Sony FMP-X10 owners thread - Page 28 - AVS Forum
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post #811 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 09:26 AM
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I'm still waiting for my call back from customer service about how to fix my FMP-X10, even though I've already swapped it out for a new one, which seems to be working. I called them last weekend, when my error message changed from Network not available to Error 6002, and they told me to call them back on Monday because the service level I was talking to doesn't work on the weekend.
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post #812 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 09:29 AM
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Well, I actually have 2 questions. First, I'm just wondering if the DVDs, which read "Mastered in 4K" have a better picture or have better sound than just a regular Blu Ray disk played on a 4k TV. Second, since most, if not all, 4K TVs upconvert, why would anyone buy a something like Sony's new BDP-S7200, which is supposed to upscale to 4K, access to Netfix, SEN, etc? If someone owns a 4K TV and already has a Blu Ray player (not this particular one) what's the benefit of owning this new Blu Ray player? 4K TVs already have a lot of these features built-in. Unless someone owns a different brand of TV, it'll give them access to SEN, other than that, I don't see the benefit. And to combine the questions, if someone were to watch Spiderman 2 Mastered in 4K on this new Blu Ray player, will it look better, worse, or the same as watching it on the FMP-X10?

I don't buy into the "Mastered In 4K" Blu-Ray stuff. It might improve (very very very slightly) some aspect of the PQ of the regular Blu-Ray (maybe I just haven't seen it) due to the higher bitrate... But otherwise, it's the same 1080p/24 format using AVC/MVC encoding (MVC only because of the multiview video coding needed for 3D flix). So in my opinion, I don't think you'll see much (if any) difference between the Blu-Ray and the "mastered in 4K" version. Especially on the X900 which does a magnificent job of upscaling content on it's own as is.....Remember those superbit versions of Blackhawk Down and a few other movies?, same principle, just with the Sony stamp on the end product.... and you see how well those went. Not bad, more of a placebo effect IMO..

I have a suggestion, buy the same disk, have someone load the disks and do a blind comparison of specific scenes in the movie.... Going to cost a couple of bucks, but it would put your mind at ease.

Edit: The answer to your last question, just my opinion, but there shouldn't be any question that the 4K version on the X-10 should look better. Hard to say right now as Spiderman won't be out until the 19th ? But either way, if you're seated at the correct distance, the true 4K should indeed look better...If not, then I'll be skipping the rest of this whole 4K revolution thing for good..lol

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post #813 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 09:32 AM
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All I need is another DVD player. I already have 3 in my closet, next to my stack of old routers. I think I've watched 3 movies on DVD over the last year.
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post #814 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by rolldog View Post
Well, I actually have 2 questions. First, I'm just wondering if the DVDs, which read "Mastered in 4K" have a better picture or have better sound than just a regular Blu Ray disk played on a 4k TV. Second, since most, if not all, 4K TVs upconvert, why would anyone buy a something like Sony's new BDP-S7200, which is supposed to upscale to 4K, access to Netfix, SEN, etc? If someone owns a 4K TV and already has a Blu Ray player (not this particular one) what's the benefit of owning this new Blu Ray player? 4K TVs already have a lot of these features built-in. Unless someone owns a different brand of TV, it'll give them access to SEN, other than that, I don't see the benefit. And to combine the questions, if someone were to watch Spiderman 2 Mastered in 4K on this new Blu Ray player, will it look better, worse, or the same as watching it on the FMP-X10?
Of the three provided with the purchase, Ghostbusters was by far the least impressive, followed by A&D, then Spiderman, which looked pretty good. Keep in mind, the X1 had been preordered and wouldn't even get installed until 7/15/13.

Ghostbusters had been presented in six channel surround and 70mm prints (although those were duped from 35mm.) The color correction for the Remastered DVD looked weak, some things were marginally sharper than the original DVD, but the difference would be hard to specify. The sound, I believe had gone through a remix when it was first sent to DVD. Even the 4K Netflix of Ghostbusters leaves a lot open for criticism.

I don't know why anyone would be purchasing an upconverting Blu-ray player since it is a complete waste of cash. Look for other features, especially if you have a 4K TV.
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post #815 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 11:29 AM
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Just tortured myself with 23 min of Karmin on Jimmy Kimmel... 5.1 recording...Sounded fine all the way around (not so much the music), but it was definitely a 5.1 track. No dropout's... El Dorado was tough, not to much being sent to the rears (what was was faint), which is why I went to Karmin on Kimmel.... During El Dorado I was getting a signal to my rears, I have a Rocketfish wireless rear setup to my Paradigm's, if it's not being sent a signal the box the rears connect to will flash. Checked a couple of my movies, Elysium and The Amazing Spiderman (1& 2) all three were okay.

Just tried mine and Karmin worked through my rears as well. I'm running HDMI2 from the x10 into the aux hdmi input on the receiver FWIW
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post #816 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 11:42 AM
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Yup! Left surround sound speaker is active when playing Karmin but is dead when playing all other titles. I've tested the following movies with no sound from left surround.
Total Recall, Spiderman, Spiderman 2, Patriot, A few good men, smurfs 2...basically every movie I have dl'ed from SEN with HDMI 2 audio out - I get no sound from left surround. Changed downmix from stereo to surround and back to stereo. Confirmed Denon is receiving 5.1 48khz pcm digital from fmp-x10. Anyways, seems like sony prefers jacking up prices on their 4k movies instead of fixing the hdmi 2 audio issues. If ya'll figure out a fix, please let us know. In the meantime, i'll just use my ARC for audio.
Same problem here. Using an Integra 80.3 preamp and no issues with Blu-Rays. The left surround is dead when playing Spiderman 2 on the X10.

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post #817 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 11:51 AM
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Did Sony stop sending out UV codes? I bought both Spider-Man 2 and Captain Phillips, but neither came with UV codes the next day. The last movies I bought previously were "Lawrence of Arabia", "Elysium" and "After Earth" and all came with UV codes, which is nice to be able to see it on other sets that are not connected to the X10.

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post #818 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 11:51 AM
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Well, getting the FMP-X10 from day one, we'll be the ones notifying Sony of the issues so the next update might be coming soon. I just wish it downloaded faster. And why does Sony make us buy Ghostbusters for $30 when it's on Netflix?
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post #819 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 11:53 AM
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Smurfs 2 is also on Netflix 4K now.

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post #820 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 12:34 PM
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Did Sony stop sending out UV codes? I bought both Spider-Man 2 and Captain Phillips, but neither came with UV codes the next day. The last movies I bought previously were "Lawrence of Arabia", "Elysium" and "After Earth" and all came with UV codes, which is nice to be able to see it on other sets that are not connected to the X10.

I'd love to know the answer to this. I wasn't aware they were giving UV codes and the thought that you can only watch a movie that you've paid $30 for on one tv seems ridiculous. For that price, I think they should give you a blu ray hard copy as well, but I know that'll never happen.
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post #821 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 12:49 PM
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I can die happy now....

Kicked off Amazing Spider-Man 2 download at 12:38 PM Pacific. I'm on ATT Uverse. Local max speed for my area is 25Mbps. Let's see how long before this completely downloads.
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post #822 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 01:13 PM
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They probably don't with 4K movies since you're limited on what you can watch it on.
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post #823 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 01:15 PM
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Gym bound now. Download is at 7% on the X10 as of 1:15 PM Pacific.
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post #824 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 01:48 PM
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Gym bound now. Download is at 7% on the X10 as of 1:15 PM Pacific.
You can check download speeds in X10 Settings.
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post #825 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 03:26 PM
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But we already know what it's going to read. I must say, my Xbox One looks nice on this 850A.
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post #826 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 05:52 PM
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This thing is such a piece of sh*t. Never start trying different configurations to troubleshoot this high priced paperweight, if you do, you'll end up so frustrated it's frickin ridiculous. I've tried everything in the book to get the audio to function properly, yet after all is said and done, I'm back to my original configuration and I've had more audio drops in the last 10 minutes, then I've had in the last four weeks. I'm done with this POS..

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post #827 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 06:05 PM
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Just stick with the Toslink out from the TV. When I saw 2 HDMI ports on here, one for audio and one for video, I knew someone ghetto rigged this thing to get it to market. Just hookup HDMI 1 and run a Toslink from the TV to your receiver.
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post #828 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 06:07 PM
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Do you have an Android device?
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post #829 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 06:13 PM
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If you own an Android tablet or phone, you must check out this website: http://www.time4popcorn.eu
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post #830 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 06:13 PM
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And watch the video first so you know what it is.
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post #831 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by TweakerInWA View Post
This thing is such a piece of sh*t. Never start trying different configurations to troubleshoot this high priced paperweight, if you do, you'll end up so frustrated it's frickin ridiculous. I've tried everything in the book to get the audio to function properly, yet after all is said and done, I'm back to my original configuration and I've had more audio drops in the last 10 minutes, then I've had in the last four weeks. I'm done with this POS..

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I agree, the audio problems are frustrating. Other than abandoning the HDMI2 connection and using the Toslink cable from the TV (which limits audio to 2-channel), there is one other thing for you to try. It is a temporary work-around which you may have heard about in the X1 thread. You most likely have an HDMI cable from your AVR to the display. When playing a movie on the X10, temporarily unhook the HDMI cable between the AVR and the display. This has been demonstrated to provide stable audio. Try it and report your results.

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post #832 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by rolldog View Post
Just stick with the Toslink out from the TV. When I saw 2 HDMI ports on here, one for audio and one for video, I knew someone ghetto rigged this thing to get it to market. Just hookup HDMI 1 and run a Toslink from the TV to your receiver.
Does the Toslink out from the TV support multichannel audio? I thought HDMI1 from the X10 only sent 2 channel audio.
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post #833 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 08:17 PM
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I agree, the audio problems are frustrating. Other than abandoning the HDMI2 connection and using the Toslink cable from the TV (which limits audio to 2-channel), there is one other thing for you to try. It is a temporary work-around which you may have heard about in the X1 thread. You most likely have an HDMI cable from your AVR to the display. When playing a movie on the X10, temporarily unhook the HDMI cable between the AVR and the display. This has been demonstrated to provide stable audio. Try it and report your results.
I appreciate the work around, but seriously. ....The dipsh*ts at Sony really need to hop on this and I mean HOP! If you invest $5,500 ( like I did, and others much more) in this product and this is the end result, I'd be frickin embarrassed. They've decided to go to such lengths to alienate other 4K/UHD competition, that they've essentially left us with half-assed garbage...So done with this right now....you don't even know. This should be so simple. ....

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post #834 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 08:24 PM
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I appreciate the work around, but seriously. ....The dipsh*ts at Sony really need to hop on this and I mean HOP! If you invest $5,500 ( like I did, and others much more) in this product and this is the end result, I'd be frickin embarrassed. They've decided to go to such lengths to alienate other 4K/UHD competition, that they've essentially left us with half-assed garbage...So done with this right now....you don't even know. This should be so simple. ....

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You are preaching to the choir. I had hoped you would try the workaround I suggested to see if it indeed works.

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post #835 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 08:30 PM
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Does the Toslink out from the TV support multichannel audio? I thought HDMI1 from the X10 only sent 2 channel audio.
This has been discussed before. If you go into the audio settings and change the speakers option from TV speakers to external speakers, then the Toslink will pass multichannel 5.1 audio to the AVR if you are using the TV's internal apps. This works fine, for example, for the internal Netflix app.

If, however, you fire up the X10, you will see an on-screen message "Switching audio to TV speakers" (why, I haven't a clue). With audio set to TV speakers, the Toslink only passes 2-channel sound. So, if you watch a movie or view a clip, all you will get is 2-channel audio, which you can configure to play in PLII Cinema on the AVR, which is not too bad. I haven't tested the Netflix app on the X10, but I suspect the behavior is the same. IOW, nice 4K streaming with 2-channel audio.

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post #836 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 08:44 PM
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You are preaching to the choir. I had hoped you would try the workaround I suggested to see if it indeed works.
Tried it out watching the Karmin clip, didn't help a lick.

I would really like to know what's changed since I originally had it hooked up the exact same way earlier today. I mean everything is exactly the same and I had zero audio issues other than the lack of SL channel. . Now it turned into a complete mess...lol, so ridiculous.



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post #837 of 1283 Old 08-16-2014, 08:59 PM
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This has been discussed before. If you go into the audio settings and change the speakers option from TV speakers to external speakers, then the Toslink will pass multichannel 5.1 audio to the AVR if you are using the TV's internal apps. This works fine, for example, for the internal Netflix app.

If, however, you fire up the X10, you will see an on-screen message "Switching audio to TV speakers" (why, I haven't a clue). With audio set to TV speakers, the Toslink only passes 2-channel sound. So, if you watch a movie or view a clip, all you will get is 2-channel audio, which you can configure to play in PLII Cinema on the AVR, which is not too bad. I haven't tested the Netflix app on the X10, but I suspect the behavior is the same. IOW, nice 4K streaming with 2-channel audio.
Ok, so the Toslink outputs the same as the HDMI ARC (audio return channel). Not sure why Sony gimped the X10 with a HDMI 1 that can't pass multichannel audio to the TV. Seems like I read previously it had something to do with HDCP 2.2 and multichannel audio over the same cable or something??


I suspect the message "Switching audio to TV speakers" to due to HDMI CEC (Bravia Sync) from the X10 telling the TV to turn on it's speakers when it is not outputting audio through HDMI 2. I suppose you could avoid this by turning off "Control for HDMI" in the HDMI settings of the X10.
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post #838 of 1283 Old 08-17-2014, 05:49 AM
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Ok, so the Toslink outputs the same as the HDMI ARC (audio return channel). Not sure why Sony gimped the X10 with a HDMI 1 that can't pass multichannel audio to the TV. Seems like I read previously it had something to do with HDCP 2.2 and multichannel audio over the same cable or something??


I suspect the message "Switching audio to TV speakers" to due to HDMI CEC (Bravia Sync) from the X10 telling the TV to turn on it's speakers when it is not outputting audio through HDMI 2. I suppose you could avoid this by turning off "Control for HDMI" in the HDMI settings of the X10.
Not sure why it behaves this way, but as you say, it may be a content protection thing. I have tried unsuccessfully to change the behavior. I don't use ARC, and Bravia Sync is turned off as well. I am frustrated, but since there is so little content on the X10, it only affects me occasionally.

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post #839 of 1283 Old 08-17-2014, 05:52 AM
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Tried it out watching the Karmin clip, didn't help a lick.

I would really like to know what's changed since I originally had it hooked up the exact same way earlier today. I mean everything is exactly the same and I had zero audio issues other than the lack of SL channel. . Now it turned into a complete mess...lol, so ridiculous.



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Thanks for reporting back. One of the most frustrating aspects of the audio issue is that sometimes the stars align and it works properly. Then the next time you try it, it's broken again.

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post #840 of 1283 Old 08-17-2014, 06:07 AM
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Tried it out watching the Karmin clip, didn't help a lick.

I would really like to know what's changed since I originally had it hooked up the exact same way earlier today. I mean everything is exactly the same and I had zero audio issues other than the lack of SL channel. . Now it turned into a complete mess...lol, so ridiculous.



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You can try and have Sony send you another one. I had the same problem on my X1 and they sent me 2 different ones before it worked right.
They first tried to fix over the phone and finally said we will send you a replacement. Not sure if they will do this for the X10, you would need to ask, but they are aware of the problem.
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