Album art embedded in wav files - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 17 Old 11-20-2008, 07:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Is there any way to embed album art in wav files? I have recorded all of my cd's this way in order to preserve the original recording. WMP 11 has downloaded all the album art and shows it properly when playing back. But when I use an extender such as the PS3, the album info shows up, but not the art. Everytime my library gets a little screwy, WMP always has to re-donload the art, so I assume the info is being stored in the WMP and not the actual file. Is there anyway to store this info in the file to make it work properly with everything?
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post #2 of 17 Old 11-20-2008, 09:08 AM
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nope.... WAV does not support tagging or pics

SEan
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post #3 of 17 Old 11-20-2008, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sean_w_smith View Post

nope.... WAV does not support tagging or pics

SEan

I'm curious then how it is that WMP shows the album art and song title data for WAV files just as it does for MP3 or other taggable files ? Is it simply the case that tagging is not necessary for WMP but it would be if moving the WAV files to another media player ?

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post #4 of 17 Old 11-20-2008, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stash64 View Post

I'm curious then how it is that WMP shows the album art and song title data for WAV files just as it does for MP3 or other taggable files ? Is it simply the case that tagging is not necessary for WMP but it would be if moving the WAV files to another media player ?

If it rips the CD it knows the artist and album from the serial #.

A player could also try to use physical directory information and filename information to try build a database.

I didn't write WMP but I can guarantee there is no tags in Wav. you really should consider a more robust lossless codec. you'll cut your space requirements in 1/2 and have robust tagging and cover art with any of the popular choices.

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post #5 of 17 Old 11-20-2008, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sean_w_smith View Post

If it rips the CD it knows the artist and album from the serial #.

A player could also try to use physical directory information and filename information to try build a database.

I didn't write WMP but I can guarantee there is no tags in Wav. you really should consider a more robust lossless codec. you'll cut your space requirements in 1/2 and have robust tagging and cover art with any of the popular choices.

Sean

I did rip all my albums to FLAC but then I decided, after the fact, to use WMP as my music server software on a mini PC. After all that work, I am now ripping to WAV. The main reason for using WMP is that I am intending to use the new Gyration Air Music Remote to access my music library. It only works with iTunes or WMP. I guess I could have ripped to WMA lossless, but I had not heard anything positive about the WMA format.

Sean
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post #6 of 17 Old 11-21-2008, 07:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stash64 View Post

I guess I could have ripped to WMA lossless, but I had not heard anything positive about the WMA format.

WMA Lossless is just that, lossless. It has the exact same audio quality of the WAV file, in half the size. You can convert WAV to WMA Lossless and not lose any quality.

You might want to give it a try. You will lose nothing, but you will gain ability to correctly store track tags and album art. If you choose to move to iTunes, you can even convert the WMA Lossless tracks to Apple Lossless and still not lose any quality.

Chris
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post #7 of 17 Old 11-21-2008, 09:22 AM - Thread Starter
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I had thought about going the WMA lossless route, but then I would have been stuck in Microsoft land, I was trying to insure that my ripping of cd's would be future proof. That being said, I have found mp3 conversion tools that will bulk convert my wav files. I was hoping to find one that could use the info in the wave file to automatically embed the file tags.
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post #8 of 17 Old 11-21-2008, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galager View Post

I had thought about going the WMA lossless route, but then I would have been stuck in Microsoft land, I was trying to insure that my ripping of cd's would be future proof. That being said, I have found mp3 conversion tools that will bulk convert my wav files. I was hoping to find one that could use the info in the wave file to automatically embed the file tags.

not possible.

dbpoweramp is a great tool for converting between lossy and lossless formats... Use it all the time...

http://www.dbpoweramp.com/dmc.htm

Sean
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post #9 of 17 Old 11-21-2008, 01:55 PM - Thread Starter
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so basically as far as anyone knows, there is no way to extract the info from wmp to embed into the wav file? I'm just going to have to do it manually, huh. What a PITA. It's too bad you can't rip into two files at once. I'd like to have a wav file for my home stereo system and everything copied into mp3 for my ipod/car/whatever.
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post #10 of 17 Old 11-21-2008, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galager View Post

so basically as far as anyone knows, there is no way to extract the info from wmp to embed into the wav file? I'm just going to have to do it manually, huh. What a PITA. It's too bad you can't rip into two files at once. I'd like to have a wav file for my home stereo system and everything copied into mp3 for my ipod/car/whatever.

There maybe someway to extract it from WMP but I dont know.

Prorams like MediaMonkey will rip to FLAC, WMA Lossless etc and then transcode to MP3 on the fly when synching to your IPOD etc so you only have to maintain one lossless copy and then it creates lossy copies when needed.

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post #11 of 17 Old 11-21-2008, 08:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisL01 View Post

WMA Lossless is just that, lossless. It has the exact same audio quality of the WAV file, in half the size. You can convert WAV to WMA Lossless and not lose any quality.

You might want to give it a try. You will lose nothing, but you will gain ability to correctly store track tags and album art. If you choose to move to iTunes, you can even convert the WMA Lossless tracks to Apple Lossless and still not lose any quality.

Chris

The hard drive space-savings is not too big a deal for me. It would amount to 30-40 GB for a lossless format (i.e. FLAC) instead of 60-70 GB for WAV. I do understand that the lossless formats are suppose to be bit-for-bit identical to WAV but oddly the FLAC and WAV files sound different to me. And I was also surprised that both formats sound different than playback of a CD through my DVD or Blu-Ray player, particularly the FLAC files. The WAV files sound a little more CD like.

For the FLAC and WAV files, I'm using the same exact equipment and same path (optical) with the only difference being the playback software. I was using WinAmp for the FLAC files and WMP 11 for the WAV files. For both media players, I tried to turn off any and all settings that appeared to alter or process the bitstream... such as EQ settings. It puzzles me that there should be any difference in sound if I am indeed sending a pure and unaltered digital signal to my receiver.

I should also mention that my WAV files are working perfectly with the Gyration Air Music Remote, though I had a bit of a scare. I transferred about 40GB of WAV files from an external hard drive to the mini PC I am using as a music server. I did this piece-meal rather than transferring the entire WAV music folder. That was a mistake as the song to album associations got all screwed up even though everything looked fine "folder-wise". I erased these files and then transferred the complete WAV music folder. That did the trick... all the songs and album art came out where they should be. And I was very happy to see that the Air Music Remote properly read all this data. It shows all the correct playlists, albums, etc in the LCD window and even provides a "Now Playing" graphic with ticker. Bottom line, I don't think WAV is too bad an option if you plan to live and play in the Microsoft realm with WMP.

Sean
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post #12 of 17 Old 11-21-2008, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galager View Post

so basically as far as anyone knows, there is no way to extract the info from wmp to embed into the wav file? I'm just going to have to do it manually, huh. What a PITA. It's too bad you can't rip into two files at once. I'd like to have a wav file for my home stereo system and everything copied into mp3 for my ipod/car/whatever.

It doesn't matter how you get the metadata - you can't write it into a WAV file: the file format simply doesn't support metadata. A .WAV file contains digital audio samples, period - no tags, no metadata, no images, unlike almost every other audio file format.

Some media players can store metadata ABOUT a .WAV file - but that data is stored in the media player's database, and cannot be written into the audio file itself.
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post #13 of 17 Old 12-14-2008, 12:26 AM
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hmm i didn' think you could get album art with wmp...
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post #14 of 17 Old 12-14-2008, 07:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stash64 View Post

I do understand that the lossless formats are suppose to be bit-for-bit identical to WAV but oddly the FLAC and WAV files sound different to me.

I have ripped all of my music to WMA Lossless a couple of years ago. When I got a new reciever (Denon AVR-4308ci) I decided to test to see if I could hear a difference. So, I put a CD in my Denon CD changer, and cued up the same song from the media server. After level balancing (very important!), I could switch back and forth and couldn't tell a difference.

I was pleased by this because the path is somewhat longer going via the media server:

CD -> Windows Media Player -> WMA Lossless -> hard disk -> TVersity -> WAVE -> network -> AVR -> speakers

As opposed to:

CD -> AVR -> speakers

But when all is said and done, the ripped version sounded identical to the CD. And it certainly is faster and a lot more convenient to navigate through the media center than walking upstairs and finding the correct disk.

Mike
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post #15 of 17 Old 12-14-2008, 10:44 AM
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I'm having an album art issue too, I'm very new to this and trying to muddle my way through. I've got the Linksys NAS200 as a server and the Denon AVP and I'm using dbpoweramp to rip to FLAC. It took me a while but I finally got the files to list properly on the AVP menu so I can search by artist, album or song but now I have no album art being displayed on the Denon. When I go into the server and check the files the album arts' JPEG is there. I did get album art to display before (no idea how) and it would do so once I selected a track to play - but not any more. It would be nice to have album art to show not only when the track is selected but also in the "album" menu.

Any guidance would be very appreciated.
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post #16 of 17 Old 12-16-2008, 09:26 PM
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bump.
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post #17 of 17 Old 01-05-2009, 05:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galager View Post

It's too bad you can't rip into two files at once. I'd like to have a wav file for my home stereo system and everything copied into mp3 for my ipod/car/whatever.

?! You can. I've done it for years.
EAC rips a CD to .wav and then invokes LAME to compress it to .mp3, passing the metadata as well.
Unless you configure the software to delete the intermediate .wav file, you will have both.

Mmmmm .wav at home (album art in folder) and mp3 on the road.

As for tagging .wav files, I dimly recall something about a .riff format . . . .
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