Darbee vision darblet - Page 292 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #8731 of 8749 Old 06-29-2015, 02:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post
Sorry. That is just wrong. The Darbee will accept any resolution 108p 60 and below. It actually works best if applied to a lower resolution and I feed it native 480i, 720p, 1080i, 1080p 24, 30 and go. It is not a scalar and will not upscale anything. It won't pass higher resolutions. However after application to you accepted resolution, you can use a down stream scalar such as a 4K out Lumagen or the one in your 4K projector or panel. No problem and it improves things, the more the lower the native signal is.
So the only thing I said that was "wrong" was the omission of "up to 1080" which I thought was pretty obvious.

I guess I never asked if he was sending his SNES through the Darbee, but we all know he's inputting/outputting 1080.
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post #8732 of 8749 Old 06-29-2015, 08:57 PM
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No big deal. It is important to note that all the darbee does to a signal is to bring up detail otherwise hidden because of a lack of definition between small contrast transitions. Very valuable what it does and nice that it doesn't change anything else. What ever resolution, number of bits, yada yada, tht goes in, comes out.

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post #8733 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 06:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post
No big deal. It is important to note that all the darbee does to a signal is to bring up detail otherwise hidden because of a lack of definition between small contrast transitions. Very valuable what it does and nice that it doesn't change anything else. What ever resolution, number of bits, yada yada, tht goes in, comes out.
Its all good.

I was certain I was going to return my Darbee. Lots of snake-oil in the entire 'adder device' market. At first I wasn't seeing much benefit but then I left it on and forgot about it. Now I think it looks pretty bad without it.
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post #8734 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 07:12 AM
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Here's a general question to all:

Now that you've owned the Darbee for quite a while, how much do you use it? As much as you figured you would? More? Less?

(I had the original Darblet but it caused havoc with my system. When I purchased the Lumagen VP with darbee processing, I happily got rid of the Darblet).


Me, I rarely use the Darbee processing. The reason is mostly because I found the Darbee to impose a distinct signature look upon the image, which makes me aware the image has been altered and processed. Thus the more I turn it up to make an appreciable difference in clarity/dimensionality, the more processed the image looks, the more I turn it down the less processed it looks, but the less effect, and worth, the Darbee seems to have. If I put it on it tends to be at around 15 or so. But, again, I rarely use it these days.

I'm curious if others have similar or very different experience.
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post #8735 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 07:21 AM
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I leave mine on all the time at 43% and don't notice that things look too processed or that they look unprocessed, it's the sweet spot for my current setup (I was debating between 45 and 40 when I set it up initially and slowly took a look at single digits to get a feel for the right spot - not unprocessed but not overly processed). I also like the clarity effect that it gives.

But I think that's why YMMV even exists as an acronym.

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Currently watching on: BenQ W1070, 82" 1.0 Gain Screen, Darbee Darblet HD 43%, PS3, PS4, with Yamaha Aventage RX-A1030, SVS PB-2000, a Def Tech CS-8040HD, 2 SM65 for L/R, and 2 SM55 for surrounds.
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post #8736 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 07:43 AM
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Any body using the Darbee Darblet 5000 with Sony VPL-HW40ES projector? How is the difference with and without it? What is the number being set up?
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post #8737 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 08:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fredxr2d2 View Post
I leave mine on all the time at 43% and don't notice that things look too processed or that they look unprocessed, it's the sweet spot for my current setup (I was debating between 45 and 40 when I set it up initially and slowly took a look at single digits to get a feel for the right spot - not unprocessed but not overly processed). I also like the clarity effect that it gives.

But I think that's why YMMV even exists as an acronym.
43% !!! Holy cow! Yup, YMMV certainly applies to these devices.

BTW, do you use it with a flat panel or projector? I use a projector and perhaps that makes the effect more visible.
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post #8738 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by R Harkness View Post
43% !!! Holy cow! Yup, YMMV certainly applies to these devices.

BTW, do you use it with a flat panel or projector? I use a projector and perhaps that makes the effect more visible.
I use it with my W1070 1080P DLP projector on an 82" screen. I was watching HP4 at 45% and was thinking to myself that it just looked too processed, so I switched it to 40% and I left it like that for a few minutes, but really felt like it didn't look good. I switched it to Game mode and switched it back almost immediately. I then inched up from 40 to 41 to 42 to 43 to 44, decided that 44 was a little too much and dropped one notch to 43. I've left it there and had no complaints. I think things look noticeably sharp, but not over processed.

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Currently watching on: BenQ W1070, 82" 1.0 Gain Screen, Darbee Darblet HD 43%, PS3, PS4, with Yamaha Aventage RX-A1030, SVS PB-2000, a Def Tech CS-8040HD, 2 SM65 for L/R, and 2 SM55 for surrounds.
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post #8739 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 08:25 AM
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I leave it on all the time on my Sony vw95es projector with 106 inch screen. Forget what strength, semi-low maybe 25. I never change it or turn it off.
One time it turned off, maybe after a power failure. The picture didn't look as good, and that's when I discovered it wasn't on, and turned it back on. That proved to me that it's worth leaving on. I think some of the recent projectors have some settings that may resemble Darblet processing, in which case I might try that instead.
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post #8740 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Harkness View Post
Me, I rarely use the Darbee processing. The reason is mostly because I found the Darbee to impose a distinct signature look upon the image, which makes me aware the image has been altered and processed. Thus the more I turn it up to make an appreciable difference in clarity/dimensionality, the more processed the image looks, the more I turn it down the less processed it looks, but the less effect, and worth, the Darbee seems to have. If I put it on it tends to be at around 15 or so. But, again, I rarely use it these days.
There is a very simple fix for this, which is to leave the unit on for a few weeks until you finally stop obsessively scrutinizing every pixel in the image, and flipping the processing on and off and on and off and on and off and on and off trying to detect what it does. Eventually, you'll get over that and just watch what you want to watch, until you forget that the Darbee is even on at all, except that it makes everything look a little bit better.

15% is very low, almost at the verge of not being discernible at all. If your tolerance for any incremental change to what you expect is a "pure" picture is that small, you should probably not be using Darbee.

Every display interacts with the processing differently, but 30% to 40% is typically a safe zone. If you set it for 30% and are aghast that your picture is no longer pure... well, again, leave it like that for a few weeks and see if you still feel that way. Odds are, you probably won't.
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post #8741 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 04:27 PM
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I had not used my Darbee Deblet 5000 for months, with power switch complete off. I tried to power it up this afternoon. A green light flashed once inside the case and death. There is no reset button. I had pushed all the buttons, but no reaction. It is death. Sent a email to Darbee Vision and awaiting their advice. What a bad day.
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post #8742 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 05:14 PM
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Ive had one for years set at Gaming 53 which I guess is kind of high compared to others but it gives me a great picture on my Samsung 8500 LED.Wonder what it will be like when I use it on a 65 OLEd which is a future purchase?

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post #8743 of 8749 Old Yesterday, 09:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post
There is a very simple fix for this, which is to leave the unit on for a few weeks until you finally stop obsessively scrutinizing every pixel in the image, and flipping the processing on and off and on and off and on and off and on and off trying to detect what it does. Eventually, you'll get over that and just watch what you want to watch, until you forget that the Darbee is even on at all, except that it makes everything look a little bit better.

15% is very low, almost at the verge of not being discernible at all. If your tolerance for any incremental change to what you expect is a "pure" picture is that small, you should probably not be using Darbee.

Every display interacts with the processing differently, but 30% to 40% is typically a safe zone. If you set it for 30% and are aghast that your picture is no longer pure... well, again, leave it like that for a few weeks and see if you still feel that way. Odds are, you probably won't.
Thanks for simplifying things for me Josh.

I've had the darbee processing for a long time, and have had a long time to use it, and I've tried living with it on at various settings for quite a while. But this is where I've ended up.

I remember back further in this thread (or another forum) there have been a range of reactions to owning the Darbee processing. Some like me, I remember, had become more conservative after an initial "wow" period.

Though with new, eye-candy SFX movies I sometimes pump up the Darbee some more. But for many older movies the Darbee effect I find feels less film-like. It's been a while so I was seeing how others stand. I'm not actually against processing per se. I actually use a similar contrast enhancing process on my JVC projector, called "Clear Black."

I actually like that processing better than the Darbee, as I find it more unobtrusive
while making a significant difference in clarity and dimensionality. (Not that everyone would agree). Though occasionally I like the Darbee over the JVC processing. I was simply seeing who else has come to a similar place with the Darbee.

(BTW, I'd say your estimate of 30% to 40% being a typical "safe zone" is a bit high. As I remember when I used to monitor the Darbee threads, not a few people ended up finding more like 20 to 30 in terms of adding some clarity with, to them, acceptable artifacts. At 30 to 40 I'm amazed if you don't notice how exaggerated bright areas become, especially light reflections on the faces of actors. The scene in Avatar where the Colonel finishes with the weights and sits up to talk to Jake has strong down-light accents on his face, nose, forehead, and they become seriously exaggerated and artificial looking at those "safe" numbers you mention. IMO. This is what bugs me on lots of material when I try to live with the darbee processing much higher than 15 or 20).

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post #8744 of 8749 Old Today, 06:29 AM
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I have my Darbee at 45% on my 136" 2.35:1 screen with a JVC RS46 projector and love it. Anything less I can't see what it's doing. For me it gives the image a bit more 'pop' and makes it seem as if it is adding clarity that isn't there without it. I've had it on this setting for all movies, TV shows and games and completely left it alone for the last 6 months. I shut it off the other day and everything looked dull.
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post #8745 of 8749 Old Today, 08:10 AM
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For non-projector owners: The Darblet goes up to 120%. Have had our Samsung PN60F8500 plasma and Darblet 5000 for two years. My wife and I are very satisfied with a Darblet setting that is way beyond where the projector folks fear to tread.
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post #8746 of 8749 Old Today, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Harkness View Post

(BTW, I'd say your estimate of 30% to 40% being a typical "safe zone" is a bit high. As I remember when I used to monitor the Darbee threads, not a few people ended up finding more like 20 to 30 in terms of adding some clarity with, to them, acceptable artifacts. At 30 to 40 I'm amazed if you don't notice how exaggerated bright areas become, especially light reflections on the faces of actors. The scene in Avatar where the Colonel finishes with the weights and sits up to talk to Jake has strong down-light accents on his face, nose, forehead, and they become seriously exaggerated and artificial looking at those "safe" numbers you mention. IMO. This is what bugs me on lots of material when I try to live with the darbee processing much higher than 15 or 20).
Is it possible that you are running the JVC "Clear Black" setting and Darbee setting together? If so then that would account for your misconception that 30-40% is a bit high. I run the Darbee at HD 40% with all processing on my projector turned off. Looks great on all Blu-rays and streaming videos.

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post #8747 of 8749 Old Today, 08:29 AM
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Is it possible that you are running the JVC "Clear Black" setting and Darbee setting together? If so then that would account for your misconception that 30-40% is a bit high. I run the Darbee at HD 40% with all processing on my projector turned off. Looks great on all Blu-rays and streaming videos.
No, I'm definitely not making that error. As for "misconception" I'm speaking mostly about taste.
HD at 40% may look great to you, there's no disputing taste, but it generally would be intrusive and obvious to me on lots of material. Again, I'm not making any argument that people "should" see it as I do.
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post #8748 of 8749 Old Today, 12:48 PM
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It all depends on how critical a viewer are. And what you self label yourself at is not usually an objective rating of your viewer criticality. clearly you should set it at whatever you think is best. One can increase the saturation of colors beyond what they would be to measure correctly if that;s what you like. Its like picking the ideal mate.


People who are video professionals and whose job it is to improve the video displayed, usually use about 20% Darbee before they see artifacting who prevents their evaluation of what they are evaluation. For just general viewing, most of these people use around 30. I use 35 and leave it on for everything on my 1100ES. But I don't see certain artifacting that others might see, both caused by the darbee and other things. there is no safe. No one can tell you what's right and what's wrong. Its what you like.

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post #8749 of 8749 Old Today, 01:33 PM
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Precisely why I've said it's a matter of taste, and that I was curious where people's taste ended up with the Darbee.
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