3-4 years ago media players were a hot thing, what happened? - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 44 Old 07-30-2012, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by MarkHotchkiss View Post

I'm not an Apple fan, but as an engineer, I can't dispute that Apple has technology what beyond what most CE manufacturers have. It is the only reason they can get away with locking it down.
There is no technology that compares to AirPlay, although Sonos comes close. An AppleTV will perform exactly as advertised. My iPod (the only Apple device I own) has the best UI of any player I own. The iPhone may be the most copied device in history. So I personally think terms like "crapple" and "sheeple" are inappropriate descriptions. You sound rather biased, to me.
Most of us try to ignore it.

I would not call it "technology beyond" other companies. almost any device can do UPNP/DLNA with ease these days. What makes apple apple is there locked down platform makes it easy to use nothing about better tech or any of that they cater to what apple wants and what apple needs not what some of us more media savy people might want.

Also I would not call the iphone most copied. All this back and fourth about everyone copies apple i think is BS. My windows mobile 5 phone had eveything an iphone did plus more. Only thing apple did was pave the way for finger control rather then stylus control I will give them credit for that. But besides that everything else was already there.
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post #32 of 44 Old 07-30-2012, 09:59 PM
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Originally Posted by halfelite View Post

almost any device can do UPNP/DLNA with ease these days.
Now that's funny - comparing AirPlay with DLNA? Seriously?

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What makes apple apple is there locked down platform makes it easy to use nothing about better tech or any of that they cater to what apple wants and what apple needs not what some of us more media savy people might want.
I'm not sure that I'm interpreting those sentences correctly, due to missing punctuation, but if you are trying to say that Apple, by having the system proprietary allows them to deliver what works best for them and not necessarily what you want, then I agree. The reliability of their devices is partly due to the fact that they don't inter-operate with others. To me, that is cheating a little.

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Also I would not call the iphone most copied. All this back and fourth about everyone copies apple i think is BS.
Not everyone copies Apple, and not all Apple devices deserve copying. But iPods and iPhones have been copied since their inception. When the iPhone first came out, nothing looked like it. Before the iPhone, all major smart-phones had keys. Now, most smart-phones look like the iPhone. Even if that was the natural evolution of smart-phones, Apple was in front of the curve.

Can you point to a device that has been copied more than the iPhone?

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My windows mobile 5 phone had eveything an iphone did plus more.
Now that's an exaggeration. As an example, nobody had capacitive-multitouch before the iPhone introduced it. Windows Mobile had no app-store. The image on a Windows Mobile device did not right itself when you rotated it. These may be little things, but this level of detail is missing from most manufacturers, especially Micro$oft.


I'm not an Apple fan. The only Apple device I own is an old iPod Nano. But as an engineer, I recognize leading-edge technology. Heck, I've been trying to get multi-touch on some of my designs for years (and I have yet to find multi-touch drivers for embedded-Linux).
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post #33 of 44 Old 07-30-2012, 10:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkHotchkiss View Post

Now that's funny - comparing AirPlay with DLNA? Seriously?
It can be somewhat of a comparison, Basic DLNA is good at playing and delivering video which is what the masses want, Now granted it doesnt work with iphone, but if I take my android phones I can play video with ease to any one of my media players in my house, While yes AirPlay has more features its also features that im sure most people would not use. beyond sending audio/video to another device,.
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I'm not sure that I'm interpreting those sentences correctly, due to missing punctuation, but if you are trying to say that Apple, by having the system proprietary allows them to deliver what works best for them and not necessarily what you want, then I agree. The reliability of their devices is partly due to the fact that they don't inter-operate with others. To me, that is cheating a little.

Yes that's what I was implying apples model works as long you agree to do everything apples way, The second you dont want one device being an apple device the apple model falls apart. I respect the apple way I may not agree with the apple way but it works for a lot of people that want easy and simple.
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Not everyone copies Apple, and not all Apple devices deserve copying. But iPods and iPhones have been copied since their inception. When the iPhone first came out, nothing looked like it. Before the iPhone, all major smart-phones had keys. Now, most smart-phones look like the iPhone. Even if that was the natural evolution of smart-phones, Apple was in front of the curve.
Can you point to a device that has been copied more than the iPhone?
Now that's an exaggeration. As an example, nobody had capacitive-multitouch before the iPhone introduced it. Windows Mobile had no app-store. The image on a Windows Mobile device did not right itself when you rotated it. These may be little things, but this level of detail is missing from most manufacturers, especially Micro$oft.
I'm not an Apple fan. The only Apple device I own is an old iPod Nano. But as an engineer, I recognize leading-edge technology. Heck, I've been trying to get multi-touch on some of my designs for years (and I have yet to find multi-touch drivers for embedded-Linux).

Hence I said apple can be credited with the turn around of touch screen displays with fingers, MS mobile was clunky and used the stylus, And if I remember right there was a few windows 6.5 phones launched that lacked buttons but did still have slide out qwerty keyboard. But we will get this back on topic before we go to far off.
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post #34 of 44 Old 07-31-2012, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by theslydog View Post


BTW, I got a new Sony Google TV box for the novelty and something to play with but realize that was prolly just a waste of money.

I cancelled my order a couple of weeks ago but was thinking of getting it yet again. Why do you feel it was not worth it? Did you try Plex, GTVplayer, etc ...? It seems really interesting, although that Pivos Xios player is also intriguing.

Philip
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post #35 of 44 Old 07-31-2012, 04:11 PM
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Me too, but every time I seriously consider the Sony box, or any GoogleTV product, I still walk away for what it does not do.
This is a combination of not being able to stream from the majority of the major content broadcasters as well as limited playback support for local shares of my own content library.
1 box capable of handling both streaming and local content is attractive.

Also the design decision to only include 1 hdmi input is a bit perplexing to me.

Eventually I probably end up getting the Sony box once it is in the market a while longer just to play around with it.
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post #36 of 44 Old 08-01-2012, 12:15 PM
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@qz3fwd

More than one input hdmi with a simple way of switching would really be neat. If they were all active and GTV could somehow search and filter the content that would be even better. As it stands, I am having a hard time thinking of the Sony GTV as being more interesting than the Xios DS Android box. That one will run XBMC as well as Plex which might be interesting. Unfortunately the reviews for it are not much better than those for the GTV. The Sony has that neat remote though and the hardware appears to be nice. Can't think of any other new media players that would be fun to play around with.

Apple's Mountain Lion OSX with AirPlay mirroring to an ATV is very neat. It's almost as good as running XBMC natively. The negative is the remote control issue.

Philip
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post #37 of 44 Old 08-01-2012, 12:32 PM
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Media streaming is and always will be a niche market. As long as you have to jump through hoops to rip DVDs and Blu-Rays, it will always be so. Until the movie industry starts providing FULL QUALITY digital copies of their films, it will stay that way. My brother in law might think what I did was cool, but there's no way in hell he's going to spend a week ripping his whole DVD collection one by one.
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post #38 of 44 Old 08-01-2012, 12:43 PM
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You nailed it. My neighbors, friends and family all admire and want my setup... that is until they hear what is involved and all the technical know-how they'll need to set-up media players, servers, jukeboxes, etc. Plug 'n play it definitely ain't. One of my neighbors got a Boxee Box, but he uses it as an Internet box to view YouTube and Netflix, that's it.

HD Media Keen Videosaurus
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post #39 of 44 Old 08-01-2012, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishdoom View Post

Media streaming is and always will be a niche market. As long as you have to jump through hoops to rip DVDs and Blu-Rays, it will always be so. Until the movie industry starts providing FULL QUALITY digital copies of their films, it will stay that way. My brother in law might think what I did was cool, but there's no way in hell he's going to spend a week ripping his whole DVD collection one by one.

They aren't going to provide that since they want you to buy the disk and use it in a physical Blu-ray player. I think they view media players as vehicles for video at a lower quality.

philip
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post #40 of 44 Old 08-01-2012, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by mlknez View Post

A short little history....
Really, there have only been 2 reliable and capable units in this market.

I've been using my PCH A110 for years. Seems reliable and capable enough to moi.
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post #41 of 44 Old 08-02-2012, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by hcour View Post

I've been using my PCH A110 for years. Seems reliable and capable enough to moi.

It took 2 years for PCH to get their firmware close to stable and even now, it has to be rebooted quite a bit more often than the Dune players.
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post #42 of 44 Old 08-02-2012, 09:11 AM
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I'm not sure why anybody wants to be in the streamer business anymore.

On the one side you've got media companies who are fighting tooth and nail to prevent your device from getting access to their content. All the major streaming companies don't want to deal with, or even actively try to lock out small time vendors. The Bluray alliance has done everything they can to prevent .iso playback.

On the customer side, you'd have to be crazy to court us (the people in this forum) as a target market. We want it all in one box, and we want it flawless, and every single one of us has a different setup. At this point I have to imagine there's thousands of possible variations on how a piece of video is encoded, between container, codecs, subtitles, etc. Even if you assume everybody is ripping their purchased media, look at how many different ways there are to do that. Then get into storage type, network protocols, UI behavior, scraping, etc. We're a small and really picky bunch to try and please.

Then add on you're at the mercy of chipset providers - look at Sigma over the past year. Or the debacle when Boxee had to switch vendors at the last minute. And I have to guess you're sales numbers are in the tens of thousands - which means your production costs are massive b/c they can be amortized over a million-piece run, and material costs are high because you can't get the kind of volume discounts big names get.
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post #43 of 44 Old 08-02-2012, 09:26 AM
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Probably because there is money still to be made in the streamer market. I've worked for a number of small companies that each had their own niche, they may not have had the margins of the bigger corporations but a few million a year profit still isn't bad. Put your money in a bank and sit on it and see how much you make off it. If they were'nt making money they wouldn't be in business, pure and simple.smile.gif
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post #44 of 44 Old 08-05-2012, 04:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmcd View Post

I cancelled my order a couple of weeks ago but was thinking of getting it yet again. Why do you feel it was not worth it? Did you try Plex, GTVplayer, etc ...? It seems really interesting, although that Pivos Xios player is also intriguing.
Philip

My wife tolerates the pile of media players next to the TV that I play with - looking for the holy grail of media players smile.gif

The Sony is a mixed bag some of the apps work fine but it is still a bit clunky and it easily frustrates.

The most interesting one atm is an ebay f16ref ATV-108 VISSON MBX V2 with Cortex A9 1.2GHz running 4.0.4 This will run the alpha XBMC Pivos build. The one I got for $100 will stream 1080p fine. I have got some of the video plugins and repositories working like Free Cable etc.
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