Motion enhancement - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 12 Old 11-23-2011, 12:12 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
noos@xp37's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 82
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hello,

what video processors do the sometimes hated and sometimes loved calculation of extra pictures to smoothen the motion (temporal interpolation and diagonal interpolation?). I know how it looks as I have seen the Cinemateq Motion Optimizer for SD. I like that look! Others hate it, I know. So what devices except the TVone blend machines can do this with HD? And do these Tvones an the others really process 1080p24 with extra pictures? Will they also do it wit 720p or other resolutions. And calculate these devices a corresponding number of pictures to fill up the hz rate? Like when doing 720p94, would they do 72 extra pictures? Or 1080i72, 48 extra pictures from 1080p24 material?
The Cinemateq motion optimizer is limited to 576i/480i....

Thanks
noos@xp37 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 12 Old 11-23-2011, 02:22 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Fudoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 1,345
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked: 21
How would a processor transmit the data (e.g. 1080p72 or 1080p96) to the display or beamer when the HDMI connection and the target display do not support such data rates and refresh rates ?
Fudoh is offline  
post #3 of 12 Old 11-24-2011, 01:35 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
noos@xp37's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 82
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hello,

I am asking for example 1080i72 (single link bandwidth limit...), not progressiv and not HDMI . It can be done via RGBHV or DVI, as HDCP is gone in my setup befor it hits any videoprocessors. I am using CRT projectors, they can....

Best regards form Munich
noos@xp37 is offline  
post #4 of 12 Old 11-24-2011, 02:20 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Fudoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 1,345
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked: 21
Ok, agreed that there's a niche inside the niche for motion enhancement on CRTs, but I guess you would agree that this market is much too little to warrant any profit for any manufacturer investing into it, right ?

Nevertheless I'm sure that the HDMI limitations are the original reason why we didn't see any more external interframe creation attempts on outside processors. If HDMI was universally supporting 1080p72 or 1080p96, most BD players would have this feature by now.
Fudoh is offline  
post #5 of 12 Old 11-24-2011, 05:20 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
noos@xp37's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 82
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hello,

yes 1080p60 is big limitation. But I have enjoyed DVD film based material motion enhanced to 576p with 50 pictures by the Cinemateq Motion Optimizer. I love it! So would a 1080p24 conversion to 1080p60 with 60 real pictures be a big step to. I am sure/guess the TVone 2XXX devices do this when HDCP is not present, but I would like to know: If you drive higher refresh rate than 60, do you get more pictures calculated at the TVONEs? From PC I know lots of TFT screens that take 120hz siganls, so it would be nice to feed them with 120 pictures per sec..
And you are right, external processors are a small market anyway, and than motion....
But I would like to know how recent decives compare to that former high end stand alone device Motion Optimizer by Cinemateq.

Regards
noos@xp37 is offline  
post #6 of 12 Old 11-24-2011, 10:18 AM
Advanced Member
 
wildchild22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Deer Lake , Newfoundland
Posts: 599
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Send a pm to Nashou66 on curts forum with a link to this post he will know the answer as he uses tvones and sells them
wildchild22 is offline  
post #7 of 12 Old 11-24-2011, 05:33 PM
Advanced Member
 
nidi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 567
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by noos@xp37 View Post

Hello,

what video processors do the sometimes hated and sometimes loved calculation of extra pictures to smoothen the motion (temporal interpolation and diagonal interpolation?). I know how it looks as I have seen the Cinemateq Motion Optimizer for SD. I like that look! Others hate it, I know. So what devices except the TVone blend machines can do this with HD? And do these Tvones an the others really process 1080p24 with extra pictures? Will they also do it wit 720p or other resolutions. And calculate these devices a corresponding number of pictures to fill up the hz rate? Like when doing 720p94, would they do 72 extra pictures? Or 1080i72, 48 extra pictures from 1080p24 material?
The Cinemateq motion optimizer is limited to 576i/480i....

Thanks


TV One's can do motion interpoation ? that's new to me?

what models?

Thanks

Michael
nidi is offline  
post #8 of 12 Old 11-26-2011, 01:00 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
noos@xp37's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 82
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by nidi View Post

TV One's can do motion interpoation ? that's new to me?

what models?

Thanks

Michael


Hello Michael,

I got it from that thread and the specs sheets a TVone:

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewt...asc&highlight=



http://www.tvone.com/search.php?sear...lation&x=0&y=0




Regards

Marc
noos@xp37 is offline  
post #9 of 12 Old 11-26-2011, 06:55 AM
AVS Special Member
 
nashou66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: West Seneca, NY
Posts: 4,359
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 51 Post(s)
Liked: 86
Wqell what TV-One units have is Temporal Interpolation and Diagonal interpolation as well as frame rate. the frame rate I do not think can be toggled on or off it is always on I believe( I have to find out more on this) because there is no menu adjustment for it.

The Diagonal interpolation is great!! almost totally eliminates the diagonal jaggies.

I can not say how well it does with motion resolution enhancement since I use CRT projectors which already are the best at motion resolution. I have not tried the units on any digital display.

Also it has been overclocked to well over 208MHz pixel clock !! That is they tested it to 1080p@85hz on one of their High res displays. And if you have an HDCP striper you can send those higher resolution to the CRT PJ via RGBHV to get the super high bandwidth.
But it does send it via digital with dual link DVI capabilities.

I run each of my two CRT's in a blend config at 1054x800p@96hz.

Looks great!!

Athanasios
nashou66 is offline  
post #10 of 12 Old 11-26-2011, 10:45 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
noos@xp37's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 82
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Thanks!

I am on CRT dope too, but extra pictures to the standard 24 are good on CRTs too. With the Motion Optimizer SD material that is im motion looks super sharp and even mooooore 3d, because fast moving objects in the front will stay focused/sharp and give the screen depth! But I have no idea what the Motion Oprimizer from Cinemateq does to create more pictures, and if it is the same as the TVones do? But the more I look into to TVones, the more I start to like them!
noos@xp37 is offline  
post #11 of 12 Old 11-26-2011, 11:22 AM
AVS Special Member
 
nashou66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: West Seneca, NY
Posts: 4,359
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 51 Post(s)
Liked: 86
The only bad thing about the tv-ones is they are not geared towards home theater and are very industrial/commercial oriented. that is they have no onscreen menus and some have no LCD screen at all so it has to be adjusted via PC program. But the scaling is really really really good. And the high bandwidth capabilities of the C2xxA series is amazing for CRT displays . they do have trouble scaling from say 1080p@60 to 1080p@72 it is a bit choppy.

But if you stay in the same frame rate multiple it does a great job and from film to video
3/2 pull down is awesome as well. but not in reverse. its interlacing is pretty good too for those who for some reason need to go from progressive to interlaced, it does this better than the lumagens.

Athanasios
nashou66 is offline  
post #12 of 12 Old 11-26-2011, 11:37 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
noos@xp37's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 82
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Important point, no joke!

"for those who for some reason need to go from progressive to interlaced"

...scan convertrs are hard to find and insane expensive. Good to have this option!
noos@xp37 is offline  
Reply Video Processors

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off