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-   -   HDfury AVR-Key Help (http://www.avsforum.com/forum/37-video-processors/2896225-hdfury-avr-key-help.html)

juan81 07-13-2017 07:36 PM

HDfury AVR-Key Help
 
I currently own a Denon AVR-X3200W receiver, Xbox One S, and LG 65C7P tv. Currently I cannot receive HDR signal because the receiver will not pass through but the audio is great. Do you offer some type of splitter of sort to allow me to get 4k with hdr video to my LG C7 tv and Dolby Atmos / DTS X Audio to my receiver? I believe the AVR-Key might work but not 100% sure. Thanks in advance

HDfury 07-14-2017 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by juan81 (Post 54264657)
I currently own a Denon AVR-X3200W receiver, Xbox One S, and LG 65C7P tv. Currently I cannot receive HDR signal because the receiver will not pass through but the audio is great. Do you offer some type of splitter of sort to allow me to get 4k with hdr video to my LG C7 tv and Dolby Atmos / DTS X Audio to my receiver? I believe the AVR-Key might work but not 100% sure. Thanks in advance

yes AVRkey will work 100% on its own, just like Vertex

AVRkey is 1st OCT, Vertex 1st NOV.

Otherwise, if you want solution right now, you need INTEGRAL + LINKER.

bobof 07-14-2017 03:57 PM

Does the AVRKey audio HDMI output carry downscaled video or a blank screen?

HDfury 07-14-2017 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobof (Post 54285217)
Does the AVRKey audio HDMI output carry downscaled video or a blank screen?

HDCP1.4 720p or 1080p selectable blank stream (black video) with FULL HDMI AUDIO.

johnson636 07-27-2017 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HDfury (Post 54288897)
HDCP1.4 720p or 1080p selectable blank stream (black video) with FULL HDMI AUDIO.

Will the AVR Key allow none atmos capable AVR Receivers to properly play atmos audio?

HDfury 07-27-2017 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnson636 (Post 54538090)
Will the AVR Key allow none atmos capable AVR Receivers to properly play atmos audio?

If AVR supports ATMOS but cannot decode it because it doesn't support the video signal or hdcp2.2, then yes, it will allow it.
If AVR does not support ATMOS, then no need to try to send any ATMOS to it.

Rolls-Royce 07-28-2017 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnson636 (Post 54538090)
Will the AVR Key allow none atmos capable AVR Receivers to properly play atmos audio?

No. It demuxes (separates) the audio from the datastream, repackages it into HDMI 1.3 or 1.4 format so it can be read and played back by a capable AVR, and combines it with 720p/1080p/no video to be sent to the AVR. ATMOS playback by a non-ATMOS receiver would require a separate decoder box or preamp that can extract the object-based audio and route it to the correct channels. When Dolby Surround first came out, several manufacturers introduced boxes for use with two-channel receivers that would create the center and surround channels and had small amps built in to power them. I still have one of the units Radio Shack sold, in storage.

johnson636 07-28-2017 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rolls-Royce (Post 54544338)
No. It demuxes (separates) the audio from the datastream, repackages it into HDMI 1.3 or 1.4 format so it can be read and played back by a capable AVR, and combines it with 720p/1080p/no video to be sent to the AVR. ATMOS playback by a non-ATMOS receiver would require a separate decoder box or preamp that can extract the object-based audio and route it to the correct channels. When Dolby Surround first came out, several manufacturers introduced boxes for use with two-channel receivers that would create the center and surround channels and had small amps built in to power them. I still have one of the units Radio Shack sold, in storage.

My bubble has been burst:( Was thinking of purchasing a SR7007 or SR7008 with the hopes of the AVR key would allow me to play and direct the atmos tracks to my atmos speakers:(

Rolls-Royce 07-28-2017 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnson636 (Post 54544990)
My bubble has been burst:( Was thinking of purchasing a SR7007 or SR7008 with the hopes of the AVR key would allow me to play and direct the atmos tracks to my atmos speakers:(

Sorry. I didn't want to see you spend money on something that wouldn't do what you wanted.

D_B_0673 08-15-2017 08:52 AM

does the Vertex have all the AVR-key functionality built in?
dan

HDfury 08-15-2017 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D_B_0673 (Post 54636976)
does the Vertex have all the AVR-key functionality built in?
dan


It's completely different way of doing it.

AVRkey is really intended to bring HDMI AUDIO to any AVR and it will do it for ANY VIDEO SIGNAL in existence today from any HDMI sources for any AUDIO signal in existence today.
HOWEVER, what you have is 600MHz (UHD/HDR/2.2) passthru WITH HDMI AUDIO extracted and forwarded at 720p or 1080p blanked signal (no video ! only audio)

> this method is perfect for HDMI audio and will work for the purpose in any situation, the only limitation here is that you get HDMI AUDIO to your AVR, and not the video from the original signal.

Vertex will also work bringing HDMI AUDIO to older receivers from modern sources but it will also bring the HDMI VIDEO, for this instead of extracting HDMI Audio from a passthru and inject it on a self created blank stream. It will scale down the signal and perform operation on the fly so the original signal go through to your display untouched and the second signal get downscaled so you have FULL HDMI AUDIO AND HDMI VIDEO at your AVR (using the best video capabilites that your AVR support)

D_B_0673 08-15-2017 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HDfury (Post 54638296)
It's completely different way of doing it.

AVRkey is really intended to bring HDMI AUDIO to any AVR and it will do it for ANY VIDEO SIGNAL in existence today from any HDMI sources for any AUDIO signal in existence today.
HOWEVER, what you have is 600MHz (UHD/HDR/2.2) passthru WITH HDMI AUDIO extracted and forwarded at 720p or 1080p blanked signal (no video ! only audio)

> this method is perfect for HDMI audio and will work for the purpose in any situation, the only limitation here is that you get HDMI AUDIO to your AVR, and not the video from the original signal.

Vertex will also work bringing HDMI AUDIO to older receivers from modern sources but it will also bring the HDMI VIDEO, for this instead of extracting HDMI Audio from a passthru and inject it on a self created blank stream. It will scale down the signal and perform operation on the fly so the original signal go through to your display untouched and the second signal get downscaled so you have FULL HDMI AUDIO AND HDMI VIDEO at your AVR (using the best video capabilites that your AVR support)

thanks, once I get the vertex, I am still going to need help. Your explanations are fine,my grasp of the technology is lacking.
I had received a email from you stating that you were going to keep a count down counter on the number of Vertex still available for preorder (count down every 1000). Where is that located on the Vertex website or will I receive an email update?
thanks again
dan

HDfury 08-16-2017 03:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D_B_0673 (Post 54638598)
thanks, once I get the vertex, I am still going to need help. Your explanations are fine,my grasp of the technology is lacking.
I had received a email from you stating that you were going to keep a count down counter on the number of Vertex still available for preorder (count down every 1000). Where is that located on the Vertex website or will I receive an email update?
thanks again
dan

Remaining units will be mentioned on the Vertex product page and yes, you will get email before it ships and/or before it's out of stock.

D_B_0673 08-16-2017 04:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HDfury (Post 54641718)
Remaining units will be mentioned on the Vertex product page and yes, you will get email before it ships and/or before it's out of stock.

thanks

hexcode99 08-17-2017 02:56 PM

Does the AVR-Key have an optical Optical Out downmix of the audio signal? If not, I know the Vertex/Integral does. How does the Optical Out downmix work if you are outputting 48khz/96khz 5.1/7.1 LPCM or 5.1/7.1 DTSHD/DolbyHD bitstream?

HDfury 08-17-2017 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hexcode99 (Post 54650694)
Does the AVR-Key have an optical Optical Out downmix of the audio signal? If not, I know the Vertex/Integral does. How does the Optical Out downmix work if you are outputting 48khz/96khz 5.1/7.1 LPCM or 5.1/7.1 DTSHD/DolbyHD bitstream?

No optical out on AVR key, only HDMI audio.

We do not decode and manipulate sound, we are just forwarding any audio signal as it is and eventually changing HDCP and signal type (res, chroma, etc..) so it matches an AVR technically not able to receive the original video signal but perfectly capable of receiving the original sound signal.
Optical out on Integral / Vertex is mainly for ARC purpose and/or 5.1/stereo.

Downmixing any audio signal requiere decoding and license, we never did such audio device yet, but we do have an "audiofury" on the paper since a while.

HDfury 09-19-2017 08:03 AM

AVR Key GUI
 
2 Attachment(s)
Here is first picture of AVR Key GUI.

We tried to keep everything super easy as it's a plug and play product.

splotten 09-19-2017 12:05 PM

You really should consider making a AVR key with more than one Input. 4 or 6 remote controlled inputs would allow users to replace the HDMI switch in the AVR, increasing the usability a lot. Even better make two HDMI video outputs as well. One for the TV and one for the projector.

HDfury 09-19-2017 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by splotten (Post 54824942)
You really should consider making a AVR key with more than one Input. 4 or 6 remote controlled inputs would allow users to replace the HDMI switch in the AVR, increasing the usability a lot. Even better make two HDMI video outputs as well. One for the TV and one for the projector.

Thank for the inputs, we have all that in the making ;)

Anyway, cheap switcher + AVRkey will remain the most cost effective solution & Regarding 2 ouputs > Vertex !

HDfury 09-26-2017 09:04 AM

AVRkey official firmware/GUI for release:https://www.hdfury.com/tools/4K_AVR-Key_FW1.214.218_GUI1.1.zip


AVRkey official usermanual fo release:
https://www.hdfury.com/docs/HDfuryAVRkey.pdf


We might ship all units out a bit before the end of the pre order period.

HDfury 09-27-2017 05:41 PM

1 Attachment(s)
AVR-Key have shipped today a few days ahead of the schedule. Usermanual and GUI utility (should be rarely needed) are available on the download section of the product page.

william06 09-29-2017 07:51 AM

Hi. I purchased the avrkey to watch my roku 4 vudu Dolby vision purchases In dv with atmos on my lgg7 and Samsung 950. Bypassing the 950 inability to pass dv over arc imput. To make a long story short the avrkey works. Roku 4 out to avrkey to imput 4 on tv and imput one on 950. All is well key passes HDR to tv and audio from sb atmos. My big mistake never researched enough that roku devices do not use Dolby vision. Now trying to see if I can use the avrkey between the lg arc imput and soundbar arc output and using the HDMI audio out from avrkey to HDMI 1 on sb. Tried once yesterday but so far no go need to use the audio from tv for atmos. Any suggestions or am I just out of luck. Only other alternative might be Apple TV 4K just trying not to output any more $$$$ . Thanks. The lg is supposed to pass atmos on dd+ over arc the Samsung is not capable or receiving or decoding it. Any help appreciated. Sorry for the rambling post

HDfury 09-29-2017 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by william06 (Post 54877592)
Hi. I purchased the avrkey to watch my roku 4 vudu Dolby vision purchases In dv with atmos on my lgg7 and Samsung 950. Bypassing the 950 inability to pass dv over arc imput. To make a long story short the avrkey works. Roku 4 out to avrkey to imput 4 on tv and imput one on 950. All is well key passes HDR to tv and audio from sb atmos. My big mistake never researched enough that roku devices do not use Dolby vision. Now trying to see if I can use the avrkey between the lg arc imput and soundbar arc output and using the HDMI audio out from avrkey to HDMI 1 on sb. Tried once yesterday but so far no go need to use the audio from tv for atmos. Any suggestions or am I just out of luck. Only other alternative might be Apple TV 4K just trying not to output any more $$$$ . Thanks. The lg is supposed to pass atmos on dd+ over arc the Samsung is not capable or receiving or decoding it. Any help appreciated. Sorry for the rambling post

Hi, i'm not sure i got this right (the part in bold)

Can you try to detail more what you are trying to do, my guess is that you are trying to feed ROKU > TV directly and then use TV ARC to feed your soundbar, directly or via AVRkey, is that correct ?

The problem here is that AVRkey doesn't have CEC/ARC control, CEC/ARC is not a SOURCE.
AVRKey need to be feed with a valid signal (Video signal and audio signal from any HDMI/HDCP2.x or 1.x source), CEC/ARC is not a valid source signal, it serves a whole different purpose.

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...-hdmi-arc.html
This a very informative thread, bottom line, for DD+(atmos) over ARC, you need compatible TV and compatible AVR.

I'm sorry you are having this issue and discover that the industry is marketing feature on one side, while they never mention the other part of the equation must also be brand new matching it in order to work.
Unfortunately AVRkey is not yet ARCkey. We cannot fix all the industry issues and lies at once ;)

For DV playback, you need AT LEAST the following:

DV source, DV content, DV TV.

Now if you have that and have older AVR and need full sound to it, then you put AVRkey between DV source and DV TV and run HDMI cable from audio out to your AVR.
The only setting you have to make sure it's correctly set for DV playback is VIDEO slide switch, it must be set to SINK (middle position).

Here is first feedback we received for AVRkey on our support server.

Got mine today! Works perfectly! Many thanks, I have been waiting for a product like this to solve my issues for along time! avr-key is working perfectly first time. Well done and thank you!

william06 09-29-2017 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HDfury (Post 54877800)
Hi, i'm not sure i got this right (the part in bold)

Can you try to detail more what you are trying to do, my guess is that you are trying to feed ROKU > TV directly and then use TV ARC to feed your soundbar, directly or via AVRkey, is that correct ?

The problem here is that AVRkey doesn't have CEC/ARC control, CEC/ARC is not a SOURCE.
AVRKey need to be feed with a valid signal (Video signal and audio signal from any HDMI/HDCP2.x or 1.x source), CEC/ARC is not a valid source signal, it serves a whole different purpose.

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/39-net...-hdmi-arc.html
This a very informative thread, bottom line, for DD+(atmos) over ARC, you need compatible TV and compatible AVR.

I'm sorry you are having this issue and discover that the industry is marketing feature on one side, while they never mention the other part of the equation must also be brand new matching it in order to work.
Unfortunately AVRkey is not yet ARCkey. We cannot fix all the industry issues and lies at once ;)

For DV playback, you need AT LEAST the following:

DV source, DV content, DV TV.

Now if you have that and have older AVR and need full sound to it, then you put AVRkey between DV source and DV TV and run HDMI cable from audio out to your AVR.
The only setting you have to make sure it's correctly set for DV playback is VIDEO slide switch, it must be set to SINK (middle position).

Here is first feedback we received for AVRkey on our support server.

Got mine today! Works perfectly! Many thanks, I have been waiting for a product like this to solve my issues for along time! avr-key is working perfectly first time. Well done and thank you!

Forget roku that works fine with avrkey. Great and does what it was designed to do. Here's my question
My lg tv apps vudu for one streams dolby vision with dolby atmos over hdmi arc. To a Samsung k950 soundbar conneced to its hdmi arc imput. Is there a way to insert the avrkey in line witch i own to extract the atmos audio into an imput on the soundbar that will accept the atmos.
Audio? Lg hdmi arc output ti hdmi video imput on the avrkey. HDMI video output avrkey to hdmi arc imput on soundbar and hdmi audio audio output from avrkey audio output to an hdmi imput on soundbar capable of decoding the atmos signals from the tv. As the video signals in the avrkey are pasthrough not processing or do i have that wrong. Again sorry for the long post. Just to be clear i have the dv video on my tv app just want to pull out the atmos audio to the soundbar

HDfury 09-29-2017 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by william06 (Post 54878018)
Forget roku that works fine with avrkey. Great and does what it was designed to do. Here's my question
My lg tv apps vudu for one streams dolby vision with dolby atmos over hdmi arc. To a Samsung k950 soundbar conneced to its hdmi arc imput. Is there a way to insert the avrkey in line witch i own to extract the atmos audio into an imput on the soundbar that will accept the atmos.
Audio? Lg hdmi arc output ti hdmi video imput on the avrkey. HDMI video output avrkey to hdmi arc imput on soundbar and hdmi audio audio output from avrkey audio output to an hdmi imput on soundbar capable of decoding the atmos signals from the tv. As the video signals in the avrkey are pasthrough not processing or do i have that wrong. Again sorry for the long post. Just to be clear i have the dv video on my tv app just want to pull out the atmos audio to the soundbar

Hi William

Please read my answer again, i think i covered it, for ARC you need equipment that support DD+/ATMOS over ARC, is it the case of your AVR ? if answer is no, there is no way AVRkey can make your sound bar accept ATMOS/DD+ over ARC if it doesn't initially support it.
As stated above, AVRkey is made to work in between SOURCE AND SINK, where it will desembbed Audio from Video and forward it on a 720stream; this require video stream initially, ARC doesn't have any video, it's a return channel. so AVRkey cannot help for ARC issue like that.

So extract ATMOS from DV, as i explained you need DV source, DV content, DV TV and you put AVRkey in between DV source and DV TV and it will extract ATMOS to feed any AVR.

william06 09-29-2017 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HDfury (Post 54878636)
Hi William

Please read my answer again, i think i covered it, for ARC you need equipment that support DD+/ATMOS over ARC, is it the case of your AVR ? if answer is no, there is no way AVRkey can make your sound bar accept ATMOS/DD+ over ARC if it doesn't initially support it.
As stated above, AVRkey is made to work in between SOURCE AND SINK, where it will desembbed Audio from Video and forward it on a 720stream; this require video stream initially, ARC doesn't have any video, it's a return channel. so AVRkey cannot help for ARC issue like that.

So extract ATMOS from DV, as i explained you need DV source, DV content, DV TV and you put AVRkey in between DV source and DV TV and it will extract ATMOS to feed any AVR.

As explained above my tv is the dv source. The only HDMI output is the arc HDMI 2 I was trying to extract the audio from that and I guess your trying to explain to me the avrkey cannot do that . Thanks for trying to help.

william06 09-29-2017 11:02 AM

Hey guys please do not let my above post detract from the quality and pourpose of the avrkey. It is a great little product and does what it was designed to do perfectly as you can tell I was also trying to get it to do something it was not designed to do. My bad. For example I can plug my roku4 directly to an imput on my tv by going from the roku into the avrkey and video out to the tv and HDMI audio out to the proper imput on the soundbar I get beautiful HDR picture on tv and Dolby atmos from soundbar. If the roku was enabled for Dolby vision I would be able to receive that. Also the help, communication from HD fury is awesome

rick98761 09-29-2017 05:46 PM

Is anyone using this for an AppleTV 4k? Currently I’m having to ARC audio back to my AVR since it cannot passthrough Dolby Vision video. If I understand correctly this is exactly what I need in order to get full quality audio while keeping Dolby Vision. Would it introduce any lip sync issues or are those handled somehow. What is the best way if I want to run my HTPC through this as well. It can output Dolby Vision as well I believe.

william06 09-29-2017 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick98761 (Post 54880578)
Is anyone using this for an AppleTV 4k? Currently I’m having to ARC audio back to my AVR since it cannot passthrough Dolby Vision video. If I understand correctly this is exactly what I need in order to get full quality audio while keeping Dolby Vision. Would it introduce any lip sync issues or are those handled somehow. What is the best way if I want to run my HTPC through this as well. It can output Dolby Vision as well I believe.

I believe it will work with an apple tv 4k. I am currently using with a roku 4. I plan to switch to the apple tv when they introduce atmos and a few other items.

rick98761 09-29-2017 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by william06 (Post 54880722)
I believe it will work with an apple tv 4k. I am currently using with a roku 4. I plan to switch to the apple tv when they introduce atmos and a few other items.



Just trying to decide if I can justify the price. My AVR is supposed to get an update in 2018, but that’s a wide range.


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