DVDO EDGE !! - Page 5 - AVS Forum
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post #121 of 7106 Old 07-23-2008, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

The NEXT announcement from DVDO should be really interesting. If they can offer custom gamma/grayscale adjustments and color management in a VP50Pro replacement, this segment is going to have a lot to offer.

Who's to say the pro wont get that?
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post #122 of 7106 Old 07-23-2008, 10:47 PM
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I could really use the HDMI audio-only output on the VP50Pro right now since my Monoprice 4x2 switcher/splitter (the new 2.5 version even) doesn't seem to want to pass any audio.

I hope it's a feature on the next in the VP line, and that it comes soon...
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post #123 of 7106 Old 07-23-2008, 11:55 PM
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Okay, I'm getting really confused. People are saying 'this is awesome for the non projector crowd' but then they are also say 'this is not for plasmas' because XxY resolution doesn't mean exactly the same thing to different manu's. Aren't Plasmas and Projectors the bulk of the market?

So, let me be very plain instead of asking a generic question: I have a TH-42PH9UK (1080i) and may upgrade to a TH-50PF10UK (1080p) at some point (or 11,12, series etc. when I get around to it).

For both of those models can I get 1:1 pixel mapping out of the Edge into the Plasma - i.e., no processing by the Plasma?
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post #124 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 12:02 AM
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In the owners manual for the TH-42PH9UK it says:

786,432 (1024 (W) X 768 (H))
[3,072 X 768 dots]
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post #125 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 12:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightminer View Post

So, let me be very plain instead of asking a generic question: I have a TH-42PH9UK (1080i) and may upgrade to a TH-50PF10UK (1080p) at some point (or 11,12, series etc. when I get around to it).

For both of those models can I get 1:1 pixel mapping out of the Edge into the Plasma - i.e., no processing by the Plasma?

IIRC the TH-42PH9UK has a native res of 1024 x 768. It isn't a supported output resolution of the Edge so no posiibility of 1:1.

The TH-50PK10UK is 1920x1080 and this is a supported output res from the Edge and 1:1 is a posibility.

I'm not that familar with these models but just because the input and native panel res match doesn't always result in 1:1 pixel mapping. It's worth double checking with owners to confrim under what conditions 1:1 is possible. There will always be some degree of processing in panel.

D
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post #126 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightminer View Post

Okay, I'm getting really confused. People are saying 'this is awesome for the non projector crowd' but then they are also say 'this is not for plasmas' because XxY resolution doesn't mean exactly the same thing to different manu's.

Where are these people you're speaking of? I think if the native resolution of your projector or plasma matches one of the available presets this VP is perfect for you. Unfortunately, as someone else already pointed out, your panel wouldn't be a good candidate for this scaler if you are looking for 1:1 pixel mapping.
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post #127 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 12:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dazzerxxx View Post

IIRC the TH-42PH9UK has a native res of 1024 x 768. It isn't a supported output resolution of the Edge so no posiibility of 1:1.

The TH-50PK10UK is 1920x1080 and this is a supported output res from the Edge and 1:1 is a posibility.

I'm not that familar with these models but just because the input and native panel res match doesn't always result in 1:1 pixel mapping. It's worth double checking with owners to confrim under what conditions 1:1 is possible. There will always be some degree of processing in panel.

D


I believe you can get 1:1 with a 1024 x 768 signal into the DVI blade of the 9UK.
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post #128 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 12:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_CA View Post

I believe you can get 1:1 with a 1024 x 768 signal into the DVI blade of the 9UK.

Thanks for the info.

It can be a bit hit and miss. My Fujitsu panel will accept 1:1 1360x768 over HDMI but only at 60hz which is a bit of problem as I live in Europe so no 1:1 with local material.

D
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post #129 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 02:53 AM
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Add to it :

- zoom range from 50% to 150%
- multiple memories per input to recall zoom, pan and all other parameters (contrast, etc...)

And it will be the product allowing 2.35 screen with 16/9 display at an affordable price !

Richard.
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post #130 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 04:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlemesle View Post

Add to it :

- zoom range from 50% to 150%
- multiple memories per input to recall zoom, pan and all other parameters (contrast, etc...)

And it will be the product allowing 2.35 screen with 16/9 display at an affordable price !

Richard.


That already exists with the VP20
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post #131 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 05:13 AM
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Not sure,

The VP20 have same limitation as the VP50Pro on the zoom range (according to its user manual). The zoom can be from 100% to 150%. And VP20 only have Display Aspect Ratio parameter, no Screen Aspect Ratio parameter. So I don't think VP20 allow you to do 16/9 on a 2.35 screen.

Negative zoom is called Underscan on VPxx products and is only referenced in the VP30, VP50 and VP50Pro user manual. VP20 doesn't have this functionality.

Does the EDGE have underscan capabilities ?

An advantage of the VP20 is the preset aspect ration (memory for zoom, pan and borders) and some more output resolution.

But the EDGE have better video processing and more inputs/outputs.

A comparison between the VP20 and the EDGE would be interessant since each one target digital and standard only display. But VP20 price tag is twice the price of the EDGE !

Richard.
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post #132 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 07:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlemesle View Post

Does the EDGE have underscan capabilities ?

Well, if you'd read the feature set Josh posted at the start of this thread you'd see:

Output Aspect Ratio Controls
•Presets: 4:3, 16:9
•Underscan Adjustment to eliminate Overscan inherent in a display
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post #133 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 07:16 AM
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I read it more than once but probably too quickly...

So it is better than the VP20 which doesn't have this underscan feature.

Thanks Dale,

That's a good news !

Richard.
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post #134 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dazzerxxx View Post

IIRC the TH-42PH9UK has a native res of 1024 x 768. It isn't a supported output resolution of the Edge so no posiibility of 1:1.

Actually, that's not the case. The Edge supports VGA, XGA and SXGA output resolutions. (That's 640x480, 1024x768 and 1280x1024 for those of you that are PC-terminology challenged. ) The latter two formats were added in a recent beta, so they aren't listed in the feature set shown in the first post in this thread.

- Dale Adams
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post #135 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 09:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale Adams View Post

Actually, that's not the case. The Edge supports VGA, XGA and SXGA output resolutions. (That's 640x480, 1024x768 and 1280x1024 for those of you that are PC-terminology challenged. ) The latter two formats were added in a recent beta, so they aren't listed in the feature set shown in the first post in this thread.

- Dale Adams

Thanks for the info Dale but why not support 1366x768 as well??? I'm sure an argument could be made for other resolutions but there is such a prevalence of panels with this resolution available today.
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post #136 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 09:20 AM
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Josh answered this a few postings above. 1366 seems to be no defined standard, so there are various versions of this resolution and they still might not work on every display. From a support standpoint it's probably wiser not to include them.
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post #137 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 09:29 AM
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Still if you add the Panasonic plasma version of 1366x768 you add a whole lot of displays. How hard can that be?
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post #138 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 09:42 AM
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I suspect it isn't a question of difficulty in the adding the functionality to support the various plasma resolutions, but that DVDO may not want to cannibalize sales of the VP line of processors. It seems pretty clear that the EDGE is meant to target customers who don't need many custom features, but do want to add quality video processing to their setups beyond what is possible is most mainstream receivers and pre/pros.

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post #139 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobloblaw View Post

DVDO may not want to cannibalize sales of the VP line of processors.

The fact that they are already adding new resolutions in beta does not seem to support that speculation.
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post #140 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobloblaw View Post

I suspect it isn't a question of difficulty in the adding the functionality to support the various plasma resolutions, but that DVDO may not want to cannibalize sales of the VP line of processors. It seems pretty clear that the EDGE is meant to target customers who don't need many custom features, but do want to add quality video processing to their setups beyond what is possible is most mainstream receivers and pre/pros.

perfect explanation IMHO

-Gary
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post #141 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 10:15 AM
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I agree. That sums up the Edge's target market. You get HDMI 1.3 switching and MNR, FIne Detail and Edge Enhancement. What more could the average set up need? This is a great solution for the majority of the market...

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post #142 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 10:58 AM
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Would I be able to feed a 1080p 60fps source (say blu-ray) and have this output 1080i 60? I say this because this would be ideal for my two tv setup. One is 1080p 60, other is not.

What are the available memory settings per input?
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post #143 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stepmback View Post

Would I be able to feed a 1080p 60fps source (say blu-ray) and have this output 1080i 60? I say this because this would be ideal for my two tv setup. One is 1080p 60, other is not.

What are the available memory settings per input?

Note, the second HDMI out is for audio only.
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post #144 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightminer View Post

In the owners manual for the TH-42PH9UK it says:

786,432 (1024 (W) X 768 (H))
[3,072 X 768 dots]

Stick this in your back pocket for the future....there is no such thing as an interlaced digital display (1080i for instance). In the case of the plasma you have, it is 1024x768 (768p) native, so ideally for maximum performance, you want to feed it that resolution. The 1080i you are seeing is the maximum scan rate "input" it can take.

Hope that helps.
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post #145 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 01:31 PM
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Josh,
I'd like to understand what limitations I can expect vs the VP50Pro I've been considering up until now. I live in PAL territory an my setup contains a 720p front projector, 16:9 screen, Oppo 980 DVD, PS3 BluRay and a STB automatically switching between 576i50/720p50/1080i50 depending on the channel currently watched.

1. Can I use different settings for MNR, FD and EE depending on input resolution provided by the STB?

2. Can 1080p24 be scaled to 720p48 (or 720p24)?

3. Is it possible to automatically get different output resolutions depending on what is transmitted by the PS3? (1080i60->720p60 for concert videos etc and 1080p24->720p24/48 for film content.)

4. The product brief PDF for the ABT2010 ASIC mentions support for sub-pixel Y/C delay but the EDGE comparison PDF states the opposite. Any chance that this feature will be enabled?

Thanks,
Mikael
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post #146 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 03:03 PM
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Thanks for the info everyone. If there are still options and DVDO is still working on the final specification I would definitely big-time say go look at Amazon or Visual Apex and mine their site for what the top selling Plasma's are. The Panasonic Pro line on Visual Apex was typically 4 of the top 6 or 7 slots for best sellers. So from a market perspective I think it would make sense to include those!

I understand if 'today' (versus a year ago or so) 1024x768 might be too small, but remember that at 42 inches 1080i and 1080p are only visually distinguishable by taping your eyeballs to the screen. Normal sitting distances (10 feet? 8? 14?) can't tell the difference. Anyway they seem to have the 50 inch sizes, so that is good.

Yeah - under "top selling pro plasmas" the top 2 are:

1. Panasonic TH-50PH11UK: Featuring 720p resolution, 15,000:1 contrast ratio
2. Panasonic TH-42PH11UK: Featuring 720p resolution, 15,000:1 contrast ratio

There are lots of people with mid-size living rooms that don't want them dominated by a huge TV. I just helped a friend choose a 37 inch - they could have afforded a 1080p 50 inch, but it didn't make sense in their living room.

Can anyone confirm for sure if it can be done via the computer-related settings mentioned above? Some say it can be done, but we don't seem to have concensus yet.

Also - with computer resolutions you have to be careful about rectangular vs square pixels. If I understand right, the pixels aren't square on the Plasma, and on a monitor with 1024 X 768 they would be square. Does this make a difference at the DVDO Edge output level? I've seen output not deal with the recatngular pixels vs square pixels correctly before. Everyone is fat when you go to widescreen.
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post #147 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 03:08 PM
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As to people above saying they should add the Panny version of 1366 - I agree. Aren't Panny and Pio the 2 top sellers? I would include the main resolutions for both. It is all market research, whatever the top sellers are. But - be careful! Not the top sellers overall. Be very careful here. The top sellers of units that are high quality enough that people are still willing to buy more stuff to add to them. The Costco 'how can it be that cheap' Plasma's from companies you've never heard of - people who buy those aren't going to add an Edge to it in general. From everything I've heard about Plasma's so far its a Panny/Pio world for the middle-high end or high end or whatever we want to call it. So if you add the Pio and Panny 1366 so we can get 1:1 pixel mapping - gigantic market just opened up with a perfect solution!
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post #148 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightminer View Post

As to people above saying they should add the Panny version of 1366 - I agree. Aren't Panny and Pio the 2 top sellers? I would include the main resolutions for both. It is all market research, whatever the top sellers are. But - be careful! Not the top sellers overall. Be very careful here. The top sellers of units that are high quality enough that people are still willing to buy more stuff to add to them. The Costco 'how can it be that cheap' Plasma's from companies you've never heard of - people who buy those aren't going to add an Edge to it in general. From everything I've heard about Plasma's so far its a Panny/Pio world for the middle-high end or high end or whatever we want to call it. So if you add the Pio and Panny 1366 so we can get 1:1 pixel mapping - gigantic market just opened up with a perfect solution!

Not to sound like a broken record, but I second this.
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post #149 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_CA View Post

Not to sound like a broken record, but I second this.

I started it so you're actually thirding it.
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post #150 of 7106 Old 07-24-2008, 05:07 PM
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Can the Edge be configured to automatically switch between 1080p24 output for film-based sources and 1080p60 output for video-based sources?
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