BD Quality - ISO on HTPC vs converted file playing on media player - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 11:47 AM - Thread Starter
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I was looking at the Oppo 103 since it can stream HD Content. It has all kind of high end parts for video and audio.

But it will not play an ISO and from what I understand, nothing will except a HTPC.

I have an Oppo 83 right now. We have a lot of hires music, DVD's, and starting to build a BD collection.

I'd like nothing more than to put all this on a server and stream from there.

Will/Can I get the same quality from a well built HTPC, with all the audio and video enhancements that I can from something like a Oppo 103? The downside of the OPPO(or any other device) is I need to covert the video, what do I lose there and is that correct?

The 103 is $500. For $500 what can I see in an HTPC? I already have all the backend and plenty of storage.

Audio quality is my biggest thing and what I'd really like is to still play ripped DVD-A's through my analog setup, I've still never found as good of bass management as I get on the analog side.

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post #2 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 01:30 PM
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Got a HTPC, not really using it anymore. Western Digital's Live will play 99% of the files out there easily with no setup or work, and yes it has BD-ISO (lite) support.

As for video enhancements, the WD has a Sigma xx70 series chip and it upscales and denoises. Can't really see a difference.

I'd rip your DVD's to 1:1 ISO's if you have the room and the BD's to 1080p HPL4.1 x264/.mkv rips.
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post #3 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 01:31 PM
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There are three ways to backup your bluray and dvd discs

1) make an iso. the best solution for 3D. also has the fewest playback devices.

2) save to folder structures. instead of a single .iso file you will have a file folder will all the same files the physical disc has on it. For bluray this is often called BDMV, for dvd it is called VIDEO_TS. i believe the Oppo can do this for bluray but not dvd. I learned that reading an FAQ, not by owning one, so please get someone else to confirm that.

3) remux the main movie file to something else, with .mkv being the most popular

A/V quality wise, all three are the same. You aren't changing the audio or the video stream, just the kind of box they are packaged in.

The Oppo is a licensed bluray player. That means dealing with Cinavia at some point. This is an audio watermark that only becomes an issue watching rips, not physical discs. Right now Oppo only seems to be enforcing this when you watch saved BDMV folders, not if you turn your discs into mkv files.

This has also come to be an issue with pc software as well, though with a PC you still have a few ways to deal with it. Watching mkv files on a pc from a Cinavia source should be easy for the foreseeable future.

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post #4 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 01:41 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiddles88 View Post

Got a HTPC, not really using it anymore. Western Digital's Live will play 99% of the files out there easily with no setup or work, and yes it has BD-ISO (lite) support.
As for video enhancements, the WD has a Sigma xx70 series chip and it upscales and denoises. Can't really see a difference.
I'd rip your DVD's to 1:1 ISO's if you have the room and the BD's to 1080p HPL4.1 x264/.mkv rips.
The WD LIVE plays far LESS than "99% of the files out there" Yes, it does play BD ISO files but if they are "branching files" most Disney and quite a few others it will NOT play them correctly. Further the WD LIVE does NOT PASS DTS-MA. Being as the original poster said "Audio quality is my biggest thing" your recommendation kinda sucks...
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post #5 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 02:31 PM - Thread Starter
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After reading through some more stuff it looks like the Dune HD Duo is what I'm looking for.

I do not need a separate BD player since my plan is to rip them all, so I'll never play one directly.

Plus I have my PS3 as a backup and the Dune HD Duo gives me analog outputs as well.

From what I read about the Max is the BD player itself was not too great. I really wish the base model had analog outputs since I don't need local storage.

My post originally came from me reading on here about another post that no players play ISO's but now it looks like that may be an upcoming problem, not a current one.
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post #6 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by comicguy View Post

The WD LIVE plays far LESS than "99% of the files out there" Yes, it does play BD ISO files but if they are "branching files" most Disney and quite a few others it will NOT play them correctly. Further the WD LIVE does NOT PASS DTS-MA. Being as the original poster said "Audio quality is my biggest thing" your recommendation kinda sucks...

What files won't play? You are talking rubbish. Have you actually tried the latest firmware? Out of 60 movies (properly ripped, not dodgy P2P rips with 50 warpoints and a retarded amount of reference frames) I tested all played from 1080/60i to 1080p/24 to SD. And audio quality may be sacrificed to DTS if the OP rips blu-rays. I'd say your comment kinda sucks. Where are the facts?
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post #7 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 03:04 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Tiddles88 View Post

What files won't play? You are talking rubbish. Have you actually tried the latest firmware? Out of 60 movies (properly ripped, not dodgy P2P rips with 50 warpoints and a retarded amount of reference frames) I tested all played from 1080/60i to 1080p/24 to SD. And audio quality may be sacrificed to DTS if the OP rips blu-rays. I'd say your comment kinda sucks. Where are the facts?
What part of this... "Audio quality is my biggest thing" confuses you? In what world would someone concerned about audio quality want to sacrifice DTS-MA?
FWIW, all of my files are direct non compressed rips from original discs...
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post #8 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 04:16 PM
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I think the number of people who have both the equipment and the ears to actually hear a difference between DTS and DTS-MA is very small. But granted, the OP did specify that audio was of prime concern in which case the WD Live does not do DTS-MA so would not be a good recommendation for him.

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post #9 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by comicguy View Post

What part of this... "Audio quality is my biggest thing" confuses you? In what world would someone concerned about audio quality want to sacrifice DTS-MA?
FWIW, all of my files are direct non compressed rips from original discs...

What? Did your original concerns suddenly vanish and you only focus on audio? Where are the playback problems now? USELESS.

Who cares about DTS-MA. DTS is more than sufficient. You can't tell a difference anyway.
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post #10 of 15 Old 12-13-2012, 06:54 PM - Thread Starter
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I can tell the difference in DTS-MA and other formats.

Considering DVD-A is basically the same as DTS-MA there is a good quality difference between them.

Time to sell my Oppo and order a Dune HD. Picked up a BD drive tonight and going to try ripping one of my BD's to see how that goes.
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post #11 of 15 Old 12-14-2012, 01:17 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Tiddles88 View Post

What? Did your original concerns suddenly vanish and you only focus on audio? Where are the playback problems now? USELESS.
Who cares about DTS-MA. DTS is more than sufficient. You can't tell a difference anyway.
You know for an "advanced member" you come across as kind of an ass sometimes. Do you have many Blu-rays that are "branching titles"? If so, you would know that the WD Live does NOT play a lot of these correctly.
Thanks for telling the original OP and myself that we can't hear the difference in audio as well.
sheesh...
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post #12 of 15 Old 12-14-2012, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by comicguy View Post

You know for an "advanced member" you come across as kind of an ass sometimes. Do you have many Blu-rays that are "branching titles"? If so, you would know that the WD Live does NOT play a lot of these correctly.
Thanks for telling the original OP and myself that we can't hear the difference in audio as well.
sheesh...

There is no audio difference and all my BD's are ripped as a single non-branching track. You want branching, get a blu-ray player.
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post #13 of 15 Old 12-14-2012, 01:50 PM
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There is certainly a difference in audio, as mentioned some can notice it and some can't. And if you are ripping to a single M2TS and creating an ISO from that then that is why all your ISO's work correctly. Rip a Disney title to ISO directly and let us know how that wprks out for you on the WD

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post #14 of 15 Old 12-14-2012, 08:59 PM
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And if you are ripping to a single M2TS and creating an ISO from that then that is why all your ISO's work correctly.
That is quite correct. As has been mentioned before when you feed the WD Live a BD.iso all it does is go to the BDMV\STREAM folder and play the biggest .m2ts file in the folder -- whatever that may be. If your target device is the WD Live, there is no reason to rip the main title to an .iso vs. just the single main_title.m2ts file. All an .iso does is package the full BDMV folder structure which the WD ignores anyway. The WD will not process a playlist, which means it cannot properly handle a seamless branching title and it gives no chapter support for the title. My players are all WD and so all my BD rips are BD.m2ts rips of the main title using Clown_BD which joins together any seamless branching titles into a single BD.m2ts.

So bottom line, ripping the main title to BD.iso is only useful if the target player can process the playlist to give you chapter support.

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post #15 of 15 Old 12-15-2012, 08:27 PM - Thread Starter
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So do the Smart Series play DTS-MA or no?

According to the comparison web page none of the Smart series does:

AC3 (Dolby Digital) Up to 5.1
EAC3 (Dolby Digital Plus) No
Dolby True HD No
DTS Up to 5.1
DTS HD High Resolution Audio No
DTS HD Master Audio No

But from Duneplayer on the D1:


Extended support for Dolby True HD and DTS HD Master Audio: output bitstream (up to 7.1 channels) or decode to LPCM (up to 7.1 channels) for maximum flexibility when connecting audio equipment, and for extended support of advanced playback features (such as Picture-in-Picture).


So which is it? I was going to buy a Smart series to try it out, if it does what I want I'll move the Smart to the bedroom and then buy a HD Duo for the main room.
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