What to buy for holidays ? - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 14 Old 10-29-2011, 05:59 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Alesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 120
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hello guys,

I know that there are a lot of threads talking about LED over LCD over Plasma in here but I was not able to find the information I am looking for at this present time or that dealth with what I am looking for...

I am not an expert in this (which I think that's why this forum is great to get some other opinions) but I know what I want in a display after doing all my home work...

So haven't found my "perfect" display yet, I was wondering what are the best display to buy at this moment of the year (Q4 2011) ?

Here is a brief histrory of what I did try at this moment. All of the non professional test I have done were to set the display in THX or cinema mode right out of the box and watch all type of content going from SD sattelite to 1080p24 bluray.



1st model, Panasonic TCP46G25.

I did like:

1) THX mode right out of the box was superb to me for watching movies. Skin tones and landscaping looked great and real.
2) Panel uniformity (this is really important to me), when it's black, it's black everywhere with no hotspots
3) Black levels (this is really important to me), were pretty close to be real dark black (really low grey/black tone)
4) VierraCast is nice but not a must
5) The best SD picutre I saw
6) Super fast display in any kind of action scenes
7) Pricing around 999CAD


I did not like

1) The power supply noise was horrible. That made me return this display.
2) The audio from the TV is horrible when listening from the TV
3) Danger of image retention
4) Power consumption



2nd model, Sharp Quattron LED LC46LE810UN

What I did find kind of nice:

1) Pricing around 1199CAD
2) Picture quality is not bad in full HD from a bluray
3) Power consuption
4) No image retention

I did not like:

1) Super reflective mirror like frame at the bottom of the TV
2) Horrible back ligthing with hotspots everywhere in the screen
3) Horrible black levels along with horrible back lighting hotspots
4) Horrible audio from the TV even with a supposed subwoofer in the back
5) Horrible SD picture quality from satellite receiver (perhaps due to the high performance of the screen ?), a lot of compression noise and blocks visible



3rd model, Panasonic TCL42D2

What I did like:

1) Pricing around 1199CAD
2) Better SD quality than the Sharp Quattron but not as close as the plasma
3) Good full hd picture quality
4) Power consumption
5) No image retention

What I did not like:

1) Horrible back lighting uniformity from an angle viewing
2) Horrible back ligthing with hotspots everywhere in the screen
3) Horrible black levels along with horrible back lighting hotspots
4) Horrible audio from the TV


So seeing I had no real luck in the 1199$ price range, I tried higher end model...


4th and last model tested, Samsung UN46D8000

What I did like about it:

1) Physically look real nice, thin and narrow border
2) Best audio quality coming out directly from the TV
3) Best SD picture quality I got from the LED product I've tested
4) Nice network features although not required for me
5) 3D
6) An adavence cinema mode that will turn off the back lighting on the bottom and top black bar when listening to 2:35.1 material resulting in real black bars (completely turned off) and was even darker than the plasma black bars.
7) No image retention


What I did not like

1) uh... the price... 2799CAD for a 46 inch !

2) I got really surprised at how bad the back lighting was even at that price level. It was better than the other LED products I have tried but still, for the price, I think it is not acceptable

3) The video processing make the image look not right... like everything seems to be plastified and smooth...

4) Motion of images are not that bad but I prefer the picture quality when all the processing is removed. The thing is that now, you can see the motion blurryness in fast action scene. When processing is on, it gives a non realistic feel to the picture.

5) Seems to be too good to be true image when wathcing some bluray movies... like it was capture with a consumer digital video camera... it gives a strange feel to the image... not having the texture of movie film...

6) Another strange mode do dim or turn off the back lighting when the picture is black but when it comes back on, it's kind of annoying.

It looks like when you get black image, the display seems to be completely turn off or unpluged from the wall (really black).

But as soon any bit of the image return, you get that backlight turn on again and now you see a big step from being completely off (really black like power off) to black (dark grey with bad back lighting)... good idea I think but not close to be perfect in my opinion... specially for 2799$...




So I know I like the plasma "feel" where you have fast response, excellent uniformity across the screen and no hot spot. So I tend to prefer plasma at this time. But do all plasma display buzz like that G25 ? Even the new VT30 set make a buzzing noise...

It seems even when you pay more than double the price of a plasma screen, I cannot get the picture quality and uniformity from a LED display.

So here is the question again... knowing what I did like and did not like (I did my home work I think), what would you suggest as of Q4 2011 for a display in the 42-46 inches range ?

Sorry for the long post but thanks for all your input !

Alesis
Alesis is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 14 Old 10-29-2011, 06:14 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Otto Pylot's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 7,280
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 150 Post(s)
Liked: 241
First of all, it looks like you've done your homework which is good. Second of all, it's your choice, not ours. So what looks best to you is best. Personally, I don't like plasmas at this point in time because it wouldn't work in our environment ( lots of light).
Otto Pylot is offline  
post #3 of 14 Old 10-29-2011, 06:18 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Alesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 120
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post

First of all, it looks like you've done your homework which is good. Second of all, it's your choice, not ours. So what looks best to you is best. Personally, I don't like plasmas at this point in time because it wouldn't work in our environment ( lots of light).

Thanks for your reply... I understand that this is my choice and taste... that is why I did describe all my dislikes and likes...

I am seeking suggestions from you guys that's it... I do not know what to look for as I did try 4 display.

Knowing you don't like plasma for your bright environment, what would you or have you pick instead ?

Alesis
Alesis is offline  
post #4 of 14 Old 10-29-2011, 09:29 PM
Member
 
sloppojoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 135
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Sony xbr929 for LCD, or Panasonic ST/GT30 (research price and features to see which you prefer) for plasma. I would choose the plasma myself, especially if you have a vested interest in 3d.
sloppojoe is offline  
post #5 of 14 Old 10-30-2011, 10:13 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Otto Pylot's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 7,280
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 150 Post(s)
Liked: 241
Sloppojoe has a point about plasma if 3D is what you want. I don't want 3D so it's never been a consideration. I clicked on the links above but they take me to either remotes, pc boards, or tv wall mounts so I couldn't really look at the models you listed. As far as the tv we purchased goes, we bought an LG LCD which looks really nice (it's calibrated) and views well in our room under all kinds of various lighting conditions. However, at night we do use a bias light which greatly improves the pq, and lighting, reflections, etc is a total non-issue.
Otto Pylot is offline  
post #6 of 14 Old 10-30-2011, 11:48 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Steve S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Fresno CA
Posts: 5,356
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alesis View Post

Hello guys,

I know that there are a lot of threads talking about LED over LCD over Plasma in here but I was not able to find the information I am looking for at this present time or that dealth with what I am looking for...

I am not an expert in this (which I think that's why this forum is great to get some other opinions) but I know what I want in a display after doing all my home work...

So haven't found my "perfect" display yet, I was wondering what are the best display to buy at this moment of the year (Q4 2011) ?

Here is a brief histrory of what I did try at this moment. All of the non professional test I have done were to set the display in THX or cinema mode right out of the box and watch all type of content going from SD sattelite to 1080p24 bluray.



1st model, Panasonic TCP46G25.

I did like:

1) THX mode right out of the box was superb to me for watching movies. Skin tones and landscaping looked great and real.
2) Panel uniformity (this is really important to me), when it's black, it's black everywhere with no hotspots
3) Black levels (this is really important to me), were pretty close to be real dark black (really low grey/black tone)
4) VierraCast is nice but not a must
5) The best SD picutre I saw
6) Super fast display in any kind of action scenes
7) Pricing around 999CAD


I did not like

1) The power supply noise was horrible. That made me return this display.
2) The audio from the TV is horrible when listening from the TV
3) Danger of image retention
4) Power consumption



2nd model, Sharp Quattron LED LC46LE810UN

What I did find kind of nice:

1) Pricing around 1199CAD
2) Picture quality is not bad in full HD from a bluray
3) Power consuption
4) No image retention

I did not like:

1) Super reflective mirror like frame at the bottom of the TV
2) Horrible back ligthing with hotspots everywhere in the screen
3) Horrible black levels along with horrible back lighting hotspots
4) Horrible audio from the TV even with a supposed subwoofer in the back
5) Horrible SD picture quality from satellite receiver (perhaps due to the high performance of the screen ?), a lot of compression noise and blocks visible



3rd model, Panasonic TCL42D2

What I did like:

1) Pricing around 1199CAD
2) Better SD quality than the Sharp Quattron but not as close as the plasma
3) Good full hd picture quality
4) Power consumption
5) No image retention

What I did not like:

1) Horrible back lighting uniformity from an angle viewing
2) Horrible back ligthing with hotspots everywhere in the screen
3) Horrible black levels along with horrible back lighting hotspots
4) Horrible audio from the TV


So seeing I had no real luck in the 1199$ price range, I tried higher end model...


4th and last model tested, Samsung UN46D8000

What I did like about it:

1) Physically look real nice, thin and narrow border
2) Best audio quality coming out directly from the TV
3) Best SD picture quality I got from the LED product I've tested
4) Nice network features although not required for me
5) 3D
6) An adavence cinema mode that will turn off the back lighting on the bottom and top black bar when listening to 2:35.1 material resulting in real black bars (completely turned off) and was even darker than the plasma black bars.
7) No image retention


What I did not like

1) uh... the price... 2799CAD for a 46 inch !

2) I got really surprised at how bad the back lighting was even at that price level. It was better than the other LED products I have tried but still, for the price, I think it is not acceptable

3) The video processing make the image look not right... like everything seems to be plastified and smooth...

4) Motion of images are not that bad but I prefer the picture quality when all the processing is removed. The thing is that now, you can see the motion blurryness in fast action scene. When processing is on, it gives a non realistic feel to the picture.

5) Seems to be too good to be true image when wathcing some bluray movies... like it was capture with a consumer digital video camera... it gives a strange feel to the image... not having the texture of movie film...

6) Another strange mode do dim or turn off the back lighting when the picture is black but when it comes back on, it's kind of annoying.

It looks like when you get black image, the display seems to be completely turn off or unpluged from the wall (really black).

But as soon any bit of the image return, you get that backlight turn on again and now you see a big step from being completely off (really black like power off) to black (dark grey with bad back lighting)... good idea I think but not close to be perfect in my opinion... specially for 2799$...




So I know I like the plasma "feel" where you have fast response, excellent uniformity across the screen and no hot spot. So I tend to prefer plasma at this time. But do all plasma display buzz like that G25 ? Even the new VT30 set make a buzzing noise...

It seems even when you pay more than double the price of a plasma screen, I cannot get the picture quality and uniformity from a LED display.

So here is the question again... knowing what I did like and did not like (I did my home work I think), what would you suggest as of Q4 2011 for a display in the 42-46 inches range ?

Sorry for the long post but thanks for all your input !

Given the number and variety of "deal breakers" you've listed there is nothing available that will satisfy your needs. You will have to decide for yourself which "problems" you can deal with and which you can't if you want to keep a set.

Steve S.
Steve S is offline  
post #7 of 14 Old 10-30-2011, 06:33 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Alesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 120
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by sloppojoe View Post

Sony xbr929 for LCD, or Panasonic ST/GT30 (research price and features to see which you prefer) for plasma. I would choose the plasma myself, especially if you have a vested interest in 3d.

Thanks for the sony suggestion... For that Panasonic, I would buy this in a heart beat if it wouldn't be for that horrible powersupply noise...

Alesis
Alesis is offline  
post #8 of 14 Old 10-30-2011, 06:34 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Alesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 120
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post

Sloppojoe has a point about plasma if 3D is what you want. I don't want 3D so it's never been a consideration. I clicked on the links above but they take me to either remotes, pc boards, or tv wall mounts so I couldn't really look at the models you listed. As far as the tv we purchased goes, we bought an LG LCD which looks really nice (it's calibrated) and views well in our room under all kinds of various lighting conditions. However, at night we do use a bias light which greatly improves the pq, and lighting, reflections, etc is a total non-issue.

Any LG model in particular ?

Alesis
Alesis is offline  
post #9 of 14 Old 10-30-2011, 06:40 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Alesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 120
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve S View Post

Given the number and variety of "deal breakers" you've listed there is nothing available that will satisfy your needs. You will have to decide for yourself which "problems" you can deal with and which you can't if you want to keep a set.

Uh... really ! I though there would have been other models in other brands that would not suffer from bad back lighting or powersupply noises...

I just find having to sound proof a tv set is ridiculous... I saw some people opening their panasonic display and insulate the interior...

So my question was for other brands than panasonic, samsung or sharp since there does not seem to be anything that will fit my need like you are saying...

I sincerly though that there could be LED models with excellent back lighting or excellent SILENT plasma set out there that I was not aware of but you guys knew about !

Thanks for your input...

Alesis
Alesis is offline  
post #10 of 14 Old 10-30-2011, 07:49 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Otto Pylot's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 7,280
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 150 Post(s)
Liked: 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alesis View Post

Any LG model in particular ?

I have the 47LD520 (last year's model) and have been very happy with it.
Otto Pylot is offline  
post #11 of 14 Old 10-30-2011, 10:49 PM
Member
 
sloppojoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 135
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alesis View Post


Uh... really ! I though there would have been other models in other brands that would not suffer from bad back lighting or powersupply noises...

I just find having to sound proof a tv set is ridiculous... I saw some people opening their panasonic display and insulate the interior...

So my question was for other brands than panasonic, samsung or sharp since there does not seem to be anything that will fit my need like you are saying...

I sincerly though that there could be LED models with excellent back lighting or excellent SILENT plasma set out there that I was not aware of but you guys knew about !

Thanks for your input...

Have you viewed/ listened for the buzzing on the newer Panasonic? I hear nothing, even when a few feet from the set. I also hear (no pun intended) that the buzzing can vary from set to set. That being said, maybe you had one of the louder buzzers.
sloppojoe is offline  
post #12 of 14 Old 10-31-2011, 12:35 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Steve S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Fresno CA
Posts: 5,356
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alesis View Post

Uh... really ! I though there would have been other models in other brands that would not suffer from bad back lighting or powersupply noises...

I just find having to sound proof a tv set is ridiculous... I saw some people opening their panasonic display and insulate the interior...

So my question was for other brands than panasonic, samsung or sharp since there does not seem to be anything that will fit my need like you are saying...

I sincerly though that there could be LED models with excellent back lighting or excellent SILENT plasma set out there that I was not aware of but you guys knew about !

Thanks for your input...

Sorry to have offended you.

The HX929 is silent, has very good local dimming, but will exhibit some slight "haloing" around bright images on dark backgrounds (i.e. white credits rolling on black background etc) which is more noticeable from off-angle seating positions--this may not meet your requirements for excellent black levels with no backlighting anomalies whatsoever. It's built-in speakers are also not likely to meet your requirements (but that's true of any flat panel tv).
It's also somewhat expensive--probably more than the Samsung D8000 you've rejected (don't blame you for that one)

The vast majority of Panasonic plasma owners either don't hear any power supply buzz or ignore what little they do hear. Since you are particularly sensitive to this (and there's nothing wrong with that) and have heard this to an objectionable level on two different sets I wouldn't recommend one of them either. Samsung plasmas are reputed to be worse than Pannys in this respect.

A couple of years ago you could have bought a high-end ccfl backlit lcd like a Samsung LN46B650, played with the settings a bit, and been pretty happy overall--maybe the set's audio would be a little lacking and it wouldn't be 3D but the pq would have been quite good, backlighting wouldn't suffer the flashlighting of an edge-lit led, and there would have been no power supply noise. The closest current model would be the LN46D630.

I wish you the best of luck in your search!

Steve S.
Steve S is offline  
post #13 of 14 Old 10-31-2011, 08:40 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Alesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 120
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by sloppojoe View Post

Have you viewed/ listened for the buzzing on the newer Panasonic? I hear nothing, even when a few feet from the set. I also hear (no pun intended) that the buzzing can vary from set to set. That being said, maybe you had one of the louder buzzers.

I've got the chance to install the new VT series and beleive me, they do buzz a lot...

I am in a small environement in my house. I sit at around 7' from the tv so that is why I did my "homework" with 42 or 46 inch tvs.

There is no doubt about it, the new VT series are incradible but man, I cannot understand how it is acceptable to pay that amount of money for a tv set and be annoy with a back ground noise of that magnitude.

I've seen the 60VT30 but they are installed at over 18 or 20' from the viewing area so of course it is less proheminent noise but still, I can hear it... so imagine sitting at 7' from a tv, it is really annoying...

One of my friend has a 50G10 and it is a lot less noise than the G25 I did try.

What model are you refering not to hear any noises ?

Alesis
Alesis is offline  
post #14 of 14 Old 10-31-2011, 08:47 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Alesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Qc, Canada
Posts: 120
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve S View Post

Sorry to have offended you.

The HX929 is silent, has very good local dimming, but will exhibit some slight "haloing" around bright images on dark backgrounds (i.e. white credits rolling on black background etc) which is more noticeable from off-angle seating positions--this may not meet your requirements for excellent black levels with no backlighting anomalies whatsoever. It's built-in speakers are also not likely to meet your requirements (but that's true of any flat panel tv).
It's also somewhat expensive--probably more than the Samsung D8000 you've rejected (don't blame you for that one)

The vast majority of Panasonic plasma owners either don't hear any power supply buzz or ignore what little they do hear. Since you are particularly sensitive to this (and there's nothing wrong with that) and have heard this to an objectionable level on two different sets I wouldn't recommend one of them either. Samsung plasmas are reputed to be worse than Pannys in this respect.

A couple of years ago you could have bought a high-end ccfl backlit lcd like a Samsung LN46B650, played with the settings a bit, and been pretty happy overall--maybe the set's audio would be a little lacking and it wouldn't be 3D but the pq would have been quite good, backlighting wouldn't suffer the flashlighting of an edge-lit led, and there would have been no power supply noise. The closest current model would be the LN46D630.

I wish you the best of luck in your search!

Not to worry, I feel offended... just a little surprise that there is no other solutions to what I am seeking for...

Like I already told, I am in a small environement sitting at around 7' from the tv. The G25 reflected the noise so badly on the wall directly to the listening area... I was pretty bad.

I did take attention to the sound of the tv because the majority of time specially at night, I do not turn on the receiver to listen to the tv. The best audio I got was from the samsung tv even though it was the slimmest tv, it had an excellent sound for me. So I am going to take a look at the 46D630 definively !

Thanks for your input and suggestions !

Alesis
Alesis is offline  
Reply OLED Technology and Flat Panels General

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off