FleaHDMI - Time to iron out the facts? - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 272 Old 06-07-2007, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Newcomb View Post

I recently pulled mine out of my system (due to 24P issues with my particular Blu-ray player), however this is how I did it:
LD, DVD, HD-DVD, etc > into 4806CI receiver (all signals upconverted if needed by receiver to 1080i) > into Flea @1080i > into JVC RS1 (projector). While it may be less than optimal (from the Flea's standpoint), the Flea does support 1080i and I get the convenience of using my receiver for the switching.

Larry


I don't think I truly understand. So you're saying you sent 1080i signals into the Flea and used the receiver for switching?

device @ 1080i > Flea > receiver > TV ?
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post #92 of 272 Old 06-07-2007, 01:55 PM
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Ideally, you would send a native signal to the Flea for best performance. Use native mode on the Sat box and feed that to the Flea before the receiver sees it. This is per the Flea manual and has something to do with the NR being done at the pixel level IIRC.

That said, there's no rule you can't try it other ways and see how it looks.

I certainly would not downconvert everything to 480i though.
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post #93 of 272 Old 06-07-2007, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

Ideally, you would send a native signal to the Flea for best performance. Use native mode on the Sat box and feed that to the Flea before the receiver sees it. This is per the Flea manual and has something to do with the NR being done at the pixel level IIRC.

That said, there's no rule you can't try it other ways and see how it looks.

I certainly would not downconvert everything to 480i though.


On my cable box, I can select all the formats. (480i/p 720p or 1080i) Not sure what the NR is, since I have had the ability to select any one I wanted.

So should I select them all, and let the Flea do it's thing?
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post #94 of 272 Old 06-07-2007, 01:58 PM
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[quote=UWisconsin97]I don't think I truly understand. So you're saying you sent 1080i signals into the Flea and used the receiver for switching?

[quote]

He's saying he took the output of the receiver into the Flea and then on to the display. That is not the recommended method from Algolith though. See above.
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post #95 of 272 Old 06-07-2007, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UWisconsin97 View Post

On my cable box, I can select all the formats. (480i/p 720p or 1080i) Not sure what the NR is, since I have had the ability to select any one I wanted.

So should I select them all, and let the Flea do it's thing?

The native signal resolution would be whatever it is originally. For example, CBS HD is 1080i, ABC HD is 720p, NBC HD is 1080i, FOX HD is 720p, and so on.

Non HD channels will be native 480i or 480p.

Some Sat/cable boxes have a "native" mode which automatically detects the native resolution and sends it on through. So if you switch to CBS HD, you automatically get 1080i, if you switch to ESPN HD you automatically get 720p.

Some boxes have modes like 1080i/480i which would be next best as it would at least send native for channels matching those resolutions. In that case all HD would be sent 1080i and all SD sent 480i.

If you don't have any of these modes on the box, then just pick 1080i or 720p whichever looks best. Probably 1080i would be my recommendation.
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post #96 of 272 Old 06-07-2007, 02:14 PM
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good to see some Algolith support on the forum. Anthony, how are you?
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post #97 of 272 Old 06-08-2007, 12:01 PM
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Quote:


He's saying he took the output of the receiver into the Flea and then on to the display. That is not the recommended method from Algolith though. See above.

Exactly. I have multiple HDMI sources and the Flea can only switch two. I just want to sit down and watch a movie (and not spend a lot of time switching inputs on multiple devices).

Per Anthony's (Algolith) suggestion, I tried hooking it up direct and was unable to discern any improvement as a result of feeding it the "native" resolution (although the Flea's improvement is subtle at best, at least for me).

Larry
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post #98 of 272 Old 06-17-2007, 05:11 AM
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Agreed. But I think it's supposed to be subtle.
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post #99 of 272 Old 06-17-2007, 06:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Newcomb View Post

Exactly. I have multiple HDMI sources and the Flea can only switch two. I just want to sit down and watch a movie (and not spend a lot of time switching inputs on multiple devices).

Per Anthony's (Algolith) suggestion, I tried hooking it up direct and was unable to discern any improvement as a result of feeding it the "native" resolution (although the Flea's improvement is subtle at best, at least for me).

Larry

Use the split screen mode and you will see the difference. I have my FLEA settings pretty low(lower than the recommended settings) and it is still a big difference.

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post #100 of 272 Old 06-17-2007, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post

Use the split screen mode and you will see the difference. I have my FLEA settings pretty low(lower than the recommended settings) and it is still a big difference.


Anything wrong with using it on higher settings?
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post #101 of 272 Old 06-17-2007, 09:14 PM
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I see what I would call smearing or ghosting of the image if it is et too high. Algolith has default settings to use as a baseline then you just adjust them to your liking. I have mine set so that it works well enough for everything although if I had a really noisy picture I could further adjust the settings but I would rather just leave the settings alone and not play around with it. Which works for me. It does a great job with both HD and SD.

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post #102 of 272 Old 06-25-2007, 10:30 AM
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After more than three weeks, I finally got this reply from Algolith re: the below black issue:
_____________________

Sorry about the lateness of the reply. I had to speak to a few people here internaly in order to attempt to give you a proper response. I was informed that, for DVD's, television etc, the below black (0-15) and above white (236 - 255) color ranges are not used. These ranges are only used with PC RGB and the color space that should be used on your source ideally should be YCbCr / YPbPr 4:2:2 to achieve best results with the Flea with HDMI. The "clipping below black" experienced during the Digital Video Essentials test pattern should in no way affect the quality of the video output you will receive when viewing regular DVD's and television programming.

To answer your question: This is not something that can be resolved via firmware/software.

Best regards.
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post #103 of 272 Old 06-25-2007, 04:59 PM
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Sounds like they're bitten with the same old hardware bug. The problem of course is that 422 may not be readily available from your source.

I've found something interesting, though. Playing around with my SonyBDP300 blue-ray player into the Flea I've been able to get display of below black (based on the THX optimizer pattern) by adjusting the brightness control on the player. You then have to recalibrate at the display or elsewhere, but it does seem to work with both Studio RGB and 444YCbCr. The Sony player has selectable settings for YCBCr, Studio RGB, and PCRGB for the HDMI output. Of course it won't show below black with PCRGB no matter what you do which is correct behavior, so this leads me to believe this is actually a viable workaround. The stipulation is that it seems to require a brightness control at the source.
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post #104 of 272 Old 06-25-2007, 05:01 PM
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To me this is less than acceptable response coming from a company that specializes in video processors.

Vinod
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post #105 of 272 Old 06-30-2007, 04:01 PM
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I recently purchased a Sony BDP-300 blue-ray player. No matter what I do, I can't get multichannel pcm to pass through the Flea HDMI to my pre/pro. It either lacks the center/rears, sounds like static, or the sound is accompanied by a high-pitch whine. DD bitstream passes fine. Multi pcm works fine from the bdp300 when the player is hooked directly to the pre/pro.
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post #106 of 272 Old 07-01-2007, 09:08 PM
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The one time I connected my HD DVD player to my HDMI Flea last week I also got a high pitched whine with multichannel PCM. I was just trying it out but I typically only use my HDMI Flea for my broadcast sources.

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post #107 of 272 Old 07-02-2007, 04:57 AM
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I retested yesterday using the Sony BDP300, Toshiba A1, and Oppo 970.

I could not get workable multi PCM through the Flea with any of them.

I also tried reverting from firmware V2.05 to V2.04 on the Flea. No dice.

Then upgraded to firmware V2.07. No dice.

I guess I was mistaken when I said it worked with the Oppo before.

All sources work fine with the Flea out of the loop.

I have an email in to Algolith.
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post #108 of 272 Old 07-09-2007, 03:54 PM
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I got a call (that's right a phone call) today from Algolith tech support about the multi-PCM issue and they are looking into this.
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post #109 of 272 Old 08-31-2007, 10:31 AM
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Quick question about the Flea. Does anyone know what the latency is on it? Other then SD TV, I was thinking about using the other port for my PS3 to play PS2 and PS1 games.

Thanks

EDIT: Duh, PS2 does not have HDMI. I guess I'll use the PS3
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post #110 of 272 Old 08-31-2007, 02:28 PM
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I don't but I'll bet Ofer will know. Look him up . He's around here somewhere.
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post #111 of 272 Old 08-31-2007, 03:36 PM
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It's very low. I can't remember exactly, but it was less than a one frame delay.
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post #112 of 272 Old 11-28-2007, 11:43 AM
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I have a Flea in between Oppo DV-970HD and a lumagen visionHDP. Statuswindow reports RGB levels in to the flea.

To get the oppo to send YCbCr I have to force after each reboot. Changing from RGB to YCbCr 4:4:4, this is due the Oppo assume Lumagen doesn't handle YCbCr colorspace over DVI-connector. Is it possible that the Flea assume the same, forcing the signal to RGB?
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post #113 of 272 Old 12-06-2007, 08:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

I recently purchased a Sony BDP-300 blue-ray player. No matter what I do, I can't get multichannel pcm to pass through the Flea HDMI to my pre/pro. It either lacks the center/rears, sounds like static, or the sound is accompanied by a high-pitch whine. DD bitstream passes fine. Multi pcm works fine from the bdp300 when the player is hooked directly to the pre/pro.


I get exactly the same thing with my Flea HDMI. Just static and whining when trying to pass multi PCM. Any fix yet Algolith??
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post #114 of 272 Old 01-05-2008, 08:55 PM
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Anybody know whether Algolith has anything planned for the Flea line at CES? I'm wondering whether there's any chance prices will drop on the current critters....


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post #115 of 272 Old 04-01-2008, 04:23 AM
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To current FLEA HDMI users ,does it really improve 1080/24p source significantly ? Any words from Algolith on a new version Flea Hdmi which passes BTB on RGB signal ?
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post #116 of 272 Old 04-01-2008, 05:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdeTan View Post

To current FLEA HDMI users ,does it really improve 1080/24p source significantly ? Any words from Algolith on a new version Flea Hdmi which passes BTB on RGB signal ?

as any other source. I use my HDMI flea for all my broadcast sources which always needs cleaning up. I don't use it with HD DVD or BD. So for 1080P24 I have my VUDU box going through the HDMI FLEA at 1080P24and it works just fineat cleaning up the image.

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post #117 of 272 Old 04-01-2008, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post

as any other source. I use my HDMI flea for all my broadcast sources which always needs cleaning up. I don't use it with HD DVD or BD. So for 1080P24 I have my VUDU box going through the HDMI FLEA at 1080P24and it works just fineat cleaning up the image.

Thanks , then I suppose there is not much impact when using with HD DVD and Blu ray . By the way , will input YCbCr 4:4:4 to Flea hdmi clip BTB ? I check my Panasonic BD30 and it output YCbCr 4:4:4 while Toshiba A35 output YCbCr 4:2:2 at 24p .
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post #118 of 272 Old 04-01-2008, 08:07 AM
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I never tried to use the HDMI Flea with my HD DVD or BD player. The HDMI Flea can't handle anything higher than 1080P24. And the HD DVD and BD players I have will output at 1080P24, but they also output at 1080P60 depending on the content and whether you are in a menu, or booting up etc. So I never ran the players through the FLEA. But for the most part I don't think the HD DVD/BD titles need the processing of the FLEA.

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post #119 of 272 Old 04-01-2008, 08:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post

I never tried to use the HDMI Flea with my HD DVD or BD player. The HDMI Flea can't handle anything higher than 1080P24. And the HD DVD and BD players I have will output at 1080P24, but they also output at 1080P60 depending on the content and whether you are in a menu, or booting up etc. So I never ran the players through the FLEA. But for the most part I don't think the HD DVD/BD titles need the processing of the FLEA.

Hi aaronwt, did you try increasing the detail enhancement level during HD and BD playback and see if it sharpen the details on 1080p24 input source? And can we bypass the Flea till it get into the movies then on the processing ?
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post #120 of 272 Old 04-01-2008, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Yeo View Post

Thanks , then I suppose there is not much impact when using with HD DVD and Blu ray . By the way , will input YCbCr 4:4:4 to Flea hdmi clip BTB ? I check my Panasonic BD30 and it output YCbCr 4:4:4 while Toshiba A35 output YCbCr 4:2:2 at 24p .

I can only speak to my experience with the HDMI Mosquito and assume the same would apply to the Flea. I found that the Mosquito generally did not improve the PQ of 1080p material through a BD or HD DVDD player, whether at 24, 50, or 60 fps and correspondence with Anthony from Algolith confirmed those findings. I believe it may be in some of the earlier posts on this thread. if not, you can always email them.
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