Ripping Blu-Rays II - Page 223 - AVS Forum
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post #6661 of 6670 Old Today, 06:25 AM
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Originally Posted by DotJun View Post
You should crop out the letterboxing as this will save some bit rate.

If you absolutely need a file to be a specific size, then yes, do 2-3 pass. If you only need the file around a ballpark size then IMO you are better off sticking to crf and tweaking the crf value or other settings that affect compression like Decimation.
How do you crop the letterboxing and keep the full frame? Is this the cropping feature under the picture tab?

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PSNR and SSIM are the easiest. Not saying it's 100%, just saying it is objective.
I've noticed these are settings under "tune" how do they correlate to judging quality?

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post #6662 of 6670 Old Today, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ScottJ View Post
That's what Beamr Video is supposed to do. AFAIK it's only available as a commercial solution, sold to Netflix et al.
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Originally Posted by DotJun View Post
PSNR and SSIM are the easiest. Not saying it's 100%, just saying it is objective.

Edit: Let me clarify that when I talk of transparency in a compressed video I am not saying it is bit for bit exact. I have never and will never make claims like this. What I am saying however is that something I find transparent is so close to the source that it's not worth fretting about. Yes, I understand that some people will be up in arms if there is one off colored pixel in a single frame somewhere in the video, but I'm not that person [emoji4]
Beamr is a tool to compress, and from my quick read I'd guess that they developed better perceptual encoding. I was asking about a tool that would objectively compare, i.e. without human involvement, a 1:1 rip of a retail Blu-ray with a re-encoded copy.

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post #6663 of 6670 Old Today, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by pepar View Post
Beamr is a tool to compress, and from my quick read I'd guess that they developed better perceptual encoding. I was asking about a tool that would objectively compare, i.e. without human involvement, a 1:1 rip of a retail Blu-ray with a re-encoded copy.
Their "breakthrough" is not in perceptual encoding, but a better way to measure the visible differences between two videos. (Call it perceptual differencing?) They repeatedly try different reencodings, with varying compression parameters, and measure the visible degradation. If it's too much, they throw it out and try again.
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post #6664 of 6670 Old Today, 12:51 PM
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Can Handbrake be used to re-code DD 5.1/AC3 audio into AAC for the .MP4 container while leaving the video alone and just passing it through?

I have some HDTV recording files from my TiVo I'm been experimenting with. I used Video ReDo to convert the MPEG-2 files to H.264 and saved them as .m2ts. Unfortunately this was a while ago and I have since deleted the original .tivo MPEG-2 source. Recently, I used VRD to re-mux them into an .MP4 container to experiment with playing them on my TiVo. Apparently VRD leaves the audio as AC3. When I send them back to my TiVo the video plays but not the audio. Someone in another thread suggested the audio would need to be converted from AC3 to AAC for the MP4 container.

So the files are already H.264 encoded and I don't want Handbrake to re-code them yet another time -- just convert the audio and remux. Can Handbrake do this? Can it take the .m2ts file, convert the audio to AAC and remux to MP4 while just passing the video stream through?

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post #6665 of 6670 Old Today, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottJ View Post
Their "breakthrough" is not in perceptual encoding, but a better way to measure the visible differences between two videos. (Call it perceptual differencing?) They repeatedly try different reencodings, with varying compression parameters, and measure the visible degradation. If it's too much, they throw it out and try again.
It's the measuring part that interests me, and just how that could be done objectively. Of course, the followup question is would you want to objectively measure a subjective difference? Ooooo, down the rabbit hole ....

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post #6666 of 6670 Old Today, 07:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
Can Handbrake be used to re-code DD 5.1/AC3 audio into AAC for the .MP4 container while leaving the video alone and just passing it through?

I have some HDTV recording files from my TiVo I'm been experimenting with. I used Video ReDo to convert the MPEG-2 files to H.264 and saved them as .m2ts. Unfortunately this was a while ago and I have since deleted the original .tivo MPEG-2 source. Recently, I used VRD to re-mux them into an .MP4 container to experiment with playing them on my TiVo. Apparently VRD leaves the audio as AC3. When I send them back to my TiVo the video plays but not the audio. Someone in another thread suggested the audio would need to be converted from AC3 to AAC for the MP4 container.

So the files are already H.264 encoded and I don't want Handbrake to re-code them yet another time -- just convert the audio and remux. Can Handbrake do this? Can it take the .m2ts file, convert the audio to AAC and remux to MP4 while just passing the video stream through?
No, Handbrake forces you to re-encode the video and sometimes it drives me nuts. I use Super for those cases when I just want to re-encode the audio. If I don't fell like messing with Super, I will often just set up a re-encode with Handbrake at the lowest resolution and fastest settings for video (think 160p). Then I just mux out the new audio track and remux into the original .mp4 with Yamb or into .mkv with MKVMerge.

You don't have to have .aac for an .mp4 container but a large of amount of devices still demand an .mp4 with .aac as the 1st audio stream. To keep it compliant but still have true 5.1 audio, I will often create an .mp4 file with 2 audio tracks:
#1 : .aac DPLII 160kb/s
#2 : .ac3 5.1ch 448-640kb/s

Last edited by smitbret; Today at 07:08 PM.
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post #6667 of 6670 Old Today, 07:42 PM
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Ripping Blu-Rays II

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Originally Posted by smitbret View Post
Yeah, I understand that. It just surprised me how much difference there was between Godzilla and Transformers: Age of Extinction. I don't remember that much grain in Transformers, but there is little doubt that Transformers scenes were a lot more complex. I guess robots with all of their moving parts use a lot of bandwidth. I remember when they first Transformers came out there was a discussion of how much rendering time it took to make their transformations and it was something ridiculous like 24 hours to render a 20 second transformation.



Still, most 2 Hour BDs that I re encode come in between 8-12GB. It was surprising to see Godzilla that low. You just never know. At this point, there's no way to accurately predict a destination size until the CF encode is actually done.
Transformers not only has 40 more minutes on Godzilla, but I'm sure that transformers also has a lot bright static scenes, all of which contributes to needing more bits.

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Originally Posted by jhughy2010 View Post
How do you crop the letterboxing and keep the full frame? Is this the cropping feature under the picture tab?







I've noticed these are settings under "tune" how do they correlate to judging quality?
I don't use handbrake so I'm not so sure how to use its cropping tool.

Psnr and ssim are metrics for pq. The tune feature will optimize certain parameters to increase whichever metric you chose to go with. You can have the encoder spit out the actual number for psnr or ssim after the encode. The higher the number the closer it is to the source. My advice is, don't get caught up with the numbers game and just let your eyes be the judge.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
Can Handbrake be used to re-code DD 5.1/AC3 audio into AAC for the .MP4 container while leaving the video alone and just passing it through?



I have some HDTV recording files from my TiVo I'm been experimenting with. I used Video ReDo to convert the MPEG-2 files to H.264 and saved them as .m2ts. Unfortunately this was a while ago and I have since deleted the original .tivo MPEG-2 source. Recently, I used VRD to re-mux them into an .MP4 container to experiment with playing them on my TiVo. Apparently VRD leaves the audio as AC3. When I send them back to my TiVo the video plays but not the audio. Someone in another thread suggested the audio would need to be converted from AC3 to AAC for the MP4 container.



So the files are already H.264 encoded and I don't want Handbrake to re-code them yet another time -- just convert the audio and remux. Can Handbrake do this? Can it take the .m2ts file, convert the audio to AAC and remux to MP4 while just passing the video stream through?

AFAIK, handbrake will not pass video through as video processing is what this app was built for. What you could do is use eac3to to transcode your audio file then use mkvmerge to mux them together.
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post #6668 of 6670 Old Today, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
Can Handbrake be used to re-code DD 5.1/AC3 audio into AAC for the .MP4 container while leaving the video alone and just passing it through?
AVIDeMux can.
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post #6669 of 6670 Old Today, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by DotJun View Post
You should crop out the letterboxing as this will save some bit rate....
Since the letterbox bars are an unmodulated solid color you'll save very little.
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post #6670 of 6670 Old Today, 09:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smitbret View Post
No, Handbrake forces you to re-encode the video . . .
You don't have to have .aac for an .mp4 container but a large of amount of devices still demand an .mp4 with .aac as the 1st audio stream. To keep it compliant but still have true 5.1 audio, I will often create an .mp4 file with 2 audio tracks:
#1 : .aac DPLII 160kb/s
#2 : .ac3 5.1ch 448-640kb/s
Thank you and @DotJun & @olyteddy for the responses.

Turns out I can change the MP4 profile in Video ReDo to convert the audio from AC3 to AAC while leaving the video alone. However, when doing so VRD flattens the 5.1 AC3 to 2.0 AAC and I lose surround sound. The resulting file now plays on my TiVo and gives me audio but I'm not thrilled with it being 2.0.

@smitbret -- if I am reading your post correctly, it tells me that this is not a limitation of VRD but that AAC is only 2.0 which is why you also include an AC3 5.1 audio track in your MP4's. Is this the case?

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