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post #6271 of 6296 Old 08-16-2014, 06:34 AM
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Originally Posted by anam8tr View Post
Hi everyone. My membership just ran out on AnyDvd HD and for another 2 years it's almost $90. Does anyone have any suggestions on a more permanent solution for ripping a 1:1 BDMV folder format (playing on PCH c-200)? I do like that Slysoft updates all the time with new codes but $100 every 2 years is pretty steep.

Thanks !!!
Its not very much more to buy a lifetime license.
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post #6272 of 6296 Old 08-16-2014, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by anam8tr View Post
Hi everyone. My membership just ran out on AnyDvd HD and for another 2 years it's almost $90. Does anyone have any suggestions on a more permanent solution for ripping a 1:1 BDMV folder format (playing on PCH c-200)? I do like that Slysoft updates all the time with new codes but $100 every 2 years is pretty steep.

Thanks !!!
DId they stop having lifetime subscriptions? I got a lifetime option with Any DVD HD many, many years ago. It has paid for itself many times over.

EDIT: I just checked. They do still have a lifetime option. Although it is more than I paid six years ago. I see it's only around $160US (119 Euros) with the current exchange rate. Which is still a very good deal. Plus they usually have big discount sales at certain times of the year. I know when I got my license I waited for a sale which reduced the price.

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post #6273 of 6296 Old 08-16-2014, 08:05 AM
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Thanks guys. May have to bite the bullet and get lifetime. On sale now for $130.
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post #6274 of 6296 Old 08-16-2014, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anam8tr View Post
Hi everyone. My membership just ran out on AnyDvd HD and for another 2 years it's almost $90. Does anyone have any suggestions on a more permanent solution for ripping a 1:1 BDMV folder format (playing on PCH c-200)? I do like that Slysoft updates all the time with new codes but $100 every 2 years is pretty steep.
If you buy a lifetime license you will never pay again.

But seriously, if you think $50/yr is too steep, then you are in the wrong hobby.
Don't you pay a lot more than that per year just to buy the BluRays you rip?

You do buy them, don't you?

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post #6275 of 6296 Old 08-16-2014, 07:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
If you buy a lifetime license you will never pay again.

But seriously, if you think $50/yr is too steep, then you are in the wrong hobby.
Don't you pay a lot more than that per year just to buy the BluRays you rip?

You do buy them, don't you?


Not to mention the hard drive space.


I had a newbie ask me if this whole thing was worth it. At the time I had written this my initial post, I hadn't really researched the legality of it all. Given the questionable legality issues, I had to reply no. A 200 movie archive, which I think is fairly tame, cost somewhere in the $3-$4K range depending on the price of the BD. The HD space needed is somewhere around 11TB ( I have 16TB capacity without any backup). I also buy the digital version of any movie that I buy just to try to remain as square with the law as I can. So that is additional expense. Then there is the expense of the media players, the servers, etc. These breakdown and have to be replaced. So it's not an overwhelmingly expensive hobby but it isn't cheap either. I think I enjoy the process of making my media collection more than I actually watch any of the movies on it (I mean really am I going to watch that many BDs?). Given that, I've started to think that I may ultimately give into the studios desire and only rent from RedBox and Amazon Prime while giving up owning physical media altogether.


But yeah, it is a little odd to see somebody in this hobby balk at paying $160 for a lifetime software license.
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post #6276 of 6296 Old 08-16-2014, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by jhughy2010 View Post
Ok good to know. How are you able to determine this?



I tried encoding "Man of Steel" with H.265 (x265) video codec using x265 tune: Psnr. The encode began by saying that its estimated time of completion was 12 hours. I came back about 6 hours later, discovering that is was only about 10% complete and the estimated time of completion was 18 hours.



Anyhow, it was incredibly hot and the AC was running all day so I didn't want to contribute to my inflated electricity bill for experimentation purposes so it looks like I'll be trying it on my laptop at work sometime soon.



I was using my HTPC to encode (i5-4440) and my laptop is an i7-4700... I'm wondering if I'll get significantly better results on my laptop.









Yes, I just received "God's Not Dead" on Blu Ray from Netflix and noticed there was no lossless tracks available. DD surround did sound good though and I really didn't have much complaint regarding it. A few months ago I received a RedBox version of the new Hunger Games movie that wasn't Lossless either.

How am I able to determine what? Decimation? I'm not sure with handbrake, but it's an x264 option so I'm sure it's there somewhere.

I hear ya about the electricity bill, that's why I do my encodes at work [emoji1] an i7 will encode faster due to hypertreading.

265 seems a lot slower than 264. Are you sure all the options are set to the same values? Maybe manually input all the option variables just to make certain? Is there a --help function for 265 cli? I'm on vacation right now so can't really check on this stuff myself [emoji4]

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Originally Posted by elario View Post
Well I meant to just cut your own samples. If you are in any way interested in video encoding you should keep a folder full of short samples for testing purposes. Use MVKMerge to (for example) cut a 60 second clip from Saving Private Ryan beach scene.

It would be nuts to encode a full movie every time you want to try a different setting or check a new revision.

Yep, or specify what frame range you want to encode in your avsynth file.

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Originally Posted by fatherom View Post
Agreed, but it seems to be slightly more common than that. Here's the subset of my ~400 title collection that don't have lossless audio (release date is included here, and the total size in GB, so clearly many of these titles have plenty of room for more audio options):


How odd, I'm pretty sure my Ocean's set are in dts-hd.
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post #6277 of 6296 Old 08-16-2014, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by agogley View Post
Not to mention the hard drive space.


..................................... A 200 movie archive, which I think is fairly tame, cost somewhere in the $3-$4K range depending on the price of the BD. The HD space needed is somewhere around 11TB ( I have 16TB capacity without any backup)..............................
I've averaged around 31GB per full BD ISO rip. I was at that average when I was around 1K titles and I'm still around a 31GB average now that I'm close to 2K titles.

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post #6278 of 6296 Old 08-16-2014, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by wmcclain View Post
MakeMKV has a backup mode for BDMV folders. Not for DVD.
MakeMKV backups DVDs as well.

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post #6279 of 6296 Old 08-17-2014, 05:13 AM
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Originally Posted by techflaws View Post
MakeMKV backups DVDs as well.
A full VIDEO_TS folder backup? I thought not, but I should check again.

We know it produces MKV files. The OP was asking about BDMV backups for Blu-ray.

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post #6280 of 6296 Old 08-17-2014, 02:59 PM
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I was able to do some reading on x265 and it seems to not yet be ready for full time use. There still lots of switches that haven't been implemented yet and of course things aren't optimized yet due to its infancy.

I did find a simple and easy to read post on x265 though. It's here if anyone is interested: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=167081
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post #6281 of 6296 Old 08-17-2014, 03:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post
I've averaged around 31GB per full BD ISO rip. I was at that average when I was around 1K titles and I'm still around a 31GB average now that I'm close to 2K titles.
I gave incorrect numbers. I'm at about 8 TB and have 12. But even I averaged around 31GB per movie, that would be a minimum of 6 TB ( no idea what my avg would be if I didn't count some of the two disc movies). That's with no redundancy. So to have a decent library, you'll need some decent HD space.

P.S. I think if I had a larger library it would drive down my average. But even so, your 2k titles is a lot of space.

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post #6282 of 6296 Old 08-18-2014, 07:42 AM
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If someone has to ask if it is worth it, I'd say that they already lean toward thinking that it is not worth it.

On one hand, you have the cool (and convenient) factor of being able to scan through/search your media collection with a graphical interface. And then there is that immediacy/convenience of hitting the play and going directly to the movie.

On the other hand ... well if you need to think about the "other hand" then you are likely not a candidate for this.

Just my $.02.

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post #6283 of 6296 Old 08-18-2014, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by agogley View Post
I had a newbie ask me if this whole thing was worth it. At the time I had written this my initial post, I hadn't really researched the legality of it all. Given the questionable legality issues, I had to reply no.
The term "worth it" is one of those that needs a context definition. In terms of a financial "worth it" the answer is a simple no if one is keeping things ethical. There is no cost advantage to buying a BD disk then investing in additional storage/playback hardware to do what we do -- not compared to putting the disk in a player for the 1-3 times one will actually watch the thing in their lifetime. If however, one is pirating with torrents and/or ripping titles they rent/borrow or otherwise don't spend money on to own, there will be a definite break-even point as their library grows to just a modest size of recent titles -- A WDTV Live + 3TB external HDD + software and you break even at no more than 25 recent release (full-priced) BD titles.

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A 200 movie archive, which I think is fairly tame . . . The HD space needed is somewhere around 11TB
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Originally Posted by agogley View Post
I gave incorrect numbers. I'm at about 8 TB and have 12. But even I averaged around 31GB per movie, that would be a minimum of 6 TB ( no idea what my avg would be if I didn't count some of the two disc movies). That's with no redundancy. So to have a decent library, you'll need some decent HD space.
I rip only the movie from my BD's as full bitrate BD.m2ts files containing only the video, HD-audio and English sub streams. The file sizes of BD titles varies greatly -- they span 16-40GB in my collection. I use 3TB drives in my server array and fill them completely. Over all my drives I fit 105-110 BD.m2ts titles on a 3TB drive which averages to ~35 titles /TB.

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post #6284 of 6296 Old 08-18-2014, 09:45 AM
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I thought you were on to something there, Kelson, right up to the point where you used "break even point" in the context of pirating. Maybe I misread you, but there is no break even point if one gets caught. Not to be alarmist or anything, but we all know that ISPs are monitoring usage.

But I guess I do get your point in one sense.

I do it strictly for the convenience of going immediately to the movie, with a very slight nod to the ability to catalog my library.

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post #6285 of 6296 Old 08-18-2014, 09:54 AM
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Maybe I misread you, but there is no break even point if one gets caught. Not to be alarmist or anything, but we all know that ISPs are monitoring usage.
And yet torrents are alive and well and constantly downloaded. And of course it doesn't apply to rent&rip which is what I had mainly in mind.

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post #6286 of 6296 Old 08-18-2014, 10:10 AM
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And yet torrents are alive and well and constantly downloaded.
Yes I suppose. And it's been a while since there have been any high profile busts.

I seem to remember reading some ISPs will send a few warnings before they throttle data usage and/or stop service. Maybe that's how IP owners are handling illegal downloads?

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post #6287 of 6296 Old 08-18-2014, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by pepar View Post
I seem to remember reading some ISPs will send a few warnings before they throttle data usage and/or stop service. Maybe that's how IP owners are handling illegal downloads?
I think the legions of people streaming YouTube, Netflix, VuDu, Amazon etc. and chewing up ~50% of the bandwidth are more of a concern to ISP's.


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post #6288 of 6296 Old 08-18-2014, 12:03 PM
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I was referring to the anti-pracy efforts that the music industry is cajoling the ISPs to employ and not the bandwidth usage. But anyway, that's enough beating that horse this time around.

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post #6289 of 6296 Old 08-18-2014, 08:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
The term "worth it" is one of those that needs a context definition. In terms of a financial "worth it" the answer is a simple no if one is keeping things ethical. There is no cost advantage to buying a BD disk then investing in additional storage/playback hardware to do what we do -- not compared to putting the disk in a player for the 1-3 times one will actually watch the thing in their lifetime. If however, one is pirating with torrents and/or ripping titles they rent/borrow or otherwise don't spend money on to own, there will be a definite break-even point as their library grows to just a modest size of recent titles -- A WDTV Live + 3TB external HDD + software and you break even at no more than 25 recent release (full-priced) BD titles.

I agree that whether something is "worth it" is relative to each individual. Each of us is going to be in varying financial status with different desires.


I hadn't even considered the pirating context because I had merely assumed that this newbie was going to (or already had) purchased his media library.

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I rip only the movie from my BD's as full bitrate BD.m2ts files containing only the video, HD-audio and English sub streams. The file sizes of BD titles varies greatly -- they span 16-40GB in my collection. I use 3TB drives in my server array and fill them completely. Over all my drives I fit 105-110 BD.m2ts titles on a 3TB drive which averages to ~35 titles /TB.
Yes, mine also vary to about the same size as you have. My average would probably be close to that except for the two-disc movies that I have which throw off my relatively small sample size.


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Originally Posted by pepar View Post


I thought you were on to something there, Kelson, right up to the point where you used "break even point" in the context of pirating. Maybe I misread you, but there is no break even point if one gets caught. Not to be alarmist or anything, but we all know that ISPs are monitoring usage.

But I guess I do get your point in one sense.

I do it strictly for the convenience of going immediately to the movie, with a very slight nod to the ability to catalog my library.

Jeff
Even with the increased detection and notification done by ISPs by users who visit known torrents, the chance of getting caught is so minimal. And unless you are selling the stuff, the risk is really limited to a civil suit. Of course, that wouldn't apply to those pirates who merely rent from RedBox and then rip those. The only people that seem to be concerned about the potential legal issues are those of us who legally buy our products but then have to resort to methods of questionable legality to enjoy them the way we'd prefer. And even in that case, we aren't haunted by being caught but just because we want to be good citizens.


As for why I created my media library...it's exactly the same as you. It allowed the convenience of being able to see and play movies without having to look at physical discs. It also allowed for better cataloging and full descriptions of the movies. Having shelves of plastic BD boxes or binders full of discs is just a terrible medium for organizing and using one's media collection.
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post #6290 of 6296 Old 08-18-2014, 08:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
I think the legions of people streaming YouTube, Netflix, VuDu, Amazon etc. and chewing up ~50% of the bandwidth are more of a concern to ISP's.



Great chart. This is going to increase given the number of mobile devices that depend on streaming video. I know that I have more mobile videos than I can store on my Ipads. I have to depend on streaming services for the kids or have the movies in the cloud ready for download.
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post #6291 of 6296 Old 08-19-2014, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by agogley View Post
Yes, mine also vary to about the same size as you have. My average would probably be close to that except for the two-disc movies that I have which throw off my relatively small sample size.
I keep an Excel file database with all the titles on my servers that includes file size. I did an Average of the file sizes in my collection and it comes to ~26-7GB. I think the only 2-disk titles I have are the LOTR Extended editions and I have them listed as separate titles in the database because I didn't combine the two halves into a single title file.

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As for why I created my media library...it's exactly the same as you. It allowed the convenience of being able to see and play movies without having to look at physical discs. It also allowed for better cataloging and full descriptions of the movies. Having shelves of plastic BD boxes or binders full of discs is just a terrible medium for organizing and using one's media collection.
As for me, I just thought it would be cool -- and I was right. I always wanted to build a server for my network and play with some new hardware etc. but never had a legitimate reason to do so because I simply never needed a server on my network for mundane data use. When I got into Video streaming (DVD, BD and especially HDTV captures/archives) it gave me all sorts of excuses to upgrade my network to GigE and expand it through the house, experiment with NAS units, build a server, buy multiple streamers for whole-house streaming, etc., etc., etc. LOL, I estimate that we haven't watched probably 30% of what is on my servers which means the probability of ever watching a given title more than once is close to zero.

It's a great hobby. I spend money on it and in return I get a lot of enjoyment from it on many different levels. I love new toys. I have a taste for the upper end. This hobby gives me all the excuses I need to acquire them.
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post #6292 of 6296 Old 08-19-2014, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by agogley View Post
Great chart. This is going to increase given the number of mobile devices that depend on streaming video. I know that I have more mobile videos than I can store on my Ipads. I have to depend on streaming services for the kids or have the movies in the cloud ready for download.
The chart is actually a little dated -- circa. 11/2013.
Here is the original link which I should have cited in my original post -- and have now corrected.

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post #6293 of 6296 Old 08-19-2014, 09:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
The chart is actually a little dated -- circa. 11/2013.
Here is the original link which I should have cited in my original post -- and have now corrected.


Still a great chart.


I have an Excel database and should add the file sizes. I have a few more 2 Disc titles such as the ten commandments and Ben Hur which I combined into one (and count as one). I'm just been thinking about whether I should continue doing the entire thing given the questionable interpretations of law (given that I enforce criminal laws for a living). I have really enjoyed setting up and running my servers/software/media devices. I also learned a lot about networking in the process which has been a huge boon to me in my job.


However, if I started now, I'd probably not choose to buy discs anymore. I think that in ten years I'd prefer an all digital format. Given how little I've really watched my collection, I think it would be better for me to switch. But that is just my thinking and as I've said, "worth it is going to be an individual judgment. And I've tried to be fairly balanced here, noting that people should compress or do whatever gives them the most satisfaction.

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I've been having a miserable time with Handbrake nightly build (using QSV). Has anyone else given up trying to get a film encoded via QSV? I really am skeptical of the quality as well.

Anyhow, reverted back to a stable build and am using x264 (nice and slow).

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I've been having a miserable time with Handbrake nightly build (using QSV). Has anyone else given up trying to get a film encoded via QSV? I really am skeptical of the quality as well.

Anyhow, reverted back to a stable build and am using x264 (nice and slow).
Quality/Size ratio for QSV is terrible. With the latest Intel drivers and a Haswell you can get decent results but you have to use average bitrate instead of constant quality. If you use constant quality and set the quality to what you normally would the file will be at least double in size. Definitely larger than the source. Plus you'll have bitrate spikes. Whenever I tried constant quality I've always had it spike to at least 60Mbps. Anything with a lot of fast movement it typically gets up around 5~6Gbps and it obviously becomes unplayable when you hit those spikes. The last one I tried was an episode of Under the Dome and the source was about 5GB, constant quality was set to 20, 1080p and I ended up with a 96GB file. Looked terrible compared to the source. I re-ran it with standard x264 with the same settings and I get a 2GB file and the quality not noticeably different from the source. I'll sometimes use QSV for shows like Whose Line is it Anyway where I don't care about the quality. I just want to shrink it down a bit and convert from mpeg2/interlaced to AVC/progressive. Quality is definitely terrible though. QSV is no where near ready for prime time Blu-ray re-encoding. Unless you want all your rips to look like Yiffy encodes. But yeah.... try QSV with average bitrate and see if you get better results.
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Ripping Blu-Rays II

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Originally Posted by techmattr View Post
Quality/Size ratio for QSV is terrible. With the latest Intel drivers and a Haswell you can get decent results but you have to use average bitrate instead of constant quality. If you use constant quality and set the quality to what you normally would the file will be at least double in size. Definitely larger than the source. Plus you'll have bitrate spikes. Whenever I tried constant quality I've always had it spike to at least 60Mbps. Anything with a lot of fast movement it typically gets up around 5~6Gbps and it obviously becomes unplayable when you hit those spikes. The last one I tried was an episode of Under the Dome and the source was about 5GB, constant quality was set to 20, 1080p and I ended up with a 96GB file. Looked terrible compared to the source. I re-ran it with standard x264 with the same settings and I get a 2GB file and the quality not noticeably different from the source. I'll sometimes use QSV for shows like Whose Line is it Anyway where I don't care about the quality. I just want to shrink it down a bit and convert from mpeg2/interlaced to AVC/progressive. Quality is definitely terrible though. QSV is no where near ready for prime time Blu-ray re-encoding. Unless you want all your rips to look like Yiffy encodes. But yeah.... try QSV with average bitrate and see if you get better results.

Would tweaking vbv buffer/bitrate (rate control) help this situation out?

Edit: help out the bitrate spikes I mean.
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