2015: Plasma's final year? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 166 Old 10-10-2012, 06:12 PM - Thread Starter
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There is this displaysearch grafic which predicts that 2015 is Plasma's final year - orange PDP is no longer present in 2016 eek.gif

Seems that displaysearch believes that OLEd takes Plasma's place in 2016. I am having a hard time believing that because in 2016 OLEd will still be very expensive and because of that not fit for the massmarket (yet). OLEd is moving very slooow, a very expensive 65'' OLEd will be for sale in..wink.gif 2015. Plasma will not die a sudden death in 2016, it will take some time and it will be slooow. Displaysearch predictions after 2014 are not realistic afaik.


At the start of 2011 Samsung predicted Plasma will be around till 2020.
AVS discussion.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1387744/samsung-predicts-plasma-around-until-2020


So, when is the end of Plasma?


http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/columns/2012/07/hdtv-expert-tv-shipments-to-fall-14-in-2012-by-ken-werner.php

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post #2 of 166 Old 10-16-2012, 08:22 AM
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CRT continues to rule on poorer countries in the world. Majority of TV shows in Asia are still in SD in 4:3 aspect ratio. These contents look ugly on standard LCD tv.
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post #3 of 166 Old 10-16-2012, 10:19 AM
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OLED is a long way off from displacing plasma. Are there any OLED sets for sale right now?
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post #4 of 166 Old 10-16-2012, 11:33 AM
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I'm positive I addressed this graph in another thread.

That said, there's another Panasonic rumor floating about today about them exiting the TV business. If true, well....

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #5 of 166 Old 10-16-2012, 12:06 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

I'm positive I addressed this graph in another thread.
That said, there's another Panasonic rumor floating about today about them exiting the TV business. If true, well....

Panasonic to exit TV market, hopes to build LCD panels for Apple's iPad

http://appleinsider.com/articles/12/10/16/panasonic-to-exit-tv-market-hopes-to-build-lcd-panels-for-apples-ipad---report


Panasonic chairman plans company shift away from TVs – and consumer electronics. But is it too little too late?

http://www.whathifi.com/blog/panasonic-chairman-plans-company-shift-away-from-tvs-%E2%80%93-and-consumer-electronics-but-is-it-too-l
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post #6 of 166 Old 10-16-2012, 04:03 PM
 
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So, no 2013 models by the looks of it. Panasonic fail (but not entirely their fault), without ever having delivered the coveted "Kuro killer" coupled with little signs of OLED life.

Another dark day in display land.
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post #7 of 166 Old 10-16-2012, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

So, no 2013 models by the looks of it. Panasonic fail (but not entirely their fault), without ever having delivered the coveted "Kuro killer" coupled with little signs of OLED life. Another dark day in display land.

On HDJ AVJ said they are designing several 2013 Plasma models so i wouldn't think they'd just suddenly pull the plug like that.

Also there's this: (Reuters) - Japan's Panasonic Corp will cut production of LCD and plasma panels for televisions in 2013 as sales continue to remain below expectations,

http://www.reuters.com/assets/print?aid=USBRE89F1BQ20121016

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post #8 of 166 Old 10-16-2012, 11:57 PM
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Cut != eliminate for those that are confused.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #9 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 06:00 AM
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"Panasonic to cut LCD TV panel output on weak demand"

"Cut Output" = "Make Less"

For those that can't read entire sentences and have problems understanding them.

buytme
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post #10 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 10:49 AM
 
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Lots of confusion abounds. smile.gif My understanding of the semantics is they will begin winding it down as opposed to exiting altogether in 2013 (or they will cease production by the end of the calendar year?). I hope the 2013 models surface.
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post #11 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 11:02 AM
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It just seems like to me and probably others that the "Kuro killer" is not going to be coming out for some reason , they just sit on the technology. Oh well. About plasma dying, it's very possible. how much longer can they milk the currently technology. Bring the Kuro tech once and for all, what the f.....is wrong with you.
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post #12 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hungro View Post

It just seems like to me and probably others that the "Kuro killer" is not going to be coming out for some reason , they just sit on the technology. Oh well. About plasma dying, it's very possible. how much longer can they milk the currently technology. Bring the Kuro tech once and for all, what the f.....is wrong with you.


moan and whine all you want, it seems pretty clear they won't be making any investments not already expended on plasma tech as they wind down out of television production.

anyone know where panny gets their panels from?

neflixis our nemesis
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post #13 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 04:03 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mr. wally View Post

moan and whine all you want, it seems pretty clear they won't be making any investments not already expended on plasma tech as they wind down out of television production.
anyone know where panny gets their panels from?

I believe (???) they manufacturer their own PDP panels
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post #14 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 04:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

I believe (???) they manufacturer their own PDP panels

do they make their own lcd panels or buy them like sony does?

neflixis our nemesis
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post #15 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 04:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mr. wally View Post

do they make their own lcd panels or buy them like sony does?

They make their own:

http://www.whathifi.com/news/japan-panasonic-to-concentrate-on-50in-lcd-tv-displays-and-panels-for-smartphones-tablets
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post #16 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 04:50 PM
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"With the news that plants are set to close, consolidate or be sold, that concept of class-leading products in terms of technology, rather than sheer sales numbers, appears to be coming to fruition."

So it sounds like they want to become Pioneer?

How does that make any sense at all?

buytme
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post #17 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 05:16 PM
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I very much doubt that Sony, Sharp or Panasonic will be a meaningful player in TV by decade's end. Each is falling apart for some similar and some different reasons. The global economy is going to suck for the next several years. And, to make matters worse, by 2017-18, the Koreans will have been able to ramp up OLED and convince the world that it's the only technology worthy of your TV dollars at the high end. With cheap Taiwanese -- and mainland Chinese -- LCDs as alternatives, where does that leave Japan? Hint: Not as important people in the TV business.

If they read and understood "The Innovator's Dilemma", they'd just get out now and cut their losses. (Note: This isn't an option for Sharp, but it most certainly is for Panasonic and Sony.)

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #18 of 166 Old 10-17-2012, 06:38 PM
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I hope we get some 2013 plasma models from panasonic
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post #19 of 166 Old 10-18-2012, 05:49 AM - Thread Starter
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US executives at Panasonic here denied reports stemming from a news report in Japan that the company was planning to exit the TV business.

recent media reports appearing on sites including Apple Insider and Japanese Business news service Diamond Online ''are basically speculative in nature and contain a number of errors of fact or misinterpretation''.
http://www.twice.com/articletype/news/panasonic-dismisses-tv-exit-reports/103643
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post #20 of 166 Old 10-18-2012, 11:50 AM
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I hope they stay afloat.
My Samsung LCD just crapped out, so researching currently for a replacement, which of course would be a plasma (main HT display).
I'll probably hold out until the holiday to figure out what set to purchase.
Panasonic was going to be my choice, so what do you all think?
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post #21 of 166 Old 10-18-2012, 12:59 PM
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@8mile, shocking those "high end news sites" would get it so wrong! wink.gif

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #22 of 166 Old 10-18-2012, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by binici View Post

I hope they stay afloat.
My Samsung LCD just crapped out, so researching currently for a replacement, which of course would be a plasma (main HT display).
I'll probably hold out until the holiday to figure out what set to purchase.
Panasonic was going to be my choice, so what do you all think?

Haven't read anything that would alter personal purchase intent for this year: seems like all the top plasma sets from Panasonic (and Samsung, for that matter) have received excellent reviews....
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post #23 of 166 Old 10-18-2012, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted by rogo View Post

@8mile, shocking those "high end news sites" would get it so wrong! wink.gif

Not all did and Lee Stewart linked above to whathifi which I normally do not look at much as their reviews are very cursory at best. I then decided to see what updates whathifi had made on this issue and
this link came up which I posted a day or so ago somewhere on avsforum (initially posted on their site 2 days ago) and which appears to be a reasonably accurate summation of the situation and which coincides quite a lot with what the HDJ Panasonic Insider posted:

http://www.whathifi.com/news/japan-panasonics-loss-making-tv-division-to-cut-production-of-lcd-and-plasma-panels

To quote a few bits:

Panasonic has announced a shake-up of its TV panel manufacturing, which will see reductions of both LCD and plasma production capacity, and more LCD panels being bought in from external suppliers.


It will buy in more LCD TV panels from outside sources such as LG Display, which it already uses, increasing the amount of panels it buys in to at least 70% of its requirement this financial year, and more in 2013-14.

Panasonic's Himeji plant (above), which is already split between TV and smaller panels, will boost the proportion of its capacity used for smaller displays to more than 50%, but will still make LCD TV panels for those manufacturers it supplies.

Its Amagasaki plasma panel plant (above) will also reduce production of TV displays this year, while boosting output of panels used for electronic signs.

But Panasonic isn't getting out of the TV business: it's expected that its LCD TV sales with move up a little year on year to around 13m sets, although plasma sales will fall by half to around 2.5m.
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post #24 of 166 Old 10-19-2012, 11:19 AM
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That plasma number is terrifyingly low. That's barely north of 1% of the TV market. Add in another 1-2% for Samsung and you are talking maybe 3% of the global TV market.

2015 sounds like the latest possible final year at this point. Samsung's 2011 prediction is definitely out of date.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #25 of 166 Old 10-19-2012, 12:02 PM
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We should also consider thata 4K plasma will probably never happen since the factory yield of plasma displays decreases with increassed with increased pixls per density (pixels per square inch).
Also it is possible that the price of 4K LCD passive 3D models will be close to the price of plasmas by 2015.
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post #26 of 166 Old 10-19-2012, 01:03 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

We should also consider thata 4K plasma will probably never happen since the factory yield of plasma displays decreases with increassed with increased pixls per density (pixels per square inch).
Also it is possible that the price of 4K LCD passive 3D models will be close to the price of plasmas by 2015.

Back in October 2008, Samsung did show an Ultra HD Plasma Display:

Samsung 63" ultraHD plasma

http://www.electronista.com/articles/08/10/30/samsung.63.ultrahd.plasma/
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post #27 of 166 Old 10-19-2012, 04:06 PM
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Lee,
Thank for the link I had not read it before. Hopefully the manufacturing yield of the smaller pixel technique are lower enough to compete against the same size LCD models.
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post #28 of 166 Old 10-19-2012, 04:22 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

Lee,
Thank for the link I had not read it before. Hopefully the manufacturing yield of the smaller pixel technique are lower enough to compete against the same size LCD models.

What's the largest PDP - 65"? They now make LCDs at 70, 84 and 90 inches. I don't have too much hope for UHD PDP.
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post #29 of 166 Old 10-20-2012, 08:47 AM
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I think this is the 3rd or 4th time I've posted this link:
http://panasonic.net/prodisplays/products/152ux1/index.html

Nonetheless ever since they announced they will be closing their P5 plant last year, it is obvious that plasma is entering a slow decline. I don't even have to be smart to make that kind of mathematical certainty forecast back then. Not sure about 2015 as CRT are still being sold next year.

LG and Sammy are likely to stay in the plasma game longer than panny, though it is not their product of focus
http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/samsung-lead-panasonic-plasma-201204231782.htm
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post #30 of 166 Old 10-20-2012, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KidHorn View Post

OLED is a long way off from displacing plasma. Are there any OLED sets for sale right now?

Sony sold an 11" one a few years back.

LOL
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