Denon Video Processor - Page 4 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #91 of 953 Old 01-04-2009, 09:29 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Q of BanditZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: blurayoasis.com
Posts: 15,242
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

'd say Realta, Gennum VXP, and Pioneer Kuro all are about equivalent for SD/HD video via these tests.

I may have missed it, but which Kuro? Would a Kuro owner like myself basically not get much if anything out of a device like this. I guess that's a big salute to the Kuro if that's the case.

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
Q of BanditZ is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #92 of 953 Old 01-04-2009, 10:03 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Q of BanditZ View Post

I may have missed it, but which Kuro? Would a Kuro owner like myself basically not get much if anything out of a device like this. I guess that's a big salute to the Kuro if that's the case.


Kuro 4280. The deinterlacing should be the same though independent of model native resolution i.e. 1080i is deinterlaced to 1080p, 480i is deinterlaced to 480p as the first step. It's important to distinguish that this was referring to VIDEO deinterlacing. Realta/602ci is superior to Kuro 4280 with FILM deinterlacing. Cadence pickup is almost instantaneous and 1080p24 conversion of both 1080i and 480i/p film sources is the best and most consistent I have seen.

It's possible that 2nd gen Kuro may do a little better with film sources. Kuro processing certainly is excellent.
Does your Kuro produce 1080p24 from SD/HD film sources without artifacts/stuttering i.e. Purecinema advanced mode?
cpcat is offline  
post #93 of 953 Old 01-04-2009, 10:06 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Q of BanditZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: blurayoasis.com
Posts: 15,242
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

Does your Kuro produce 1080p24 from SD/HD film sources without artifacts/stuttering i.e. Purecinema advanced mode?

As far as I'm concerned it does.

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
Q of BanditZ is offline  
post #94 of 953 Old 01-04-2009, 10:28 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Maybe 2nd gen (I assume your PRO111 is 2nd gen) has improved this. My 4280 does OK but you can see intermittent jerkiness/stuttering with most viewing which always bothered me. Additionally, "advanced" mode seems to engage some sort of contrast limiting on the Kuro i.e. the picture dims slightly which always bothered me as well.
cpcat is offline  
post #95 of 953 Old 01-04-2009, 10:35 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Q of BanditZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: blurayoasis.com
Posts: 15,242
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

Maybe 2nd gen (I assume your PRO111 is 2nd gen) has improved this. My 4280 does OK but you can see intermittent jerkiness/stuttering with most viewing which always bothered me. Additionally, "advanced" mode seems to engage some sort of contrast limiting on the Kuro i.e. the picture dims slightly which always bothered me as well.

Hmmm...I haven't had any of those problems. I'm pretty sensitive to things like that. The only way the picture would dim slightly here for me is if I put the set into one of the two Power Save modes.

Great ISF Job by Chad B.
Q of BanditZ is offline  
post #96 of 953 Old 01-04-2009, 11:03 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Then, unless you need a comprehensive switching hub or maybe lipsync correction (or maybe you just like new toys) the 602ci may not make a huge difference. The Kuro has decent noise reduction. That extra money you paid was for the VP that came inside your display.

The Kuro is the new Fujitsu.
cpcat is offline  
post #97 of 953 Old 01-04-2009, 03:53 PM
AVS Special Member
 
DonoMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 3,670
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

P.S. The Lumagen Radiance XD thread title simply refers to it as "VXP". Would you like them to change that as well?

At least theirs uses the (almost) current product. (There's a GF9452 now and some of us think Lumagen needs to switch to it given that their Radiance is modular, and given its price, but that's a discussion for the Lumagen thread - feel free to go agree with me in that thread )

"Vintage" is good for wine, not for A/V equipment.

-Dan D.
DonoMan is offline  
post #98 of 953 Old 01-04-2009, 04:01 PM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonoMan View Post

At least theirs uses the (almost) current product. (There's a GF9452 now and some of us think Lumagen needs to switch to it given that their Radiance is modular, and given its price, but that's a discussion for the Lumagen thread - feel free to go agree with me in that thread )

For that amount of money, you deserve the latest and greatest. IIRC, Anthem D2V2 will also use 9452.
cpcat is offline  
post #99 of 953 Old 01-05-2009, 12:28 PM
Newbie
 
tuuna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Great thread folks!

I'm thinking about picking up the 602 if...

This is what I'm trying to do.

. I'm here in Canada we don't go DTV until 2011.
. I want to eliminate my Scientific Atlanta 4250HD STB.
. I think this box is crap the way it process' HD channels and
sometimes when it switches between 2.1 and 5.1 I hear a snap
thru my niro1000 (maybe I don't understand please correct)
. I thinking to eliminate my STB buy the Pioneer DVR-660 and use its tuner.
. Feed DVR out to 602.
. Has anyone tried this?
tuuna is offline  
post #100 of 953 Old 01-05-2009, 02:51 PM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
If you are planning to get the 602, you might try it first with your present tuner. There's no way to guarantee that it will solve the "pops" but it might. Obviously, you'll want to run ALL of your sources through the 602 if possible and use native source signal resolution to the VP so that it (the VP) is performing the processing. Finally, you'll want to be sure the VP is set to output the native resolution of your display.
cpcat is offline  
post #101 of 953 Old 01-05-2009, 06:46 PM
Newbie
 
tuuna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
cpcat:

. Thanks for the reply
. Have you ever?.... RF in thru ATSC/NTSC tuner (tuner without signal decoding) thru 602 out to view.
. Good ol' RF is 480i?

--> If you are planning to get the 602, you might try it first with your present tuner.

. I assume you mean ATSC/NTSC tuner
. The only tuner I have is through the LCD, unfortunately no signal out or loop thru and the 602 does not have an RF in. Thats why I need the Pioneer DVR - RCA out to 602.
. Not a fan of HDMI to many handshaking issues copy protection etc...
. I tried both HDMI and RCA I didn't notice a difference
. All audio was through the STB then amp via optical
. I came back to audio from my Sharp ATSC/NTSC LC46SE94U to my Niro via optical no issue here
. Could be a "hardware" issue, again SA4250HD is crap. The way it decodes uncompress' video/audio...

--> ... you'll want to run ALL of your sources through the 602 if possible and use native source signal resolution to the VP so that it (the VP) is performing the processing.

. I plan on this.

Eighty percent of my viewing is cable TV. If I could get the 602 to come near HD straight from the wall I would be happy. Most HD is bogus (my opinion). From my limited experience HD is dependant on how "footage" is shot, "cleaned up"/compressed/coded at source probably Teranex VC300, passed thru city, uncompressed/decoded at STB. I'm thinking huge signal degradation.

This weekend I wanted to test drive the 602 here in Toronto no one has it on display. I'm going to phone Denon tommorow and ask if they have shipped here locally. No way I'm dropping that kind of cash and no test drive.

Has anyone tried the Epson HQVIDPROTX3? Is it equivalent to the 602? Both have the Realta chip.
tuuna is offline  
post #102 of 953 Old 01-05-2009, 07:47 PM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
The 602ci is primarily an HDMI unit. 6 HDMI 1.3a inputs and two HDMI 1.3a outputs. You'll get best PQ w/HDMI. Second best will be component (even with 480i). It does have 2 component (1 BNC, 1 standard), 1 s-video and 1 composite video input as well.

The signal you are referring to as "RF" from the Coax still requires a tuner (analog cable, digital cable, NTSC, ATSC). The 602ci doesn't have a tuner.
cpcat is offline  
post #103 of 953 Old 01-06-2009, 04:01 PM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Well, as I indicated in the initial review, the Realta/602ci is not absolutely perfect when it come to video deinterlacing. I've noticed slight jaggies when watching HD football/basketball (especially with near-horizontal lines ie. boundary lines or the teardrop-shaped "yards to go" overlay on NBC). It's roughly equal to ABT 2010, Pio Kuro and Gennum VXP in this regard (so still good performance), but not excellent. Reon, on the other hand, seems to do the best job at this of any deinterlacer I've seen. For now, for critical viewing of HD 1080i video sources, I'll use Reon to deinterlace (Integra DTC-9.8) and still allow the 602ci to do its magic with noise reduction. This will include the SUPER BOWL obviously.

It would seem logical that the Reon performance with video deinterlacing could be matched or possibly even surpassed with added tweaks to Realta's firmware. Denon, are you listening?
cpcat is offline  
post #104 of 953 Old 01-06-2009, 04:34 PM
Member
 
ta-kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 180
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
so you can use the 2010 and the realta to gether processing the same video signal with improved results?Explain how you do this as would not both chips want to process the signal or are you going through the realta first and then cleaning up the jaggies with the 2010 afterwards?
ta-kid is offline  
post #105 of 953 Old 01-06-2009, 04:41 PM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ta-kid View Post

so you can use the 2010 and the realta to gether processing the same video signal with improved results?Explain how you do this as would not both chips want to process the signal or are you going through the realta first and then cleaning up the jaggies with the 2010 afterwards?

You misunderstood. The REON is the best at video deinterlacing (not the ABT 2010). Realta and ABT 2010 are roughly equal with video deinterlacing. Therefore, the setup would be 1080i->Realta noise reduction->Reon deinterlace to 1080p.

With the 602ci, you simply set the processor's output to equal the input resolution to allow the NR (and other picture controls) to be active with no other scaling/deinterlacing applied.
cpcat is offline  
post #106 of 953 Old 01-06-2009, 07:22 PM
Member
 
ta-kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 180
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

You misunderstood. The REON is the best at video deinterlacing (not the ABT 2010). Realta and ABT 2010 are roughly equal with video deinterlacing. Therefore, the setup would be 1080i->Realta noise reduction->Reon deinterlace to 1080p.

With the 602ci, you simply set the processor's output to equal the input resolution to allow the NR (and other picture controls) to be active with no other scaling/deinterlacing applied.

Yes I did misunderstand.I was thinking of the combo 2010 and realta which is what I would end up with if I got the Denon also.But i see how you are doing the realta/reon combo with the adjustable input/output on the denon.
So if I were to keep my Edge would a better combo be with the Reon?or the Realta with the good NR?
I guess that would be hard to answer without knowing my primary feeds,which are digital cable through a motorola 6416,SD and HD,and how much video noise I am getting or compression.I would assume there is a trade off either way.
Or maybe a better combo is a Reon and Realta.
ta-kid is offline  
post #107 of 953 Old 01-07-2009, 05:15 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ta-kid View Post

So if I were to keep my Edge would a better combo be with the Reon?or the Realta with the good NR?
I guess that would be hard to answer without knowing my primary feeds,which are digital cable through a motorola 6416,SD and HD,and how much video noise I am getting or compression.I would assume there is a trade off either way.
Or maybe a better combo is a Reon and Realta.

The combination of Reon for video deinterlacing and Realta for everything else provides the best of what's currently available as far as I can tell. Realta still does well with video deinterlacing mind you, again equal to ABT 2010, Gennum VXP, and Kuro with regards to jaggies on near-horizontal lines. However, Reon does provide an incremental improvement with this particular aspect.

Edge +Reon would provide pretty much the best of everything except noise reduction. The one thing you give up would be the stable 1080p24 conversion of film sources that Realta can provide. Edge does provide much more stable film deinterlacing overall compared to Reon however.

Edge + Realta/Denon 602ci would really not be much advantage as Realta/Denon 602ci either equals or outperforms Edge in every area IMO.
cpcat is offline  
post #108 of 953 Old 01-07-2009, 05:13 PM
Member
 
ta-kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 180
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

The combination of Reon for video deinterlacing and Realta for everything else provides the best of what's currently available as far as I can tell. Realta still does well with video deinterlacing mind you, again equal to ABT 2010, Gennum VXP, and Kuro with regards to jaggies on near-horizontal lines. However, Reon does provide an incremental improvement with this particular aspect.

Edge +Reon would provide pretty much the best of everything except noise reduction. The one thing you give up would be the stable 1080p24 conversion of film sources that Realta can provide. Edge does provide much more stable film deinterlacing overall compared to Reon however.

Edge + Realta/Denon 602ci would really not be much advantage as Realta/Denon 602ci either equals or outperforms Edge in every area IMO.

So the million dollar question now is,Is there a stand alone video processor that uses the REON HQV other then a A/V reciever?
ta-kid is offline  
post #109 of 953 Old 01-07-2009, 05:27 PM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ta-kid View Post

So the million dollar question now is,Is there a stand alone video processor that uses the REON HQV other then a A/V reciever?

Not that I'm aware of. Several displays/projectors have it though. The problem with Reon is that it really only excels at one thing, video deinterlacing. Film deinterlacing is unfortunately not its strong suit and the SD-only noise reduction isn't that great either.
cpcat is offline  
post #110 of 953 Old 01-07-2009, 06:48 PM
Advanced Member
 
mfogarty5's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 641
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 34 Post(s)
Liked: 37
cpcat,

If I read the manual correctly, it appears that users can simply press what looks like a channel up/down button to change the output resolution from 1080p24 to 1080p60. Is that correct?

Other than the Crystalio's "DynamicVP" do you know of any other processors that allow users to change the output resolution so easily?
mfogarty5 is online now  
post #111 of 953 Old 01-07-2009, 06:55 PM
Member
 
ta-kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 180
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

Not that I'm aware of. Several displays/projectors have it though. The problem with Reon is that it really only excels at one thing, video deinterlacing. Film deinterlacing is unfortunately not its strong suit and the SD-only noise reduction isn't that great either.

Well it looks like more and more the 602 is my next purchase someday,unless more improvements are made to the Edge or Santa brings me a Kuro.LOL
ta-kid is offline  
post #112 of 953 Old 01-08-2009, 03:48 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfogarty5 View Post

cpcat,

If I read the manual correctly, it appears that users can simply press what looks like a channel up/down button to change the output resolution from 1080p24 to 1080p60. Is that correct?

Other than the Crystalio's "DynamicVP" do you know of any other processors that allow users to change the output resolution so easily?

Yes, there is a toggle for output resolution which is perty nifty.

No other VP I've had would allow toggle for output res.

It also has independent assignable output resolution FOR EACH INPUT. This means you can independently set up each input including picture controls, NR, AR, etc. as well as output resolution. For example, I have the inputs for my PS3 and Tosh A1 set to output 1080p24 while the input for Sat box and OTA tuner box are set to output 1080p60.

Everything is saved for that input. In other words, if I change a picture control or output res it will be saved for that input automatically but will not effect any other input.
cpcat is offline  
post #113 of 953 Old 01-08-2009, 05:21 AM
Member
 
batborsen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 166
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
IsnĀ“t it strange that HQV:s cheaper chip reon has something it does better than their
higher end chip realta?
batborsen is offline  
post #114 of 953 Old 01-08-2009, 06:51 AM
AVS Special Member
 
DonoMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 3,670
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Not particularly. It is architecturally different and the one thing it's being said to do better is not by much. Perhaps the video deinterlacing software in the Realta implementations that cpcat has seen could be tweaked more. Or maybe the Realta doesn't even have the power to do it better. Who knows? There are some really awesome deinterlacing methods available that just take way too much power to do.

"Vintage" is good for wine, not for A/V equipment.

-Dan D.
DonoMan is offline  
post #115 of 953 Old 01-08-2009, 09:04 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I think this post from oyfoo awhile back sheds some light on this. Sorry if I've already linked this post here, I might be confused as to which thread I'm in.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...22#post7391122
cpcat is offline  
post #116 of 953 Old 01-10-2009, 08:31 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I initially didn't see any indication of a fan on the 602ci (looking at the chassis), however, last night noticed a very faint whirring coming from the unit and turns out there is a fan but it is very quiet. Also, turning "power saver" off (as recommended in the OM while using the web browser control) basically just keeps the unit on, even in standby mode, except for the front display as far as I can tell. Turning "power saver" on allows the unit to go into a true standby mode.

On another note, 1080p24 conversion continues to work well for me including utilizing progressive cadence detection for both 480p and 720p film sources.
cpcat is offline  
post #117 of 953 Old 01-11-2009, 07:17 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by oferlaor View Post

true enough, but I'd be more excited if this had happened a couple of years ago.

I'm a lot more cynical about HQV's implementation.

You really cannot compare something like Lumagen/PixelMagic/DVDO processor featureset to HQV featureset anymore. The HQV featureset has stayed static while these three companies moved much further.

At this point, I'm confidently able to disagree with this statement. At least as far as PQ factors are concerned (deinterlacing, scaling, noise reduction) Realta not only "compares" but outperforms. With the caveat that I've not seen/tested VXP 9450 (but have owned/extensively tested the 9350 based Anthem AVM50 and ABT 2010-based DVDO Edge) Realta/Denon 602ci is either equal or superior to both ABT 2010 and Gennum/Sigma VXP in the important areas of scaling, deinterlacing, and noise reduction.

Reon (yes, REON) remains the best I've seen at minimizing jaggies with near-diagonal lines with both SD and HD video deinterlacing.

The combination of REON/REALTA appears to provide the ultimate performance in all areas. Therefore, "HQV" as it were, certainly "compares".

Realta/Denon 602ci is only surpassed by any other in one area of performance and that happens to also be by a chip bearing the "HQV" logo (video deinterlacing, slightly bested by REON).

I would love to hear that Gennum/Sigma 9450 has made significant improvements in these areas. I'd particularly be interested in how 9450 performs with the HQV HD film resolution loss test (the 9350 could not pass this test). I understand that some (including Gennum) held that this test "did not matter" as it wasn't "real world material" or was even "biased towards Silicon Optix". However, my own testing shows that most every quality deinterlacing solution out there PASSES this test. This includes Reon, Realta, ABT 2010, Sony, and Pio Kuro.

I would also love to hear the HQV test results of noise reduction on the new VXP 9450 as this was supposedly one of its major upgrades from the 9350.
cpcat is offline  
post #118 of 953 Old 01-11-2009, 09:31 AM
AVS Special Member
 
dazzerxxx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,549
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

I would love to hear that Gennum/Sigma 9450 has made significant improvements in these areas. I'd particularly be interested in how 9450 performs with the HQV HD film resolution loss test (the 9350 could not pass this test). I understand that some (including Gennum) held that this test "did not matter" as it wasn't "real world material" or was even "biased towards Silicon Optix". .

I have the HQV test disc for HD DVD. I ran the range of tests on a Tosh HD-A1 @ 1080i/60 to a Radiance. I'd need to dig out my notes to confirm FW versions but it passed the various tests. Re the resolution test you mention there's no reolution loss with video/Film SMPTE 133 patterns or the panning stadium material.

The directional texture/edge enhancement is also an interesting feature. At low settings it has a very subtle effect (crisper/more dimensinonal) on the image without introducing visible artefacts (that I could see) using the Imatest patterns. In fact comparing the effect of this feature lead me to believe that some Blu-ray players appear to post enhance the image compared to others to achieve a certain look. It was interesting to change the settings and make the players image look similar. The noise reduction is also very subtle/more refined compared to the ABT2010 solution I also use.

D
dazzerxxx is offline  
post #119 of 953 Old 01-11-2009, 11:08 AM
AVS Special Member
 
cpcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Vidalia, GA
Posts: 6,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by dazzerxxx View Post

I have the HQV test disc for HD DVD. I ran the range of tests on a Tosh HD-A1 @ 1080i/60 to a Radiance. I'd need to dig out my notes to confirm FW versions but it passed the various tests. Re the resolution test you mention there's no reolution loss with video/Film SMPTE 133 patterns or the panning stadium material.

The directional texture/edge enhancement is also an interesting feature. At low settings it has a very subtle effect (crisper/more dimensinonal) on the image without introducing visible artefacts (that I could see) using the Imatest patterns. In fact comparing the effect of this feature lead me to believe that some Blu-ray players appear to post enhance the image compared to others to achieve a certain look. It was interesting to change the settings and make the players image look similar. The noise reduction is also very subtle/more refined compared to the ABT2010 solution I also use.

D

It's good to hear the Radiance/9450 passes the HQV nr tests and the film resolution loss test. The 9350 failed the latter test by causing vertical bands to appear on the edges of the horizontal line boxes at the four corners of the pattern. Your last statement caught my eye though. Do you mean the ABT2010 reduces more overall noise or that the 9450 reduces noise without changing the image? The ABT2010 afterall doesn't incorporate temporal NR but only MNR.


The detail enhancement feature on the Realta is also very good when used at conservative settings. It is applied on a per-pixel basis according to the Realta marketing speak. At +3 out of 12 it partially compensates for the common oversoftening I see with 720p football. Although, I've experimented with the Realta's edge enhancement (sharpness control) quite a bit, I've still found that I prefer leaving it at zero.
cpcat is offline  
post #120 of 953 Old 01-11-2009, 12:28 PM
AVS Special Member
 
dazzerxxx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,549
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpcat View Post

Do you mean the ABT2010 reduces more overall noise or that the 9450 reduces noise without changing the image? The ABT2010 afterall doesn't incorporate temporal NR but only MNR.

No.

I was referring to the ABT mosquito noise reduction as it appears to affect image detail. It's limited to off, low or high whereas the Radiance offers indenedant 2D/3D, mosquito and block noise adjustable on a range from 0 to 31 and this is what I mean my subtle.

D
dazzerxxx is offline  
Reply Video Processors

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off