel? All Nigerians lie. I am from Nigeria.

Alan
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post #108 of 131 Old 10-24-2005, 10:44 PM
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Alan,
Considering your talent with programming in many languages, it really shocks me each time I try to assemble one of your attempts at HTML. ;)

I had a client like this with a beautiful condo overlooking Lake Michigan, about one block from Lake Shore Drive, and two blocks from Michigan Ave. (aka Chicago's Magnificent Mile).

This cheap so and so slithered out of the final payment and threatened to have his Atty. draft a letter to Request because he felt the VRQ was an unfinished Beta level product because it did not support cover art nor perfectly ID each of his mangled DVDs (about 20-30 of which were Hong Kong pirates that I would not load).

I pointed out that his DVDs were pretty badly worn, and I was told that "you guys might have scratched them". I loaded this changer MYSELF, and I was even kind enough to inspect each and every one and clean any of them that were gunked up before I loaded them...

Perhaps it was your unruly teenage children, Sir??

You guys (especially trip-Q, Alan, and AVO-Doug) know my level of communication, I would say I am probably more thorough than most with descriptions. I explained time and time again that the system had about a 90-95% recognition rate, and that we would manually groom the database to correct any stragglers.

10% of 300+ discs is still quite a few discs to manually correct, and of course he WATCHED this process. He was constantly saying how this was preposterous that I had to manually search, title, and select cover art for these 30 or so discs (which I should have recognized as an attempt to justify non-payment).

Anyway, I haven't received one dollar since the deposit, and the second payment was due that day and we were stupid enough to walk out the door without it... thinking we were coming right back to do the new RF remote he agreed to that night... We were supposed to draft a change order and get it to him that week. I sent the request for payment and the change order with it's deposit amount within the specified time period, but it was never paid.

The freshly released RF remote comes in a few weeks later, but the job is on perma-hold and the client starts pulling this "unfinished beta product" crap... and the letters to collect the balance of the initial project were returned with businessman's quasi-legalese BS about an unfinished job and misrepresentation of services...

As a partner as well as the tech with the most time on this, I am out the most money... and it's not even my sale or my client.

Certified: Vantage InFusion, AMX A.C.E.
Lutron HomeWorks, Lutron RadioRa2 (Level 2)
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post #109 of 131 Old 10-25-2005, 11:10 AM
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In business you are going to run into bad clients and evil customers. The only reason this has gone on is Andrew's unsupported assertion that there were reasons other than the theif did not wish to pay and so did not and that he enabled a theif to steal. He suggests that I did not show up or perform work in a timely fashion or that that the system had functional issues but has supplied no details.

I really apologize to everyone as this is of ony parenthetical interest to anyone save myself. Anyone in busniness will have clients who do not pay or who behave in unjustifiable ways. These details are immaterial save the fact that I have only performed one job of the four contacts and that job was hardly a satsifactying experience. Actually, I wish to leave this subject and see if Andrew or anyone else can supply an more information about third party panel. It would seem as though Andrew has solved one of the biggest problems which is the time it takes to wake up a panel after it has fallen asleep ( and thanks to Arosenbaum for pointing this out. )

Alan
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post #110 of 131 Old 10-25-2005, 10:37 PM - Thread Starter
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So has anyone used the RTI in-wall touchscreens? They have ethernet and RS-232.

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post #111 of 131 Old 11-06-2005, 10:00 PM - Thread Starter
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The WT-840 from Aurora looks just like the Zykronix. Is that a CCD camera in it? I wanted more 411 from Zykronix but nope, not without a non-disclosure agreement!

It only does 800x600 though. Pretty slick for an 8" I guess. It would be nice to have all 1024 x 768's...then I could use one GUI for my touchscreens and display them easily on my Plasmas that I hope to be buying!!!

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post #112 of 131 Old 11-07-2005, 09:10 PM
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Saw the Zykronics 8" panel in action running a simple java script. Response was extremely sluggish, feeling very underpowered. The Zykronics folks were promising more robust performance this fall, but that has yet to be seen.
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post #113 of 131 Old 11-07-2005, 09:11 PM
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Its kinda hard to find the guts of this thread through the haze of the personal war that's going on.
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post #114 of 131 Old 11-07-2005, 10:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Ya, it started out ok, then when downhill.

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post #115 of 131 Old 11-08-2005, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AI Limited
Ya, it started out ok, then when downhill.
So says you. Alan made it interesting. I was picturing Alan with a sword smiting the evil theif.

:D.

p.s. I was also picturing him with smoke coming out of his nostrils as he was writing, such was his disdain.
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post #116 of 131 Old 11-08-2005, 12:38 AM
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Quote:
Saw the Zykronics 8" panel in action running a simple java script.
This was the Pantera?

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post #117 of 131 Old 11-08-2005, 08:38 AM
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I can say I am friends with both Doug (avophile) and Alan (Audible Misspellings) and they are most certainly not the same person. Doug does AMX and Alan does Crestron. They both are very professional.

I am always quite happy when my friends are taking the wrath of the DIYs here and I can sit back and laugh without getting beat up myself. But this one takes the cake. I wonder why Andrew hasn't responded again?

And like QQQ (who's posts I have always liked and who has beaten me up from time to time) I thoroughly enjoyed the mental image of Alan banging on the keyboard with smoke coming out of his butt.

Get a good deal on the Algorenet? Don't come crying to me when you need it fixed.
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post #118 of 131 Old 11-08-2005, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midi-guy
...Having used a ViewSonic VA150 on my system, I would only add that the WinCE/ce.Net based units probably would not be an ideal solution for you...
Just read thru this thread (the relevant parts anyway) and the comment above struck me. I've been playing with a ViewSonic Airpanel 110 and it seems to have a very difficult time roaming between multiple access points in my house. As compared with my XP-based Tablet PC, which roams pretty seamlessly between APs.

Is this a known problem with WinCE-based devices? Thanks.
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post #119 of 131 Old 11-08-2005, 10:57 AM
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I'm trying to find useful info here too, but am left wondering....where's the moderator? This is hardly the place to wring out dirty laundry. Why don't you guy's get a room or use the handy PM feature? Thanks.

Now, any other panels people are using with success??
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post #120 of 131 Old 11-08-2005, 11:17 AM
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Something I've been ruminating on over in the Charmed Quark forum is the use of these:

http://www.chippc.com/products/thinc...ckpc/index.asp

They are basically tiny RDP clients, running CE.Net. So they are very small, dedicated RDP computers that can fit into a gang box or in a wall cavity behind something. So, I was thinking that, if you were looking for a completely centralized solution (for fixed all mounted panels I mean), where everything was maintainable in a central closet, you could go with a situation like this:

Put the a nice punchy controller in the closet, put one of these in each room, mounted in a wall cavity, in front of which you just mount a standard 15" or 7" touch screen. So basically each of them would just be set up to log into a particular account on the server, via RDP. So there would be zero automation software running in the rooms, it's all running back at the server, so when upgrades come out out, you upgrade the server, and everyone automatically is upgraded.

If you went with something like the Lilliput 7" touch screen for the small screens, then you'd be looking at about $650 per room, since the Lillput can be had for about $300 or less and the JackPC is abou $300. Add in another $50 for mounting bracket and such. The JackPCs can do up to 1280x1024, so in the major rooms you can mount a 15" screen and have more real estate. In those rooms you'd be looking at something like $1000 per room (about $600 for the touch screen and $300 for the JackPC plus odds and ends.

That seems like it could be an interesting and easily maintainable solution, that doesn't have a huge price per room. You could make it even more centralized by putting the JackPCs in the closet as well, and run each into an inexpensive Cat-5 based KVM extender so that only the wall mounted touch screen is in each room. So in the closet each JackPC would go into the ethernet switch, and then out through it's own KVM extender. That would offer an extremely centrally maintained system, at a small increase per room.

Of course if one or two of the rooms happens to be on the other side of the wall from the closet, then those could just do a straight video/touch screen run from the JackPC to the touch screen and save a few bucks.

A manly multi-GHz machine should easily be able to handle 10 RDP sessions when they are just running the automation interface touch screen viewer program, since most of the time they are doing nothing but idling and watching for changes in device state. And you'll have to run Windows Server or add a product like Thinsoft which allows for multiple RDP sessions on XP. But, in the end, you'll come out with a very controllable and maintainable system that offers rich two-way touch screen interfaces in every room for considerably less than the alternatives.

Dean Roddey
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