Sony 4K Media Streamer FMP-X1 $699 Coming Summer 2013- - Page 11 - AVS Forum
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post #301 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 05:18 AM
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Originally Posted by jjnbos View Post

SO I think we established it could easily have been built with a SSD, but it wasn't :-)

I thought we had first and foremost established that an SSD would have been out of the question due to cost smile.gif
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post #302 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 05:22 AM
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Originally Posted by benes View Post

There is no option to move it either until it's in your library, which is only after you buy it.

So you would have to move movies you own to an external disc as Sony puts others on your dirver thar you don't want and forces you to buy them in order to get rid of them - sounds like a brilliant plan smile.gif
Kidding aside I think that when you call their support they should have a suggestion on how to solve that issue.
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post #303 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 05:28 AM
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Originally Posted by benes View Post

The movies are about 50GB each so it comes with a little over 0.5 TB used.

How do manage that? I can assure you both of my X1s where above 1.6TB used when first setup. I have just confirmed I am already up to 1.9TB consumed and I've only downloaded 6 more titles (currently on 7th). That leaves me with the feeling as stated earlier (and I'm not alone) that the built in storage is inadequate.
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Originally Posted by OzHDHT View Post

I don't get the relevance here to the fact the existing X1 as manufactured contains a conventional HDD. It could not have easily been done with SSD as we've already established the X1 requires 2TB of storage (and that's pretty woeful for 4K movie size), especially if you have all of the preloaded movies intact which takes you over 1.5TB storage used..

hmmm

My 2T external SSD drive cost $200 retail has 2TB capacity and is the size of a deck of cards.

http://www.amazon.com/LaCie-9000298-Rugged-Mini-Disk/dp/B00IRV005E/ref=sr_1_5/182-9075121-3091755?ie=UTF8&qid=1394960869&sr=8-5&keywords=lacie+2tb+rugged

SO I think we established it could easily have been built with a SSD, but it wasn't :-)

We are talking 2TB 2.5" internal Solid State Drives as others have already corrected you on. You are quite clearly referring to standard portable USB 2.5" drive. 2TB SSDs are only just starting to be talked about for release this year. and they WILL have a price tag to match:

http://www.techoftomorrow.com/2013/pc/2tb-pci-e2-5-inch-intel-ssds-coming-in-2014-in-leaked-roadmap/

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post #304 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted by benes View Post

I have the 10 free movies and I've also downloaded every one of the free videos and it shows 676 GB used.

I haven't bought any more movies but it appears that about half of them have been downloaded. It doesn't look like these are being reported as used space. If it needs more room I assume these will be silently deleted.

You can go through and manually delete. I've gotten rid off a few unwanted titles already as well as clips. It's pretty small selection left really for what a device like it should ideally be able to hold without filling up. If you use 50-60GB as an average file size for movies, it would indicate a theoretical ability to store around 30 odd standard length movies by themselves. With the clips and probably even the short previews left in there, that drops further. My exact movie count is only 15 including American Hustle. Yet I'm down to my last 100gig. I'm pretty sure going through spending time deleting more 5min demo clips is not going to result in masses of storage being liberated. The only option now is external HDD expansion.

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post #305 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by benes View Post

If you really only have 15 movies in your library I don't see how it could have filled up already. That should be well under 1TB. Maybe your unit is counting pre-downloaded movies as used space. That doesn't appear to be the case on mine.

I have 10 full length movies plus 52 demos in my library:




I'll be home shortly and happy to upload pics of mine to show exactly what's on it. I can again assure you it's sitting at 1.9TB while still downloading American Hustle. I did a reconciliation today using Sony's most recent pdf brochure which I believe covers all of the existing titles up to Capt Phillips as I wasn't in front of the tablet at the time to read straight off it.

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post #306 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by benes View Post

Yeah not saying I don't believe you but I just don't understand why that's happening. You said yours came with 1.5TB used out of the box which is different from mine too. Maybe they changed something. When did you buy yours and what titles were in your library at the start? I bought mine right around Jan 1 and it came with the 10 free movies and about 40 demos. It was around 600GB used. I've since downloaded some more demos and its up to 676GB. I've never deleted anything.

And the first few days I had it it was auto-downloading the whole time too. I've even manually pre-downloaded a few new movies that I haven't bought yet. The last time I did this with Captain Phillips the used space didn't change so it must not be counting these.

Here's my main X1. As you'll see from the screen there's 17 (thought I'd deleted karate kid and that's my boy). Maybe something is happening diff in the tablet version interface to measure storage as opposed to the TV based interface.

u9a7uga6.jpg
asu2a3ym.jpgy2uby8e8.jpg

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post #307 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by OzHDHT View Post

You can go through and manually delete. I've gotten rid off a few unwanted titles already as well as clips. It's pretty small selection left really for what a device like it should ideally be able to hold without filling up. If you use 50-60GB as an average file size for movies, it would indicate a theoretical ability to store around 30 odd standard length movies by themselves. With the clips and probably even the short previews left in there, that drops further. My exact movie count is only 15 including American Hustle. Yet I'm down to my last 100gig. I'm pretty sure going through spending time deleting more 5min demo clips is not going to result in masses of storage being liberated. The only option now is external HDD expansion.

Yes you can delete (via the garbage can symbol once you have selected movie via the app) the shorts and most of the pre-loaded stuff. Also, once you buy and download a movie you can delete it to make room for other movies. You can then later re-download your original movie(at no cost)from the 4K store in the future. Your X1 is like a briefcase that can hold x number of movies at a given time. "Excess" movies are still in the cloud/SEN store. Yes, I know it may be inconvenient to spend another eight hours to redownload content, but at least you still have access to all your stuff. As far as I know, no one has successfully used an external HDD with the X1.

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post #308 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by benes View Post

Yeah that is weird. It definitely doesn't add up. It seems like its not deleting anything and letting it all pile up.

Sony says "Store dozens of your favorite 4K Ultra HD movies, TV shows and short-form videos (approx. 45 full-length feature films), Storage of 45 movies is based on average movie file size of approximately 38 GB per movie."

I wonder what would happen if you downloaded more movies. If it says you have no more room I would say the product is not performing as advertised and Sony should fix it for you. You are not anywhere close to the capacity they claim.
I have. I've transferred a title to an external HDD and back to the internal HDD. It can only be in one place at a time. And titles that are on your external drive will not show up in your main library. They will only show up on a separate screen when the external is plugged in.

Also the hard drive will be fully formatted before it can use it so you can't use the drive for anything else.

Sure using Sony's basic math there and an empty 2TB drive, you could get to 40 or so movies easily. There's no way the longer films like Lawrence are less than 60gig though. Again doing the basic math and looking at the fact the X1 when preloaded came with 1.65 gig approx already used, there's only effectively room for another 10 movies - that's if they all averaged 40gig. Throw in Lawrence and movies over 2 hrs like American Hustle and it not hard at all to see the X1 running out of room. I'm going to cull a few of the crap films that I swore I'd already deleted tonight and get back a few gigs.


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Yes you can delete (via the garbage can symbol once you have selected movie via the app) the shorts and most of the pre-loaded stuff. Also, once you buy and download a movie you can delete it to make room for other movies. You can then later re-download your original movie(at no cost)from the 4K store in the future. Your X1 is like a briefcase that can hold x number of movies at a given time. "Excess" movies are still in the cloud/SEN store. Yes, I know it may be inconvenient to spend another eight hours to redownload content, but at least you still have access to all your stuff. As far as I know, no one has successfully used an external HDD with the X1.

Ahh yeah, I'm more than well aware of the ability to delete. One thing I'm not about to do is waste bandwidth (and time - till we have fiber broadband locally) to an incredible degree by deleting anything I may want again in the future. Far simpler to just add a decent sized USB HDD. I plan to buy another one to replace the 1TB Toshiba I tried before that either didn't work with the older firmware or just didn't work with the X1 period. I proved this morning with a spare USB that wasn't even FAT 32 formatted (timemachine backup) that the current firmware definitely now recognises USB drives properly. It told me the drive wasn't formatted to correct format and asked if I'd like to format it. Being it was a piddly 250gig I was about to wasn't my time with it.

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post #309 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 10:05 PM
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That's the part I don't understand. What was using up that 1.65TB? How many movies did your unit come with?

The only thing I can think of again is that it is counting non-purchased movies as used space while mine is not.

I can confirm both units have the same amount of preloaded movies. Considering I haven't downloaded anything to my 'spare' X1, I can easily go and note the storage used on that unit as well a little later. The preloaded movies are the 10 as per Sony's deal that ran out Dec last year: The Amazing Spider-Man, Salt, The Karate Kid, The Other Guys, Battle: Los Angeles, That’s My Boy, Bad Teacher, Total Recall 2012, Taxi Driver, and The Bridge on the River Kwai, plus all of the short films/clips.

I can't honestly see why the device would count non-purchased movies as used space. That just doesn't add up at all.

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post #310 of 423 Old 03-16-2014, 11:47 PM
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Originally Posted by OzHDHT View Post

I can confirm both units have the same amount of preloaded movies. Considering I haven't downloaded anything to my 'spare' X1, I can easily go and note the storage used on that unit as well a little later. The preloaded movies are the 10 as per Sony's deal that ran out Dec last year: The Amazing Spider-Man, Salt, The Karate Kid, The Other Guys, Battle: Los Angeles, That’s My Boy, Bad Teacher, Total Recall 2012, Taxi Driver, and The Bridge on the River Kwai, plus all of the short films/clips.

I can't honestly see why the device would count non-purchased movies as used space. That just doesn't add up at all.

Maybe catalog movies that you would have to pay for are already on the drive - in that case you don't have to download them which for you would be an advantage. And if you don't buy them they could get deleted one by one when you still add new movies once you arrive at maximum capacity.
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post #311 of 423 Old 03-17-2014, 03:48 AM
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We are talking 2TB 2.5" internal Solid State Drives as others have already corrected you on. You are quite clearly referring to standard portable USB 2.5" drive. 2TB SSDs are only just starting to be talked about for release this year. and they WILL have a price tag to match

Hmm

who made the rule they couldn't use more than one drive? In a box as huge as an X1?
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post #312 of 423 Old 03-17-2014, 05:26 AM
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Hu
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Hmm

who made the rule they couldn't use more than one drive? In a box as huge as an X1?

Huge?!? Compared to what.. An Apple TV or WDTV. So a it would be a sensible idea to put 2 conventional HDDs in a single unit so there can be 2 points of potential mechanical failure?

EDIT:
for those who didn't get a 'preloaded' X1 or have never bothered to check what amount of storage was used, I took a pic of my 'as new' spare X1. As I'd stated twice earlier, it most definitely has 1.6TB of space filled out of the box..



I also used it to test Oliver's idea of what if somehow there were more original library films already on it waiting for purchase. I used MIB 3 to test. Much to my surprise it told me it was ready to play. This was on my spare unit. So to check it, also tried it on my main unit and found it too was there ready to play. So Benes you were kind of correct in what you suggested before Oliver, the X1 was counting real content, that's actually downloaded but locked till it's paid for. So mystery solved and good to know that other original catalog titles are already there awaiting purchase. I believe the giveaway now is if you see a 'downloaded' next to a title you don't yet own, then it is def downloaded. I had previously thought that it was a flag to say preview was downloaded.

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post #313 of 423 Old 03-19-2014, 11:55 AM
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When trying to buy a movie, I get a prompt for a 5 digit pin.What is that about.It seems like a parental control thing but I do not see anywhere in the settings?thanks, Ron
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post #314 of 423 Old 03-19-2014, 06:40 PM
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When trying to buy a movie, I get a prompt for a 5 digit pin.What is that about.It seems like a parental control thing but I do not see anywhere in the settings?thanks, Ron

Ron, you should have been asked to create a purchase confirmation pin when you set up the X1. It's just there to prevent accidental purchases if you have automatic purchases switched on in your SEN account. Parental control is a different pin set up yet again.

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post #315 of 423 Old 03-20-2014, 12:20 AM
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Thanks for checking.

What's strange is there doesn't seem to be any consistency in how it counts pre-downloaded titles. Yours is obviously counting all of them as used space while mine seems to only count some of them.

I've actually tested this. When I first got the unit I wanted to see how big the movies were so I pressed "Download to Rent" on Godzilla (without ever buying it) and I checked the Used Space before and after and it was about 50GB difference. But just recently I did the same thing with Captain Phillips and the Used Space didn't change at all.

I've gone thru all the movies on the store and it appears that about 25 of them have been pre-downloaded. Doing a rough calculation that would just about fill up my 1.3TB of "empty" space. So it seems my hard drive is filled to the brim just like yours but it's not being reported that way.

Maybe the difference is between the tablet (OzHDHT) and the TV (yours) application of the control software?
If that is the case then I would think that the way it is done on the tablet is more useful as it at least makes you aware of predownloaded content.
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post #316 of 423 Old 03-21-2014, 12:24 AM
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Not really since the hard drive is now filled up with movies that you may not have any interest in purchasing and with no way to delete them. You'll have to delete your own purchased movies to make room, or buy an external hard drive, while these unwanted movies fill up space with no way to get rid of them other than buying them.

I can still tell which movies are pre-downloaded, but since they aren't counted as used space they will be automatically deleted when more room is needed for other content.

It seems like they made an improvement for the TV interface. I wonder if it works this way for everyone else with the tablets?

As long as only movies are deleted that weren't paid for I cannot see it as a problem, that would also make more sense to me than to autodelete movies that you have paid for.
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post #317 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 01:45 PM
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Does the FMP X1 come preloaded with the following movies, meaning the full movies:


The Amazing Spider-Man
Bad Teacher, featuring Cameron Diaz
The Karate Kid, featuring Jackie Chan and Jaden Smith
The Other Guys, featuring Will Farrell
Battle: Los Angeles
That's My Boy, featuring Adam Sandler
Salt, featuring Angelina Jolie
Total Recall 2012, featuring Colin Farrell and Kate Beckinsale
Taxi Driver
The Bridge on the River Kwai

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post #318 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 02:42 PM
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It used to, new sale (since Jan 1) doesn't include 10 movies anymore.

Sorry.

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post #319 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 04:47 PM
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I believe the movies are there, they just aren't free any more.

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post #320 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 06:08 PM
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I believe the movies are there, they just aren't free any more.

I would say that's definitely the case, that is unless Sony for some reason stopped preloading them in more recently sold units. Easy enough to test that, would just need someone with a very recently acquired unit to purchase one of the titles and see if it's there immediately.

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post #321 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 06:52 PM
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just called Sony, person said they come preloaded with 10 movies, hope she is right. Persons voice is digital sounded from another country.

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post #322 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 07:50 PM
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just called Sony, person said they come preloaded with 10 movies, hope she is right. Persons voice is digital sounded from another country.

The digitized voice can tell you what they think is correct, but they're not right. Something can always slip through the cracks, but don't count on it.

https://us.en.kb.sony.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/43378/c/65,66/kw/43378

Why did I not get 10 free movies with the purchase of the 4K Ultra HD media player?
Article ID: 43378 | Last Updated: 02/19/2014
The 10 free pre-loaded movie promotion expired on 12/31/2013.

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post #323 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 10:04 PM
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The digitized voice can tell you what they think is correct, but they're not right. Something can always slip through the cracks, but don't count on it.

https://us.en.kb.sony.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/43378/c/65,66/kw/43378

Why did I not get 10 free movies with the purchase of the 4K Ultra HD media player?
Article ID: 43378 | Last Updated: 02/19/2014
The 10 free pre-loaded movie promotion expired on 12/31/2013.

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She salespersonn said "I can assure you have my word the 10 full movies are loaded to the player" then she wanted to take my order. I also checked about 10 Sony Authorized Resellers on the internet and their
website states the movie titles.

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post #324 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 11:16 PM
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You understand that the movies are preloaded on the player. What you seem to be missing is that you still have to pay money to buy or rent them. Just because they are already loaded doesn't mean  you can watch them for free.

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post #325 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 11:43 PM
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You understand that the movies are preloaded on the player. What you seem to be missing is that you still have to pay money to buy or rent them. Just because they are already loaded doesn't mean  you can watch them for free.

Watch them for free? Isn't this why it costs $700.00, with this price it should include the ability to watch them. A 2TB Western Digital hard drive costs $90.00. Sounds like the hardwire ethernet has to be connected to the internet just to watch and pay for the preloaded movies, what a rip off.

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post #326 of 423 Old 04-04-2014, 11:57 PM
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Watch them for free? Isn't this why it costs $700.00, with this price it should include the ability to watch them. A 2TB Western Digital hard drive costs $90.00. Sounds like the hardwire ethernet has to be connected to the internet just to watch and pay for the preloaded movies, what a rip off.

If you'd had bought one before the free movie cut off, it wouldn't be so much of a rip off. Guess this is unfortunately a classic case of 'you snooze, you lose' tongue.gif

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post #327 of 423 Old 04-05-2014, 12:19 AM
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If you'd had bought one before the free movie cut off, it wouldn't be so much of a rip off. Guess this is unfortunately a classic case of 'you snooze, you lose' tongue.gif

Nope, more like snooze Sony loses my business since they dont get the $2,500 i was going to spend on a 55" 4K set and the 4K media player that is selling in a bundle.

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post #328 of 423 Old 04-05-2014, 12:55 AM
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Watch them for free? Isn't this why it costs $700.00, with this price it should include the ability to watch them. A 2TB Western Digital hard drive costs $90.00. Sounds like the hardwire ethernet has to be connected to the internet just to watch and pay for the preloaded movies, what a rip off.

By George, I think you've got it. Yes, it's a ripoff, which nobody can deny.

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post #329 of 423 Old 04-05-2014, 02:07 AM
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Originally Posted by smartwater View Post

Nope, more like snooze Sony loses my business since they dont get the $2,500 i was going to spend on a 55" 4K set and the 4K media player that is selling in a bundle.

We'll that's your right as a consumer, especially if you haven't even bought a 4K panel yet rolleyes.gif. Frankly, I totally felt you could take or leave the free movies as the majority of them are garbage. Def wouldn't have stopped me getting one to use it with a $20k VW1100.

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post #330 of 423 Old 04-05-2014, 02:47 AM
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Originally Posted by bweissman View Post

By George, I think you've got it. Yes, it's a ripoff, which nobody can deny.

In another thread about the VW1000ES projector it seems as if people got 300$ worth in vouchers which they can use towards purchasing the movies they want.
Seems like a great idea and much better than having movies on there that many of us will not even watch when they are for free.


A few posts up we talked about the number of movies that should/could come out per month and/or week - has anybody contacted Sony to ask them about their release plans for this year?

It seems to me that Sony still is sitting on quite a few 4k scans of classic movies like Dr. Strangelove or The Man From Laramie plus possibly soon another large format movie with Lord Jim that is slated for a June release on Blu-ray in France.
A few new releases will hopefully be handled in 4k even if the CGI will have to be upscaled - just don't dumb down everything to 2k - it is a colossal waste!
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