The Grand Budapest Hotel: Blu-ray vs. Vudu vs. iTunes vs. Amazon - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 73 Old 07-09-2014, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by blueskies758 View Post
As much as I love Blu ray discs, I fear its only a matter of time for physical media.
Nah. I don't buy that a bit.

This is not the same world it was yesteryear. Once upon a time there was a single method of media delivery because alternatives were too expensive for the average consumer. Today that has changed. The average consumer has the ability to choose their preferred method of delivery at not much extra cost to themselves. This is advantageous to both the consumer and to the studios. Multiple methods of delivery is win-win for everyone and for that reason physical media is not going anywhere anytime soon. Now that being said, maybe physical media moves on over to stick eventually as opposed to disc, but none the less, multiple methods of delivery is here to stay.
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post #32 of 73 Old 07-09-2014, 08:01 PM
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Big Barney I hope you're right - about everything except the stick idea. I'll leave that Kool aid in the punch bowl thank you.
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post #33 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by blueskies758 View Post
As much as I love Blu ray discs, I fear its only a matter of time for physical media.

The up and coming younger generation has been groomed and is accustomed to disc less media and I have
a difficult time envisioning them buying films or any media for that matter on discs.

I hope I'm wrong - but in the end so long as I'm good and dead before that happens

I have bought a couple episodes of the Walking Dead on Amazon, but that's all. Never plan on buying films I cannot resell or hold in my hand.

Kevin D
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Originally Posted by bigbarney View Post
Nah. I don't buy that a bit.

This is not the same world it was yesteryear. Once upon a time there was a single method of media delivery because alternatives were too expensive for the average consumer. Today that has changed. The average consumer has the ability to choose their preferred method of delivery at not much extra cost to themselves. This is advantageous to both the consumer and to the studios. Multiple methods of delivery is win-win for everyone and for that reason physical media is not going anywhere anytime soon. Now that being said, maybe physical media moves on over to stick eventually as opposed to disc, but none the less, multiple methods of delivery is here to stay.
I agree with both of you (awesome, isn't it?).

It is great to have the options of discs and streaming. One for serious viewing and the other for casual, perusal and maybe previewing before buying blu.

The problem is twofold for physical media and it has nothing to do with its qualities or value.

Firstly, the current generation and increasingly earlier ones are or are becoming more comfortable with streaming as opposed to physical media.

This is overwhelmingly the case with music, as noted by my daughter five years ago when I gave her an Amazon gift card and suggested some CD's. She chuckled at me and said "no one buys CD's anymore dad" then she spent it all on MP3 downloads. She could get just the tracks she liked on her phone.

My oldest daughter (now 24) loves movies. My nephew (her partner in crime) is a film director, she has written screenplays and acted, sings, etc. A typical Dad / daughter night out includes going to the movies. When she moved to her own place, I bought her a Sony 590, a very good bluray player. I also bought her several blurays.

She has never bought another bluray. She uses the player quite a bit though, she has her own Netflix account, is signed up as a user on my Amazon Prime account. She buys shows and movies on Amazon, and watches movies galore.

She is a cable cutter and uses the internet for all entertainment. YouTube and HBOGo also get much play.

The second is the movie companies. The demographic they try to hit is her generation. I hope they maintain physical media - selfishly since I prefer bluray for something I value enough to purchase, but it may dry up at the source.
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post #34 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 08:14 AM
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Thanks for the comparison. Could you please post the full-rez screenshots?
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post #35 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 08:58 AM
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they are cropped so they are full rez. everything is not resized so it's fine
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post #36 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueskies758 View Post
As much as I love Blu ray discs, I fear its only a matter of time for physical media.
Yes and the reason being is you spend so much time purchasing equipment, laboring with love over the connections and tuning of it all to get the best picture and sound possible, then what. For me at least 90% of the time I just get midway, or if possible to the end of the movie, and ask myself. Why did I spend so much to get such a crappy movie to look/sound good. It was suppose to be a good movie, but it is lousy. I sure wish I would have saved all this money and hassle and just streamed the damn thing.

Old adage, garbage in garbage out and it doesn't matter the money you've payed to put lipstick on that pig- it's still a Michael Bay (or insert any number of overhyped yambo's here) pig.

TBNT, I'll just stick with the stream and now thanks to the author I'll default to Amazon. Simple is beautiful.
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post #37 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hernanu View Post
Firstly, the current generation and increasingly earlier ones are or are becoming more comfortable with streaming as opposed to physical media.
Streaming is not the answer for everything. You can't stream to a moving vehicle (at a reasonable price) for example. But you can watch a movie with the ever increasing number of dvd players in cars these days which the "new and upcoming generation" is biting into like gangbusters. You can't stream (at a reasonable price) stream to many summer cottages and cabins (as is the case with mine)

Again, I don't think physical media is going anywhere anytime soon. There is a need and will continue to be a need for quite some time to come.... and that's what the customer wants these days.... CHOICE.
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post #38 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 01:34 PM
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Physical media and players will remain as long as they're profitable. At some point data delivery, whether by streaming or files to a secure server/player, would seem to be more economical. It's already largely happened for music delivery. Physical media's decline is likely to be gradual. 4K is already available and should improve with HEVC. It's like saying that film will never die. Not dead yet, but as electronic acquisition becomes better in every way the writing is on the wall.
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post #39 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by TVOD View Post
Physical media and players will remain as long as they're profitable.
Well, that's the point... It's still profitable and still a demand.... and it will remain that way for a number of years yet.
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post #40 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 02:26 PM
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I am fairly new to this forum and certainly a relatively newbie in the world of a/v electronics. This thread has been very enlightening to see the level of detail of Blu ray vs streamed media. I have been pro Blu ray for what seams like a long time (early 2007). I prefer to own my movies rather than rent, quite simply because my time is valuable to me and if I am going to sit down to watch a movie, I want it to be something I enjoy and would want to watch more than once to pick up on all those little subtle pieces of filler and hidden gems that you don't always catch on a first watch. The issue for me is always portability. I have become more accustomed to obtaining my movies in digital format than on Blu ray as I don't always have time to sit down in front of my home theater and enjoy a movie from start to finish. Wife, Kids, Dog, Business, Hobbies, etc... you know the drill, point is, I have to make time for a movie, so sometimes, I have to resort watching them when I have free time on my tablet. If I am lucky, any new Blu ray I purchase will come with a free digital copy so I get the best of both worlds, but all to often, this is not the case. So I have been defaulting more and more to downloading them from iTunes as that has been the most convenient method at this point for me. In fact, the perfect world for me would be to purchase the Blu ray with a free digital copy, but I fear physical media will be a thing of the past even though it is such a young format. Truth is, the corporate world is pushing digital content more and more. My kids no longer have hard copy books at school, they have iPads. Even in my business, my design software package, is no longer delivered on physical media, it is shipped on a USB thumb drive or you can choose to direct download the install files. Obviously this is to save money on packaging, copying, labeling, shipping, etc... So I guess it reasonable to expect that digital video content will follow a similar trend at some point in the future.
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post #41 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mightyhuhn View Post
do you really think is a good idea to compare a rip on this page?

and they don't need to be good at encoding they simple don't touch the source with color conversations and they all ready beat vudu in this case easily.

and the free encoder x264 is a lot better than h264 encoder in main concept.
Absolutely. I'd be fascinated to see how publicHD is doing in relation to the commercial services. They are using something like 10mbps with x264 encoding from a Blu-ray.

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Streaming is not the answer for everything. You can't stream to a moving vehicle (at a reasonable price) for example. But you can watch a movie with the ever increasing number of dvd players in cars these days which the "new and upcoming generation" is biting into like gangbusters. You can't stream (at a reasonable price) stream to many summer cottages and cabins (as is the case with mine)

Again, I don't think physical media is going anywhere anytime soon. There is a need and will continue to be a need for quite some time to come.... and that's what the customer wants these days.... CHOICE.
There are ways to download moves to a hard drive or whatever, but seriously, why do we need movies to entertain kids? Can't they play the license plate game or read a book or something? What did people do before sitting in front of a screen 24/7?

First of all, a summer place on the lake or whatever is a summer place on the lake for a reason. To go in the lake, go out on the boat, have a campfire, be around friends and family, cook on the grill outside, etc, not to sit there and watch movies on a crappy little setup that sucks compared to your HT at home. Secondly, a lot of summer places can get cable and/or DSL, even ones in semi-remote areas, although I'm not sure it really makes sense. It used to be a big deal to stay connected, and now most things can be access through a smartphone anyways.
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post #42 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggAW View Post
There are ways to download moves to a hard drive or whatever, but seriously, why do we need movies to entertain kids?

First of all, a summer place on the lake or whatever is a summer place on the lake for a reason. To go in the lake, go out on the boat, have a campfire, be around friends and family, cook on the grill outside, etc, not to sit there and watch movies on a crappy little setup that sucks compared to your HT at home. Secondly, a lot of summer places can get cable and/or DSL, even ones in semi-remote areas, although I'm not sure it really makes sense. It used to be a big deal to stay connected, and now most things can be access through a smartphone anyways.
Wow... just... wow!
What I provide my children in terms of entertainment while on the road is my choice. If you don't like it.... Oh well.
What I provide my family with for entertainment at the cabin in the evening after a day in the sun is my choice. If you don't like it.... Oh well.

We can't get cable/dsl where we are and even if we could... we wouldn't. You can't pay for cable/DSL for just a Summer. You have to pay for it year round. That's a lot of money to spend for a grand total of maybe 2 months usage. Physical media makes better sense.
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post #43 of 73 Old 07-10-2014, 07:31 PM
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The observation of the current limits of the cloud is legitimate. I disagree with the idea that one can completely depend on it for storage. If the availability of physical media does decline, I hope we still have some method of playing local files.
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post #44 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 07:04 AM
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The observation of the current limits of the cloud is legitimate. I disagree with the idea that one can completely depend on it for storage. If the availability of physical media does decline, I hope we still have some method of playing local files.
I agree completely. It is still on its shakeout phase, and I prefer what I have, which is physical media supplemented by a NAS drive that I can reach wherever I go to trusting my stuff on a cloud server. For most things.

Right now the music I've downloaded there is not reachable at speeds or throughput so that I can play it remotely from my cell phone (my platform on the move), so that's a limitation.

I do, however buy MP3's from Amazon and play them from their cloud server.

Part of that purchase is to download those MP3's from Amazon to my NAS drive, so I can play them locally with full control and ownership. To me, this is the best of both worlds since I own my own local copies and can play them anywhere through Amazon's cloud player.

When movie services reach that level of delivery, ownership and sophistication, then I could transition to all digital delivery/purchase, since it would offer a higher value than physical alone to me(emphasis intended). Now, I'll happily use streaming and take advantage of its pluses, but it's not complete.
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post #45 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 07:21 AM
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Originally Posted by BiggAW View Post
There are ways to download moves to a hard drive or whatever, but seriously, why do we need movies to entertain kids? Can't they play the license plate game or read a book or something? What did people do before sitting in front of a screen 24/7?
I always hated the license plate game. Nothing more mind numbing than long trips with the parents in the summer, the windows needed to be down (no air) so conversations were basically someone saying something and everyone yelling "WHAT?!?!?"

Movies on an iPad with headphones on are fine for long trips for me (mine are now adults, so it's really fine).

I remember what people did at night - they listened to the radio, sat around it for hours. Same idea, different delivery system, much poorer sound.

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First of all, a summer place on the lake or whatever is a summer place on the lake for a reason. To go in the lake, go out on the boat, have a campfire, be around friends and family, cook on the grill outside, etc, not to sit there and watch movies on a crappy little setup that sucks compared to your HT at home. Secondly, a lot of summer places can get cable and/or DSL, even ones in semi-remote areas, although I'm not sure it really makes sense. It used to be a big deal to stay connected, and now most things can be access through a smartphone anyways.
Again, no one has to justify what they do for fun or how they raise their kids. I never took my girls on survival type trips (I went through outward bound twice), but don't look askance at people who do.

I had no problem with sitting out on a veranda with a beer as the Maine sun went down, having had a long day running around with my girls with one watching a downloaded movie on her iPad and the other reading her kindle while listening to music.

We'd take pauses to reconnect, just to talk but to me part of vacation is removing the constraints of home and just enjoying the pleasures and pauses.
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post #46 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 01:30 PM
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The day when connectivity anywhere anytime can't be that far away. After all, without that how can the NSA keep an eye on us through the cameras on nearly all portable devices? Can you see me now?
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post #47 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 01:44 PM
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The day when connectivity anywhere anytime can't be that far away.
It's already here. You can get a satellite signal anywhere in the world... but then how many people do you see walking around with a sat phone? I can even get satellite internet at my cabin... IF... I wish to pay the rather extreme price (I don't).

It all comes down to dollars and cents. Why should I pay an insane satellite rate when physical media is easily available? Now.... if they ever fix it so that "anywhere, anytime connectivity" comes in at a quality and price comparible to the ease and access of physical media... THEN, I think we can kiss blu ray/dvd goodbye.
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post #48 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 02:50 PM
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It's already here. You can get a satellite signal anywhere in the world... but then how many people do you see walking around with a sat phone? I can even get satellite internet at my cabin... IF... I wish to pay the rather extreme price (I don't).
Unless I've missed it, there's no iPad with a sat option.

Last edited by TVOD; 07-12-2014 at 08:04 AM.
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post #49 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 03:06 PM
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Wow... just... wow!
What I provide my children in terms of entertainment while on the road is my choice. If you don't like it.... Oh well.
What I provide my family with for entertainment at the cabin in the evening after a day in the sun is my choice. If you don't like it.... Oh well.

We can't get cable/dsl where we are and even if we could... we wouldn't. You can't pay for cable/DSL for just a Summer. You have to pay for it year round. That's a lot of money to spend for a grand total of maybe 2 months usage. Physical media makes better sense.
I know I sound like an old curmudgeon, but it just needs to be said!

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I always hated the license plate game. Nothing more mind numbing than long trips with the parents in the summer, the windows needed to be down (no air) so conversations were basically someone saying something and everyone yelling "WHAT?!?!?"
Luckily, we have A/C these days.

I stand by my point about vacationing and vacation houses.
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post #50 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 04:23 PM
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but it just needs to be said!
Ummm... no, I don't think it does. My family and I enjoy our cabin the way we want to, and how we choose to do that has little do to with this thread.
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post #51 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 04:35 PM
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. Unless I've missed it, there's no iPad with a sat option
It doesn't quite work that way, but yes you can use an ipad as normal over satellite

http://www.galaxybroadband.ca/residential-home.html
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post #52 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 07:00 PM
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It doesn't quite work that way, but yes you can use an ipad as normal over satellite

http://www.galaxybroadband.ca/residential-home.html
I see, so with this I can just carry an iPad anywhere without anything else and be connected via satellite? That's great news! But what about:

"Small video clips can be streamed online (ie. YouTube) and the amount of streaming available depends on your service plan. However, we do not recommend streaming high throughput applications (ie. Netflix, Apple TV) that are designed for Cable and DSL connections. Using high throughput video streaming applications can cause you to exceed the Soft Download Cap."
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post #53 of 73 Old 07-11-2014, 07:15 PM
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I see, so with this I can just carry an iPad anywhere without anything else and be connected via satellite? That's great news! But what about:

"Small video clips can be streamed online (ie. YouTube) and the amount of streaming available depends on your service plan. However, we do not recommend streaming high throughput applications (ie. Netflix, Apple TV) that are designed for Cable and DSL connections. Using high throughput video streaming applications can cause you to exceed the Soft Download Cap."
I'm not arguing with you one single bit. As I CLEARLY stated above, the price tag to all of this is stupidly high. And yes... if you pay enough you can even take it on the road, play your ipad, stream full blu ray rips, and watch tv till your heart is content if you wish.

If you recall, what I said above is that the time you speak of is already here. It's a simple matter of dollars and cents, and until "anywhere, anytime connectivity" can be attainable by the AVERAGE consumer... physical media won't be going anywhere.

Go back to post 47 and read it again.
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post #54 of 73 Old 07-12-2014, 12:14 AM
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Most of the recent posts seem really off topic?

Anyone have opinions on imagic's review of 'The Grand Budapest Hotel: Blu-ray vs. Vudu vs. iTunes vs. Amazon'

If not maybe they should be posting elsewhere.

Thanks
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post #55 of 73 Old 07-12-2014, 07:34 AM
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Most of the recent posts seem really off topic?

Anyone have opinions on imagic's review of 'The Grand Budapest Hotel: Blu-ray vs. Vudu vs. iTunes vs. Amazon'

If not maybe they should be posting elsewhere.

Thanks
Stay focused guys. If you have comments that don't fit this thread, you're sure to find one or even create your own.

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post #56 of 73 Old 07-12-2014, 07:46 AM
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Thanks for proving yet again that Blu-ray is the best way to watch cinematic media, unless of course having the best quality picture and sound is not important to you.
Yeah, this just about nails it. I don't think we're as backwards as some people think, buying our movies on physical media for the highest quality. Streaming is for movies that I'm mildly interested in watching but don't want to spend money on. And let's not even talk about streaming quality in 3D movies.

Will it happen eventually? Yes. Will it happen next year? Nope.
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post #57 of 73 Old 07-12-2014, 11:49 AM
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Physical media and players will remain as long as they're profitable.
Sadly I agree. Look what is happening to plasma. Panasonic pulled out, Samsung just pulled out, and I would bet within a year, LG will pull out, leaving no more plasma. Plasma still beats everything else overall, but there is not enough money to be made in plasma. Once that threshold is reached with Blu Ray, one by one, the movie companies will pull out too, until we get to a point where none of them will transfer them to blu ray.

RIP Robin Williams. Thanks for the laughter.
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post #58 of 73 Old 07-12-2014, 01:00 PM
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Hopeless optimist here, but it seems unlikely to me that physical cinematic media will simply vanish. BluRay may (and probably will) evolve into a niche market over the years, but when it does, someone will profitably meet the niche demand. And more capable physical media will be part of the reason for the diminished BluRay demand when that finally does happen.

Consider the amazing reincarnation of the vinyl album. Of all the people each of us comes in contact with, what would you guesstimate the ratio of BluRay demand is versus vinyl album demand? 50 to 1? 100 to 1? Much higher? Whatever the actual numbers are, if there's a current market for the vinyl album, there's a future market for cinematic physical media.

Plus, my wife says I buy enough shiny discs to keep a couple of manufacturers in business all by myself.

Props Mark, great work.
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post #59 of 73 Old 07-12-2014, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by mightyhuhn View Post
they are cropped so they are full rez. everything is not resized so it's fine
ah, I had to open each picture in a new window to see its full size. The forum re-size them to fit the page.
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post #60 of 73 Old 07-13-2014, 06:54 AM
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Sadly I agree. Look what is happening to plasma. Panasonic pulled out, Samsung just pulled out, and I would bet within a year, LG will pull out, leaving no more plasma. Plasma still beats everything else overall, but there is not enough money to be made in plasma. Once that threshold is reached with Blu Ray, one by one, the movie companies will pull out too, until we get to a point where none of them will transfer them to blu ray.
Streaming already dominates the movie market, but Blu-ray isn't going away. For rentals, streaming is great, as it has a whole 24-hour ecosystem lock-in, but buying movies through streaming services has a permanent ecosystem lock-in... People, Americans especially, seem to like to put things on their shelves and keep them in a collection. While streaming is taking over the market and will continue to do so, there is still a segment of the market that wants something to own and put on their shelf. Although this thread is about quality, the quality is effectively the same on all but the largest screens, and since 99% of the population doesn't have 100"+ screens, that's irrelevant to the market, and 99% of the market won't make a decision based on highly technical differences in the way the movies are compressed for Blu-ray vs. HDX or iTunes or Amazon that they don't understand anyways.
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