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post #181 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stepmback View Post

Maybe I was a little vague. My intention is to unplug the output (audio and video) and run it to my other TV (1080i 60fps). What I am trying to accomplish to set PS3 to 1080p all the time and have the Edge down convert signal to 1080i for this TV (via a memory setting). Then when I plug back into other tv/projector and change to other memory setting it will be set to 1080p. I just dont want to change the settings on PS3 everytime I go from a 1080p set to 1080i set.

Your application would not be facilited by the EDGE given the way its memory is set up. You would have to change the output res in the menu every time you switch display devices. As others have suggested you would have to create a macro with your univ remote to make it quasi-seamless. It seems a line a has been drawn in the sand as to what someone who buys an $800 VP would be competent to configure.
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post #182 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 11:58 AM
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FYI I will start contacting beta members early next week to get orders in place.

Expect to hear from me.
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post #183 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh@dvdo View Post

This can be accomplished using the input aspect ratio of EDGE but it is not as easy as it is on the VP50PRO which has specific features (Output Aspect Ratio controls for Display and Screen) which EDGE does not.

Josh, there's a few folks in this thread interested in a cheap solution to the zoom/shrink method or "Digital Scope" (CIH without a lens). Maybe you can drop by if you get a chance.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1022306&page=4
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post #184 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary J View Post

Which side do I fall on as a quasi-semi advanced user?

You have a web page with pictures of your theater and a list of your gear. I think we all know which side you fall on.
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post #185 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_CA View Post

Note, the second HDMI out is for audio only.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_CA View Post

Your application would not be facilited by the EDGE given the way its memory is set up. You would have to change the output res in the menu every time you switch display devices. As others have suggested you would have to create a macro with your univ remote to make it quasi-seamless. It seems a line a has been drawn in the sand as to what someone who buys an $800 VP would be competent to configure.

But with that said the VP is capable of accepting a 1080p signal and downconverting it to 1080i?
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post #186 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 12:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parkes View Post

Thanks Josh,

Can you explain then what the "2.35:1 Screen Output Mode" is as identified in the EDGE vs VP50 comparison pdf. It currently is unchecked for the EDGE yet if I understand what you are saying then the EDGE will indeed allow me to scale for an anamorphic lens setup. So what is that particular item comparing?

Thanks
Jim

The iScan VP50PRO has three controls for the Output Aspect Ratio (Display/Lens/Screen). EDGE has a single control for Output Aspect Ratio (Display). With the VP50PRO a user can define that they have a 16:9 projector, with or without a motorized or fixed anamorphic lens, being projected onto a 2.35:1 screen. Once this is done all Input Aspect Ratio controls are sized correctly for their combination. A user of EDGE can get the same intended results for 2.35:1 content by vertically stretching a 2.35:1 image by 33% using the Vertical Zoom control but EDGE is not as flexible as the VP50PRO in allowing the user to define their output configuration with the processor determining the correct output image.

Josh Allen
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post #187 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 12:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stepmback View Post

But with that said the VP is capable of accepting a 1080p signal and downconverting it to 1080i?

Yes, EDGE can do this.

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post #188 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 12:49 PM
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Hi Josh,

What is the video resolution of the second 'audio only' output?(for those that don't know audio is carried in the VBI over HDMI)

What audio input/output formats, sampling rates and number of channels of LPCM are supported?

How is audio EDID handled? Does it use the audio EDID received from the second output if connected otherwise use the audio EDID from the main output?

Thanks,

Shawn
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post #189 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 12:49 PM
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edited.
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post #190 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh@dvdo View Post

How about sending me an email instead of posting on a public forum?

Done
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post #191 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 01:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfogg View Post

What is the video resolution of the second 'audio only' output?(for those that don't know audio is carried in the VBI over HDMI)

720p-60

Quote:


What audio input/output formats, sampling rates and number of channels of LPCM are supported?

All audio formats are supported: PCM (stereo and multi-channel), Bitstream (DD up to TrueHD, DTS up to DTS-MA), and DSD (SACD)

Quote:


How is audio EDID handled? Does it use the audio EDID received from the second output if connected otherwise use the audio EDID from the main output?

There are three audio outputs on EDGE: the HDMI A/V (display), the HDMI Audio Only and the Optical Digital Output. If the user has selected the HDMI A/V output EDGE will communicate the Audio and Video EDID of the connected device on this connection. If the user has selected the HDMI Audio Only output then EDGE will take the Audio EDID of that connected device and combine it with the Video EDID of the device connected on the HDMI A/V output. If the user has selected the Optical Digital output then EDGE will communicate that 2 channel PCM and DD/DTS is the maximum capability in the Audio EDID and combine that with the Video EDID of the device on the HDMI A/V output. We consider this be an Intelligent Auto EDID Merge feature.

Josh Allen
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post #192 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh@dvdo View Post

EDGE is capable of detecting the "preferred" format that is reported by a display in its EDID. If that "preferred" format is not one of the default formats supported by EDGE (480p, 576p, 720p, 1080i, 1080p, or VGA) it can still be selected using the 'Auto' Output Format selection option. So if you have a 1920x1200 display that reports that 1920x1200 is the "preferred" format (which most PC monitors do) you will be able to output this resolution from your EDGE. If your display is a 1366x768 LCD that reports that its "preferred" format is 720p you will not be able to output the native resolution of this display.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh@dvdo View Post

There are no standards for 1366x768 (or 1360x768). In our VP line products we have 4 presets to handle these resolutions and the user may be forced to change sync polarity or horizontally/vertically shift the image to get 1:1. Most users do not want to go through this kind of advanced setup and these displays are becoming less and less popular.

I'm confused. I have a Panny pro plasma with 1366x768 native resolution: assuming that the Panny is reporting a 'preferred' format of 768p (correct?), what would happen if I were to use the 'Auto' Output format selection option on the EDGE?

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post #193 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pia-chan View Post

I'm confused. I have a Panny pro plasma with 1366x768 native resolution: assuming that the Panny is reporting a 'preferred' format of 768p (correct?), what would happen if I were to use the 'Auto' Output format selection option on the EDGE?

This VP is not a good option for Panny Pro plasma's with a native res of 1366x768. You will be subject secondary processing by your panel. You can PM me for more info since this has been discussed here already.
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post #194 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 02:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pia-chan View Post

I'm confused. I have a Panny pro plasma with 1366x768 native resolution: assuming that the Panny is reporting a 'preferred' format of 768p (correct?), what would happen if I were to use the 'Auto' Output format selection option on the EDGE?

Then EDGE would output the preferred format for that display, which may or may not be 1366x768. All of the timing descriptors for the preferred format are also included in the EDID.

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post #195 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 02:40 PM
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Well, I am curious to know the following:

1. Can the Edge convert a 1080p to 720p?
2. How does it compare against scalers in receivers such as the Denon 4308, Denon 5308 and Pioneer Elite SC-09?

I guess time will tell. Hopefully, I will get a chance to test and compare in the next week or so.

Thanks and have a good day!

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post #196 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 02:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgarner View Post


1. Can the Edge convert a 1080p to 720p?

Yes

Quote:


2. How does it compare against scalers in receivers such as the Denon 4308, Denon 5308 and Pioneer Elite SC-09?

EDGE has the same performance as the VP50PRO so any comparison between the VP50PRO and an AVR can be applied to EDGE as well.

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post #197 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh@dvdo View Post

The iScan VP50PRO has three controls for the Output Aspect Ratio (Display/Lens/Screen). EDGE has a single control for Output Aspect Ratio (Display). With the VP50PRO a user can define that they have a 16:9 projector, with or without a motorized or fixed anamorphic lens, being projected onto a 2.35:1 screen. Once this is done all Input Aspect Ratio controls are sized correctly for their combination. A user of EDGE can get the same intended results for 2.35:1 content by vertically stretching a 2.35:1 image by 33% using the Vertical Zoom control but EDGE is not as flexible as the VP50PRO in allowing the user to define their output configuration with the processor determining the correct output image.

Josh, I understand here that the EDGE have two zoom control :

- horizontal zoom control and
- vertical zoom control to do vertical stretch.

Am I right ?

In such case, it means that the EDGE can be used with vertical zoom to 133% and horizontal zoom to 100% to stretch vertically the image in order to use with an anamorphic lens ?

But what if we use no anamorphic lens ? Can we zoom (or use underscan) 66% horizontally and vertically to reduce a 16/9 image in order to be totally visible in a 2.35:1 screen ?

On the VP50Pro, the underscan is limited to 75% which is not enough and zoom start at 100% with is not enough too...

What about the Edge ?

Richard.
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post #198 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgarner View Post

2. How does it compare against scalers in receivers such as the Denon 4308, Denon 5308 and Pioneer Elite SC-09?

Out of those receivers, the 5308 is suppose to have the best VP out of the bunch. I got the 5308 and the VPpro is leaps better in PQ.
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post #199 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 04:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale Adams View Post

Output Aspect Ratio Controls
Presets: 4:3, 16:9
Underscan Adjustment to eliminate Overscan inherent in a display

It's nice to see Dale still follows the ABT threads since his knowledge and history of the inner workings of VPs are much appreciated.

The underscan adjustment was the biggest selling point for me when I bought the VP30 since it is a problem that has plagued many of us who use our screens as a PC monitor. My XBR 60 has close to a 4% overscan which is most of the bottom tab bar for Windows. I wouldn't consider a VP without this feature.

The 2 HDMI outs is really cool even if one is for audio since I my current receiver (Pio-92) doesn't allow me to choose separate video and audio sources (unlike my older Elite-53) and switching the configuration in the setup menu is a pain. With the video signal bypassing the receiver this is no longer an issue since the source selection will not affect video.

I would definitely jump on this one if you don't have a external processor, although it isn't quite enough for me to retire my trusty VP especially after just replacing my power supply last month (like many others) and recently buying an Algolith Flea.

I'm really looking forward to the VPXX model which I assume will have 2 HDMI 1.3 outs (possibly both with video). Hopefully I will have a bitstream source by then since I'm still using a PS3 and a HDA1.
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post #200 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_CA View Post

This VP is not a good option for Panny Pro plasma's with a native res of 1366x768. You will be subject secondary processing by your panel. You can PM me for more info since this has been discussed here already.

What is the disadvantage? How is there less scaling without the Edge in the chain? You would still have the hard part, de-interlacing, done by the superior Edge.
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post #201 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 05:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shamus View Post

Out of those receivers, the 5308 is suppose to have the best VP out of the bunch. I got the 5308 and the VPpro is leaps better in PQ.

Thanks for the information. I was planning to pick up the 4308 or 5308 soon, but I am going to wait.

The Edge seems quite interesting, however I wish it had 2 full HDMI Video and Audio out to support my Projector and TV.

Maybe an upgrade in the future?

Thanks and have a good day!

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post #202 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnus_CA View Post

Any problems caused by a lost picture can be solved by a prompt that requires you to approve the new resolution within 10 seconds or the resolution reverts to default or what it was set to before.

Are you talking about how the EDGE works here or the VPxx range? On these, once approved, you wind up with the new resolution/frame rate which is one that may not give you a picture at all. I have a VP50 so I know how it works. What's needed is a button for a back to a common default res setup like 576/480i. The Oppos for example have a dedicated Res button that allows you to cycle through all its possible out resolutions - here we would just need one to get it back to a standard res that is acceptable to almost any display.

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post #203 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 05:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by escon View Post

Are you talking about how the EDGE works here or the VPxx range? On these, once approved, you wind up with the new resolution/frame rate which is one that may not give you a picture at all. I have a VP50 so I know how it works. What's needed is a button for a back to a common default res setup like 576/480i. The Oppos for example have a dedicated Res button that allows you to cycle through all its possible out resolutions - here we would just need one to get it back to a standard res that is acceptable to almost any display.

EDGE will change to the chosen output format and if the user does not confirm that they see a picture it will default to the previously selected format in 7 seconds.

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post #204 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 05:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh@dvdo View Post

EDGE will change to the chosen output format and if the user does not confirm that they see a picture it will default to the previously selected format in 7 seconds.

Excellent - thanks Josh.

Phil.
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post #205 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 06:07 PM
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any idea when the Betas will be available?

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If you havent listened to it yet can you really say its not better?
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post #206 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 06:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh@dvdo View Post

The iScan VP50PRO has three controls for the Output Aspect Ratio (Display/Lens/Screen). EDGE has a single control for Output Aspect Ratio (Display). With the VP50PRO a user can define that they have a 16:9 projector, with or without a motorized or fixed anamorphic lens, being projected onto a 2.35:1 screen. Once this is done all Input Aspect Ratio controls are sized correctly for their combination. A user of EDGE can get the same intended results for 2.35:1 content by vertically stretching a 2.35:1 image by 33% using the Vertical Zoom control but EDGE is not as flexible as the VP50PRO in allowing the user to define their output configuration with the processor determining the correct output image.


More confused than ever. Can I leave my Panamorph lens in place all the time for 2.35:1?
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post #207 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 08:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgarner View Post

Thanks for the information. I was planning to pick up the 4308 or 5308 soon, but I am going to wait.

The Edge seems quite interesting, however I wish it had 2 full HDMI Video and Audio out to support my Projector and TV.

Maybe an upgrade in the future?

The 5308 has two so you wouldn't need it.
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post #208 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 09:29 PM
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Can't decipher if this EDGE has picture adjustments or not, i.e. contrast, brightness, sharpness etc. as in the VP series? If so is it seperate per HDMI input?
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post #209 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 09:52 PM
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deleted, double post

Thanks and have a good day!

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post #210 of 7116 Old 07-25-2008, 10:18 PM
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I have two questions. I'm learning about VP right now. I've been following for a while. I currently use D* and get my local channels via OTA. I have a Denon 3808 with the DCDi chip which I understand is not good at all.

When I try to watch D* through the processor in the 3808, the picture looks much worse than when my Sony rear projection 60 inch series A3000 set gets a signal straight from the box. I understand that D* picture quality for SD stations is poor, but the HD channels (especially the MPEG4 channels) look beautiful.

How does the VP50 perform with D*, both SD and HD?

Second, since I have the 3808, what would be the best way to install this box? I know that I should turn off all my processing in the TV and in the AVR, but should I put a VP before the AVR or after?

Could you guys make a cheaper box by only including one HDMI in/out for us that have AVR's or would that be too small a market?
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