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Old 07-30-2014, 05:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Networking Setup - Cleanest way to run cables?

So I am trying to plan this out and thinking of savings some cash in the new build and doing the media closet in the basement myself.. I was wondering what most of you guys have done as far as keeping your networking cable clean.. I have done the breakdown for all the runs that will be entering the media closet. As you can see below it is a pretty extensive setup.. At least it is for me.. The Unity setup's wiring will be in their own enclosures, however I will need to connect roughly 48 cat6 wires to a network switch.. What would be the cleanest way to connect all the wires? I would prefer to do in wall enclosures, but not sure if doing a rack mount for the ethernet is better.. Any opinions?
Data/Telephone/Cable: Cat6 Cabling needed for the Legrand Unity System = 47 Cat6 Home runs
Cat6 Cabling needed for all Data ports in the house = 38 Cat 6 home runs
RG6 quad shield cabling needed for house = 7 RG6 quad shield cable home runs
Telephone cabling needed for house = 7 phone cable home runs
Audio speaker cabling needed for house = 17 x 16/4 cable home runs and 34 x 16/2 runs from keypad to speakers
Cat6 cabling for IP Camera System = 16 Cat6 home run cables

Alarm System:
Window Sensors = 27 Window Sensors

Door Sensors = 7 Door Sensors (This includes the garage doors)

Smoke Alarms = 6 Smoke Detectors

CO Alarms = 3 Carbon Monoxide Detectors

Motion Sensors = 5 Motion Sensors
Flood Detector = 2 Sensors
Keypads = 2 Keypads
Siren = 2 Sirens (1 indoor and 1 outdoor)

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Old 08-03-2014, 01:03 AM
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I'm not really sure what you are asking here but will throw a few things out to think about.

If you are terminating everything in one location like the basement you might want to consider getting some kind of a locking Cabinet that you could put all of the equipment in, this would give you some more security and the ability to have a single UPS System for everything. Of course if you want to save some money you can put things on some shelves or mount on a board.

When it comes to all of the cables ran from the various locations I personally like to use Patch Panel(s) as opposed to running the cables directly in to the equipment. Sure this does add a little extra cost but it makes life a whole lot easier if / when you decide to replace a piece of equipment which of course would have some kind of a different physical port layout and cause some kind of issue with the cabling you already have. With the patch panel(s) all you have to do is replace the cable from the panel to the equipment and you are done.

I also suggest using different color cables for easy identification this can be done with the cables running from the individual rooms to the patch panel as well as the patch panel to the equipment itself. That said make sure you label everything with labels that will last / not fall off / fade over time.
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Old 08-03-2014, 09:29 AM
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I'd stay away from that quad RG-6. Belsen 7915A is just as good and no special quad connectors are required. Much easier to use. Look it up.

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Old 08-04-2014, 11:17 PM
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Personally speaking, I think that's drastic overkill that will cost you a small fortune and most of it won't get used at all.

You need one cat 6 to each room. You can use a switch in rooms that require more than one connection. People think they're going to get bottlenecks that way but with gigabyte connection speed it'll be hard to max anything out, and if you do it will be for seconds at a time.

Most of the alarm system you can do with wireless technology. You should have ONE wired keyboard, the other one can be wireless. All of your sensors and smokes can be wireless. It's a bit more expensive going wireless but a lot easier.

Are you going with a monitoring company or are monitoring yourself? If you have a cell phone then you can easily monitor yourself. You can have text messages sent to your phone on just about any alarm function (arming, disarming, alarm triggers, fire, flood, doors/windows opening or closing.... etc)
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Old 08-05-2014, 08:36 AM
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My two cents includes learning to terminate your own cables where feasible. You can then purchase less-expensive bulk wiring and parts, cut to precise lengths and, in case of a failure, know how to troubleshoot/repair a bad run. Losing excess cable is best for keeping signal paths short while cleaning up the spaghetti.
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Old 08-05-2014, 09:35 AM
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Personally speaking, I think that's drastic overkill that will cost you a small fortune and most of it won't get used at all.

[bad advice deleted...]
Do we need to do this again, BB? The OP is building a new house. There will never be a better time to do wiring and do it right. It does not cost a fortune and, although his plan isn't that easy to understand, it does not appear to be overkill for a large house.

Wireless networking is really convenient for mobile devices. It sucks rocks for security and speed.

And, really, wireless security devices? Who wants to have to keep changing those batteries?

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(I think BB has microwaved his brain with too much wireless!)
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Old 08-05-2014, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Pvr4Craig View Post
Do we need to do this again, BB? The OP is building a new house. There will never be a better time to do wiring and do it right. It does not cost a fortune and, although his plan isn't that easy to understand, it does not appear to be overkill for a large house.
My opinions are as valid as yours and I am allowed to state them.

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Wireless networking is really convenient for mobile devices.
Agreed. Where did I say anything other than that?

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And, really, wireless security devices? Who wants to have to keep changing those batteries?
My system is almost completely wireless, including smokes and flood sensors. I installed it almost 3 years ago and have yet to change a battery. Please stick to things you know.

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Craig
(I think BB has microwaved his brain with too much wireless!)
Any further personal attacks and I will report you.
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Old 08-05-2014, 12:33 PM
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Regarding the number of Cat6 wires to pull to each room - your call, and I support overkill while the walls are open but FYI I'm doing just fine with 1 or 2 per room.

Regarding your wiring closet, I really think it is overkill to prepare for 48 hard wired devices. I agree with Diggles - pull bulk wire and get an RJ45 crimper and pinout sheet to do your own termination (oh, and decide now - T568A or T568B!). Then, rather than plugging everything in just terminate and plug in your active devices. This both makes it more cost efficient to run the wires now and lessens the networking requirements in your wiring closet. Most people just don't have the need for dozens of simultaneously active hard wired devices, even with 16 hard wired security cameras. How many PCs, smart TVs, and media players, etc. does any home need? Just mark your wires and plug in the active devices.

Oh, and make them pull nice long runs into your wiring closet! You want room to locate your cable, Cat6, phone, and alarm hubs without overlapping and making a mess in the closet so don't let them short you in the closet - you can always trim later.
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Old 08-05-2014, 12:47 PM
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I would rather have extra cat cables at each location rather than adding switches later. Especially when the walls are open. I also believe in two RG-6 cables. I use a roof top antenna for TV and FM Radio.

As a coincidence, as I post this, the local channels are out on my Dish. My wife gets to watch her Soap's on the antenna.

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Old 08-05-2014, 02:03 PM
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. Most people just don't have the need for dozens of simultaneously active hard wired devices, even with 16 hard wired security cameras. How many PCs, smart TVs, and media players, etc. does any home need? Just mark your wires and plug in the active devices.
.
Agree completely.
I'm a bit of an electronics junky and I have 4 tv's (6 in the summer), all streamable, 2 theater receivers, 3 desktop PC's, (one serving as NAS), a small boatload of wireless devices, including 3 cell phones, 2 tablets, 2 laptops.... not to mention 3 game machines for the kids. It's all networked and works fine.... on 1/2 of what the Op mentions.

Phone jacks? You need maybe one in the kitchen and one by your main PC (should you decide to use the PC as a fax machine), and use wireless phones. I don't know too many homes that don't use wireless phones now. Heck... I don't even have a land line anymore. I have a device which connects my cell phones via bluetooth to the house phones which allows me to make and take calls through the house phones over the cell towers. My alarm system is controlled and monitored over internet and cell towers. I even get a text message anywhere in the world when some one so much as rings my doorbell.

While it is true you really do need hard wire for the beast part of your system to handle the heavier loads (watching full bd rips or similar), running 17 miles of cat6 all over the house is just completely unnecessary. The cat6 is even overkill. Cat5 is quite a bit cheaper, will do the same thing and it's easier to work with.
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Old 08-05-2014, 02:51 PM
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I've got a 16 year old house that I wired with Cat5e when built. I've got 9 rooms and 12 home runs. The only room I didn't wire was the "formal dining room" - which promptly turned into a den/office. Lesson learned, wire everything.

For active hard wired devices I've got 1 smart TV, 2 dumb TVs with gaming/media devices, one server, one desktop PC, and three desks with hard wire connections for laptops - 8 devices. This allows me to stay with high end consumer grade networking hardware in my wiring closet rather than commercial grade devices. The security, cable TV, and phone systems are all independent.

If I were doing it again, I'd bump that up to 16-18 home runs - but only to facilitate furniture/device placement in rooms and redundancy, not because I'd need that many active hard wired devices.

To each their own, though. The walls are only going to be open once.
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Old 08-05-2014, 03:16 PM
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here's my input, coming from my perspective as a systems/network architect for a security firm.

1) forget wireless whenever possible. Hard wire all the things. Definitely do not use wireless for your security system. Wifi should be on a tightly controlled part of your network and ideally should not carry sensitive data. That might be a bit Utopian in today's world of tiny devices, but aim for that goal and it'll be easier to protect the things you simply can't hard-wire.

2) Cat6a is great, but costly. If the extra expense is worth it to you for future-proofing then by all means, use it everywhere. If you want to save a few dollars, wire things like security cameras with Cat5e. The likelihood of them ever needing to do 10GbE is pretty slim. 1GbE works great with Cat5e.

3) Use patch panels in any place where you have more than about 4 cables coming from the wall outlet(s) and you can tuck the patch panel out of sight. There will come a day when you'll be very happy that you did.

4) If you have room and can hide it away properly, use a rack for your main hardware location. Get cable management for that rack. If it needs to be more presentable, use a cabinet... but if at all possible, rack mount your components within that cabinet.

5) Consider cooling requirements. Nothing is worse than getting all that equipment into place and working, then realizing you don't have enough airflow to keep it all cool. The method you use will vary greatly depending on your environment, but definitely keep it in mind.

6) Use different colored wires for different purposes in your main rack. Personally, I use red for anything outside my firewall, orange for DMZ, white for trusted, and blue for in-wall. I match keystones to cable colors. Pick whatever colors you like, but it's very nice to be able to tell at a glance that a particular wire or plug is on a particular segment of the network.

7) label *everything* you can. label each end of each wire, label wall jacks, label patch panels, label, label, label. It doesn't hurt to have a diagram or at least a list of what is where posted in or near your rack/cabinet.

8) invest in a good switch or switches. It doesn't have to be a full Cisco chassis, but get one that is managed and has more features than you currently need. Port mirroring/spanning is a great thing to have if you ever decide you want to monitor your entire network. Not a lot of consumer grade switches out there have this, but there are good options that do. Personally I really like TP-Link for a cheap but quality option. They constantly surprise me in a good way.

I could go on and on... but I think those points cover the main things. I envy that you're in a position to get this all right the first time. Best of luck!

edit: to expand a bit on cable management, since that was kinda the OP's question in the first place - get a raceway to go over your rack, and at least some "fingers" for the cabling side of the rack. A big part of my job is deploying our proprietary hardware in customer datacenters, and I usually spend more time making the cabling look pretty than I do installing and configuring the gear. Nothing says "professional" like a well-organized rack, and no rack can be well organized without good cable management.

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Old 08-05-2014, 07:09 PM
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Definitely do not use wireless for your security system.
Why?
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Old 08-05-2014, 08:36 PM
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Why?
because any halfway decent hacker can defeat that wireless system if he chooses to, without ever being noticed. That's not to say that wired ones can't be defeated, because they can, but it's significantly harder to do it without someone catching on. The same goes for wireless versus wired networking.
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Old 08-05-2014, 09:15 PM
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because any halfway decent hacker can defeat that wireless system if he chooses to, without ever being noticed.
Sorry man... that's just completely untrue. A lot of fear mongering going on here.

Not saying it's impossible mind you but you really need to know what you're doing... and if that's the case then you can also defeat a wired system. In fact some say wireless is harder to defeat because unlike hard wired sensors (with exception to smokes), the wireless ones must "check in" every few minutes. If one doesn't "check in" for what ever reason it triggers a "trouble code" or "alarm" depending on how you program it to respond. If you manage to shunt a hard wired sensor on the other hand, the ball game is over because it never has to check in and therefore will go completely unnoticed. An EOL resistor is used to make it a bit more difficult to bypass a hard wired sensor, but then if you know what you're doing it's pretty easy to defeat.

All of the big alarm manufactures are now offering wireless (ATI, ADT, DSC, Honeywell... etc) and it is installed in hundreds of thousands of homes all over the world. The better quality systems have jamming protection/notification, mac address enrollment which can not be unenrolled without a hard reset, and of course, the "check in".

Wireless systems today are about as secure as any hardwired system and in some cases... better.

So if anybody actually has any FACTS here then feel free to list them... otherwise stop the fear mongering please.

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Old 08-05-2014, 09:37 PM
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The same goes for wireless versus wired networking.
There is only one reason wifi gets hacked and it's called operator error. Using dumb 3 letter passwords, using your pets name, not using encryption PLUS mac address filtering, broadcasting your (pretty named) ssid for the whole world to see.... etc. I actually have a friend who is proud of the ssid name he's picked out and proudly broadcasts it at full strength.... DUMB.

You show me a household wifi system that got hacked... and I'll show you operator error every single time

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Old 08-05-2014, 09:58 PM
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There is only one reason wifi gets hacked and it's called operator error. Using dumb 3 letter passwords, using your pets name, not using encryption PLUS mac address filtering, broadcasting your (pretty named) ssid for the whole world to see.... etc. I actually have a friend who is proud of the ssid name he's picked out and proudly broadcasts it at full strength.... DUMB.

You show me a household wifi system that got hacked... and I'll show you operator error every single time
that is incredibly incorrect. You show me any household wifi system and I'll show you how to hack it. Well I would, if it were ethical to do so... but the point is that they can all be broken. WEP takes about 10 seconds using something cheaper and weaker than a raspberry pi. WPA and WPA2 take a little bit longer, but they are still incredibly easy to break.

SSIDs don't even enter into the equation. Not broadcasting your SSID does absolutely nothing to secure the network. So you don't know what it's called... so what? you don't need to know what it's called. you only need to know it's there... and there's no way to hide that. Mac address filtering? lol. that doesn't do anything, either.
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Old 08-05-2014, 10:04 PM
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that is incredibly incorrect. You show me any household wifi system and I'll show you how to hack it. Well I would,.
Please do. Prove it to me... otherwise stop with the rubbish.

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you only need to know it's there..
Yes well... that's kind of what ssid broadcasting does

The "pretty name" simply says... I'M HERE.....HACK ME PLEASE.

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Old 08-05-2014, 10:07 PM
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Sorry man... that's just completely untrue. A lot of fear mongering going on here.

Not saying it's impossible mind you but you really need to know what you're doing... and if that's the case then you can also defeat a wired system. In fact some say wireless is harder to defeat because unlike hard wired sensors (with exception to smokes), the wireless ones must "check in" every few minutes. If one doesn't "check in" for what ever reason it triggers a "trouble code" or "alarm" depending on how you program it to respond. If you manage to shunt a hard wired sensor on the other hand, the ball game is over because it never has to check in and therefore will go completely unnoticed. An EOL resistor is used to make it a bit more difficult to bypass a hard wired sensor, but then if you know what you're doing it's pretty easy to defeat.

All of the big alarm manufactures are now offering wireless (ATI, ADT, DSC, Honeywell... etc) and it is installed in hundreds of thousands of homes all over the world. The better quality systems have jamming protection/notification, mac address enrollment which can not be unenrolled without a hard reset, and of course, the "check in".

Wireless systems today are about as secure as any hardwired system and in some cases... better.

So if anybody actually has any FACTS here then feel free to list them... otherwise stop the fear mongering please.
I missed this one, but it's incorrect as well. The major security companies are making wireless because it can be installed super-cheap and it does provide a certain level of security. Less than a wired system... but really no home security system is providing a fool-proof barrier.

It's not fear mongering, it's fact. Also, the days of "really needing to know what you're doing" are long gone. Sure, that helps... but all a person needs to break any common form of wireless security is a desire to do so and access to the internet. it's sad, but it's true.
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Old 08-05-2014, 10:18 PM
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I missed this one, but it's incorrect as well. The major security companies are making wireless because it can be installed super-cheap and it does provide a certain level of security. Less than a wired system... but really no home security system is providing a fool-proof barrier.

It's not fear mongering, it's fact. Also, the days of "really needing to know what you're doing" are long gone. Sure, that helps... but all a person needs to break any common form of wireless security is a desire to do so and access to the internet. it's sad, but it's true.
You have produced no facts whatsoever... just more empty words.
Wired sensors DON'T CHECK IN. The alarm panel measures a voltage through the sensor with the use of a EOL resistor. This can be EASILY defeated by shunting.
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Old 08-05-2014, 10:34 PM
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You have produced no facts whatsoever... just more empty words.
Wired sensors DON'T CHECK IN. The alarm panel measures a voltage through the sensor with the use of a EOL resistor. This can be EASILY defeated by shunting.
are you being serious? Nothing I said was discovered or invented by me. It's all very well-known fact that can be easily verified by going to google.com and choosing a few relevant search terms. You think a wireless device's check-in provides any real security? it doesn't. not even remotely. wired sensors are typically connected by a loop of wire that runs through walls. Voltage is passed through that loop several times per second and if the status at the return end of that loop (open or closed) has changed since the last reading (again, just milliseconds ago) then the panel registers the fault. That's essentially the same thing as a check-in... the sensors are polled directly. Sure, the loop can be bypassed by cutting into the wall. Just not as easily as a wireless one can be. All the check-in does is ensure that nobody has removed or destroyed the wireless device. Nobody with any halfway decent technique would do that with a wireless system. There are far too many easier ways to defeat it.

I haven't provided details because I'm not interested in instructing people how to hack things. There are plenty of other people who are, and a great many of them have published information right here on the internet. Feel free to go read on your own and realize that everything I've said is true. Besides... I wasn't posting it to stir up some sort of beef with you. I was simply giving advice to the OP about their situation. I'm very well qualified to give that advice and I'm happy to do it... but arguing about it with someone who doesn't want to hear what I'm saying is an exercise in futility.
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Old 08-05-2014, 10:47 PM
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are you being serious? Nothing I said was discovered or invented by me. It's all very well-known fact that can be easily verified by going to google.com and choosing a few relevant search terms.
I can google "saw an alien" and get 10,000 hits.


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You think a wireless device's check-in provides any real security? it doesn't. not even remotely.
Really? and if it misses a chaeck in? Nothing happens? Are you sure?

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wired sensors are typically connected by a loop of wire that runs through walls.
And comes out at the piont of the sensor... example... a door with a window. All I have to do is break the window and I have assess to the wires.

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Voltage is passed through that loop several times per second and if the status at the return end of that loop (open or closed) has changed since the last reading (again, just milliseconds ago) then the panel registers the fault.
It's a constant voltage and I have acess to that constant voltage anywhere there is a sensor, and I am free to shunt it at any time. I don't have to break into walls. With wireless there are no wires to play with so it has to be played with electronically... good luck with that.

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I haven't provided details because I'm not interested in instructing people how to hack things. There are plenty of other people who are, and a great many of them have published information right here on the internet. Feel free to go read on your own and realize that everything I've said is true. Besides... I wasn't posting it to stir up some sort of beef with you. I was simply giving advice to the OP about their situation. I'm very well qualified to give that advice and I'm happy to do it... but arguing about it with someone who doesn't want to hear what I'm saying is an exercise in futility.
You're not hearing me. This isn't about hacking. It's about setting yourself up to be hacked.

Look.... If I don't broadcast my ssid and I'm under 5 or 6 layers of protection, meanwhile the guy next door to me has a broadcasted ssid named YOU_CAN'T_HACK_ME with a single layer of protection... who are you going to hack?

I'll say it again... you show me a household wifi system that got hacked.... and I'll show you operator error.
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Old 08-06-2014, 12:01 AM
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Originally Posted by bigbarney View Post
I can google "saw an alien" and get 10,000 hits.
try something a little more relevant and see what you get.

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Really? and if it misses a chaeck in? Nothing happens? Are you sure?
It won't miss a check-in. That's the whole point. It can be defeated easily without ever missing a check-in... so the check-in you're so obsessed with has nothing to do with the viability of a wireless home security system.

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And comes out at the piont of the sensor... example... a door with a window. All I have to do is break the window and I have assess to the wires.
actually, no. Most wired systems don't have exposed wires or sensors at all. The sensors are built into door and window frames. The only place they come out of the wall is at the panel. After you broke that window you'd need to saw into sheetrock to get to the wires. This type of system has been the standard for new construction in most areas for over 20 years.

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It's a constant voltage and I have acess to that constant voltage anywhere there is a sensor, and I am free to shunt it at any time. I don't have to break into walls. With wireless there are no wires to play with so it has to be played with electronically... good luck with that.
again, you don't have access to the wires. And playing with things electronically is what I do for a living. Lots of people do it for a hobby. It's not hard. some people think it's fun.

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You're not hearing me. This isn't about hacking. It's about setting yourself up to be hacked.

Look.... If I don't broadcast my ssid and I'm under 5 or 6 layers of protection, meanwhile the guy next door to me has a broadcasted ssid named YOU_CAN'T_HACK_ME with a single layer of protection... who are you going to hack?
I'll repeat myself - broadcasting or not broadcasting an SSID has absolutely zero affect on a system's security. Any device listening nearby can see the traffic generated by any wifi device on the same frequency. It doesn't matter if the SSID is broadcast or not. That's like saying I'm less prone to being mugged if I don't wear a nametag. It's irrelevant. As for how targets are chosen - it's not always about random selection or happenstance. Most attacks of this type are targeted at specific individuals, companies, or geographical areas. And if they are doing it randomly, there's no reason to choose one over another or to stop at just one network. The easiest method of attack is to use an unattended throwaway device. Everyone is equally at risk in that case, regardless of the SSID-related checkboxes on their wifi access point's configuration page.

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I'll say it again... you show me a household wifi system that got hacked.... and I'll show you operator error.
you're still wrong about this. Any WEP, WPA or WPA2 wifi network can be compromised with little more than a script that is widely available. it's very, very simple. I have yet to meet a home system I could not break into if I wanted to. Regardless of who is operating it. The only ones that are somewhat secure are commercial ones that require two factor auth with a rolling code or similar mechanism. Even those can be broken if determined enough. I have ethics, so I don't go around breaking into wifi networks... but lots and lots of people don't share my view of things or my desire to operate within the law. Those people are called criminals. Believe it or not, they are out there.

you don't believe me, I get it. that's fine. I know what I'm talking about, though. This is what I do for a living, and I've been doing it for a long time. That said, I wouldn't have this job if the entire world really understood security. So I guess in a way I'm glad that some people aren't on the same page as me
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Old 08-06-2014, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by djjoshuad View Post
try something a little more relevant and see what you get.


It won't miss a check-in. That's the whole point. It can be defeated easily without ever missing a check-in... so the check-in you're so obsessed with has nothing to do with the viability of a wireless home security system.
WRONG. It can't be defeated "easily". You're just blowing smoke with no facts again. Tens of Thousands of homes are using wireless security today quite successfully. If these systems are so "easy" to defeat, we would have heard about it now tens of thousands of times. Stop with your fear mongering bull crap please.


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actually, no. Most wired systems don't have exposed wires or sensors at all. The sensors are built into door and window frames.
WRONG.
While you can use hidden sensors in a door, you can't drill into modern window encasements (not at least without destroying its warranty) so the last few inches is exposed wire. Most hidden door sensors will look like this:



However most window encasement sensors will look like this:


Quote:
I'll repeat myself - broadcasting or not broadcasting an SSID has absolutely zero affect on a system's security. Any device listening nearby can see the traffic generated by any wifi device on the same frequency.
WRONG
You keep missing the point. A broadcasted ssid is a sore thumb that sticks out. It attracts attention
It doesn't matter if the SSID is broadcast or not as far as hacking itself goes, but that's NOT THE POINT.

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As for how targets are chosen - it's not always about random selection or happenstance. Most attacks of this type are targeted at specific individuals, companies, or geographical areas.
Interesting. You now even seem to know how targets are chosen... or you claim to anyway. Can you also see into a hacker's mind and tell me what they had for breakfast? Stop pulling "facts" out of the air please




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you're still wrong about this. Any WEP, WPA or WPA2 wifi network can be compromised with little more than a script that is widely available. it's very, very simple. I have yet to meet a home system I could not break into if I wanted to. Regardless of who is operating it. The only ones that are somewhat secure are commercial ones that require two factor auth with a rolling code or similar mechanism. Even those can be broken if determined enough. I have ethics, so I don't go around breaking into wifi networks... but lots and lots of people don't share my view of things or my desire to operate within the law. Those people are called criminals. Believe it or not, they are out there.
You're missing the point AGAIN.

This isn't about hacking. It's about setting yourself up to get hacked

Last edited by bigbarney; 08-06-2014 at 08:06 AM.
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Old 08-06-2014, 09:23 AM
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ok man, you still don't know what you're talking about but... whatever you say. I'm not interested in continuing this. OP, if you have any questions, please PM me directly. This thread has been derailed long enough.
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Old 08-06-2014, 10:25 AM
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ok man, you still don't know what you're talking about but... whatever you say..
Yes, you keep saying that. The problem is that you have yet to back ANY of your words with fact. Stop your fear mongering. Tens of thousands of households (maybe even more) rely on wireless security systems every day of the week and while nothing is 100% burglar proof, wireless systems today are by no means (I'll use your word).... "easy" to bypass. It's rubbish and you're blowing smoke.
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Old 08-06-2014, 10:39 AM
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Yes, you keep saying that. The problem is that you have yet to back ANY of your words with fact. Stop your fear mongering. Tens of thousands of households (maybe even more) rely on wireless security systems every day of the week and while nothing is 100% burglar proof, wireless systems today are by no means (I'll use your word).... "easy" to bypass. It's rubbish and you're blowing smoke.
ugh... I can't believe I'm letting myself get drawn back into this ridiculous argument.

I have stated lots and lots of facts. everything I've said is fact. none of it is opinion other than my assessment of difficulty, but I stand by that. Just because I'm not giving you examples on how to do it doesn't mean it's not a fact. I've told you time and again that all you need to do is research a little bit and you'll see that what I'm telling you is true. What more proof do you need before you will let this go? I have training, certifications, and years upon years of professional experience that have taught me these things. I'm an expert in this field and I am just sharing my recommendations and advice with OP to help him get started down the right track. What could I possibly gain from "blowing smoke?" Why would I take the time to write it all up? Just to screw with people? That makes no sense. I'm not going to demonstrate to you how to break the law and instruct you how to steal from people. that would be unethical. But *once again* you can look most of it up online in less time than it would take you to come up with another ridiculous argument against all of the facts I already gave. Fortunately, for the purposes of this thread at least, so can everyone else. So at least they can see how unreasonable you're being without having to subject themselves to a conversation with you.

good grief, man... just go look it up. it's really not difficult. I'm not coming back to this thread.
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Old 08-06-2014, 11:04 AM
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I have stated lots and lots of facts. everything I've said is fact. none of it is opinion other than my assessment of difficulty, but I stand by that.
You have stated no fact whatsoever.

The problem here is that fear mongers such as yourself AUTOMATICALLY equate wireless technology as "unsafe" and that's total 110% rubbish. If that were the case then we wouldn't have wait staff showing up at your dining table with a wireless card reader.

What it comes down to is how the wireless technology is applied and protected... OPERATOR ERROR.

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I have training, certifications, and years upon years of professional experience that have taught me these things.
Clearly not the PROPER training.

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I've told you time and again that all you need to do is research a little bit and you'll see that what I'm telling you is true.
I do research on the topic all the time. I work for the Province and I have 152 emergency shelters for kids in need and every single one of those shelters uses wireless technology of some kind in their security systems with wireless panic buttons for the staff. The staff can't even forget to remove their wireless panic buttons before they go home because the alarm senses the lost zone and triggers.

Wireless technology is safe. It all comes down to how it is applied.
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Old 08-06-2014, 02:18 PM
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... What more proof do you need before you will let this go? ...
That's the trouble with BB is that he's convinced "wireless GOOD, wired BAD". He rejects any facts that don't fit his predetermined world view and will argue endlessly. However, his arguments boil down to: "I'm right because you can't convince me I'm wrong". Unfortunately, a tonne of his crap is now out there leading unsuspecting folks down his particular path of stupid.

Craig
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Old 08-06-2014, 03:25 PM
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To expand on what djjoshuad posted

1) I agree complete wireless is for your phone / tablet / laptop that doesn't have a wired connection everything else should be wired if at all possible.

2) I'd go with Cat 6, it is very common and not a whole lot more than Cat5e ($20 per 1000 feet) and will more than likely work with the 10G Standard without an issue. If money isn't an object then why not go with Cat 6a. I can see a time when some people would want a 10G connection (maybe that is just me as I can saturate a Gig connection all day long moving video files around my network).

3) I already mentioned the use of Patch Panels in my original post and agree it is worth the extra expense of using them.

4) Cable Management is what is going to make everything look nice and neat

5) Cooling should always be a concern but most unless you have a rack full of servers you will probably be ok in the basement.

6) Couldn't agree more with color coding every Data Center does it and I do it in my own personal network as well.

7) You will never be sorry for taking the time to label EVERYTHING and I mean everything including power cords and especially AC Adapters which makes life so much easier.

8) I'm a Network person and also suggest getting some kind of a "Managed" Switch. This will give you the ability to troubleshoot issue that will more than likely will arise over time. I used to love the Netgear Line but they have gone way down hill. I've never heard of TP-Link but Cisco makes a Small Business Product that is awesome! They aren't cheap but certainly no where near the price of their enterprise products either. I have their SG300-28P which is a POE switch and has been rock solid since the day I installed it.

I took at look at the TP-Link Switches they look exactly like the Dell Line of Switches. For the money check out the Cisco Small Business ones I don't think you will be disappointed.
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Last edited by funhouse69; 08-06-2014 at 03:30 PM.
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