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post #61 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 04:42 AM
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The 2g has been officially jailbroken.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/01/a...ut-how-to-run/
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post #62 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 05:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmcd View Post

Are you talking about a high profile 720p m4v file ( such as one sees floating around the net in mkv format)? I thought the ATV 2g only supported main profile ( similar to the 1 g except you also 30fps support with the 2g model).

These are m4v files I've created using Handbrake, using an uncompressed Blu-ray 1080p rip as a source. The original rip was I believe done with an AnyDVD trial, and then passed through something else, such that it eventually ended up as a .ts file with just the Dolby Digital soundtrack (I forget some of the details, because I did that leg of it a while ago and have since been using MakeMKV for my more recent Blu-ray rips).

I created several flavors of the m4v file using Handbrake. A couple of different 720p encodes using the Handbrake nightly build's High Profile setting, as well as a 1080p encode. I could load the 1080p encode into iTunes, but it wouldn't let me sync it to my iPhone 4. All of my 720p encodes would sync to my iPhone 4 and appeared to play perfectly. Again, these were encoded in Handbrake using the "High Profile" setting, and not the older Apple TV setting. The A4 chip used in the new aTV, iPhone 4, iPad, and newest gen iPod Touch is believed to be able to handle higher bitrate content as compared to the older Apple TV.

As I said though, while these encodes appeared to play smoothly on my iPhone 4, I'm getting dropped frames or occasional judder (or something) when I play them on my new aTV. Letting the entire video get copied to the aTV's buffer does not change this.

One "advantage" that my aTV has over my iPhone 4 is that I can play my 1080p encode, but it has the same sort of playback issue (perhaps more frequently, I don't remember) and it's being downscaled to 720p, so there's no real advantage for me there anyway.

Last night I re-encoded my movie yet again, but this time used the old Apple TV setting. I did change the RF slider to 21 and set the video width to 1280. All other options were left as-is (again, this is using a recent nightly build of Handbrake). I tried that encode this morning but am still having the same playback issues.

I then went and played another HD movie trailer (for Alpha and Omega). I watched it very carefully and don't believe I saw any playback issues. I then tried the HD Avatar trailer again. Of note, both trailers streamed without needing to rebuffer this time (Avatar had paused midway through to catch up on the buffer both times I tried it last night), so either Apple's servers were getting hammered last night or my cable modem's downstream was slower last night than it was this morning. Back to the subject....the Avatar trailer appeared to play back perfectly smooth, with no "judder" issues.

So based on this *very* limited bit of testing, it seems like Apple's streaming HD content is not experiencing any "judder" issues, but my encodes are. But my encodes are also not displaying "judder" issues when played on my Acer Revo nettop or on my iPhone 4. Hopefully a lot of other people will run into this issue and complain loudly and Apple will manage to fix it in a firmware update. Or perhaps the Handbrake team will need to tweak something on their end or provide further guidance on how some of the settings should be configured when doing an encode to make the video more "compatible" with the new aTV. I'm wondering, could this be a 24 vs 23.97 type of issue, or related to the fact that the aTV sends a 720 60Hz signal to the TV?

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post #63 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 09:54 AM
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Don't know if anyones' seen this yet but................

http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com...1334&gt1=33002

iTv/ATV3 has 8gig storage???
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post #64 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 09:55 AM
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bodosom, you should post more outside links in your first few posts. There are some good ones shared in this thread already. Links to outside reviews may be nice (though I'm finding that none of them seem to be offering anything that we don't already know). There are links about it being jailbroken, etc., all of which could be useful info in the 1st post here.

Some other info that would be useful to add to the first post would be some useful tips/features that aren't documented in Apple's user guide or immediately obvious in the UI. I do not own a 1st gen unit, so it's possible that these work identically there, but I suspect that there are a large number of us with little/no experience with the 1st gen unit.

So here are a couple of things I found:
1) When playing a movie, you can press up on the D-Pad to bring the REW/FF/status bar on-screen.
2) When playing a movie, you can press down on the D-Pad to bring another variation of this status bar on screen which has chapter marks. Using the left/right D-Pad buttons, you can skip chapters this way.
3) If you know of a specific chapter number you want to jump to, you can press and hold the select button and this will bring a chapter list on screen. It looks like there's the ability for it to display thumbnail images that correspond to each chapter, and I suspect that rented movies make use of this, but it only shows a snapshot of the opening sequence of my movie for my homemade rips. Can chapter thumbnails be added either via Handbrake or inside of iTunes?

I think these *are* documented in the manual, but for those who didn't bother reading it:
4) Pressing/holding the select button from the main menu appears to put the unit to sleep. I'm not sure if there's any power savings advantage to this.
5) The MENU button acts as a "back" function most of the time. Pressing/holding the MENU button will bring you back to the home screen.

For those of you dead set against renting movies or TV shows because of the cost, something you may not know is that there are discounted/free rentals available:

* For movies, you'll need to use the iTunes app to find them (the aTV UI does not provide any way to filter the list to only discounted movies). For example, I found "The Other Man" available for rent for $1.99 in HD. Note to Netflix subscribers: It's quite likely that you'll also find that many of these discounted movies are available for streaming in Netflix. But if it's a movie you want to rent and want to see in HD, it might still be worth paying $2 for the rental in iTunes, since the PQ ought to be significantly better than what Netflix can deliver.

* For TV shows, the aTV UI shows a category called "Free Episodes" where you'll find, um, free episodes of some shows (e.g., the pilot to "No Ordinary Family" is there in HD right now).

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post #65 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mayhem13 View Post

Don't know if anyones' seen this yet but................

http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com...1334&gt1=33002

iTv/ATV3 has 8gig storage???


That is a gigantic amount if storage for a sub $100 device.

39TB unRAID1--53TB unRAID2--36TB unRAID3

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post #66 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 12:04 PM
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We've also already discussed the storage in the other thread. Nothing imaginable to do with the device is going to have issues with that much storage. You'll never be storing your songs or videos on it. If they do support apps down the road, 2GB will likely be plenty. Most of it, I'm sure, is there for buffering internet-based content (and local content) and since there is no high-bit-rate BluRay coming down the pipe from Apple, 8GB is plenty.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
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post #67 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by palehorse View Post

The 2g has been officially jailbroken.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/01/a...ut-how-to-run/

This is really interesting. It certainly didn't take long. I haven't played with a jail broken iPhone but does that mean you can ssh into it?

Philip
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post #68 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmcd View Post


This is really interesting. It certainly didn't take long. I haven't played with a jail broken iPhone but does that mean you can ssh into it?

Philip

Yes, I read yesterday that ssh has already been successful.
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post #69 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 03:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post

That is a gigantic amount if storage for a sub $100 device.

just as interesting imho is the empty slot right next to the 8 gb. it looks like room for future models w/ more storage. (2x8gb=16gb models in the future?)
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post #70 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpatky View Post

just as interesting imho is the empty slot right next to the 8 gb. it looks like room for future models w/ more storage. (2x8gb=16gb models in the future?)

It looks like the board might be used in the iPad as well which starts at 16GB.

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post #71 of 3162 Old 10-01-2010, 10:16 PM
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I haven't been able to get 5.1 working out of the HDMI connection.

So far I've fiddled with setting the Dolby Digital output from Auto to On, but that didn't seem to work. Anyone else find have this problem?

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post #72 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 12:41 AM
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I've only played one 5.1 file so far (my digital copy of Star Trek). It played fine in 5.1. My Apple TV's Dolby Digital output is set to "On" and it is hooked up via HDMI.
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post #73 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 05:47 AM
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Does Netflix stream in 5.1 (when available)? I compared the same Netflix movie streamed on my PS3 to it streamed on the aTV. 5.1 is available on the former, but not clear whether it is on the latter. All I got was stereo from the aTV, and the UI gave no indication to what audio tracks are available.

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post #74 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 06:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPresseau View Post

Does Netflix stream in 5.1 (when available)?

Last I heard Netflix doesn't do 5.1... perhaps supported down the road.

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post #75 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 06:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

Last I heard Netflix doesn't do 5.1... perhaps supported down the road.

They announced 1080p/5.1 in early 2010, but I think we're still waiting...? (I don't have Netflix yet, so I don't know)
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post #76 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 06:49 AM
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Netflix is definitely doing 5.1 on the PS3 now

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post #77 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 06:51 AM
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Well, if I understand MPresseau correctly, I believe he's (assuming he's a "he") saying that he is getting 5.1 on his PS3 using Netflix. If so, it's possible that Sony has better Netflix features in this regard. Hopefully that would come to the Apple TV later, but it's not too reassuring since the Apple TV just came out and has one of the best Netflix integrations out there, IMO, so that might leave me to think that it's intentionally hobbled by Apple so as to serve as an "advantage" for the TV show/movie rentals through the iTunes store.

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post #78 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 07:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srauly View Post

Well, if I understand MPresseau correctly, I believe he's (assuming he's a "he") saying that he is getting 5.1 on his PS3 using Netflix. If so, it's possible that Sony has better Netflix features in this regard. Hopefully that would come to the Apple TV later, but it's not too reassuring since the Apple TV just came out and has one of the best Netflix integrations out there, IMO, so that might leave me to think that it's intentionally hobbled by Apple so as to serve as an "advantage" for the TV show/movie rentals through the iTunes store.

I certainly wouldn't put it past them to do exactly that. They're not exactly shy about intentionally gimping all of their iOS devices.
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post #79 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 08:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

It looks like the board might be used in the iPad as well which starts at 16GB.

Do you mean literally the same board? The photos of them are certainly completely different.


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post #80 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 09:00 AM
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There's a thread in Apple's support forum where a couple of other people have reported seeing the same dropped frame / stutter issue that I talked about:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread....99423&tstart=0

I really hope that this is something that they can fix in a firmware update. I'm pretty certain that my iPhone 4 plays these videos without any issue, which gives me hope, but the iPhone 4 also has twice the aTV's RAM, so I asked in that forum if one of those users also had an iPad and could confirm whether it has the issue (since the iPad has the same amount of RAM as the aTV).

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post #81 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 09:20 AM
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I'm very happy with the new atv so far. How it works with the remote app is slick and very useful.

A lot of nice touches like how the volume control works for multi room (I have 2 of the new units), among other things. The video quality is good viewing on my 1080p (raaawwwwk, 1080p parrot!) projector.

So far I haven't experienced any gimped or mediocre behaviour, but I'll keep looking.
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post #82 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 10:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by srauly View Post

so that might leave me to think that it's intentionally hobbled by Apple so as to serve as an "advantage" for the TV show/movie rentals through the iTunes store.

Or they had bandwidth targets plus real-time streaming demands. I tried Netflix and I'd cheerfully trade AC3 for better video quality but at this point you get neither. It doesn't even manage DVD quality and is completely unacceptable on my television (50") and it stalled once. Hence it's not nearly as good as an iTunes SD stream.

Quote:
Originally Posted by srauly View Post

There's a thread in Apple's support forum where a couple of other people have reported seeing the same dropped frame / stutter issue that I talked about

I've watched about three hours of locally streamed HD content on my 2G with no (apparent to me) issues.


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post #83 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 10:23 AM
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I would recommend you *not* look for the issues I described, as you'll probably then see it a lot and then be unhappy. I can't help but look for it, and then when I see it, it bugs me.

As far as Netflix is concerned, I'd consider it to be sub-DVD quality, but usually still bearable (even on my 52" display viewed within about 10-12'), but I don't know that I'd be happy watching too much of it on my 92" screen. I believe, though, that it does some initial auto-detection of your bandwidth limitations and so, in your case, it may be sending you lower quality than what I get since your downstream speed is fairly low.

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post #84 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

Do you mean literally the same board? The photos of them are certainly completely different.

I don't think it's identical. The few breakdowns I have seen noted that the layout is very close outside of a few connectors (and such) missing

With that said, here are the big takeaways we're seeing so far: 8GB of storage provided care of a Samsung K9LCG08U1M NAND Flash chip, and the same one found in the iPad. Speaking of which, there's also the exact same markings on its Apple A4 processor as the iPad and new iPod touch, K4X2G643GE (not the same as the iPhone 4, as it turns out), the exact same Broadcom BCM4329XKUBG 802.11n WiFi / Bluetooth / FM chip as the iPad, and at 256MB, the same amount of RAM. Also interesting and of note are the solder pads near the side of the logic board, which look to be a perfect fit for an Apple dock connector.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/09/29/a...age-256mb-ram/
http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Apple...eardown/3625/1

FYI: My local Fry's has roughly a dozen in stock which can easily be overlooked since the box is so small.

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post #85 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPresseau View Post

Netflix is definitely doing 5.1 on the PS3 now

What title are you getting 5.1 with?

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post #86 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

Or they had bandwidth targets plus real-time streaming demands. I tried Netflix and I'd cheerfully trade AC3 for better video quality but at this point you get neither. It doesn't even manage DVD quality and is completely unacceptable on my television (50") and it stalled once. Hence it's not nearly as good as an iTunes SD stream.

I've watched about three hours of locally streamed HD content on my 2G with no (apparent to me) issues.

Do they supply video quality based on bandwidth (ie they supply a lesser quality if your bandwidth is low or drops during the stream)? Some of the services do, it would make sense if netflix does as well.
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post #87 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

FYI: My local Fry's has roughly a dozen in stock which can easily be overlooked since the box is so small.

Yeah, I've mentioned that the Apple TV can be viewed as a must-have "accessory" for iOS devices (true moreso once AirPlay is released), but I think they did a poor job of packaging the box. I can sort of see wanting to keep the box as tiny as possible (to advertise how tiny the Apple TV itself is), but the box is extremely bland and doesn't draw any attention to itself. It will blend in with docks and other boring accessories on the store shelves.

But none of that may matter if Apple starts advertising it on TV and if they can get some retailers to set up working displays to show it off.

Interesting to know that Fry's has them. Amazon is still showing them as not in stock, and a search on Best Buy's site doesn't pull them up (though it's possible they may have them in stores).

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post #88 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 11:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Francisd View Post

Do they supply video quality based on bandwidth (ie they supply a lesser quality if your bandwidth is low or drops during the stream)?

Yes - Netflix dynamically adjusts their allocated bandwidth (video quality) to match what bandwidth you have available (within reason). I have limited bandwidth and typically the quality will improve after a few minutes. My guess is once Netflix acquires a more accurate reading of what's available it increases the bandwidth. Hulu Plus lets you select what bandwidth you want to use per title (typically three or four to pick from). If it buffers a couple of times it asks if you want to adjust your setting.

For whatever reason Hulu Plus using the same bandwidth as Netflix (I can view bandwidth on a 5-minute basis) looks dramatically better. Perhaps if you have more bandwidth available it might not be the case. After seeing Hulu Plus I'm a little turned-off with Netflix's streaming quality. Up until then I blamed my limited bandwidth which is largely responsible but Hulu Plus proved there is a lot of room for improvement.

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post #89 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 01:25 PM
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MPresseau, you may want to take a look at this thread in the Apple forums:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread....99006&tstart=0

It's not specific to Netflix, but some people have had problems getting 5.1 audio working in general, and some have had luck getting it to work by trying some of the suggestions mentioned in that thread.

I haven't yet tried my aTV in the one room I have with 5.1 audio, but will try that later.

Scott R
--------------
I'd much rather watch a great movie in B&W at 240 lines of resolution than a lousy movie in 1080p with lossless audio.
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post #90 of 3162 Old 10-02-2010, 03:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

I don't think it's identical. The few breakdowns I have seen noted that the layout is very close outside of a few connectors (and such) missing

I suppose it depends on "very close". Of the larger parts they do have an A4, Samsung NAND and a Broadcom network part in common.

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