Official Lumagen RadianceMini 3D thread. - Page 43 - AVS Forum
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post #1261 of 1305 Old 08-29-2014, 11:57 PM
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Lumagen Radiance (XE/XE+/XE3D/XE/XE+/XE3D/Mini-3D/XD/XD3D) New 081514 Firmware Update

Release Notes

Added faster serial port IO to enable faster operation with calibration software. (Update time ~3 minutes @57k)

Download Link

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post #1262 of 1305 Old 08-30-2014, 01:15 AM
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Both Chromapure and the Radiance are throwing patterns up when I try to use the grayscale and CMS controls on the Mini3D. Must I disable the Radiance signal generator in CP or disconnect the vp from the laptop???
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post #1263 of 1305 Old 08-30-2014, 01:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon Fraser View Post
You could ask lumagen direct but i don't see one on their site. I think i wrote somethign a few years ago but i can't find the link to it.

MENU 0910 turns on service mode and gets you access to the CMS stuff.

Choose the 10 or 11 point greyscale adjustment. and press OK

You will then see on screen data stating the control level, it's luminance, then R G B values.
If you adjust R G or B levels up or down you will see the Luminance level alter,,,ie add G and luminance goes up...to maintain gamma you then go back and move the luminance back to where you need it to be for your chosen gamma target and when you do that the R G B values will move either up or down relative to each other to maintain the correct greyscale. You may find that due to the non linearity of your display you need to iterate this bit a few times.

to change the pattern used press 4 to cycle through the options.

I'm not sure I know where to set luminance in relation to the gamma target.
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post #1264 of 1305 Old 08-30-2014, 07:20 AM
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^^^^^^^^^^^^
Disable Signal Generator when operating the Radiance manually, otherwise the Cal SW will keep changing the patterns.

In Chromapure, the Gamma adjustment tab shows Gamma (obviously) but also shows the Reg-Green-Blue balance, so you can adjust Greyscale and Gamma together.

Adjust luminance, trim the RGB, re-adjust luma - repeat at each stimulus point.

Regards, Mike.
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post #1265 of 1305 Old 08-30-2014, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV_mike View Post
^^^^^^^^^^^^
Disable Signal Generator when operating the Radiance manually, otherwise the Cal SW will keep changing the patterns.

In Chromapure, the Gamma adjustment tab shows Gamma (obviously) but also shows the Reg-Green-Blue balance, so you can adjust Greyscale and Gamma together.

Adjust luminance, trim the RGB, re-adjust luma - repeat at each stimulus point.

Regards, Mike.

I'm familiar with the gamma module in Chromapure, but what about in the Radiance? For example, at point 5 in the grayscale adjustments, the luminance is 40.2. Do I try to keep it there while I balance the RGB values?


EDIT: I notice from 60 to 100 IRE the luminance is 100.00. Should all intensity levels show the same luminance of 100.00?

Last edited by Pres2play; 08-30-2014 at 08:14 AM.
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post #1266 of 1305 Old 08-30-2014, 08:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnecTEDDD View Post
Lumagen Radiance (XE/XE+/XE3D/XE/XE+/XE3D/Mini-3D/XD/XD3D) New 081514 Firmware Update

Release Notes

Added faster serial port IO to enable faster operation with calibration software. (Update time ~3 minutes @57k)

Download Link

Thank you Ted!
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post #1267 of 1305 Old 08-30-2014, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV_mike View Post
^^^^^^^^^^^^
Disable Signal Generator when operating the Radiance manually, otherwise the Cal SW will keep changing the patterns.

In Chromapure, the Gamma adjustment tab shows Gamma (obviously) but also shows the Reg-Green-Blue balance, so you can adjust Greyscale and Gamma together.

Adjust luminance, trim the RGB, re-adjust luma - repeat at each stimulus point.

Regards, Mike.

Oh, got it now. What a dumb mistake not seeing it. Thanks!!!
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post #1268 of 1305 Old 08-31-2014, 12:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post
Oh, got it now. What a dumb mistake not seeing it. Thanks!!!
PRES2PLAY: 60-100 shoudl not all have 100 stimulus values. Reset the greyscale to default and 10 should 10, 20 will be 20, 70 will be 70. Then measure gamma sweep. If the adjustment is a long way out..ie you want 2.2 and it's pretty even at 2.0 or 2.4 all the way across go to the lumagens GAMMA adjustment and use that to get more of it at 2.2 ish...then do the greyscale using the multi-point stuff to fine tune gamma and rgb balance the way it's been described in posts above.

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post #1269 of 1305 Old 08-31-2014, 03:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon Fraser View Post
PRES2PLAY: 60-100 shoudl not all have 100 stimulus values. Reset the greyscale to default and 10 should 10, 20 will be 20, 70 will be 70. Then measure gamma sweep. If the adjustment is a long way out..ie you want 2.2 and it's pretty even at 2.0 or 2.4 all the way across go to the lumagens GAMMA adjustment and use that to get more of it at 2.2 ish...then do the greyscale using the multi-point stuff to fine tune gamma and rgb balance the way it's been described in posts above.

Here are the actual settings that threw me off at the beginning. Once I hit "default" the values from points 1-5 all reset, which was a relief.





In Chromapure I used the WB controls to balance RGB for each intensity so it confused me for a moment to see grayscale and gamma together in the Lumagen controls. Then AV_Mike mentioned the CP gamma module and that cleared things up.


I do have a question about setting the white point. CP says to set the White Balance using gain and offset at 80% and 20% IRE; Lumagen says use 100 IRE, and to use only the display WB controls to do this. The 2-point adjustment is quite accurate, but when I try at 100 IRE the white color point is slightly off target. What is the proper way to set the white point at 100 IRE?
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post #1270 of 1305 Old 08-31-2014, 09:21 AM
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If you have a Lumagen then i'd set 100 percent stimulus using the rgb gains in the display...If the low stimulus points are miles out you could try doing some small adjustments in the display for them with it's two point controls...but generally i'd just do 100 in display then do the rest with the Lumagen....

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post #1271 of 1305 Old 08-31-2014, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon Fraser View Post
If you have a Lumagen then i'd set 100 percent stimulus using the rgb gains in the display...If the low stimulus points are miles out you could try doing some small adjustments in the display for them with it's two point controls...but generally i'd just do 100 in display then do the rest with the Lumagen....

That must be my mistake there, I've been using the 10th interval of the panel's 10-pt white balance to set at 100.
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post #1272 of 1305 Old 08-31-2014, 10:33 PM
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Adjusted color points and saved in Lumagen, but post-cal looks identical to pre-cal measurement. The Mini3D was not connected to the laptop since I was using the Lumagen controls and remote. Must the computer still be connected to the vp?




Corrections made in color management...








Post calibration result



Last edited by Pres2play; 08-31-2014 at 10:39 PM.
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post #1273 of 1305 Old 09-01-2014, 12:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post
Adjusted color points and saved in Lumagen, but post-cal looks identical to pre-cal measurement. The Mini3D was not connected to the laptop since I was using the Lumagen controls and remote. Must the computer still be connected to the vp?



Looks to me like you either didn't Save your settings or you measured the Reference test patterns, not the Adjusted test patterns from the scaler for your post charts.

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post #1274 of 1305 Old 09-01-2014, 06:58 AM
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I used reference: Menu>Other>Test Patterns>Reference


So reference patterns are for pre-calibration only?


I use reference WRGB to profile my i1D3 to my i1pro before each session. Am I using the correct patterns?


Thank you so much for your help
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post #1275 of 1305 Old 09-01-2014, 07:14 AM
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BTW, the gamut colors in the scaler also shows BLACK color. Is this used for flat panels?
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post #1276 of 1305 Old 09-01-2014, 09:14 AM
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The reference patterns do not show any adjustments that have been set in the scaler. If you are using the scaler to do calibrations then you should always use adjusted patterns as they actually show the changes you have applied in the scaler

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post #1277 of 1305 Old 09-01-2014, 02:18 PM
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Thanks, that worked!





Inside points are slightly off in the advanced color chart. I'll try the calibration at 75% later in the week.





Grayscale looks good, too!


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post #1278 of 1305 Old 09-05-2014, 04:26 PM
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Need some help!!! Ok so I recently got this lumagen mini and for some reason the only video output I can get is thru my xmbc player. My blu ray player nor western digital player will output ANY video. I can get sound to pass thru with no issues. Anyone have any suggestions Please? I know it is not the cable because when I run the same cable directly to the players I get video just fine..
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post #1279 of 1305 Old 09-05-2014, 04:34 PM
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ok well I was able to get video from my western digital player if I by-passed my receiver...there must be a setting I am missing in my pre amp.....hmmm
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post #1280 of 1305 Old 09-10-2014, 04:04 PM
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Are there any plans for a Mini3 with 17x17x17 LUT? Don't need all those inputs on 21XX boxes.
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post #1281 of 1305 Old 09-10-2014, 04:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gordon Fraser View Post
The reference patterns do not show any adjustments that have been set in the scaler. If you are using the scaler to do calibrations then you should always use adjusted patterns as they actually show the changes you have applied in the scaler
For black and white level adjustments as well? I was using the reference PLUGE patterns for this.
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post #1282 of 1305 Old 09-10-2014, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post
Are there any plans for a Mini3 with 17x17x17 LUT? Don't need all those inputs on 21XX boxes.
The mini doesn't have the processing power for 17x17x17 (4913 points). It's limited to 5x5x5 (125 points).

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post #1283 of 1305 Old 09-10-2014, 05:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kal View Post
The mini doesn't have the processing power for 17x17x17 (4913 points). It's limited to 5x5x5 (125 points).
I believe he was asking about a new product, not a firmware update.
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post #1284 of 1305 Old 09-10-2014, 05:24 PM
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post #1285 of 1305 Old 09-10-2014, 05:28 PM
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Is 17x Cube size a waste on a 55" display, like some say about having 4K at this size?
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post #1286 of 1305 Old 09-10-2014, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottJ View Post
I believe he was asking about a new product, not a firmware update.
Yes, I like the small form factor of the Mini.
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post #1287 of 1305 Old 09-10-2014, 05:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post
Is 17x Cube size a waste on a 55" display, like some say about having 4K at this size?
While it depends on the TV, screen size is not a factor. What matters is how well the display tracks colors throughout the gamut.

In any case, a 5x cube will take care of most major issues. The jump from a 5x cube to 17x cube is going to be marginal.
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post #1288 of 1305 Old 09-11-2014, 01:07 AM
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So if my 125-point LUT is hitting all the gamut targets (i.e., 25%, 50%, 75%, 100%), I really don't need 17x?
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post #1289 of 1305 Old 09-11-2014, 05:33 AM
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^^^^^^
It all depends on the linearity of your display between the calibration points. Some displays will gain very little by going from 5x5x5 to either 9x9x9 or 17x17x17, but others will benefit. I believe Tom Huffman did some testing that gave a reasonable gain in performance going upto the 9x9x9, but the gains were really small going from there upto 17x17x17.

I would be interested in a Mini3D form factor containing the larger FPGA, that would allow for larger LUT calibrations...................................... ...........

regards, Mike
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post #1290 of 1305 Old 09-11-2014, 11:43 AM
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Seems my set is not so linear, the inside color points really benefit from 5x5x5 here...

Edit: actually spent about 40 minutes calibrating the grayscale manually in the Lumagen before realizing calibration reset was still active in Auto-Cal, LOL. Had to do it all over again after the LUT calibration was finished. Didn't really mind as my calibrating skills are improving.
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Last edited by Pres2play; 09-11-2014 at 02:28 PM.
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