Official Lumagen RadianceMini 3D thread. - Page 18 - AVS Forum
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post #511 of 1327 Old 05-22-2012, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Gordon Fraser View Post

well it's news to me and Mark H is in UK and I am the UK distributor.....

Gordon

Possible confusion in the discussion between MarkH (UK maestro user) and Mark Haflich (AVS maestro salesman)?
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post #512 of 1327 Old 05-22-2012, 03:51 PM
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Possibly Manni. Either way there is no mini4K radiance on the horizon.

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post #513 of 1327 Old 06-01-2012, 02:38 AM
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Ok easy question I hope to answer, I tried to look for the answer but too much to read. If I got the mini3, how do I connect my av receiver to the mini3? I'm just thinking that I connect it to one of the hdmi inputs but how do I use the other hdmi sources on my receiver with the mini3?
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post #514 of 1327 Old 06-01-2012, 05:36 AM
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Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post

Ok easy question I hope to answer, I tried to look for the answer but too much to read. If I got the mini3, how do I connect my av receiver to the mini3? I'm just thinking that I connect it to one of the hdmi inputs but how do I use the other hdmi sources on my receiver with the mini3?

Yes, you just connect your receiver to one of the inputs on the Mini and leave it on that input. You switch source inputs on your receiver like you always would...whatever the receiver transmits the Mini will see...

If you're thinking each source would have it's owen input on the Radiance, you purchased the wrong model as it's only a two input device.
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post #515 of 1327 Old 06-01-2012, 05:51 AM
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Originally Posted by thrang View Post

Yes, you just connect your receiver to one of the inputs on the Mini and leave it on that input. You switch source inputs on your receiver like you always would...whatever the receiver transmits the Mini will see...

If you're thinking each source would have it's owen input on the Radiance, you purchased the wrong model as it's only a two input device.

Although if you want different settings for each source that is fed to the receiver then you can do that. The mini has "virtual" input capability. So you can tell it that when you press the INPUT 3 button on the lumagen remote, for instance, it should look at the physical INPUT1 on the mini but load up the settings you have created for INPUT 3.....There are six of these virtual inputs I believe.

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post #516 of 1327 Old 06-01-2012, 05:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon Fraser View Post

Although if you want different settings for each source that is fed to the receiver then you can do that. The mini has "virtual" input capability. So you can tell it that when you press the INPUT 3 button on the lumagen remote, for instance, it should look at the physical INPUT1 on the mini but load up the settings you have created for INPUT 3.....There are six of these virtual inputs I believe.

Forgot about that feature as I don't use it (I barely have enough time to calibrate once, much less for individual devices!) thanks for clarifying...
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post #517 of 1327 Old 06-01-2012, 06:09 AM
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Originally Posted by thrang View Post


Yes, you just connect your receiver to one of the inputs on the Mini and leave it on that input. You switch source inputs on your receiver like you always would...whatever the receiver transmits the Mini will see...

If you're thinking each source would have it's owen input on the Radiance, you purchased the wrong model as it's only a two input device.

Yes, I was talking about switching sources on the receiver. So, there is not really anything to miss if you use a receiver with the mini3. I was debating a mini3 vs a XS, but since I'm using a receiver, there is no need to spend 2x as much. Also, I read a splitter can be used to have another output for running a two projector set up and monoprice is one that some have used for only $30. I should have got one awhile ago, they should put something on their site for better clarification or bone heads like me
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post #518 of 1327 Old 06-01-2012, 06:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon Fraser View Post


Although if you want different settings for each source that is fed to the receiver then you can do that. The mini has "virtual" input capability. So you can tell it that when you press the INPUT 3 button on the lumagen remote, for instance, it should look at the physical INPUT1 on the mini but load up the settings you have created for INPUT 3.....There are six of these virtual inputs I believe.

That's good, I have 6 inputs on my receiver. If I'm running a two projector set up, can the cms of the mini store calibrations for each projector?
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post #519 of 1327 Old 06-01-2012, 06:16 AM
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^^^

that is how i have my mini set up... all sources going to the avr, then a splitter after the mini which feeds the pj, the 3dbee (which then goes to the pj), and a little lcd...

i didn't bother to calibrate the little lcd... maybe someday when i'm bored... also, i don't calibrate for different sources...

ymmv, this seems to work rather well for me..

edit: yes, you can have up to 8 different cms settings defined, and they can be assigned to whatever physical/logical input you want (you'd think of the different "outputs" as being logical "inputs", if that makes sense)...

a simple example, 2 pj's and 1 bdp....

using 1 physical input... you would define "physical input 1/memory a" with the cms for pj 1, and "physical input 1/memory b" with the cms for pj 2...

since you have 6 "inputs" (2 physical and 4 logical, and the physical ones can be re-assigned) and 4 memories in each input, you can define up to 24 different combinations of source/output...

once you have it sitting in front of you, it becomes a lot clearer how the architecture works... if you are familiar with database design, it works essentially like a pseudo-relational database...

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post #520 of 1327 Old 06-01-2012, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

^^^

that is how i have my mini set up... all sources going to the avr, then a splitter after the mini which feeds the pj, the 3dbee (which then goes to the pj), and a little lcd...

i didn't bother to calibrate the little lcd... maybe someday when i'm bored... also, i don't calibrate for different sources...

ymmv, this seems to work rather well for me..

edit: yes, you can have up to 8 different cms settings defined, and they can be assigned to whatever physical/logical input you want (you'd think of the different "outputs" as being logical "inputs", if that makes sense)...

a simple example, 2 pj's and 1 bdp....

using 1 physical input... you would define "physical input 1/memory a" with the cms for pj 1, and "physical input 1/memory b" with the cms for pj 2...

since you have 6 "inputs" (2 physical and 4 logical, and the physical ones can be re-assigned) and 4 memories in each input, you can define up to 24 different combinations of source/output...

once you have it sitting in front of you, it becomes a lot clearer how the architecture works... if you are familiar with database design, it works essentially like a pseudo-relational database...

Thanks
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post #521 of 1327 Old 06-02-2012, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by rfpublic View Post

Select the input and user memory that you would like to have selected when you power up. Now do a "Save". When you power up your Radiance, it will be set to this input and user memory.

The Radiance has auto input select. Press "Menu, Other, I/O Setup, Auto Select, Ok". Add inputs to the list in priority order. Press the "Help" button on the remote for a description.

"When enabled, this list can be used to auto switch to an active input when the current video source is turned off. The priority 1 input is the first input tried when the current source is turned off. HDMI inputs can be auto selected when turned on by setting 'Select when On' to 'Y'. Disable auto selection by deleting all entries in the list."

Randy Freeman
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I used this feature and it works great. I could not find this feature documented in the manual unless I missed it. SJ
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post #522 of 1327 Old 06-03-2012, 11:19 AM
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Trying to justify the purchase of a Mini-3D for a Panasonic P60ST30 Plasma (2011 Model)

This display has a nice picture but there is definitely room for improvement, and that's where these displays falls short. I've spent months following various threads and attempting multiple calibrations with an i1Display 3 Pro but these displays are known for having calibration issues. Even Home Theater Mag "abandoned further attempts to use Custom mode for 2D" due to "odd gammas" and used Cinema mode instead even with it's limited adjustments.

Someone on the Panasonic ST30 calibration thread who spent a considerable amount of time attempting to calibrate his display, purchased a Lumagen HDQ for $235 and even without HDMI said for the first time he was completely satisfied with his display, adding it did a far better job of scaling and filtering, and even cleaned up the bad signals coming out of his Dishnet box.

Sometimes what I see on my display is impressive (Blu-ray material and watching CBS in the evening) and other times it's not... poor DVD quality, poor upscaling of non-HD material, inconsistent skin tones, etc.

I understand the Radiance will perform it's best when used with projectors but I'm curious how much it can realistically do with a 60" plasma display.
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post #523 of 1327 Old 06-03-2012, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by 65Cobra427SC View Post

Trying to justify the purchase of a Mini-3D for a Panasonic P60ST30 Plasma (2011 Model)

This display has a nice picture but there is definitely room for improvement, and that's where these displays falls short. I've spent months following various threads and attempting multiple calibrations with an i1Display 3 Pro but these displays are known for having calibration issues. Even Home Theater Mag "abandoned further attempts to use Custom mode for 2D" due to "odd gammas" and used Cinema mode instead even with it's limited adjustments.

Someone on the Panasonic ST30 calibration thread who spent a considerable amount of time attempting to calibrate his display, purchased a Lumagen HDQ for $235 and even without HDMI said for the first time he was completely satisfied with his display, adding it did a far better job of scaling and filtering, and even cleaned up the bad signals coming out of his Dishnet box.

Sometimes what I see on my display is impressive (Blu-ray material and watching CBS in the evening) and other times it's not... poor DVD quality, poor upscaling of non-HD material, inconsistent skin tones, etc.

I understand the Radiance will perform it's best when used with projectors but I'm curious how much it can realistically do with a 60" plasma display.

Don't know who said it is only at its best with a projector but that is nonsense. It is at its best with any display that has sub-optimal de-interlacing and scaling or low quality calibration controls....ie virtually every display out there. In UK I have many, many users with plasma displays attached to these things. Even folk with supposed reference (Pioneer Kuro) displays.

Your ST30 is an ideal candidate for all the above reasons

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post #524 of 1327 Old 06-04-2012, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Gordon Fraser View Post

Don't know who said it is only at its best with a projector but that is nonsense. It is at its best with any display that has sub-optimal de-interlacing and scaling or low quality calibration controls....ie virtually every display out there. In UK I have many, many users with plasma displays attached to these things. Even folk with supposed reference (Pioneer Kuro) displays.

Your ST30 is an ideal candidate for all the above reasons


I found where I read the comment about the projector and decided to quote it below... not doing this to dispute anything or anyone, just simply for reference. Obviously just because a flat panel display has 10-step grayscale adjustment and other controls, doesn't mean they work as well as they should. Apparently the ST30 is one such case. Thanks for the input and if anyone has any additional comments, I'd like to hear them.

"While I can't argue the capabilities or performance of these or any other standalone video processors, it's worth noting that a purchase like this should be well considered and the potential benefits weighed against the costs. In my experience, the video-calibration adjustments now offered on many displays, particularly the flat panels I test regularly, are adequate to dial the set in to the point where further improvements might not be visibly significant. LG and Samsung even have 10-step grayscale adjustments on many of their HDTVs. Sophisticated products such as the Lumagen and DVDO discussed here are really best applied to video projection setups. There's no doubt that they offer unequalled capabilities, but you need to ensure that these capabilities will make sense relative to the display they will be used with."
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post #525 of 1327 Old 06-04-2012, 04:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 65Cobra427SC View Post

I found where I read the comment about the projector and decided to quote it below... not doing this to dispute anything or anyone, just simply for reference. Obviously just because a flat panel display has 10-step grayscale adjustment and other controls, doesn't mean they work as well as they should. Apparently the ST30 is one such case. Thanks for the input and if anyone has any additional comments, I'd like to hear them.

"While I can't argue the capabilities or performance of these or any other standalone video processors, it's worth noting that a purchase like this should be well considered and the potential benefits weighed against the costs. In my experience, the video-calibration adjustments now offered on many displays, particularly the flat panels I test regularly, are adequate to dial the set in to the point where further improvements might not be visibly significant. LG and Samsung even have 10-step grayscale adjustments on many of their HDTVs. Sophisticated products such as the Lumagen and DVDO discussed here are really best applied to video projection setups. There's no doubt that they offer unequalled capabilities, but you need to ensure that these capabilities will make sense relative to the display they will be used with."

Well. I would respectfully disagree. I spent a couple of days, just last week, trying to calibrate two LG pasma's, complete with 10 step gamma, to match each other and a Panasonic 85PF12....It was impossible. Got one of the LG's close but the other was MILES away with no hope of getting close without use of external help.....and both LG's were from same supplier, delivered and installed on same day and were the same model.....As you have possibly worked out, just because a product has tools in it that suggest they may be useful it doesn't actually mean they are, or even that they work!

I do agree that you should ensure a video processor is of use with your display though, as many are not likely to provide any benefits. Just don't agree that you can work that out based on whether it's a plasma/LCD v a projector.

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post #526 of 1327 Old 06-04-2012, 05:31 PM
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Most projector these days also have good 10 or 8 pt. grayscale tracking.. However, I think they still benefit.
The way I see is not about display tech, but how far away you are away from the screen. Most plasma/LCD display setup is when you are quite far away, like more than 2 to 3 screen width.. so, it is harder to see the benefit.when you have PJ, you are likely to be within 2 screenwidth, if not 1.5... the benefit is much clearer.
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post #527 of 1327 Old 06-06-2012, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by fight4yu View Post

Most projector these days also have good 10 or 8 pt. grayscale tracking.. However, I think they still benefit.

The way I see is not about display tech, but how far away you are away from the screen. Most plasma/LCD display setup is when you are quite far away, like more than 2 to 3 screen width.. so, it is harder to see the benefit.when you have PJ, you are likely to be within 2 screenwidth, if not 1.5... the benefit is much clearer.


Good point... which happens to be my situation. Although I don't have a projector, my plasma is a 60" display and I sit fairly close to the screen... and I want the best picture I can get... so I think I'll drop the ball and get a mini 3d in the next week or two. As Arnold says "I'll be back."
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post #528 of 1327 Old 07-03-2012, 11:46 AM
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I just wanted to state how helpful the Lumagen "tech tip" for using 2:35 without an anamorphic lens has been. I was worried about the tedium and inaccuracy of lens memory functions on my projector (JVC RS45), however--the Lumagen tech tip has saved me from having to go through this. Furthermore, scaling 16:9 broadcast images to the 2:35 aspect ratio somehow looks natural. Thanks to Lumagen, and I believe Randy (I think he writes them.)
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post #529 of 1327 Old 07-03-2012, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

I just wanted to state how helpful the Lumagen "tech tip" for using 2:35 without an anamorphic lens has been. I was worried about the tedium and inaccuracy of lens memory functions on my projector (JVC RS45), however--the Lumagen tech tip has saved me from having to go through this. Furthermore, scaling 16:9 broadcast images to the 2:35 aspect ratio somehow looks natural. Thanks to Lumagen, and I believe Randy (I think he writes them.)

With my Sony1000 I zoom to a larger pic for 2.35, an also have to lens shift to get it positioned right.    Going back to 16x9 is of course the reverse.     (Focus does not have to be changed.)    Can the Lumagen do this--zoom and lens shift--electronically?

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post #530 of 1327 Old 07-03-2012, 02:27 PM
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Yes it can. Once the tech-tip steps are completed, zoom your projector once (with a 2:35 image on screen) to fill your 2:35 screen, and that's the last time you'll ever have to zoom. going back to 16:9 content will be as simple as pressing the 16:9 button on the Lumagen remote (or desired universal remote). Watching 2:35 images will place the picture back at its 2:35 aspect ratio to fill the screen. Furthermore, you can even have the lumagen stretch your 16:9 image to fill the 2:35 screen, all while maintaining the constant image height! (the stretching is not noticable at all) by clicking 16:9 and then NLS (Non-Linear Scaling)

I'm going to try to shoot a video of it and post to youtube sometime this week. It's truly an awesome feature.

Edit: In sum:
  • When viewing 16:9 content: Press 16:9 button, and if 16:9-->2:35 stretch is desired, then and only then, press NLS button
  • When viewing 2:35 content: Press 2:35 (This step is important because otherwise, the Lumagen will shrink the top and bottom of the native 2:35 image itself by 12%.)
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post #531 of 1327 Old 07-03-2012, 08:03 PM
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Per my above post, below is a video I shot today about establishing CIH settings using the Lumagen RadianceMini 3D without having to Zoom your projector. i hope this helps someone.
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post #532 of 1327 Old 07-04-2012, 08:07 AM
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Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Yes it can. Once the tech-tip steps are completed, zoom your projector once (with a 2:35 image on screen) to fill your 2:35 screen, and that's the last time you'll ever have to zoom. going back to 16:9 content will be as simple as pressing the 16:9 button on the Lumagen remote (or desired universal remote). Watching 2:35 images will place the picture back at its 2:35 aspect ratio to fill the screen. Furthermore, you can even have the lumagen stretch your 16:9 image to fill the 2:35 screen, all while maintaining the constant image height! (the stretching is not noticable at all) by clicking 16:9 and then NLS (Non-Linear Scaling)
I'm going to try to shoot a video of it and post to youtube sometime this week. It's truly an awesome feature.
Edit: In sum:
  • When viewing 16:9 content: Press 16:9 button, and if 16:9-->2:35 stretch is desired, then and only then, press NLS button
  • When viewing 2:35 content: Press 2:35 (This step is important because otherwise, the Lumagen will shrink the top and bottom of the native 2:35 image itself by 12%.)

The NLS stretching to me is noticeable...especially during high speed panning, like a basketball game. It does however allow different settings on what portion of the picture you want zoom...
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post #533 of 1327 Old 07-04-2012, 08:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fight4yu View Post

The NLS stretching to me is noticeable...especially during high speed panning, like a basketball game. It does however allow different settings on what portion of the picture you want zoom...

Understandable....skipping the NLS after following the configuration steps of Tech Tip 16 still gets you the CIH functionality without having to use the inaccurate lens memory of the projector.
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post #534 of 1327 Old 07-05-2012, 10:25 AM
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Wow, BB--great video you made--thanks!

 

A further question, though:   I have a hybrid-size screen, AR 2.0 (144x72), because I wanted something as wide as the room would hold for 2.35, but didn't want to be limited in height (60") that a 144"W 2.35 screen would be.

 

So I have a 128x72 16x9 pic (with black bars on the side, that I mask), and a 144x60 2.35 pic (which I lens shift to the bottom edge of the screen and have a black bar at the top which I ignore).    At present I use the lens memory feature on my Sony 1000 to switch back and forth between these two configurations.     It requires zooming and also lens shifting.

 

Is it possible for the Lumagen procedures to deal with this?   Seems like I would need to set the left/right and up/down %'s specifically for my screen, right?

 

Tx again,  Bill

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post #535 of 1327 Old 07-05-2012, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

Wow, BB--great video you made--thanks!

A further question, though:   I have a hybrid-size screen, AR 2.0 (144x72), because I wanted something as wide as the room would hold for 2.35, but didn't want to be limited in height (60") that a 144"W 2.35 screen would be.

So I have a 128x72 16x9 pic (with black bars on the side, that I mask), and a 144x60 2.35 pic (which I lens shift to the bottom edge of the screen and have a black bar at the top which I ignore).    At present I use the lens memory feature on my Sony 1000 to switch back and forth between these two configurations.     It requires zooming and also lens shifting.

Is it possible for the Lumagen procedures to deal with this?   Seems like I would need to set the left/right and up/down %'s specifically for my screen, right?

Tx again,  Bill

Greetings! I'm glad you like the video, Bill. Your screen sounds a bit tricky. You could certainly fill the screen, but you'd have to establish custom aspect ratios. It would still be tricky though...It might be easier to use the radiance's stretch functions for the 2:35 image and save to virtual input 1, and then do the same thing for a 16x9 and save that to virtual input 2. You could then switch between the virtual inputs, depending on the image being displayed on the screen. (I'm not at home, so I can't see from the menu if the stretch parameters are custom, but I would imagine that they would be)
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post #536 of 1327 Old 07-05-2012, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post


Greetings! I'm glad you like the video, Bill. Your screen sounds a bit tricky. You could certainly fill the screen, but you'd have to establish custom aspect ratios. It would still be tricky though...It might be easier to use the radiance's stretch functions for the 2:35 image and save to virtual input 1, and then do the same thing for a 16x9 and save that to virtual input 2. You could then switch between the virtual inputs, depending on the image being displayed on the screen. (I'm not at home, so I can't see from the menu if the stretch parameters are custom, but I would imagine that they would be)


Tx, BB.    But I do not want to stretch the pics to fill the screen (i.e., with NLS, which stretches the pic near the L/R edges).

 

I'll play with my RadMini to see what I can do.   

 

PS   It is even more complicated since the Sony 1000 can be 17x9 (rather than 16x9) to utilize the full 4K set of pixels; this cuts off an inch or 2 on the ht of the 16x9 pic, but then I get a 136x72 pic (rather than 128x72) for 16x9 material.

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post #537 of 1327 Old 07-05-2012, 04:51 PM
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Hi Bill,

You can easily set up the Lumagen to handle your special scaling for screen. There are four user memory buttons on the remote that can be used to store and recall the special settings for your unusual screen configuration. As was previously mentioned, you can also use the virtual input feature to store more settings, if the four user memories aren't enough.

We would be happy to provide the procedure to set up the scaling for your screen. Just send an email to support@lumagen.com

Randy Freeman
Lumagen
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post #538 of 1327 Old 08-15-2012, 07:27 PM
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Have a quick question, and needed some input.
I am considering the flagship Integra AVR with the HQV Vida 1900 and the Marvell Qdeo chipset to get the best possible plug 'n play picture on my VT50 - after possibly a few noobish tinkering to serve my taste. I am getting rid of my 2007 Pio Elite since it does not process HDMI inputs. Would it be better to simply get a Lumagen Mini3D instead of the Integra, and just keep my current AVR? In short, would the dedicated VP offer a significant improvement in the PQ versus the Integra's built in unit. Thank you for the input.
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post #539 of 1327 Old 08-17-2012, 02:29 PM
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Generally speaking, any specialized piece of equipment will out perform a multi-tasking piece of equipment for the task at hand. I imagine that the folks at Lumagen had the time to evaluate HQV too, and stuck with their processing chip.
Having said that, I haven't seen either of these two in action. I just took delivery of my new (used) DVDO Duo today. My fear is that I may have short changed myself in the processing department by not spending the extra money for a Lumagen Mini. I wonder if a Mini and a DVDO Duo would complement each other. Does anyone know?
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post #540 of 1327 Old 08-30-2012, 01:45 AM
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Still rather new to the Mini3D.

Could anyone explain what the IFD feature under the deinterlace menu does? It Says 0 for less combing and 15 for maximum detail but more combing for video. I have tried many combination and have struggled to see the difference between 0 and 15. It could be that I am unable to pause my cable TV picture to have a better immediate look upon changing it.

Also will there every be a upgrade for the reinterlace feature to be allowed on 720P input? At this time it only allows this to be enabled on 480 or 576p input. My cable box seems to be broadcast in 720p which seems the sharpest. The box deinterlacing however is terrible so much that I prefer to watch it output in 1080i.
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