Official RadianceXD support thread - Page 25 - AVS Forum
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post #721 of 1407 Old 10-24-2011, 03:56 PM
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"So, although each input have 4 choices, they all have the SAME 4 choices.. Is this right?"

No, they are independent per input. MemA 480 on Input 1 can have different settings then MemA 480 on Input 2.

Or you can use the Copy command to make them the same.

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post #722 of 1407 Old 10-24-2011, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfogg View Post

"So, although each input have 4 choices, they all have the SAME 4 choices.. Is this right?"

No, they are independent per input. MemA 480 on Input 1 can have different settings then MemA 480 on Input 2.

Or you can use the Copy command to make them the same.

Shawn

Oh.. that's good if it is per input... I should receive my XD later this week, and might be easier to play around with it first and come back for more questions

Basically, what I have is a PJ and a plasma.
I have 5 sources ( Wii, PS3, DVD, Media Player, Dish)
I want to have CMS Day (probably just use the gamma factor, which should just shift the whole curve up and down, right?) and Night for both my PJ and plasma. So, that's at least 4 CMS setting I need. I might want to experiment a 2.35 and see how it does as well.
Since my plasma is only 720p/1080i and not support 24p, but my PJ does. I will need at least a 1080p60, 1080p24, 1080i and 720p mode.

Now, I think my confusion is that with my PS3 input, what I want to do for my PJ is:
in both Day and night CMS, I want 1080p60 to go to 1080p24, and 1080p24 of course to 1080p24. However, for my Media player, I want 1080p60 to actually go to 1080p60. So, if it is per input, I can set this up with just 1 MEM, is this correct? Or, do I have to switch to a different MEM setting when I switch my input from PS3 to Media, so that I get 60p->60p, instead of 60p->24p?

I better come up with a spreadsheet and matrix to get myself prepared as well Time to read up the manuals even more! BTW, any good suggestions and recommendations for intial setup? Is there any setting I should avoid, or pay more attention to?

Thanks in advance.
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post #723 of 1407 Old 10-25-2011, 12:57 AM
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Also, if my a-lens is always in place (not movable), can Lumagen do horizontal squeeze to counter-effect my A-lens? Is this what the "shrink" feature does?? (the menu does not sound like it)
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post #724 of 1407 Old 10-25-2011, 12:57 AM
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if the ps3 and media player are going to different inputs then you can do what you want easily...in fact, even if they are going to the same input via switching in an a/v amp you could probably do what you want by using the "virtual input" feature of the scaler...but for now don't even think about asking about virtual inputs!....just get the scaler and start playing then you'll understand it all.

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post #725 of 1407 Old 10-25-2011, 03:04 AM
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"Also, if my a-lens is always in place (not movable), can Lumagen do horizontal squeeze to counter-effect my A-lens?"

Yes.

"Is this what the "shrink" feature does?? (the menu does not sound like it)"

No.

All you need to do if you leave the lens in place is set output AR to 2.35 and leave that alone. Then just select the appropriate input AR (1.78, 2.35...etc..etc) for the source and the Lumagen does the rest. I leave my lens in place all the time too.

Shawn
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post #726 of 1407 Old 10-25-2011, 07:34 AM
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Wow, a flurry of updates...


Production 101811 FW Updates:

XD/XD3D
XE/XE+/XE3D
XS/XS+/XS3D


Production 101811
Bugfix for a new onscreen HDCP error message showing up incorrectly in revision 101711.
Bugfix for analog Pip input having funny colors or sometimes not being shown.


Production 101711
Bugfix for previous update (101611) causing analog inputs to sometimes not be displayed.
Added new capability for PC gaming with 2.35 screens.
If you set up your PC for a 1920x816/817 output resolution almost all current games will render with a wider field of view.
If you select 2.35 input aspect on the Radiance with this type of input mode the Radiance can then output it correctly on a 2.35 screen using either anamorphic lens (Radiance output aspect set to 2.35) or optical zoom (Radiance output aspect set to 1.78 aka 16:9).11[/b]


Production 101611
Bugfix for input menu when using Pip and pressing numbers to select the Pip source.
Improvements to auto input selection to avoid issues with mode changing on the current source.
Added reinterlacing command options.
Bugfix for issue with handling of timing descriptors in some DVI displays. Improvements to "help" within some commands.
Some other small bugfixes.
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post #727 of 1407 Old 10-25-2011, 07:59 AM
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Tried to load 101811 on my XS yesterday. It apears to be firware for the XE and will not load. 101711 loaded just fine.
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post #728 of 1407 Old 10-25-2011, 09:56 AM
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Had a bad link for the 101811 XS update (it pointed to the XE). It's fixed now.

Patrick Harkin, Lumagen Inc. engineer
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post #729 of 1407 Old 10-25-2011, 12:39 PM
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Thanks Gordon and Shawn!!!
Even though mine is still in shipment, I am loving this already !!
And so good to see the FW update so frequent. I will need to make sure I have the serial cable plug in all the time so I don't have to crawl to my cabinet so often...
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post #730 of 1407 Old 10-26-2011, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fight4yu View Post

Thanks Gordon and Shawn!!!
Even though mine is still in shipment, I am loving this already !!
And so good to see the FW update so frequent. I will need to make sure I have the serial cable plug in all the time so I don't have to crawl to my cabinet so often...

Lumagen isn't cheap, but the company is great at continuing updates and quality improvement as well as engaging directly with customers (us).

I wish every CE company was like them.

Mike
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post #731 of 1407 Old 10-26-2011, 01:45 PM
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^Totally agree.
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post #732 of 1407 Old 10-31-2011, 10:22 AM
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Got my XD last Friday! I am a bit scared it displayed a "not an supported mode" when I try to connect it to my LCD. Since this is an used unit, I am worry I have to return it... I proceed to do a FW update, and still no good. Since there is no display, I don't even have a way to know what setting it is if it is wrong. I proceed "blind" to just type numbers to try factory reset the setting... To make a long story short, when I try it on my PJ finally, it works.. and turn out the previous user is setting it to 1080p, and my LCD is only 1080i...

I hope Lumagen can think of a way to let user know what settings they have if there is no display (or make a wrong resolution change). Since there is no VFD, and the configuration utility does not allow you to 'see' and 'control' the setting, this make "debugging" quite hard. I think this is one area that I miss in my DUO (have a VFD, and someone had develop a control panel program that I can see and change almost all settings). I wish the configuration utility can be improved to a point that we can see and change, and then save/load, and not just save/load to some files we cannot see. Anyway, just my 2cents.
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post #733 of 1407 Old 10-31-2011, 12:20 PM
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it should say in the manual that, menu 0999 ok, will do a factory reset and should get you a picture...it also tells you the ir command shortcuts to force specific resolutions.

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post #734 of 1407 Old 10-31-2011, 02:57 PM
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Yeah.. I read that and blindly press menu 0999 ok.. but since I do not know if I press it correctly or not, and there is no feedback if I did it correctly or not (the display does not do anything), and there is also no mention of what factory reset is default to (I think it get to 480p, instead of Auto??)...
The point I am trying to make is that there is no effective way for me to know what's going on if there is no display, as there is no feedback or utilities to know if I did something wrong. Now, if I know my resolution is wrong, then I can possibly do some IR command like you said.. so, all those IR commands are useful if I know what my problem is, but unfortunately, I don't know at that time.
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post #735 of 1407 Old 10-31-2011, 04:07 PM
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Ir light blinks on the Radiance with every keystroke so that would be your indication that you are entering properly. Try re-booting the Lumagen and then slowly enter by IR command making sure the IR is blinking with every keystroke
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post #736 of 1407 Old 10-31-2011, 07:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LJG View Post

Ir light blinks on the Radiance with every keystroke so that would be your indication that you are entering properly. Try re-booting the Lumagen and then slowly enter by IR command making sure the IR is blinking with every keystroke

Thanks! I finally figure out as I have a PJ that have 1080p output and that solve my problem, as I now change it to Auto 2,1

I feed an SD and remove all the jaggies by reducing the combing. It looks so much better!
There are also so many settings that I can play around. Anyone had any good suggestions wrt test-discs and which setting should be tuned for each?
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post #737 of 1407 Old 10-31-2011, 07:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fight4yu View Post


Thanks! I finally figure out as I have a PJ that have 1080p output and that solve my problem, as I now change it to Auto 2,1

I feed an SD and remove all the jaggies by reducing the combing. It looks so much better!
There are also so many settings that I can play around. Anyone had any good suggestions wrt test-discs and which setting should be tuned for each?

I use the built in test patterns on the XD. I have cheap X2 from X-rite that needs to be upgraded but still produces a stunning picture on my Sony PJ. If you've invested in the Radiance, then I would definitely get a meter and software.
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post #738 of 1407 Old 11-01-2011, 05:13 AM
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^ Totally agree.
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post #739 of 1407 Old 11-01-2011, 10:45 AM
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Yes, I already got CALMAN, i1D3 and i1PRO. For grayscale/CMS, I am set, and I know how to do those... so that is not a problem.
Sorry if I am not clear before, but I am mostly interested in tuning SD type of material. HD material generally do not need any of input "enhancement", as I am feeding it with 1080p blu-ray. However, as I have DVD and DISH "compressed HD", I would like to optimize for those... For example, what patterns/scenes to use for reducing mosquito noise in SD? Other things that I am not familar with is like IFMD, Deinterlacing, Genlock, Noise reduction, sharpness (and there are horizontal, vertical and diagonal...)

Thanks.
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post #740 of 1407 Old 11-01-2011, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fight4yu View Post

Yes, I already got CALMAN, i1D3 and i1PRO. For grayscale/CMS, I am set, and I know how to do those... so that is not a problem.
Sorry if I am not clear before, but I am mostly interested in tuning SD type of material. HD material generally do not need any of input "enhancement", as I am feeding it with 1080p blu-ray. However, as I have DVD and DISH "compressed HD", I would like to optimize for those... For example, what patterns/scenes to use for reducing mosquito noise in SD? Other things that I am not familar with is like IFMD, Deinterlacing, Genlock, Noise reduction, sharpness (and there are horizontal, vertical and diagonal...)

Thanks.

Ah hah. I know the Digital Video Essentials disc has a pattern for sharpness. I don't think I saw one on the Radiance, but not 100% on that. Not sure about the mosquito noise and the other stuff you mentioned. The Genlock setting was mentioned earlier in the thread but not sure where. If I recall reading correctly, it's not used commonly, but again, not 100% on that one either. I am interested in what a more experienced user or expert would have to say on your question.
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post #741 of 1407 Old 11-01-2011, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fight4yu View Post

Yes, I already got CALMAN, i1D3 and i1PRO. For grayscale/CMS, I am set, and I know how to do those... so that is not a problem.
Sorry if I am not clear before, but I am mostly interested in tuning SD type of material. HD material generally do not need any of input "enhancement", as I am feeding it with 1080p blu-ray. However, as I have DVD and DISH "compressed HD", I would like to optimize for those... For example, what patterns/scenes to use for reducing mosquito noise in SD? Other things that I am not familar with is like IFMD, Deinterlacing, Genlock, Noise reduction, sharpness (and there are horizontal, vertical and diagonal...)

Thanks.

I watch a significant amount of SD material, both 480i and 576i. One of the main reasons the Radiance is my 3rd Lumagen product starting with the Vision. My experience says use your eyes on the enhance settings . Lumagens sharpness enhancement is the best around. You really have to crank them to high levels before you get visible edge enhancement etc. The noise reduction settings are similar.
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post #742 of 1407 Old 11-01-2011, 05:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsinger View Post

I watch a significant amount of SD material, both 480i and 576i. One of the main reasons the Radiance is my 3rd Lumagen product starting with the Vision. My experience says use your eyes on the enhance settings . Lumagens sharpness enhancement is the best around. You really have to crank them to high levels before you get visible edge enhancement etc. The noise reduction settings are similar.

Crank them up it is then
Do you have any particular type of SD material that highlight some of those "problems" and use Lumagen to correct?
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post #743 of 1407 Old 11-02-2011, 05:12 AM
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^ As you would expect the poorer the PQ of the source material the more the enhance settings are needed. On the other hand, good SD will look worse if you use too much. for example, Star Wars- Attack of the Clones can look like 720p to me using the Radiance with the sharpness enhanced at 5-7 on a 65" plasma. With something of VHS quality, however, I might leave sharpness at the same settings as Clones but crank the noise reduction up (0 on Clones) to get a better image. Using the noise reduction on Clones would make it look soft.
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post #744 of 1407 Old 11-02-2011, 08:59 AM
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Production 102111 FW Updates:

XD/XD3D
XE/XE+/XE3D
XS/XS+/XS3D


Production 102111
Bugfix for non-typical setup that could sometime power-on with a gray screen.
Bugfix for issue with some downstream devices sometimes not locking onto audio on SD<->HD switches.
Bugfix for selecting 48khz stereo audio and losing audio when switching to HDMI input.
Several small menu display bugfixes.
Fix for not always reporting mode change when option was enabled.
Another case of HDCP error message incorrectly being displayed was fixed.
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post #745 of 1407 Old 11-02-2011, 11:47 AM
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Hopefully, this is the right place for this. I wasn’t sure if I should start a new thread with these questions or not, but here goes…

1. Has 4K support be announced yet?

I have seen some references to 4K support in this thread and others sites. However, I didn’t see anything official from Lumagen about this other than they will at some point support it and it will be new hardware. (And that they might have a trade-in upgrade offer)

2. I’m thinking about getting a Lumagen (probably the XS line) and a Calibration device for calibration of my projector and I had a question on the HDMI chaining. Basically, since my current AV Receiver doesn’t support HDMI 1.4 I cannot do 3D through it. So, my thought was that I might be able to forego an upgrade to my VR Receiver, at this time, by using the Lumagen to take the input and pass 1 HDMI output directly to my projector (3D) and the 2nd HDMI output to the Receiver just for audio (bit-streaming). Would that work or will having a device in the chain (the AV Receiver) that is not HDMI 1.4 compliant mess things up?

To add a couple more details; all my video material is ripped to my media server and I play all that media on a HTPC, currently, using Arcsoft Total Media Theater. I am not 100% to what extent that has an effect on the protected audio-video path given the scenario listed above.

Thanks!
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post #746 of 1407 Old 11-02-2011, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamprey View Post

Hopefully, this is the right place for this. I wasn't sure if I should start a new thread with these questions or not, but here goes

1. Has 4K support be announced yet?

I have seen some references to 4K support in this thread and others sites. However, I didn't see anything official from Lumagen about this other than they will at some point support it and it will be new hardware. (And that they might have a trade-in upgrade offer)

2. I'm thinking about getting a Lumagen (probably the XS line) and a Calibration device for calibration of my projector and I had a question on the HDMI chaining. Basically, since my current AV Receiver doesn't support HDMI 1.4 I cannot do 3D through it. So, my thought was that I might be able to forego an upgrade to my VR Receiver, at this time, by using the Lumagen to take the input and pass 1 HDMI output directly to my projector (3D) and the 2nd HDMI output to the Receiver just for audio (bit-streaming). Would that work or will having a device in the chain (the AV Receiver) that is not HDMI 1.4 compliant mess things up?

To add a couple more details; all my video material is ripped to my media server and I play all that media on a HTPC, currently, using Arcsoft Total Media Theater. I am not 100% to what extent that has an effect on the protected audio-video path given the scenario listed above.

Thanks!

What is your 4K source?

Mike
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post #747 of 1407 Old 11-02-2011, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
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What is your 4K source?

Mike

I don't have one yet, per se. This is more about some level of future proofing. I have not done extensive research, but I see that several newer receivers support 4k (and 4k upscalling)..

EDIT: 4k isn't a deal breaker. But, if it's coming out in the next couple of months, then I can wait. Mostly, I was just curious since things are trending to 4k. Although, I realize it probably won't be main stream for a while.
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post #748 of 1407 Old 11-02-2011, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamprey View Post

Hopefully, this is the right place for this. I wasn't sure if I should start a new thread with these questions or not, but here goes

1. Has 4K support be announced yet?

I have seen some references to 4K support in this thread and others sites. However, I didn't see anything official from Lumagen about this other than they will at some point support it and it will be new hardware. (And that they might have a trade-in upgrade offer)

2. I'm thinking about getting a Lumagen (probably the XS line) and a Calibration device for calibration of my projector and I had a question on the HDMI chaining. Basically, since my current AV Receiver doesn't support HDMI 1.4 I cannot do 3D through it. So, my thought was that I might be able to forego an upgrade to my VR Receiver, at this time, by using the Lumagen to take the input and pass 1 HDMI output directly to my projector (3D) and the 2nd HDMI output to the Receiver just for audio (bit-streaming). Would that work or will having a device in the chain (the AV Receiver) that is not HDMI 1.4 compliant mess things up?

To add a couple more details; all my video material is ripped to my media server and I play all that media on a HTPC, currently, using Arcsoft Total Media Theater. I am not 100% to what extent that has an effect on the protected audio-video path given the scenario listed above.

Thanks!

In general, it is harder to calibrate on a HTPC than a source like blu-ray, due to the computer vs. Video level nature. However, since Lumagen can output patterns and in most cases work with the calibration software (CALMAN and CP) to do some sort of auto-calibration, you should be able to get good result from VP to display. The problem now remain between your HTPC (video card specifically) and VP..

I honestly hope what you wish to setup will not messed things up. The audio portion should not need to be 1.4 compliant. in the worst case, I hope you can at least have Lumagen convert the bitstream to LPCM...
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post #749 of 1407 Old 11-02-2011, 03:38 PM
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Like "deep color," "4K" is another area where there is a lot of misleading information out there.

- First, I am all for 4kx2k projectors. Our no-ring scaling provides the best scaling available for SD scaling to HD, and this would be the same for scaling to 4kx2k. Unfortunately, the HDMI spec for 4K only deals with "4kx2k at 24p on a single wire." This is unfortunate in that you will not be able to drive the projector/display at 4kx2k at 60 (or 50) unless it has four inputs (or at leaset 2 of the new 3GHz HDMI inputs). So video sources are left out of the 4kx2k world for the new single wire HDMI 4kx2k connection. There are a few very expensive projectors that take 4kx2k now, and I hope the industry will eventually realize that 4kx2k at 50/60 Hertz is as important as 4kx2k at 24. My opinion on this anyway.

- Do note that you will need to have a very large screen and sit pretty darn close to see a noticable improvement between a 1920x1080 projector and a 4kx2k projector. I would also argue that, depending on the optics, etc., there will be 1920x1080 projectors that provide a better picture than equivalently priced 4kx2k projectors at any normal viewing distance from the screen.

- I do not anticipate true 4Kx2K consumer sources for a long time - long being years. While I could be wrong on timing, I would still MUCH prefer Hollywood going to a higher bit depth first, rather than a high resolution. This would not require new HDMI chips, just new encoding on the Bluray. The first step would be reducing compression on the disc - or sat/cable feeds - to get closer to the "8-bit" claimed for Bluray, DVD and Sat/cable. Second step would be to use less agressive "DCT truncation matricies" in the encoding(these divide the 8-bit data in the frequency domain and then toss out the factional bit info. The 8x8 block DC term ends up at about 6.5 bits using the standard truncation matrix, and the 16x16 Chroma macroblock DC terms end up with 4 bits, and it only gets worse from there for the higher frequency terms). The third step would be to go to a 10-bit or even 12-bit encoding. Another possible change would be to use 12-bit lossless compression in XYZ color space on the disc like the commercial market does. None of these require new HDMI chips and I believe would provide more visible improvement than going to 4kx2k without these color depth improvements.

- It will be some time before a main-stream priced 4kx2k projector is available. Note that the "4K" JVC (RS 55 and 65), are NOT 4k (by 2K) projectors. They are 1920x1080 projectors with "DLP pixel wobble." I won't get into any discussions on whether pixel-wobble is a good thing or not, and JVC RS projectors are among my favorite projectors, but IMO calling these JVC projectors 4K is misleading since people think of a "4K" projector/display as 4096 by 2160, or 3840 by 2160, and the JVC's are neither of these. Sony is coming out with a $25K 3840 (or is it 4096?) by 2160 projector early next year, but at that price I do not consider it mainstream.

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That said, I can tell you that the current HDMI chips used in the Radiance line are not capable of 2kx4k, and we have no announcements pending for any new products in the Radiance line at this time.

Waiting for 4kx2k is like waiting to buy a cell phone until you can buy one that will never be surpassed. You end up always using old technology and never upgrading. The Radiance line has the best video processors available - I think by a large margin - and we do regular updates so they keep getting better.

Jim Peterson
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post #750 of 1407 Old 11-02-2011, 03:54 PM
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Thanks for the replies. Like I said 4k isn't a hude deal, I was just curious. I'm more concerned with the HDMI chaining. Not that I can't afford a new receiver, but just trying to use what I already have.

Thanks again!
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