New DVDO iScan VP50 - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 12:05 PM
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Thank you very much for your analysis and response Madshi - My only goal is to have everything looks as good as CSI Miami or that new Hitachi 1080 Plasma Commercial with the White Leopard (Amazing) when my Sharp is doing dot-by-dot mode. Don't know if others have seen this commercial done by a famous French Director but I've never seen such clarity that Hitachi would make my Sharp look so great.

May be looking to upgrade after all. Thanks again.

Samsung 65F8000, 60D8000, 40HU6350, Panasonic 50E60 LCD's
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post #92 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 12:09 PM
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Quote:


Not "every" because mine doesn't.

Well, every fixed-pixel display (LCD, DLP, LCoS, Plasma) does, because this is a progressive display technology by definition. It may not accept 1080p, but it has to convert 1080i to 1080p internally to display anything.

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post #93 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomHuffman View Post

Well, every fixed-pixel display (LCD, DLP, LCoS, Plasma) does, because this is a progressive display technology by definition. It may not accept 1080p, but it has to convert 1080i to 1080p internally to display anything.

Just like I said it doesn't (I do own it and know for sure). It MUST be fed 1080p and will not accept, convert, or scale any other signal because it has no internal scaler. You should have read the ink before posting.
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post #94 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 12:28 PM
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It is possible to have 1:1 and still have overscan.

I have the HL-S5088W RP from Samsung. By default it has overscan w/o 1:1. You can go into the service menu and turn digital overscan off. At this point you are 1:1 but you still have overscan due to the bezel around the screen.

Digital overscan is fake overscan. This is done by cropping the outer portion of the image and then resizing it up. This is often done to remove garbage near the edges of the image.
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post #95 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 12:29 PM
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Josh,
Unless the vp50 is able to force the sky box to transmit sd signals at 576i through hdmi its not going to be of much use to us in the uk,I know that we can recieve this signal through component but sky intend to cut off this output before very long.Will you do something to sort this out for us very soon?
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post #96 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 12:57 PM
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Josh,

This sounds like an outstanding product. I know I am getting ahead of myself, but are there plans to release a VP40 with simplified connections and lower MSRP similar to the VP20/VP30 relationship? My guess is based on the VP20 schedule that a VP40 wouldn't be released until May/June of 2007. You guys have to recoup your investment costs!

Since you understandably probably won't answer my question I will provide some customer feedback. I am a member of your target market for the VP20. I want to improve the picture of SD, but I am not a "tweaker". I would prefer to plug in my cable box(soon to be series 3 TiVo) and DVD player both connected via HDMI and "go." I do, however, have a Samsung 1080P LCD so I could take advantage of, and am interested in, the 1080i de-interlacing available in the VP50, but I don't need all the custom settings and analog inputs.

The question for someone in my shoes("middle market" as you refer to us in your VP20 press release ) is whether 1080i de-interlacing is worth the price difference between the VP20 and VP50($1300 MSRP difference). In my situation I can't justify that cost difference, but if there were a VP40 with fewer custom settings and analog inputs for say $2499 MSRP then the equation changes and I would probably splurge for the VP40.

Isn't economics great?
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post #97 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 05:37 PM
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Josh:I gather it won't support 1080/24PsF output upon release (since there has been no response to my questions), but is it possible that 1080/24PsF output will be added shortly after release?
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post #98 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 05:43 PM
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I for one have been looking forward to seeing Dale's HD-DL in action.

Josh: what's the code name of this one Josh if SD-DL was ABT102?

I am really looking forward to seeing edge adaptive processing for smooth diagonal edges on 1080i material as well as 480i/576i where ABT102 is excellent.

Why do we need a good 1080p processor when we have 1080p displays?
I've had Pioneer's new 1080p plasma since the day it was available, this is considered to have state-of-the-art 1080i deinterlacing as far as displays go. But with all these things it's the cadence detection that lets them down (for none AV-mensa people: this tells the deinterlacer that signal is 'film source' or 'video source').

To be fair it does okay with 480i and 1080i/60 that have easily recognisable 3:2 pulldown patterns -- but where 1080p displays are weak is 576i and 1080i/50 and difficult to detect 2:2 pulldown patterns.

ABT102 aced 576i cadence detection, and I am confident that it's bigger brother will do the same with 1080i/50.


I am sure there will be other great features added, such as: HD-SDI, EDID edit, reinterlace (de-bob), and possible features such as noise reduction.

I very much look forward to DVDO iScan VP50.

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post #99 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 05:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StooMonster View Post

I for one have been looking forward to seeing Dale's HD-DL in action.

Josh: what's the code name of this one Josh if SD-DL was ABT102?

Quite simply: HD-DL

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post #100 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post

One thing you should make sure is that your display supports 1:1 pixel mapping. That's important to get the best out of it. You can benefit from the VP50 without 1:1 pixel mapping, too, but you'd lose a bit of sharpness/detail this way.

How can you tell if your particular display supports 1:1 pixel mapping? I have the new Sony 70XBR2 on pre-order. Can you tell if this set has 1:1 by looking at the menu options available, or does anyone know about Sony SXRD's in general with respect to this issue?
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post #101 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 08:05 PM
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Blue,

You need to feed in a test pattern to verify 1:1 mapping.
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post #102 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 08:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue 911 View Post

How can you tell if your particular display supports 1:1 pixel mapping? I have the new Sony 70XBR2 on pre-order. Can you tell if this set has 1:1 by looking at the menu options available, or does anyone know about Sony SXRD's in general with respect to this issue?

The new Sony non-XBR SXRD sets do accept 1080p@60Hz on the HDMI input and allow 1:1. The likelihood that they would not allow this on the XBRs is very low. Additionally, these two specs (from the Sony website) all but confirm this:

-Full HD 1920x1080 native SXRD panel resolution
-1080p input resolution through HDMI connection

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post #103 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 08:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfogarty5 View Post

The question for someone in my shoes("middle market" as you refer to us in your VP20 press release ) is whether 1080i de-interlacing is worth the price difference between the VP20 and VP50($1300 MSRP difference). In my situation I can't justify that cost difference, but if there were a VP40 with fewer custom settings and analog inputs for say $2499 MSRP then the equation changes and I would probably splurge for the VP40.

Looks like great tech, but $3000 is getting a bit steep for my blood. HD is an expensive hobby. Obviously the price leaving a $500 gap for the VP40 to fit in. But my HD+ was half VP50, and the iScan Pro half that.

Steve
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post #104 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 08:36 PM - Thread Starter
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There will be no VP40....

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post #105 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 08:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uzun View Post

Josh:I gather it won't support 1080/24PsF output upon release (since there has been no response to my questions),

Nor is it listed on the first post of this thread.

Quote:


but is it possible that 1080/24PsF output will be added shortly after release?

Anything is possible but we would rather announce a feature after it has been tested. We are very aware that combined with our superior 480i/1080i deinterlacing and frame rate conversion that 004 owners would have a "go to" VP with this additional output resolution.

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post #106 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 08:53 PM
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I guess what I am asking regarding 1080/24PsF output support, is it relatively easy to add given the design of the VP50, or are there hardware or other system constraints that make adding this output format difficult and/or impossible.
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post #107 of 6318 Old 08-22-2006, 11:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by derekjsmith View Post

Gamma (R/G/B and up to 1024 point Gamma individual RGB correction)

So now you will be able to get that perfect Gamma curve even if your display does not have the controls for it. Full 10 bit RGB output Look Up Table management. Guess we need to get busy in CalMAN to add support for this

We need to get, um, a couple of engineering samples...

Color accuracy evangelist and CalMAN insider
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post #108 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 01:19 AM
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Uzun I am sure DVDO will strive and work to provide 1080 24p on the VP50

what display device wants this anyway? there aren't many are there ?

-Gary
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post #109 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 01:37 AM
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How about an optional HD-SDI Output... that would seal the deal for me

testing anything like this Josh?

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post #110 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 01:56 AM
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I think they provide 1080 24p, but not 1080/24PsF. The Qualia 004 only accepts 1080/24PsF, 1080/60P and 1080/50p. 1080/24PsF provides smoother playback for film sources than 1080/60P does, with a 48hz rather than 60hz on screen refresh rate.

My question doesn't involve output of 1080 24P but 1080/24PsF, which I sort of think they will provide unless there's some hardware or system issue that makes implementing it difficult.
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post #111 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 02:16 AM
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Gino you can't beat DVDO's HDMI output, just get a HDMI to HD-SDI converter

Josh did mentioned a HD-SDI input

Uzun me stupid, please explain to me what the difference is between 1080/24p and 1080/24PsF?

-Gary
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post #112 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 04:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh@dvdo View Post

Quite simply: HD-DL

Your brand is VRS though right? Like Gennum VXP and Realta HQV -- it's Anchor Bay Technology VRS.

So, we can talk about VRS vs VXP vs HQV etc.

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post #113 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StooMonster View Post

Your brand is VRS though right? Like Gennum VXP and Realta HQV -- it's Anchor Bay Technology VRS.

So, we can talk about VRS vs VXP vs HQV etc.

StooMonster

See here:

http://www.anchorbaytech.com/news/VRS-launch.html

VRS stands for "Video Reference Series".
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post #114 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 06:06 AM
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Like HQV means "Hollywood Quality Videoprocessing" and VXP means "Visual Excellence Processing", VRS does indeed mean "Video Reference Series".

So, as above, in discussion it's HQV vs VXP vs VRS then.

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post #115 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 06:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lexus430@zen.co. View Post

Unless the vp50 is able to force the sky box to transmit sd signals at 576i through hdmi its not going to be of much use to us in the uk,I know that we can recieve this signal through component but sky intend to cut off this output before very long.Will you do something to sort this out for us very soon?

Josh said above that VP50 (and I believe VP30 and VP20) will soon have EDID edit capabilities so that we can force interlaced signals over HDMI.

In Sky HD's case we know that this works (you're all welcome BTW ) but if it doesn't Dale Adams has dicussed his "reinterlace" algorithm in other forums/posts, this algorithm extracts an SD interlaced signal from a deinterlaced one. i.e. it extracts the original 480i from 480p (or 576i from 576p) so that VRS can deinterlace it "properly".

Either or both of these should solve the forced progressive SD over HDMI issue with Sky HD, HD DVD, BluRay, etc. If we don't see them in first version of VP50 software, I am hoping that we'll see them in later versions.

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post #116 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gino AUS View Post

How about an optional HD-SDI Output... that would seal the deal for me

An HD-SDI output would not be able to pass any HDCP-encrypted HDMI input signals.

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post #117 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 09:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StooMonster View Post

Your brand is VRS though right? Like Gennum VXP and Realta HQV -- it's Anchor Bay Technology VRS.

So, we can talk about VRS vs VXP vs HQV etc.

StooMonster

You are correct Stoo, the deinterlacers code name is HD-DL, as Dale mentioned previosuly, but the combination of our deinterlacing and scaling in any product is known as VRS technology, Video Reference Series.

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post #118 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 10:24 AM
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I have a conference call with the folks at DVDO at 1pm today to work out prebuy specials. Stay tuned!
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post #119 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Turk View Post

I have a conference call with the folks at DVDO at 1pm today to work out prebuy specials. Stay tuned!


That prebuy special should also include the option of an upgrade from other DVDO product.

Benoit
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post #120 of 6318 Old 08-23-2006, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh@dvdo View Post

There will be no VP40....

Read post 96. Maybe you should reconsider that.

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
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