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8K views 92 replies 22 participants last post by  tgm1024 
#1 ·
What TV comes to mind as the worst you've seen recently? Balancing everything, is there a TV so terrible that it's mere existence horrifies you?
 
#52 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/30#post_23017445


By the way, there seems to be a sense from people that the plasmas on display in stores are placed into some sort of torch mode. I had always assumed that they were dramatically subdued on purpose (more so than their normal brightness) to help keep the floor units from burning.

They are in torch mode, Retailers want to sell tvs. You can't sell a plasma set up to minimize the possibility of burn-in next to the retina-burning lcds. The fact that you rarely see burn in on these torched out sets is largely due to the varied content on demo loops used by most retailers.
 
#53 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/30#post_23017432


You can't in an absolute sense, but luckily there are a ton of TVs to the left and right of the one you're looking at. Wouldn't they all be affected roughly the same way? I understand the differences in what light does when striking the panel itself, particularly when piercing through an LCD vs. hitting the surface of a plasma array, but side by side comparisons would be relatively similar given any level of ambient light, no?


IOW, if it's apparent that LCD X has better blacks than Plasma Y (somehow
), then wouldn't that side by side comparison apply in my living room as well to some degree?

Perhaps you can draw 'relative' comparisons, but it does little to tell you the absolute values. I would never want to buy a display because it's black levels looked better than the panels to its left & right. I'd need to see it in a controlled lighting environment. Add the additional complication that perhaps the display you're interested in, in this bright light comparison, may either be adjusted better or worse than the surrounding displays, and you have a real can of worms. At that point even your 'relative assessment' means little to nothing.
 
#54 ·
...pretty much anything available in the Wal-Mart electronics department.
 
#55 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/30#post_23018337


Perhaps you can draw 'relative' comparisons, but it does little to tell you the absolute values. I would never want to buy a display because it's black levels looked better than the panels to its left & right. I'd need to see it in a controlled lighting environment. Add the additional complication that perhaps the display you're interested in, in this bright light comparison, may either be adjusted better or worse than the surrounding displays, and you have a real can of worms. At that point even your 'relative assessment' means little to nothing.


You make a good point and if you've ever read my posts on this subject, I have always insisted that judging a display in most retail environments is difficult. However, in this particular case, as I was able to gain access to the picture controls on both sets, which were side by side and regardless of what I did with the Vizio, it didn't even come close to the Panny, at least IMO.



Ian
 
#57 ·
Being that I sell tv's, I get to analyze the picture on many different brands and models. This years, the biggest turd I've seen is the Toshiba cinema series 55l7200. At $2000 it had a horrible picture. color accuracy was abismal, picture uniformity was a disaster, and dispite zone dimming it had just the worst black levels and contrast. After all that ranting the worst thing it has is shadow detail. Don't even try and watch a dark movie on this thing you wont be able to see anything. No amount of picture tweeking can make this thing loog good.
 
#58 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by toby1015  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/30#post_23032471


Being that I sell tv's, I get to analyze the picture on many different brands and models. This years, the biggest turd I've seen is the Toshiba cinema series 55l7200. At $2000 it had a horrible picture. color accuracy was abismal, picture uniformity was a disaster, and dispite zone dimming it had just the worst black levels and contrast. After all that ranting the worst thing it has is shadow detail. Don't even try and watch a dark movie on this thing you wont be able to see anything. No amount of picture tweeking can make this thing loog good.

Funny, of what I've read on the L7200 said that it was a very respectable FP and very capable in terms of performance. Haven't seen the L7200 myself, but I have seen it's step down L5200 is a respectable FP in it's own right as well given it's reasonable price tag


Making an assessment in a retail environment isn't the most accurate way to determine thinks like black levels, contrast ratio, etc. That was just noted above.
 
#59 ·
I am well aware of retail environment issues. I work in one which allows me to control the room lighting. The l5200 is hands down a higher quality panel. But the l7200 in a dark room is a dog. The zone dimming in it is not precise at all and causes vertical bands in the image. The panel itself can't create a very good native contrast and then you mix in the dimming and you get terrible shadow detail. This isn't my first rodeo here. I've been selling TVs at a specialty retailer for 12 years. Trust me when I say its a bad tv. The l5200 is a solid tv and a good value.
 
#61 ·
How bout Sony sxrd with green blob


Their xbr1 and 2 may also be the most expensive displays to be turds.


Nice set when it worked properly
 
#62 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by toby1015  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/30#post_23032751


I am well aware of retail environment issues. I work in one which allows me to control the room lighting. The l5200 is hands down a higher quality panel. But the l7200 in a dark room is a dog. The zone dimming in it is not precise at all and causes vertical bands in the image. The panel itself can't create a very good native contrast and then you mix in the dimming and you get terrible shadow detail. This isn't my first rodeo here. I've been selling TVs at a specialty retailer for 12 years. Trust me when I say its a bad tv. The l5200 is a solid tv and a good value.

I'm not discounting your knowledge and awareness, I'm just saying that you're the only person I've heard who's thrown this one under the bus to this extent. And based off of the solid performance the L5200, I just find it a bit hard to believe that L7200 could legitimately be the worst FP you've seen lately.


Here's another review which directly contradicts what Katzmeier said:
http://hdguru.com/review-toshiba-47l7200-3d-led-lcd-hdtv/8670/


Regardless, isn't this type of discussion exactly what AVS is all about?

 
#63 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/40_40#post_23015037


In my whole life I have never had a plasma burn in on me.


Why does that happen to other people?


How dumb do you have to be to have that happen to you?
Dumb enough to buy a Plasma and try to watch TV normally?
 
#64 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by toby1015  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/30#post_23032471


Being that I sell tv's, I get to analyze the picture on many different brands and models. This years, the biggest turd I've seen is the Toshiba cinema series 55l7200. At $2000 it had a horrible picture. color accuracy was abismal, picture uniformity was a disaster, and dispite zone dimming it had just the worst black levels and contrast. After all that ranting the worst thing it has is shadow detail. Don't even try and watch a dark movie on this thing you wont be able to see anything. No amount of picture tweeking can make this thing loog good.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoozthatat  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/30#post_23032663


Funny, of what I've read on the L7200 said that it was a very respectable FP and very capable in terms of performance. Haven't seen the L7200 myself, but I have seen it's step down L5200 is a respectable FP in it's own right as well given it's reasonable price tag


Making an assessment in a retail environment isn't the most accurate way to determine thinks like black levels, contrast ratio, etc. That was just noted above.
Quote:
Originally Posted by toby1015  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/30#post_23032751


I am well aware of retail environment issues. I work in one which allows me to control the room lighting. The l5200 is hands down a higher quality panel. But the l7200 in a dark room is a dog. The zone dimming in it is not precise at all and causes vertical bands in the image. The panel itself can't create a very good native contrast and then you mix in the dimming and you get terrible shadow detail. This isn't my first rodeo here. I've been selling TVs at a specialty retailer for 12 years. Trust me when I say its a bad tv. The l5200 is a solid tv and a good value.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoozthatat  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/60#post_23033596


I'm not discounting your knowledge and awareness, I'm just saying that you're the only person I've heard who's thrown this one under the bus to this extent. And based off of the solid performance the L5200, I just find it a bit hard to believe that L7200 could legitimately be the worst FP you've seen lately.


Here's another review which directly contradicts what Katzmeier said:
http://hdguru.com/review-toshiba-47l7200-3d-led-lcd-hdtv/8670/


Regardless, isn't this type of discussion exactly what AVS is all about?


I've always liked Toshiba products, but the picture quality on their TV's is either above or below average depending on the model and rarely has anything to do with price. This inconsistency has always baffled me, but wouldn't preclude me from buying one (I have a 32 incher which is great) as long as I know which ones to avoid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by olyteddy  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/60#post_23033661


Dumb enough to buy a Plasma and try to watch TV normally?

Funny, I have a plasma and I watch sports and letter box movies and IR hasn't been an issue for me. But then again, I don't do gaming.



Ian
 
#65 ·

Quote:
But then again, I don't do gaming.



Ian

I do a ton of gaming Ian, from sports games to FPS, both with constant static image and I've never experienced any problems with IR, like at all and I game on my PZ950.
 
#66 ·
Actually I'm not the only one. Cnet gave the toshiba l7200 a generous 5 in performance. Further more the hdguru review wasn't exactly a good review. Not much else to go on after that because there wasn't too many stores that even displayed it. Like you said, you haven't seen it. Enough said.
 
#67 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by toby1015  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/60#post_23037120


Actually I'm not the only one. Cnet gave the toshiba l7200 a generous 5 in performance. Further more the hdguru review wasn't exactly a good review. Not much else to go on after that because there wasn't too many stores that even displayed it. Like you said, you haven't seen it. Enough said.

Wasn't exactly a good review? How so? The person who wrote it, Geoff Morrison, also writes for CNET. Is he less credible because he disagrees with your assessment?
 
#68 ·
I'm well aware of who geofrey morrison is as well. What I'm saying is he didn't necessarily give it a ringing endorsement. And he does reviews for sound and vision. He used to write reviews for hometheater mag as matter of fact he's responded to letters I wrote in that publication. Its a **** tv especially at two grand quit arguing that. Dave Kazmier had nothing positive to say about its picture and he's right! He reviewed the 55" and my store only carried the 55".
 
#69 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by toby1015  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/60#post_23037444


I'm well aware of who geofrey morrison is as well. What I'm saying is he didn't necessarily give it a ringing endorsement. And he does reviews for sound and vision. He used to write reviews for hometheater mag as matter of fact he's responded to letters I wrote in that publication. Its a **** tv especially at two grand quit arguing that. Dave Kazmier had nothing positive to say about its picture and he's right! He reviewed the 55" and my store only carried the 55".

He also does reviews for hdguru. Which if you would know if you read the review from the link I posted.


And I don't believe I ever said that he gave it a ringing a review. My original post was only intended to dispute the fact that you nominated the L7200 as the worst FP you've seen lately. As in, honestly, can you whole-heartedly say that the L7200 is the worst FP you've seen lately? If you sell TV's then I'm sure you see some real gems. Tell me that the L7200 is the worst
 
#70 ·
As for the 2012 Vizio reference up-thread, I really tried hard to like them, but they all had a cringe-factor to them that I couldn't get past.


I'm not sure of the Vizio line, but they got me wondering: When company X buys a panel from company Y, does it ever happen that company Y intentionally cripples the panel (all under contract)? Perhaps not at the substrate level, but at the hardware controller level just above it (far below the firmware). I hear a lot of people throw things like "well, they're using LG panels" as if it's supposed to mean something impressive, when I'm not ever sure it does.
 
#72 ·
Yes I can whole heartedly say the toshiba 55l7200 has the worst picture I have recently seen. There are some contenders for sure. Like the lg 55ls4500 but the tie breaker is price for sure. We don't carry off brands so I can't say for sure if vizio or westinghouse for instance make a tv thats worse cause I only see them in big box stores. Many of them in the store look pretty terrible but I don't know for sure.
 
#73 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoozthatat  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/60#post_23037232


Wasn't exactly a good review? How so? The person who wrote it, Geoff Morrison, also writes for CNET. Is he less credible because he disagrees with your assessment?

HDGuru also raved about the Panasonic WT50 before it was released, saying it was one of the best LED TVs of the year. We all know how that turned out...
 
#74 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatuglyguy  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/60#post_23046332


HDGuru also raved about the Panasonic WT50 before it was released, saying it was one of the best LED TVs of the year. We all know how that turned out...

Ah I see, so clearly every reviewer/writer on hdguru should be dismissed and deemed incompetent. Makes sense.
 
#76 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross  /t/1459727/whats-the-worst-flat-panel-tv-youve-seen-lately/60#post_23050139


I've got to say this is the weirdest thread I've seen in a long time. We all come to AVS to find out the newest in tech, the best gear in almost any category and here you guys are arguing over what is the worst display you've seen. Bizarre.

Not arguing Ken, merely discussing terrible TV's.
 
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