Plasma TV? Specifically viewing in naturally bright rooms. - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 52 Old 09-15-2011, 03:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Hello, I am trying to help a friend find a good deal on a TV. The info first:
10.5 viewing distance from tv, wide 10 foot couch, bright lit room - patio door in apartment fills room with natural light. Mostly viewing TV, and dvd's no game playing. Budget approximately $800.00-$1000.00

The main question here is, as far as screen coatings go and actual tv technology, will plasma perform better in these specific condidtions? My friend says that she hates tv's with bad viewing angles, and she doesn't want to end up with a tv like that. She asked me if she should go LCD, Plasma, or LED. I am assuming because the way that LED's project light that they would be the best in this scenario, but I am not entirely sure. Any advice on this subject would be appreciated.

I've been through C-net and there's way too many models to choose from.

Because of the budget we were looking at the LG 47lk520 or the Panasonic Viera TC-P46ST30. I know the LG is an LCD, but just throwing it in the mix. I am pretty lost on this and was looking for some help
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post #2 of 52 Old 09-15-2011, 04:24 PM
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from 10 feet away you would want at least a 50 to 55 inch set 46 inch is way to small. also the pannys handle light better then lg
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post #3 of 52 Old 09-17-2011, 09:16 PM
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I am looking to buy a new TV, as I presently have a 28" CRT. While I know little from first hand experience, but I have read a lot on these and other sites.

I am debating between the 47LK520 and the different LG plasma, as Panasonic plasmas cost relatively more in Canada. (We're talking $700 for the LG vs $1100 for the Pan.)

The LG 47LK520 has a matte screen, so glare will really be reduced (some high end LCD's - mainly LED's (I believe) have glossy screens which are moving in the direction of plasma in terms of creating glare. This model is built with one of 2 panels, an IPS and a VA. The IPS is a better panel with I believe better viewing angles and if you are going into a retail store, you can tell which TV you are getting by the serial no. on the box (check LK520 on this board for more info).

From reading here and elsewhere, I would be careful regarding the plasma because her area has a lot of light and if things don't work out you might catch flack. Most people are less demanding regarding perfect color, etc. than people on this forum. But excessive glare could be a deal killer in this case, unless your friend wants to close the blinds, etc.

To some extent, it's about tradeoffs, so you might be able to find a different LCD or LED with better viewing angles. There are threads on pretty much every LCD/LED here. If she's not in a hurry, you can also check for deals.
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post #4 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 05:01 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by resevil83 View Post

Hello, I am trying to help a friend find a good deal on a TV. The info first:
10.5 viewing distance from tv, wide 10 foot couch, bright lit room - patio door in apartment fills room with natural light. Mostly viewing TV, and dvd's no game playing. Budget approximately $800.00-$1000.00

The main question here is, as far as screen coatings go and actual tv technology, will plasma perform better in these specific condidtions? My friend says that she hates tv's with bad viewing angles, and she doesn't want to end up with a tv like that. She asked me if she should go LCD, Plasma, or LED. I am assuming because the way that LED's project light that they would be the best in this scenario, but I am not entirely sure. Any advice on this subject would be appreciated.

I've been through C-net and there's way too many models to choose from.

Because of the budget we were looking at the LG 47lk520 or the Panasonic Viera TC-P46ST30. I know the LG is an LCD, but just throwing it in the mix. I am pretty lost on this and was looking for some help

You are going to have to make compromises no matter which technology you choose. In the end, you will most likely have to buy a set and bring it home to see if she is happy with it.
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post #5 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by resevil83 View Post

Hello, I am trying to help a friend find a good deal on a TV. The info first:
10.5 viewing distance from tv, wide 10 foot couch, bright lit room - patio door in apartment fills room with natural light. Mostly viewing TV, and dvd's no game playing. Budget approximately $800.00-$1000.00

The main question here is, as far as screen coatings go and actual tv technology, will plasma perform better in these specific condidtions? My friend says that she hates tv's with bad viewing angles, and she doesn't want to end up with a tv like that. She asked me if she should go LCD, Plasma, or LED. I am assuming because the way that LED's project light that they would be the best in this scenario, but I am not entirely sure. Any advice on this subject would be appreciated.

I've been through C-net and there's way too many models to choose from.

Because of the budget we were looking at the LG 47lk520 or the Panasonic Viera TC-P46ST30. I know the LG is an LCD, but just throwing it in the mix. I am pretty lost on this and was looking for some help

At a 10ft viewing distance, you should look at a 50 inch plasma at a minimum... If room is brightly lit- LG will be VERY reflective and not a good choice. Panny's are less reflective. If budget is a concern - look at the Panny TCP50S30. Can get now for under $800.
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post #6 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 08:02 AM
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Some feel with a bright room a pdp is a bad choice. I have such a room and the pdp works great but it depends on where the light hits the set. Behind the set no problem. To the sides might be and in front of the set (where you are between the light and the set) is likely a problem. The panny ST30 is a great set and I would choose it over the LG. I would also say my new Sony ex500 handles bright rooms very well and is a matte screen with decent OAV. Sony even has a B series 420 that does well with reflections.

Someone already gave you the best advice. Buy one bring it home and see if it works for you. Repeat as necessary.
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post #7 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by resevil83 View Post
Hello, I am trying to help a friend find a good deal on a TV. The info first:
10.5 viewing distance from tv, wide 10 foot couch, bright lit room - patio door in apartment fills room with natural light. Mostly viewing TV, and dvd's no game playing. Budget approximately $800.00-$1000.00

The main question here is, as far as screen coatings go and actual tv technology, will plasma perform better in these specific condidtions? My friend says that she hates tv's with bad viewing angles, and she doesn't want to end up with a tv like that. She asked me if she should go LCD, Plasma, or LED. I am assuming because the way that LED's project light that they would be the best in this scenario, but I am not entirely sure. Any advice on this subject would be appreciated.

I've been through C-net and there's way too many models to choose from.

Because of the budget we were looking at the LG 47lk520 or the Panasonic Viera TC-P46ST30. I know the LG is an LCD, but just throwing it in the mix. I am pretty lost on this and was looking for some help
I have the 47LD520 which is last year's model. We sit 10' away from the LG in a room with an 8'x10' sliding glass door to the left of the tv. Indirect light during the daytime with no reflections or glare at all. Night time viewing is with a bias light behind the set and for us, it is perfect. We wanted a screen big enough (and with an S-IPS panel) to enjoy movies etc but not be the dominant feature in the room. But it all depends on what feels good to you. 50''-55" is a nice size but it would've been too big for our room.
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post #8 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 02:31 PM - Thread Starter
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So, essentially what I'm getting here is that I should be trying to find a deal on a 50" tv. Plasma usually have glossy screens and is bad for wide viewing angles and light rooms, but very accurate with colors. LCD's are in the same boat, however some have ips panels which are better to get. I hate to start a debate about the two different platforms, but in all truth is there one better for this situation?
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post #9 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 03:15 PM
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That call can only be made by you no matter what anyone says here. I've never had a plasma but from what I've read here, the glossy screen in a well lit room can be a problem. I'm watching a football game now in the middle of the afternoon with the curtains wide and there is no reflection at all on the screen and colors look very nice (the set is calibrated). But, plasmas have blacker blacks than LCDs in general so color definition, in theory, should be better. I would try to find the two in a local store and check them out from 10' away. Keeping in mind that both sets will probably be in torch mode and not how you would probably watch it. Either set is a good set so you may just have to bring one home, set it up, and watch it for awhile under various conditions and decide. Whatever you decide, once you set it up, try it with a bias light behind the set for evening viewing. It will make a difference.
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post #10 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 03:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by resevil83 View Post

So, essentially what I'm getting here is that I should be trying to find a deal on a 50" tv. Plasma usually have glossy screens and is bad for wide viewing angles and light rooms, but very accurate with colors. LCD's are in the same boat, however some have ips panels which are better to get. I hate to start a debate about the two different platforms, but in all truth is there one better for this situation?

Plasmas have wide viewing angles, so that is not true.
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post #11 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 03:45 PM
 
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Plasmas don't do well in bright and wash out colors.
Leds and lcds have a high level of light output so they do very well in a lighted environment. Cheers
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post #12 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 07:15 PM
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IMO, a matte IPS panel is your best bet. So that leaves LG, Vizio and some Toshibas. I believe that all 47" panels are IPS panels made by LG.
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post #13 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 07:23 PM
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fwiw, i never had any issues with a plasma in a 2nd floor room with a ton of ambient natural light...

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post #14 of 52 Old 09-18-2011, 08:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Benign View Post

IMO, a matte IPS panel is your best bet. So that leaves LG, Vizio and some Toshibas. I believe that all 47" panels are IPS panels made by LG.

The LG 47LD520 (last year's model, with a "W" in the fourth position of the product code) and the LG 47LK520 (this year's model, with a "Y" in the fourth position of the product code) have the S-IPS panel.
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post #15 of 52 Old 09-23-2011, 09:18 AM
 
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Without any doubt, in a bright enviornment, LCD hands down is a better choice. You should really be considering a quality LCD/LED set.
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post #16 of 52 Old 09-24-2011, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

Without any doubt, in a bright enviornment, LCD hands down is a better choice. You should really be considering a quality LCD/LED set.

Modern Plasmas get plenty bright enough for most bright rooms, and nobody ever adjusts their screen brightness any higher than about 70%-80% because it's just not necessary. A Plasma can usually handle a bright room unless the there are extraordinary circumstances such as a south-facing window location, or a light source is really bad, or the TV is placed or located in such a way that a bright source can be seen in the screen (like being on a north wall directly across from a south facing window).

Here's my old dim 2005 Plasma displaying dim icky SD in Cinema mode with the screen brightness set to about 90% in my overly bright living room. The current models are a lot brighter than this old girl, and with much better contrast and brighter colors and better Anti-Reflective filter.

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post #17 of 52 Old 09-24-2011, 04:50 PM
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See "How to Rid Your HDTV of Reflections"

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post #18 of 52 Old 09-24-2011, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by resevil83 View Post

Hello, I am trying to help a friend find a good deal on a TV. The info first:
10.5 viewing distance from tv, wide 10 foot couch, bright lit room - patio door in apartment fills room with natural light. Mostly viewing TV, and dvd's no game playing. Budget approximately $800.00-$1000.00

The main question here is, as far as screen coatings go and actual tv technology, will plasma perform better in these specific condidtions? My friend says that she hates tv's with bad viewing angles, and she doesn't want to end up with a tv like that. She asked me if she should go LCD, Plasma, or LED. I am assuming because the way that LED's project light that they would be the best in this scenario, but I am not entirely sure. Any advice on this subject would be appreciated.

I've been through C-net and there's way too many models to choose from.

Because of the budget we were looking at the LG 47lk520 or the Panasonic Viera TC-P46ST30. I know the LG is an LCD, but just throwing it in the mix. I am pretty lost on this and was looking for some help

A couple things to take into consideration, can the patio door be controlled by drapes or blinds and when is the majority of viewing done? If the majority of viewing is done in the evening then the bright light may not be as big of an issue. All in all like others have said, their will be compromises that will need to be done but in your budget a 50" plasma (pany seems to do better with light than others) might be your best choice or if the light issue is a big deal to your friend then their are some LCDs that fit the bill but you might have to go down to a 46" to stay within budget.
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post #19 of 52 Old 09-24-2011, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

Modern Plasmas get plenty bright enough for most bright rooms, and nobody ever adjusts their screen brightness any higher than about 70%-80% because it's just not necessary. A Plasma can usually handle a bright room unless the there are extraordinary circumstances such as a south-facing window location, or a light source is really bad, or the TV is placed or located in such a way that a bright source can be seen in the screen (like being on a north wall directly across from a south facing window).

Here's my old dim 2005 Plasma displaying dim icky SD in Cinema mode with the screen brightness set to about 90% in my overly bright living room. The current models are a lot brighter than this old girl, and with much better contrast and brighter colors and better Anti-Reflective filter.


That looks pretty good in all that ambient light. How about if the windows were on the side of the TV with a small percentage of direct light on it? That's my current situation at my place. I'm hoping to upgrade my TV in the near future and I'm very concerned that plasma won't be able to handle the light sources. That was my biggest pet-peeve with my old CRT...too much reflection.

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post #20 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 08:02 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

Modern Plasmas get plenty bright enough for most bright rooms, and nobody ever adjusts their screen brightness any higher than about 70%-80% because it's just not necessary. A Plasma can usually handle a bright room unless the there are extraordinary circumstances such as a south-facing window location, or a light source is really bad, or the TV is placed or located in such a way that a bright source can be seen in the screen (like being on a north wall directly across from a south facing window).

Here's my old dim 2005 Plasma displaying dim icky SD in Cinema mode with the screen brightness set to about 90% in my overly bright living room. The current models are a lot brighter than this old girl, and with much better contrast and brighter colors and better Anti-Reflective filter.


LCD is still a better choice in a bright enviornment, the experts have already shown and proven that.
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post #21 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 08:48 AM
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They are a lot better than they used to be, but I still wouldn't recommend a plasma in a bright room at all.
LED screens are far better suited to viewing in a bright room with considerably higher light output and energy efficiency when doing so.

If the room is going to be bright when watching TV, viewing angles are much less of an issue with LCD as well. (it's mostly in a dark room where they get bad)


She needs to check out those models in a showroom for herself and see which compromise she is willing to make.

That said:


Check the matte LCD in the top left, what appears to be a plasma in the bottom left (at least that's how they tend to look in comparison) and the glossy LCDs everywhere else.

I would ignore the color differences (settings) but look at how the jacket is completely washed out on the plasma & matte LCD. (poor contrast in bright conditions)

Just a picture I found on google images, no idea of the source.
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post #22 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronoptimist View Post

They are a lot better than they used to be, but I still wouldn't recommend a plasma in a bright room at all.
LED screens are far better suited to viewing in a bright room with considerably higher light output and energy efficiency when doing so.

If the room is going to be bright when watching TV, viewing angles are much less of an issue with LCD as well. (it's mostly in a dark room where they get bad)


She needs to check out those models in a showroom for herself and see which compromise she is willing to make.

That said:


Check the matte LCD in the top left, what appears to be a plasma in the bottom left (at least that's how they tend to look in comparison) and the glossy LCDs everywhere else.

I would ignore the color differences (settings) but look at how the jacket is completely washed out on the plasma & matte LCD. (poor contrast in bright conditions)

Just a picture I found on google images, no idea of the source.

The second TV on the left downunder seems to be a 2008/2009 Sony model.
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post #23 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 09:35 AM
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Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post

The second TV on the left downunder seems to be a 2008/2009 Sony model.

Hm, so it does. The page I took it from said it was posted in 2011.

Still, as much as they are working on improving the screen coatings, plasma loses contrast the brighter the room gets unlike LCD where black level actually improves.
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post #24 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 09:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

Modern Plasmas get plenty bright enough for most bright rooms, and nobody ever adjusts their screen brightness any higher than about 70%-80% because it's just not necessary. A Plasma can usually handle a bright room unless the there are extraordinary circumstances such as a south-facing window location, or a light source is really bad, or the TV is placed or located in such a way that a bright source can be seen in the screen (like being on a north wall directly across from a south facing window).

Here's my old dim 2005 Plasma displaying dim icky SD in Cinema mode with the screen brightness set to about 90% in my overly bright living room. The current models are a lot brighter than this old girl, and with much better contrast and brighter colors and better Anti-Reflective filter.


My Elite 111FD is set up similarly in front of two very large windows, and with the light directly behind the brightness even in the middle of the day with the blinds open is never an issue. My 151FD was set up with windows to the side, which would wash out the picture with the blinds opened, but with them closed it looked great in the day, and of course spectacular in the evenings/at night.

Plasma light output just isn't an issue, and that's been clearly shown time and again. The biggest issue is glare and the elevation of black levels with direct ambient light, which can easily be mitigated with blinds/drapes. If someone wants to have full daytime ambient lighting in their room, an LCD will work better than a plasma.

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post #25 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

LCD is still a better choice in a bright enviornment, the experts have already shown and proven that.

I'm new to that particular "LCD vs plasma" conclusion - sources please!

OTOH, I have DLP FP, Plasma, LCD and LED in my home at the moment.

IMHO, of the direct view displays, the Sammy plasma does best in "bright" conditions.

FWIW, in controlled light, the DLP easily walks over all the rest in PQ!

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post #26 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 05:46 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cavu View Post

I'm new to that particular "LCD vs plasma" conclusion - sources please!

OTOH, I have DLP FP, Plasma, LCD and LED in my home at the moment.

IMHO, of the direct view displays, the Sammy plasma does best in "bright" conditions.

FWIW, in controlled light, the DLP easily walks over all the rest in PQ!

I cited a source before, I'm not going to do it now as it might not be well received.

Well your expirence goes against 99%.1 of what most people expirence with the various display technologies.
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post #27 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 06:24 PM
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I cited a source before, I'm not going to do it now as it might not be well received.


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post #28 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 10:34 PM
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If someone wants to have full daytime ambient lighting in their room, an LCD will work better than a plasma.

yep, and I have just never found that appealing to watch TV in that kind of environment. Even with my 2 LCD panels the rooms are usually controlled so that it's not flooded by bright sunlight. A poll was run in the forum asking about viewing habits and the good majority of the replies were that they viewed TV in the evening which makes bright sun lit rooms a minor issue for many.
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post #29 of 52 Old 09-25-2011, 11:07 PM
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Originally Posted by HogPilot View Post


Auditor55 has beaten this drum in hundreds of posts over several years trying without success to defend his decision to buy an LCD screen.

Search his old posts for yourself. Almost amusing if not so sad.

"The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance  it is the illusion of knowledge." - Daniel Boorstin
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post #30 of 52 Old 09-26-2011, 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

I cited a source before, I'm not going to do it now as it might not be well received.

Well your expirence goes against 99%.1 of what most people expirence with the various display technologies.

I have BOTH techs. Paid much more for the lcds over the pdps. Bought lcds to put in my bright family room. Family of 5. ALL mentioned that they liked the pdp better in the family room after I moved the lcd in to takes its place and moved the pdp down to the basement pool room. I said it cant be so I set them up side by side in family room. Result ALL 5 felt pdp was better to watch & game on in that room. Not saying the OP will have same experience but that's why they should try a set and if not happy try another!

And where is this study that shows 99.1%? Or has that been "cited" before and sealed?
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