Has anyone seen the Lumagen Vision or Vision Pro? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 230 Old 02-03-2003, 01:41 PM - Thread Starter
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I read about this on another post and it looks interesting.

Has anybody seen these in action?

http://www.lumagen.com/products.htm


Ken
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post #2 of 230 Old 02-03-2003, 03:43 PM
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Thats the same scaler *** OEMs.
T A W
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post #3 of 230 Old 02-04-2003, 02:02 AM
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Tom

How do you know *** makes this? Do you know who else
they make them for?
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post #4 of 230 Old 02-04-2003, 10:10 PM
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Hi, the Lumagen Vision & VisionPro are new and are not OEM'd from any other companies. We have our own customized chip in it for scaling & processing. I should know since I've been there from its conception. Its an excellent (ok, slightly biased opinion) processor for the price allowing you to tweak all kinds of settings...see the website for the specs. Or if you're in Portland drop by for a demo!

see ya

Patrick Harkin, Lumagen Inc. engineer
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post #5 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 08:13 AM
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Patrick, what chipset does this unit use? Any literature on your chip?

Huey ;-]
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post #6 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 08:51 AM
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What input resolutions can be accepted on the component inputs for Deinterlacing/scaling? Interlace only, or will it accept a progressive input as well? Will it swtich between the two seamlessly?

"Experience is the one thing you can't get for nothing." - Oscar Wilde
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post #7 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 09:40 AM
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http://www.lumagen.com/images/visionrear.jpg
looks a lot like the lower prices processors (<$600 market)

Huey ;-]
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post #8 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 11:22 AM
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Looks like it, but it appears to be more configurable. Kinda looks like powerstrip in a box, and appears to even do 48Hz, and allows for a 2.35:1 aspect ratio (kind of neat, if you ask me). Take your 16:9 pj, drop and ISCO II infront of it, couple it with this scaler and get 2.35:1...

My curiosity is piqued.

-Jon

-Y
"First things first, but not necessarily in that order." - Dr. Who
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post #9 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 11:41 AM
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Tom,

Very wrong, it has no relation to anything !!! does.

Cheers,
Ofer LaOr

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post #10 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 11:56 AM
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Hi,

Sean, the Vision & VisionPro accept NTSC or PAL interlaced formats for processing. The passthru input can be used for 480p or whatever you like and the syncs can be processed (some projectors need different polarity syncs) or just passed through.

Huey, our scaling & processing chip was internally developed so there is no available documentation. Deinterlacing is done using a Silicon Image 504. The rear panel is not too expensive as far as the connectors go---all the money is spent on the guts. I don't think you'll find a processor with as much quality and configurability for <1500. If you're looking for a lot more outputs and professional grade BNC connectors as well as RS232 control you should see the VisionPro.

yub, yes, refresh rates are configurable from 48-75 Khz. Output aspect ratios can be anything from 1.33 - 2.35 : 1.

later...

Patrick Harkin, Lumagen Inc. engineer
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post #11 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 12:00 PM
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patrick harkin,

Here's a suggestion. Get in touch with sspears, and offer a unit for review. sspears and crew know how to put things through their paces (although the Sil 504 is well known to him I'd imagine).

Still, a review from sspears is a good way to introduce the product to the AV community, or at least AVSForum.

-Jon

-Y
"First things first, but not necessarily in that order." - Dr. Who
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post #12 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 06:35 PM
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I second yub yub recommendation. If you are that confident in your product, sspears should review it in the progressive shootout. He's done wonders for the Zinwell Briteview/Imagemax AVT-3700. Since your company is new and not very well known, you need professional, unbiased reviews to help sell your product.

Deinterlacing via Silicon Image 504 is impressive as this is an excellent deinterlacing chip. If your scaling is decent, this is an attractive scaler indeed.

Huey ;-]
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post #13 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 07:03 PM - Thread Starter
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So far the Vision Pro sounds good. I'd love to see a review of it.

Patrick,

Are you going to submit one for review?


ken
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post #14 of 230 Old 02-05-2003, 09:55 PM
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Hi, we're checking into it---there is currently a magazine doing a review of our products and we don't want to upset them with a preemptive review without checking with them. So hopefully we can get a unit to sspears soon. I'll let you know how soon when I find out.

thanks for the suggestion!

Patrick Harkin, Lumagen Inc. engineer
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post #15 of 230 Old 02-06-2003, 12:23 AM
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Wish list:

SDI input
Adjustments to get rid of red push that many displays have.
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post #16 of 230 Old 02-06-2003, 09:11 AM
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Craig, thanks for the suggestions--we're planning on adding both of those features in a future product.

Patrick Harkin, Lumagen Inc. engineer
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post #17 of 230 Old 02-06-2003, 10:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Patrick,

Will there be any upgrade path for Vision Pro owners to this new product that you are referring to?

Ken
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post #18 of 230 Old 02-06-2003, 05:08 PM
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Hi, upgrading is not in the current plans but if enough VisionPro users wanted it we would seriously consider a factory installed upgrade path.

later...

Patrick Harkin, Lumagen Inc. engineer
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post #19 of 230 Old 02-06-2003, 05:49 PM
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Patrick,

any chance to post the manual online?

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post #20 of 230 Old 02-07-2003, 12:26 AM
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I agree it would be nice to see the manual.
How long do you guesstimate for the future
product? Sounds like what I've been looking for.
Was looking at CS 2 but sounds like I will hold
off and see about current and future Lumagen products.
If upgrade possible maybe interested in current Vision Pro.
Any idea when review will be available?
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post #21 of 230 Old 02-07-2003, 06:08 PM
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We'll be posting the Vision & VisionPro manuals on our site next week.


Patrick

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post #22 of 230 Old 02-12-2003, 07:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Patrick,

Any progress toward accepting credit cards or posting the manuals?

Ken
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post #23 of 230 Old 02-12-2003, 04:44 PM
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I checked out your website and I have a question regarding the "two zoom levels". Can you explain your zoom levels in detail?

HDTV is years away and I really want a feature that will take a Satellite TV 4X3 signal (since that is all that is really available on all channels today) and scale it to 1080i. It seems that almost all rear-projection HDTV sets do not allow any aspect ratio control for their 1080i input, what goes in...... gets displayed. Therefore, there needs to be a product that can "expand" the signal ....before.... it sends it to the display. "Expand" in this case, means to adjust the horizontal to fill the 16X9 frame and adjust the vertical by the same percentage of expansion to keep the picture from becoming distorted or stretched, to fill the 16X9 vertically. This "expand" feature results in some loss of picture at the top and bottom because part of the image is above and below the display area on a 16X9 display. But, it is still the best solution to fill a 16X9 display area with 4X3 input. Is this feature what you mean by "zoom"? This feature is a very important one for anybody who wants to fill their 16X9 display at 1080i with either 4X3 Broadcast/Satellite TV, 4X3 Laserdisc, or 4X3 VHS...all of which will be around for many years to come.
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post #24 of 230 Old 02-12-2003, 05:51 PM
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uliving,
First, the aspect ratio controls for your setup would be 4:3 on the input and 1.78 on the output. This would place the 4:3 image undistorted on your 1080i display with black bars on either side. The zoom feature steps by 15% for most aspect ratio combinations. So you could zoom once resulting in a little cropping with smaller sidebars or zoom twice and fill the screen horizontally and crop a bit more on the top/bottom. Another example would be watching a 2:35 movie (bars on top/bottom) on a 16:9 display. Zoom once to minimize the t/b bars a bit and crop some on the sides. A second zoom would fill the screen with further cropping on the sides. For the case of 1.85 on a 16:9 the first zoom fills the screen cropping r/l slightly instead of a full 15%. Hope that helps---I use the Vision with a 1080i/480p Sony rear projector myself. I've actually found I can squeak 510p out of it!

Patrick

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post #25 of 230 Old 02-12-2003, 07:29 PM
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Patrick,

this sounds great. and the whole process is with 1080i output, right?
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post #26 of 230 Old 02-12-2003, 07:35 PM
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Patrick,

what I mean by that last question really is....under the scenario you described, would the output from lumagen be able to be input to my rear projection tv though it's 1080i component input?
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post #27 of 230 Old 02-12-2003, 09:37 PM
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uliving, thats right. All the configuration controls work for 1080i as well as 480-1080p in scanline increments with component outputs.

Patrick Harkin, Lumagen Inc. engineer
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post #28 of 230 Old 02-12-2003, 11:16 PM
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Patrick,

Zoom sounds really cool, but it would be fantastic to have much more control over this feature (more delicate control, zoom position adjustment or a slightly more complex cropping control). Is this something you have planned?

I would love to see reviews of the unit.

Have you been able to get feedback from plasma users yet?

Cheers,
Ofer LaOr

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post #29 of 230 Old 02-13-2003, 09:03 AM
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Ofer, it would be an easy sw mod to step the zoom in smaller increments. So we may just roll in smaller zoom steps into the code. Cropping works with zoom and can be a per input aspect ratio setting. So if you zooomed in on a 4:3 you could adjust the cropping to see more of the bottom (and less of the top). So we have a pretty precise zoom position.
Oh, by the way thanks for the suggestion on having a programmable bootup message.

Patrick Harkin, Lumagen Inc. engineer
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post #30 of 230 Old 02-13-2003, 03:50 PM
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Just a follow up. We've added a special user code ("0923" if you happen to be using one) that toggles between the default zoom of 15% and a 5% zoom. Along with the cropping position command already present that should allow for pretty precise control.
Haven't heard from any Vision plasma users yet.

thanks for your input!

Patrick Harkin, Lumagen Inc. engineer
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