[suggestion: why not make a] New DVDO VP 10? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 26 Old 02-10-2007, 06:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Can ABT please make the DVDO VP10?

I need it for my new JVC RS1. It won't do the stretch for constant height setups.

It needs these features:

No deinterlacing - My RS1 will do that.
Scaling to support any anamorphic lens no matter what the source. For now I'll settle with 1080i and 720p.
HDMI switching.

Can you please make this for me? Make it reasonably priced too.
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post #2 of 26 Old 02-10-2007, 07:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raoul View Post

Can ABT please make the DVDO VP10?

I need it for my new JVC RS1. It won't do the stretch for constant height setups.

It needs these features:

No deinterlacing - My RS1 will do that.
Scaling to support any anamorphic lens no matter what the source. For now I'll settle with 1080i and 720p.
HDMI switching.

Can you please make this for me? Make it reasonably priced too.


If you want scaling, you need deinterlacing as well.
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post #3 of 26 Old 02-10-2007, 07:48 AM
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No deinterlacing - My RS1 will do that.

This makes no sense. You can't scale before deinterlacing.
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post #4 of 26 Old 02-10-2007, 09:42 AM
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Question is, what makes the biggest impact on performance? great de-interlacing or great scaling?

If you had to choose between the two?
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post #5 of 26 Old 02-10-2007, 03:41 PM
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It depends. Most sports I watch are now native 720p. So I scale them to 1080p. Obviously no deinterlacing needed. Looks better on my Lumagen than on my VP50. Obviously if native 1080i sports, I deinterlace to 1080p. Obviously no scaling needed. When watching 480i sports, nothing much helps. The Lumagen doesn't deinterlace video all that well and the DVDO while better, still shows artifacts, hockey sticks (rotating vectors) break up all over the place. Tough to make 480i video look good. I suppose the best is 480i video to DVDO, out 480p in to Lumagen, scale to 1080p.

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post #6 of 26 Old 02-10-2007, 10:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Why won't JVC just do what is needed and let me adjust the display to be in permanent constant height mode?
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post #7 of 26 Old 02-11-2007, 02:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Axatax View Post

This makes no sense. You can't scale before deinterlacing.

Are you saying that if you have a 480i SD DVD and want to go to 1080ioutput from a scaler, it is deinterlaced to 480p and then scaled and then interlaced back to 1080i and then output to the RS1 and then deinterlaced again to 1080 p



All that so you can get vertical stretch for the JVC Rs1

Dan
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post #8 of 26 Old 02-11-2007, 04:14 AM
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there are plenty of solutions that will work here, I don't see the point of a VP10...

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Ofer LaOr

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post #9 of 26 Old 02-11-2007, 06:41 AM
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Me neither .....
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post #10 of 26 Old 02-11-2007, 07:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D_B_0673 View Post

Are you saying that if you have a 480i SD DVD and want to go to 1080ioutput from a scaler, it is deinterlaced to 480p and then scaled and then interlaced back to 1080i and then output to the RS1 and then deinterlaced again to 1080 p


Yes, the scaling process is based on whole video frames, not interlaced fields. You can't scale without deinterlacing first.

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post #11 of 26 Old 02-11-2007, 07:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackox View Post

Me neither .....

Name a few. I don't want to spend a tonne of money on a scaler to get my 2.35:1 set up working. I hear the projector has a great scaler built in but won't do 2.35:1 stretching. So, how do I preserve the quality of the projector's scalling and adjust the aspect ratio's correctly?
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post #12 of 26 Old 02-11-2007, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Yes, the scaling process is based on whole video frames, not interlaced fields. You can't scale without deinterlacing first.


So instead of outputting from the scaler to 1080i and without having the scaler or pj to test on, would it make more theoretical sense to take a SD DVD 480i, then deinterlace, then scale to 720P then output to the RS1 and let that scale again to 1080P. that would eliminate one step of interlace/deinterlace.

I don't have a scaler that would output 1080p at this time and I am trying to do vertical stretch as economically as possible

Dan
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post #13 of 26 Old 02-11-2007, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D_B_0673 View Post

So instead of outputting from the scaler to 1080i and without having the scaler or pj to test on, would it make more theoretical sense to take a SD DVD 480i, then deinterlace, then scale to 720P then output to the RS1 and let that scale again to 1080P. that would eliminate one step of interlace/deinterlace.

Scaling in multiple steps introduces the risk of mathematical errors. Its always best to do all your scaling in one step. In this scenario, you'd want to set the video processor for 480p output so that it just deinterlaces and then let the projector take it up to 1080p.

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post #14 of 26 Old 02-11-2007, 05:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oferlaor View Post

there are plenty of solutions that will work here, I don't see the point of a VP10...

They're all expensive. I don't want to spend 2k on a scaler when the projector cost a litltle more than twice that and it is supposed to have a great scaler (Gennum) built in. I just want to do a stretch/squeeze so I can run a Constant Height setup.

R-S
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post #15 of 26 Old 02-11-2007, 05:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Scaling in multiple steps introduces the risk of mathematical errors. Its always best to do all your scaling in one step. In this scenario, you'd want to set the video processor for 480p output so that it just deinterlaces and then let the projector take it up to 1080p.

So how would you suggest hooking up an RS1 which does everything except an anamorphic stretch? I have an HD+ I could use 720p and 1080i for all the HD sources, stretch and then pass it to the projector.
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post #16 of 26 Old 02-12-2007, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raoul View Post

So how would you suggest hooking up an RS1 which does everything except an anamorphic stretch? I have an HD+ I could use 720p and 1080i for all the HD sources, stretch and then pass it to the projector.

Yes, this would work. Be aware, however, that the HD+ does not do proper inverse telecine deinterlacing for 1080i source content. It scales each individual field to the output resolution.

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post #17 of 26 Old 02-12-2007, 08:43 AM
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raoul,

so if it comes with a great processor, why do you need an additional one?

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post #18 of 26 Old 02-12-2007, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oferlaor View Post

so if it comes with a great processor, why do you need an additional one?

He basically just wants something that will do aspect ratio control for 2.35:1 CIH. The projector's internal processor doesn't offer the necessary vertical stretch.

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post #19 of 26 Old 02-12-2007, 11:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oferlaor View Post

raoul,

so if it comes with a great processor, why do you need an additional one?

Quite simple: It doesn't support a stretch mode for an in place anamorphic lens. It's idiotic that the JVC doesn't support it internally, the chip can do it. It's the same chip, Gennum, used in many top notch processors. Why they aren't supporting it is a mystery to most of us. They should also be supporting customized LUTs but they aren't doing that either.
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post #20 of 26 Old 02-12-2007, 11:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

He basically just wants something that will do aspect ratio control for 2.35:1 CIH. The projector's internal processor doesn't offer the necessary vertical stretch.

Yes. Exactly!
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post #21 of 26 Old 02-12-2007, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Yes, this would work. Be aware, however, that the HD+ does not do proper inverse telecine deinterlacing for 1080i source content. It scales each individual field to the output resolution.

would that be for video based content...I thought the Lumagens were supposed to be great with film based material???

Dan
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post #22 of 26 Old 02-12-2007, 12:41 PM
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would that be for video based content...I thought the Lumagens were supposed to be great with film based material???

The HD+ isn't made by Lumagen - it's a DVDO product.
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post #23 of 26 Old 02-12-2007, 03:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Yes, this would work. Be aware, however, that the HD+ does not do proper inverse telecine deinterlacing for 1080i source content. It scales each individual field to the output resolution.

So, with 1080i, once scaled, will my projector's processor handle the deinterlacing properly?

R-S
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post #24 of 26 Old 02-12-2007, 03:34 PM
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So, with 1080i, once scaled, will my projector's processor handle the deinterlacing properly?

No. Once the "damage" is done in the deinterlacing stage, it is unrecoverable.
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post #25 of 26 Old 02-13-2007, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raoul View Post

So, with 1080i, once scaled, will my projector's processor handle the deinterlacing properly?

Field scaling results in a progressive image. You'd be feeding the projector 1080p.

The difference here is that instead of combining the interlaced fields into whole frames by reverse telecine, the video processor takes the first 1920x540 interlaced field and scales it to 1920x1080. Then it takes the next 1920x540 field and also scales that to 1920x1080, with a vertical position offset. The result is better than interlaced 1080i, but not as good as properly deinterlacing the fields.

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post #26 of 26 Old 02-15-2007, 12:26 AM
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I renamed the thread to prevent users from thinking this is an actual product...

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