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post #181 of 292 Old 09-12-2012, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Vic12345 View Post

Hi plazmapz80u I appreciate your posts but the motion blur on the samd630 I had looked lowsy when watching hockey even though it was a very good tv.and the hidef wasn't as good as lk520.
It comes down to which tv looks best with dark filmed movies or hockeyor baseball or basketball or talk shows or cartoons or moving/still screens or bright screens or hidef or standard def or grayscale ,eyestrain,uniformity etc etc etc.It takes a very good tester /reviewer to find the best allaround tv and it comes down to what you watch the most and what your willing to live with.Seems like every tv has its positive and negative.Be thankfull your not watching an old tube tv- when the dryer came on the whole screen shrunk and people looked like green aliens and people's heads were stretched like homer Simpson.

I'm curious did you try various AMP settings (including clear and off)? Did you have the issue with BDs too? And what specifically was bad with HD?

I find viewing movies in the dark to be far more satisfying than with significant ambient light but to do so requires solid blacks with accurate gamma near black. I do use a small, dim bias light sometimes but prefer no light in the room whatsoever if possible. I can do this with my 2008 Panasonic Plasma (and could with the LN32D550 back when I had it). For playing video games, I like some bias lighting to lessen eyestrain (as gaming is more fatiguing to the eyes and often brighter than most movies too).


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post #182 of 292 Old 09-12-2012, 07:09 PM
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What I think is confusing to most people (including myself) is that no matter what reviews or forums you read there seems to be NO consensus on the "best" TV. I do understand that the type of content you like to watch may have some bearing on the top choice but at the end of the day I just want to buy a 50 inch TV and watch the following

1. Movies, mostly from DVD (Blu-Ray) but also from streaming sources
2. Broadcast and Cable TV including on-demand movies and TV shows
3. Sports, mostly baseball and football


I don't care if it's plasma, LED or a dodo bird chiseling out 60 fps on a stone tablet as long as the picture is decent.

Is the average user really going to notice "blooming" or "flash-lighting"? I always hear about "the blackest blacks" on plasmas but what about the whitest whites or the redest reds? And with respect to "break in" on plasmas, I have to say that the thought of having to do that is not very attractive to me. Why can't I just open the box, plug it in and watch stuff? I do get the whole calilbration requirement and am ok with that but having to do much beyond that feels like work to me. I thought watching TV was supposed to be recreational and relaxing but frankly this all sounds very laborious.

I would like to see a good chart breaking down the options like this

Best TV under $1000
Best TV under $1500
Best TV under $2000
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post #183 of 292 Old 09-12-2012, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by waclark View Post

What I think is confusing to most people (including myself) is that no matter what reviews or forums you read there seems to be NO consensus on the "best" TV. I do understand that the type of content you like to watch may have some bearing on the top choice but at the end of the day I just want to buy a 50 inch TV and watch the following
1. Movies, mostly from DVD (Blu-Ray) but also from streaming sources
2. Broadcast and Cable TV including on-demand movies and TV shows
3. Sports, mostly baseball and football
I don't care if it's plasma, LED or a dodo bird chiseling out 60 fps on a stone tablet as long as the picture is decent.
Is the average user really going to notice "blooming" or "flash-lighting"? I always hear about "the blackest blacks" on plasmas but what about the whitest whites or the redest reds? And with respect to "break in" on plasmas, I have to say that the thought of having to do that is not very attractive to me. Why can't I just open the box, plug it in and watch stuff? I do get the whole calilbration requirement and am ok with that but having to do much beyond that feels like work to me. I thought watching TV was supposed to be recreational and relaxing but frankly this all sounds very laborious.
I would like to see a good chart breaking down the options like this
Best TV under $1000
Best TV under $1500
Best TV under $2000

Amen.

I am going a bit insane trying to find something. Just looking for 60-70" that general HD tv viewing, sports and movies look good on. That's all. Want something with decent viewing angles, nothing crazy.
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post #184 of 292 Old 09-12-2012, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by waclark View Post

What I think is confusing to most people (including myself) is that no matter what reviews or forums you read there seems to be NO consensus on the "best" TV. I do understand that the type of content you like to watch may have some bearing on the top choice but at the end of the day I just want to buy a 50 inch TV and watch the following
1. Movies, mostly from DVD (Blu-Ray) but also from streaming sources
2. Broadcast and Cable TV including on-demand movies and TV shows
3. Sports, mostly baseball and football
I don't care if it's plasma, LED or a dodo bird chiseling out 60 fps on a stone tablet as long as the picture is decent.
Is the average user really going to notice "blooming" or "flash-lighting"? I always hear about "the blackest blacks" on plasmas but what about the whitest whites or the redest reds? And with respect to "break in" on plasmas, I have to say that the thought of having to do that is not very attractive to me. Why can't I just open the box, plug it in and watch stuff? I do get the whole calilbration requirement and am ok with that but having to do much beyond that feels like work to me. I thought watching TV was supposed to be recreational and relaxing but frankly this all sounds very laborious.
I would like to see a good chart breaking down the options like this
Best TV under $1000
Best TV under $1500
Best TV under $2000

Nice Flinstones reference. I wonder how many people besides me understood the dodo bird reference? I never heard Fred or Barney complain about their sets not being calibrated
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post #185 of 292 Old 09-12-2012, 11:36 PM
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Plazmapz80 I ran the Sammy with clear setting as it suppose to reduce some stuttering.I tried the different settings but nothing took the blur away on fast moving hockey players.I'm noticing blur on plasma too but not quite as noticeable with moving players from the few games I've looked at.

Sorry I don't know what BD is.

There was nothing wrong with the hidef.It just did not look as good as the lg.the Sammy seemed darker and did not have the clarity/detail (like when they show the crowd you can see people really clear on lg)and Rich color that the lg had.

I slightly prefer plasma of the 3tvs I've had (mostly because the good off angle viewing)but hockey doesn't seem to look as good On it as the lcds.
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post #186 of 292 Old 09-12-2012, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by waclark View Post

What I think is confusing to most people (including myself) is that no matter what reviews or forums you read there seems to be NO consensus on the "best" TV. I do understand that the type of content you like to watch may have some bearing on the top choice but at the end of the day I just want to buy a 50 inch TV and watch the following
1. Movies, mostly from DVD (Blu-Ray) but also from streaming sources
2. Broadcast and Cable TV including on-demand movies and TV shows
3. Sports, mostly baseball and football
I don't care if it's plasma, LED or a dodo bird chiseling out 60 fps on a stone tablet as long as the picture is decent.
Is the average user really going to notice "blooming" or "flash-lighting"? I always hear about "the blackest blacks" on plasmas but what about the whitest whites or the redest reds? And with respect to "break in" on plasmas, I have to say that the thought of having to do that is not very attractive to me. Why can't I just open the box, plug it in and watch stuff? I do get the whole calilbration requirement and am ok with that but having to do much beyond that feels like work to me. I thought watching TV was supposed to be recreational and relaxing but frankly this all sounds very laborious.
I would like to see a good chart breaking down the options like this
Best TV under $1000
Best TV under $1500
Best TV under $2000

Until you do a demo of the "blooming" you will probly never see it because you are so used to seeing it in whatever you are viewing. But once you see it, you can not unsee it. Try going around to whereve you shop (Best Buy, fry's, whatever) and see if they have a copy of the Panasonic demo of the "Fireworks". It's an astounding demo of fireworks set to an infinate black background and play it on a plasma and an equivalent lcd/led and it is all over the place. smile.gif not trying to be conceited when I say that, but like I said... once you see it you can not unsee it.

The blackest blacks makes a difference in the "real" of an image. If you are having washed out blacks it will not be as immersive of an image. When you have a great black response, (on a broad area) most of the accuracy of your other colors will fall into place because you are not having light (white) making your colors lighter. The analogy I make where I work is if you watch football, do you want to see Texans Red or Texans Pink. Not, and I repeat, NOT showing any sort of team allegiance here, I just live in Houston and it's the easiest way to make people understand what I am talking about.
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post #187 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 01:56 AM
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I always hear about "the blackest blacks" on plasmas but what about the whitest whites or the redest reds?
They're good. Reds & whites are good. It's absolute blacks (among mixed content i.e. local backlight zone: on) that's still a problem for any technology, is why black is kind of a big deal. Who can get the closest is least limited in that measure. But red & whites are doable!


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One thing I've noticed here is there seems to be several cliques... how precious.
Well drop the attitude & you might get an invite from the AVS Plasma Kings.


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Originally Posted by waclark View Post

What I think is confusing to most people (including myself) is that no matter what reviews or forums you read there seems to be NO consensus on the "best" TV. I do understand that the type of content you like to watch may have some bearing on the top choice but at the end of the day I just want to buy a 50 inch TV and watch the following
1. Movies, mostly from DVD (Blu-Ray) but also from streaming sources
2. Broadcast and Cable TV including on-demand movies and TV shows
3. Sports, mostly baseball and football
I don't care if it's plasma, LED or a dodo bird chiseling out 60 fps on a stone tablet as long as the picture is decent.

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Originally Posted by JBartoletti View Post

Amen.
I am going a bit insane trying to find something. Just looking for 60-70" that general HD tv viewing, sports and movies look good on. That's all. Want something with decent viewing angles, nothing crazy.

You just have to pick a side & dig in boys. No free rides!
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post #188 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 05:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Vic12345 View Post

Plazmapz80 I ran the Sammy with clear setting as it suppose to reduce some stuttering.I tried the different settings but nothing took the blur away on fast moving hockey players.I'm noticing blur on plasma too but not quite as noticeable with moving players from the few games I've looked at.
Sorry I don't know what BD is.
There was nothing wrong with the hidef.It just did not look as good as the lg.the Sammy seemed darker and did not have the clarity/detail (like when they show the crowd you can see people really clear on lg)and Rich color that the lg had.
I slightly prefer plasma of the 3tvs I've had (mostly because the good off angle viewing)but hockey doesn't seem to look as good On it as the lcds.

BD is short for Blu-ray Disc, I was asking if the motion blur and overall picture was better with a Blu-ray Movie or TV show or other program on a Blu-ray


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post #189 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 05:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Djyinn View Post


The blackest blacks makes a difference in the "real" of an image. If you are having washed out blacks it will not be as immersive of an image. When you have a great black response, (on a broad area) most of the accuracy of your other colors will fall into place because you are not having light (white) making your colors lighter. The analogy I make where I work is if you watch football, do you want to see Texans Red or Texans Pink. Not, and I repeat, NOT showing any sort of team allegiance here, I just live in Houston and it's the easiest way to make people understand what I am talking about.

This is exactly what I discovered by comparing my LG IPS panel LCD against my old Panasonic Plasma (which is just a entry level 1080p plasma from 2008, nothing special). Back when I had the Samsung D550 LCD, I noticed the same thing between it and the plasma (it had blacks that bested the plasma by quite a bit, around 0.005 fL).


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post #190 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 06:43 AM
 
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The blackest blacks makes a difference in the "real" of an image. If you are having washed out blacks it will not be as immersive of an image. When you have a great black response, (on a broad area) most of the accuracy of your other colors will fall into place because you are not having light (white) making your colors lighter. The analogy I make where I work is if you watch football, do you want to see Texans Red or Texans Pink. Not, and I repeat, NOT showing any sort of team allegiance here, I just live in Houston and it's the easiest way to make people understand what I am talking about.

I have to disagree with the highlighted statement. I have an LG 42LD550 with S-IPS panel which has great color accuracy, saturation, and picture "depth". It shows very fine detail in shadow areas as well. But it does not have the best blacks as compared to my Mitsubishi LT-46231 with the S-PVA LCD panel. The Mitsubishi has much better blacks and off angle viewing, but has somewhat compromised color accuracy and also unbalanced color saturation. I've noticed this to some degree with any TV that has the S-PVA panel. Many colors on the S-PVA panel can be lighter or darker than what they should be. Some of that may have to do with having more limited picture controls in it's menu compared to the LG. But over all, while I think having better black level generally translates to some other better picture qualities, it does not always mean colors will also be better. As always given the many TV brands, your mileage may vary applies in how it behaves.

Now when comparing it to a plasma (apples & oranges), the differing technology inherent in the plasma panel seems to be responsible for the improved color and blacks. While these characteristics often provide the "best bang for the $" and overall picture quality, there still are trade offs as there also are with LED/LCD.
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post #191 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 08:21 AM
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FWIW, my 2010 LG has been stellar since purchased. I agree in principle with waclark's statement. This is, after all, just television, and I think a lot of us get too wrapped up in it and need to step back a bit. I know I do. I think there are tv's within every model line that just perform better than others, even within that same model line. And those of us who happen to be lucky enough to get that one set, just don't see some of the issues. Djyinn's point about red jerseys is a good analogy. On my LG, red jersey's, on any team, are just that, red. Not pink, red. The zebras are black and white, not gray and white (even though I really hope they replace them with ones who understand the rules of the game!). When it comes time to buy a new tv in a few years, I'll probably look at plasma's (OLED?) first because that's where the newest improvements will more than likely be and LCD/LED will be a passing technology. But until then I'll just enjoy by LG LCD.
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post #192 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 10:11 AM
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I was watching avatar in 3D blue ray on my LG LV9500 nano led local dimming and the screen went black on the bluray and I could not see the TV. Try that with a plasma.
You may be right,maybe be nano led is the limit of lcd led! No their is still a ways to go!
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post #193 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 10:27 AM
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Off angle viewing IS a big deal... for some people, including me. A couple months ago I bought a 24 in SAMSUNG LED monitor that doubles as a tv in a bedroom since it has a build-in tuner and I hook up WiFi. This particular model now discontinued has some feature that allowed you to shift the pixel angle through some hardware feature plus it tilts but doesn swivel. Here's the deal. That unit without doing this had horrible off angle viewing and I didn't just eye ball it, I used a protractor and actually precisely measured the angle in degrees where the picture became badly distorted.

I was quite shocked it was just over TEN DEGREES which really isn't much. Buyers beware.... most LED makers brag their sets can be viewed at a wide angle typicall 160 degrees or so. That's marketing hype. What they mean by view is yeah, still see the picture, but not a picture quality anyone would accept.

That's when I started including both squating and actually lying on the floor in my in store testing. Some of the so-called better and more expensive LED's flunked the off angle test... badly. So be aware unless you always view your LED square on within 10 degrees or so from straight on and also at eye level with the center of the screen. If you don't you might really be disappointed once you get your new LED home. Check them out as I did. I rather feel silly in the store for 30 seconds than having buyer's remorse for years.
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Originally Posted by BillyBoyBlue View Post

A couple months ago I bought a 24 in SAMSUNG LED monitor that doubles as a tv in a bedroom since it has a build-in tuner and I hook up WiFi. This particular model now discontinued has some feature that allowed you to shift the pixel angle through some hardware feature plus it tilts but doesn swivel.

So be aware unless you always view your LED square on within 10 degrees or so from straight on and also at eye level with the center of the screen. If you don't you might really be disappointed once you get your new LED home. Check them out as I did. I rather feel silly in the store for 30 seconds than having buyer's remorse for years.


First, your example of a computer monitor/TV is flawed. Everyone knows LCD panels used for computer monitors have different characteristics than ones used for consumer TV use. Computer monitors, by design, have a more focused center viewing angle standard since that is their purpose. (Offers privacy from those nearby, a brighter, sharper centered image)

I can understand that you need/want a TV with good off angle viewing. I don't agree you have to buy a plasma TV to get that. If you research some TV brands/models and find out which one use a high quality S-PVA panel they will provide very good off angle viewing.


Using your own method I just grabbed my tripod and a large framing square, which is a protractor. I centered the protractor and find that I can view my TV with S-PVA panel up to 52 degrees off center left or right with NO perceptible change in color, brightness or contrast. As I continues to move off center, the picture still does not "washout" and still very watchable till about 70 degrees off center. In the vertical plane, I can lay on the floor and see no fading or washout and standing on a chair shows no fading or washout. Is it as good as a plasma? I can't say since I don;t have one handy.
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post #195 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 11:30 AM
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I was watching avatar in 3D blue ray on my LG LV9500 nano led local dimming and the screen went black on the bluray and I could not see the TV. Try that with a plasma.
You may be right,maybe be nano led is the limit of lcd led! No their is still a ways to go!

You do realize that this comment is almost laughable if you understood how light/panels work. You do realize that even if you are on a completely black screen that your back/rim/fullarray, whatever it may be, your lighting source illuminating the LCD's is still lit, correct? So, fundamentally, because there is no panel lighting on a plasma that it will ALWAYS beat an LCD, right? I'm just making sure. Try your "demo" with a GT, ST, or VT series Panasonic, even the 8000 series sammy plasmas... a Plasma will always win in a black contest because when it is black, it essentially is off. Now, what you may be seeing from the plasma is a reflection on the glass. This is the panel.

Also, being really in love with your set is something else too. If it amazed you, then awesome! keep having a great time with your panel and enjoying great pictures, but be careful when you make statements like "try that with a plasma", specially when it comes to black levels. I will take that "bet" all day, any day. smile.gif
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post #196 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 11:39 AM
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I have to disagree with the highlighted statement. I have an LG 42LD550 with S-IPS panel which has great color accuracy, saturation, and picture "depth". It shows very fine detail in shadow areas as well. But it does not have the best blacks as compared to my Mitsubishi LT-46231 with the S-PVA LCD panel. The Mitsubishi has much better blacks and off angle viewing, but has somewhat compromised color accuracy and also unbalanced color saturation. I've noticed this to some degree with any TV that has the S-PVA panel. Many colors on the S-PVA panel can be lighter or darker than what they should be. Some of that may have to do with having more limited picture controls in it's menu compared to the LG. But over all, while I think having better black level generally translates to some other better picture qualities, it does not always mean colors will also be better. As always given the many TV brands, your mileage may vary applies in how it behaves.
Now when comparing it to a plasma (apples & oranges), the differing technology inherent in the plasma panel seems to be responsible for the improved color and blacks. While these characteristics often provide the "best bang for the $" and overall picture quality, there still are trade offs as there also are with LED/LCD.

I should have stated *depending on make, model* ... continuing that quote contains the phrase "because you are not having light (white) making your colors lighter". When you light a color from the rear, you are changing the hue of the tone you are trying to reproduce. Backlighting color palettes of any nature is fundamentally flawed, but, up until recently it was the only technology utilized for television production. I think we will see some amazing things with the onset of OLED and, if it ever happens, an AMOLED panel.
Generally, the better black levels you have on a tv the better the color palette, but ANY tv now a days, be it LED, LCD, PLASMA, OLED... all can be calibrated to within degrees of each other for that "perfect picture", which in and of itself is almost subjective.
We can read what the software and the laptops put out all day long on curves and this that and the other on calibration settings, but it still has to look good to the audience. wink.gif
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post #197 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

BD is short for Blu-ray Disc, I was asking if the motion blur and overall picture was better with a Blu-ray Movie or TV show or other program on a Blu-ray
I never tried blue ray on it.

.I've only got a cheap plasma and satisfied mostly,but I wonder what a more expensive one would look like.I thought watching plasma with lights on would be a problem but our lights aren't too bright and have shades so it's noT overly distracting,although it's only 42inch.If offangle viewing is an issue then plasma is mostly better.
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post #198 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by BillyBoyBlue View Post

Off angle viewing IS a big deal... for some people, including me. A couple months ago I bought a 24 in SAMSUNG LED monitor that doubles as a tv in a bedroom since it has a build-in tuner and I hook up WiFi. This particular model now discontinued has some feature that allowed you to shift the pixel angle through some hardware feature plus it tilts but doesn swivel. Here's the deal. That unit without doing this had horrible off angle viewing and I didn't just eye ball it, I used a protractor and actually precisely measured the angle in degrees where the picture became badly distorted.
I was quite shocked it was just over TEN DEGREES which really isn't much. Buyers beware.... most LED makers brag their sets can be viewed at a wide angle typicall 160 degrees or so. That's marketing hype. What they mean by view is yeah, still see the picture, but not a picture quality anyone would accept.
That's when I started including both squating and actually lying on the floor in my in store testing. Some of the so-called better and more expensive LED's flunked the off angle test... badly. So be aware unless you always view your LED square on within 10 degrees or so from straight on and also at eye level with the center of the screen. If you don't you might really be disappointed once you get your new LED home. Check them out as I did. I rather feel silly in the store for 30 seconds than having buyer's remorse for years.

likely not a Samsung S-PVA panel... could be CMI S-MVA, which have really narrow viewing angles but great PQ dead center


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post #199 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 12:55 PM
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likely not a Samsung S-PVA panel... could be CMI S-MVA, which have really narrow viewing angles but great PQ dead center

Or maybe an e-IPS panel which was targeted for midrange monitor use?
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post #200 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 01:07 PM
 
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Purely speculation and guessing what kind of LCD screen his monitor has. Unless someone wants to find out the model number and go searching. But then, who cares? Just more thread clutter. rolleyes.gif
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post #201 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post

Or maybe an e-IPS panel which was targeted for midrange monitor use?

really, Samsung puts IPS panels in their displays?

maybe Super PLS (Plane to Line Switching) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPS_panel)... but not likely given the narrow viewing angles


and to be totally honest, I don't think discussing LCD panel tech is off-topic in a LCD vs. Plasma thread since the type of panel you get makes a real difference PQ wise and display property-wise, just like the difference between LCD and Plasma


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post #202 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 01:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by 6athome View Post

I was watching avatar in 3D blue ray on my LG LV9500 nano led local dimming and the screen went black on the bluray and I could not see the TV. Try that with a plasma.
You may be right,maybe be nano led is the limit of lcd led! No their is still a ways to go!

I would agree that an LED/LCD with nano LED technology is probably one good way to improve black level and close the gap in regard to that particular plasma feature. If some TV maker utilized this technique in a more refined manner, increased the density of the nano leds, and maybe used an S-PVA panel, it might prove to be a winner in picture improvement. As long as there were no other caveats/issues such as lack of micro dimming or CE control such as Samsung seems to currently have.
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post #203 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post

really, Samsung puts IPS panels in their displays?

That was a question, not a statement. Geez, my mistake.
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post #204 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post

That was a question, not a statement. Geez, my mistake.

sorry, wasn't trying to be rude... just saying it was likely a panel tech known for narrow viewing angles


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post #205 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by 6athome View Post

I have the LG LV9500, nano led, 2300 LED's and 280 dimming zones, let me say that I will match this TV with any plasma! When the room is dark and the screen goes total black you can not see this TV. I don't know of any plasma that can do that.
The LV9500 only uses 98 watts full on. How many watts for a plasma?
The only sport I watch is ice hockey,the ice needs to be white,I have owned plasma in the past and their always seemed to be something missing while watching hockey,nice clear ice.

Actually, quite many LCD:s would do this as they would just turn off the screen if no contents, so that example isn't the best. It is a fact that some LCDs can produce true black (0,0 cd/m2). I think there are plasmas that does the same also. If you would have an all black screen with only something else on it, a good LCD with local dimming would beat a plasma as far as I know, as most of the blacks would be "true black" on the LCD but only "almost black" on the plasma. There are of course drawback to local dimming as well, but I am sure that someone from the other camp will point them out soon enough so I won't smile.gif
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post #206 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 01:57 PM
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There is no end to TV reviewers. In the review comments listed above I have to wonder what shortcomings there were in the VT50 that were not mentioned. Things like IR/screen burn, video/pixel noise, dithering, and a few other issues actual owners of these TVs have found and disclosed in the very threads here on AVS for ST50/GT50/VT50.

Have to agree with you here that I think that many reviewers let plasma TVs "get away" with things like pixel noise and IR, even though they are quick to point out any flaw with an LCD. I don't really know why this is the case, as any serious reviewer must know this. Then it's up to anyone to decide for themselves if this is a problem or not, but not even mention it seems strange.
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post #207 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 02:13 PM
 
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Have to agree with you here that I think that many reviewers let plasma TVs "get away" with things like pixel noise and IR, even though they are quick to point out any flaw with an LCD. I don't really know why this is the case, as any serious reviewer must know this. Then it's up to anyone to decide for themselves if this is a problem or not, but not even mention it seems strange.

I've noticed it also. It's like watching political news on some TV networks.wink.gif

It definitely reflects bias. I think it's naive to think reviewers do not have bias. It's human nature to ignore the "warts" on something or someone if, on the whole, everything else is very acceptable. And then highlight the faults of something else. If a reviewer likes all the other aspects of plasma picture qualities, it would be difficult to acknowledge the things that are not so great. Also, I think the process of review doesn't represent long term viewing for plasma or LED/LCD. So things can get missed or setup not properly done for optimum comparisons. Lastly, a controlled environment for a review, may not represent what most buyers have in their homes. Lot's of variables there.

But, it's all good TV and just a choice. I thought about a 42" plasma for the bedroom given the subdued lighting. But I found a nice LCD that works for the casual morning and nite time viewing there.
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post #208 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 02:13 PM
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I bought a Panasonic TH-50PH9UK 5 years ago, I go into Best Buy and my plasma still smokes all led and lcds screens! And its only 1080i, The blacks are richer and the whites are right on! I'm keeping mine till it dies! I would look at what visual apex that's where I got mine good luck!log

Not sure if you are referring to the the heat problem when you say it smokes all LEDs and LCDs (they are actually the same thing), as the best blackest blacks as well as the whitest whites are found on LCD:s today. This is actually a quite common misunderstanding as people have heard that plasmas have the best black levels. It should be said in all fairness that the deep blacks on those LCDs that can produce it does come at a price though (haloing, blooming etc), and I would guess plasmas still lead when it comes to shadow details etc.

But never mind, if you are happy with you TV, by all means keep it and stay happy. In most cases, we are way to picky here and looking for problems instead of just enjoying our TVs, as most of them are very good no matter if they are LCD or Plasma.
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post #209 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 02:21 PM
 
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Not sure if you are referring to the the heat problem when you say it smokes all LEDs and LCDs (they are actually the same thing), as the best blackest blacks as well as the whitest whites are found on LCD:s today. But never mind, if you are happy with you TV, by all means keep it and stay happy. In most cases, we are way to picky here and looking for problems instead of just enjoying our TVs, as most of them are very good no matter if they are LCD or Plasma.

+1 there. No reason to start or continue a rant about one tech over another just because of a disappointment in some past purchase.wink.gif I agree, poring over all the small nuances of what goes into producing the picture on our TVs causes some AVS members to obsess and loose out on just enjoying how good it is. Been there and done that myself. Then it's time to step back and just marvel at how good the TV we have really is.
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post #210 of 292 Old 09-13-2012, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by caloyzki View Post

ok i understand that. but why most of the people here are complaining about the off-axis viewing or angle viewing. im wondering how do you guys watch on ur tv? do you guys watch on your tv's in sideways? i dont think so. nobody on this world watch their tv on sideways or something like that whatever you call it. just sit up straight and relax in front of your tv and youl enjoy the view. that is how we watch tv. peace.

I choose an LCD (Sonys HX929) instead of a VT50 after much going back and forth, but still, I would have to agree with anyone saying that the biggest drawback of high end LCDs are the viewing angels. My 65HX929 is one of the most expensive sets on the market (in Europe I think it is THE most expensive one, even on sale) but still I am the first to say that viewing angels are not good. If viewing angels where important to me (I use a projector for "group viewings") I would have gone with a plasma, no hesitation.
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Samsung Un55es6500 55 Inch 1080p 120 Hz 3d Slim Led Hdtv , Lg Cinema Screen 55lm7600 55 Inch Cinema 3d 1080p 240 Hz Led Lcd Hdtv , Plasma Vs Led
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