LG 55EC9300 55" OLED Owners ONLY Thread - Page 23 - AVS Forum
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post #661 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 08:30 AM
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Local Dimming? Local Dimming ?? We don't need no stinking local dimming !
Hey, you've got 2 million local dimmers.
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post #662 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 08:33 AM
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This is what came with mine...
Thanks Marty.

It looks like a standard warranty that covers a new TV regardless of where it was purchased. I got a little worry because another thread had LG customer support stating that warranty is only valid from authorized dealers.
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post #663 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 08:39 AM
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I included an attachment of a chat I had with an LG service agent. I'm not sure the agent knew what they were talking about though.
Yep, that was the picture that got me spooked. But the warranty card does not mention authorized dealer so we are good for 2 years if bought with a credit card with extended protection benefit.
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post #664 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 08:43 AM
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Well those settings appeared great for "real" content at first, then I fired up Simpsons and it's completely wrong. Fired up Family Guy and same thing. Sigh... clearly his set is a bit different.

Why are the colors so far off on this thing? You simply can't edit the gray scale to get them right either, you have to edit the color management system which honestly I have no idea how to properly do.
When you say you 'fired up Simpsons', are you talking about changing the channels on your DVR? If so, broadcast & cable color quality is all over the place from channel to channel. The last thing in the world you should do to judge the accuracy of your calibration is to look for consistency from one channel to the next.

What makes me really suspicious is when your talked about how great the new settings appeared with 'real content' and then all of a sudden you thought everything was wrong based on how the animated Simpsons looked.
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post #665 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 08:47 AM
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I'm using an i1 Display Pro. I turned color up to 80, maxed green saturation, it won't budge. I am using HCFR's OLED profile which claims "used for OLED that use white, red, blue, green". I managed to get them all dialed in but cyan and green, and cyan is because of green.

Perhaps explains my issues calibrating.. faulty? I notice I am getting weird artifacts on some colors if I adjust tint and some colors. If I pause the screen, they are still slightly flickering.
As I recall from the shootout, the 9300 does have an issue with cyan. I recall that because I joked about it at the shootout, saying I was used to having a cyan error from my Sharp Elite.
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post #666 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 08:47 AM - Thread Starter
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For those who think there are indents that magically appear with the tv off there are not, This drove me crazy with the 9800. They are reflection points that are only an illusion of an indent. If you feel your panel there is absolutely no indent.

I also tested grey scale pattern and can see every shade at 50 brightness, if there is someone who cannot I would consider an exchange as your set may be defective.

Last edited by Vegas oled; 08-29-2014 at 08:51 AM.
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post #667 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 08:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Has anyone check sub-pixels? Just curious if LG fixed the problem or if I am just lucky with my panel. Also 8800 owners, curious if the sub-pixel issue is present with this set. The 8800 is actually a 13.5 model and is supposed to have improvement gained my engineering from the 9800 so is probably a great choice for those who want a flat display.
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post #668 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by JoeBel View Post
I took a mf cloth to it but my dent wasn't something I could ever have gotten out. It was located on the top-center of my panel, was fairly noticeable when the panel was off due to reflectivity. I didn't notice it during content for the hours I had the tv. What annoyed me was my gf isn't one to notice "anything" and she zeroed in on it immediately. She seemed to find some joy in trying to mar my 3K purchase.

Is your pixel a sub, how close do you have to be to see it, what color? I would keep an eye on it, hopefully they have improved the sustainability of the subs so there aren't issues with them going out as the 9800 owners had reported.
The dent on my tv is like directly in the middle. Wonder if its how they are shipping them. And the pixel appears black on every color.
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post #669 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 08:59 AM - Thread Starter
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As I recall from the shootout, the 9300 does have an issue with cyan. I recall that because I joked about it at the shootout, saying I was used to having a cyan error from my Sharp Elite.
This issue was never an issue on my mind when I looked at the Sharp Elite, all I could see was incredible black levels.
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post #670 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:01 AM - Thread Starter
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The dent on my tv is like directly in the middle. Wonder if its how they are shipping them. And the pixel appears black on every color.
There is no dent, it is an illusion. Spent three days with my 9800 thinking it was a dent. It is a reflection illusion. If this bothers you I would go 8800 as the illusion is on every 9800 and 9300 and will be on every curved LG OLED .

Curious as to what black pixel? If you have a pixel out in every color I would exchange it. This I have never seen on any lG OLED and is a must exchange.

Last edited by Vegas oled; 08-29-2014 at 09:06 AM.
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post #671 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:03 AM
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Hey, you've got 2 million local dimmers.
Priceless Ken!
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post #672 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:03 AM
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I have found a different color profile/preset from your main color setting is needed for B&W to look it's best. If your main calibration uses "Warm 2" you can almost instantly get B&W to look "right" by switching to "Warm 1" .. Otherwise, it's a mess. I realize I am not speaking in correct tech terms here, but I know what I see and what looks right. Last night I tried both The Honeymooners and Casablanca on BD and I have never seen them looking better. No signs of yellow or green in the image and excellent gradients in motion. Nothing that stuck out as "wrong" and a real thrilling viewing experience. (hope that makes sense)

ALSO, sharp as a tack with no artifacts.
Actually B&W should look correct with a proper calibration. There really shouldn't be a need for a separate preset for a B&W broadcast. What I've found that sometimes occur is that the color carrier is sometimes left on by the broadcaster and you get an odd tinting to a B&W broadcast. It's easy to detect by simply dropping your color level to '0'. If you see a change, you know that's something amiss with the broadcast.
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post #673 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Vegas oled View Post
This issue was never an issue on my mind when I looked at the Sharp Elite, all I could see was incredible black levels.
Yup. The point I always made was the cyan was a color not often seen (especially at the lower luminance levels the error was most prevalent). Additionally, without seeing a reference point for the correct rendition of cyan, it would be tough to know the error is even there. Colors that are frequently seen and for which we have solid reference points (yellow bananas, orange oranges etc.) would be easily detected color errors if they existed.
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post #674 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Vegas oled View Post
Has anyone check sub-pixels? Just curious if LG fixed the problem or if I am just lucky with my panel. Also 8800 owners, curious if the sub-pixel issue is present with this set. The 8800 is actually a 13.5 model and is supposed to have improvement gained my engineering from the 9800 so is probably a great choice for those who want a flat display.
I have looked mine over and so far have noticed no incidence of stuck or dead pixels. Running a grey screen I have gone up to it with a magnifying glass and gone all over the thing. Didn't know what I would find, but it all looks good to me. I have about 33 hours on it so far. IR is also already started to back off. It always faded within a second or so but now it doesn't seem to be lasting even that long, if at all. So far I am impressed with the QC for this production run.

If you are just lucky, then I am also lucky it seems!
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post #675 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by MartyGillis View Post
GOOD LUCK to anyone trying to get everything to look good on this set. You can do it, but not without multiple settings on multiple presets and even then you will run into problematic content. As they say, there is no such thing as a perfect TV, but the 9300 shows you quickly that there is no such thing as a perfect cable system or broadcast standard. Sloppy engineers, no doubt about it.

Grrrrrr!
oled shows source flaws like no other
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post #676 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:13 AM
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Actually B&W should look correct with a proper calibration. There really shouldn't be a need for a separate preset for a B&W broadcast. What I've found that sometimes occur is that the color carrier is sometimes left on by the broadcaster and you get an odd tinting to a B&W broadcast. It's easy to detect by simply dropping your color level to '0'. If you see a change, you know that's something amiss with the broadcast.
Absolutely! I regularly drop my saturation down to "0" for that very reason. I think the problematic grey scale on this set is forcing me to just use a different setting for B&W until i can find a happy medium between the two. I am not as technical as the rest of you, and would welcome a calibration if there were someone good in my area which is the High Desert.
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post #677 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:14 AM
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Yup. The point I always made was the cyan was a color not often seen (especially at the lower luminance levels the error was most prevalent). Additionally, without seeing a reference point for the correct rendition of cyan, it would be tough to know the error is even there. Colors that are frequently seen and for which we have solid reference points (yellow bananas, orange oranges etc.) would be easily detected color errors if they existed.
My Lumagen Radiance after they added the 125 point LUT firmware update allows you to fix the cyan problem. Sometimes wish I hadn't now that I see how much cyan is used in commercials.
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post #678 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:16 AM
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oled shows source flaws like no other
And it does the opposite for quality encodes! The good stuff looks excellent, the excellent stuff is off the hook. I can live with that.
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post #679 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:26 AM
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You should exchange it anyway, cause of your problem with the crushing blacks on the sides of the panel.

But for your calibration problem: It is very important with LG's CMS, to do two or three steps per color maximum! Otherwise, this whole thing goes crazy and give you huge artefacts. Also, RGB (greyscale) should at no point reach +50 or -50! This will also skew the PQ by giving you artefacts!

Last but not least: Every set is different to one another!!! Copying settings will most likely make the picture worse. See at Vgas_oleds for example. He copied settings for his EA9800 and he copies settings for hi EC9300. One looks neutral with his camera (don't have a clue at which color temperature his camera is set) and the other one is bathed in blue. Copying calibaration settings do no display in the wrld justice.

There is a flamingo stand for it, but you have to buy it seperately.
Thanks, i'm still under the impression that the 2-3% shade of black crush is normal and caused by the curve. I'd imagine no one would really notice it unless they threw up patterns and moved them around the screen.

Nice to know the artifact thing with CMS is normal. Makes me wonder why that review site cranked them to the extremes, massive massive artifacts on my screen during some content.

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When you say you 'fired up Simpsons', are you talking about changing the channels on your DVR? If so, broadcast & cable color quality is all over the place from channel to channel. The last thing in the world you should do to judge the accuracy of your calibration is to look for consistency from one channel to the next.

What makes me really suspicious is when your talked about how great the new settings appeared with 'real content' and then all of a sudden you thought everything was wrong based on how the animated Simpsons looked.
No, these are high quality 1080p premium web-dls. The artifacts caused when using those settings are so obvious that it makes the TV look faulty. It's unwatchable on some scenes if I adjust the luminance more than 1-2 points in the CMS. The artifacts even continue when it is paused. The glitches only happen during certain shades, I found real content (BD Source) that does the same.

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I also tested grey scale pattern and can see every shade at 50 brightness, if there is someone who cannot I would consider an exchange as your set may be defective.
Anyone confirm? With 2.4 gamma I need the set on 58 to see all shades, and I'd say 60 is more ideal. While normally I'd just set it to that and forget it, it actually causes issues with some dark content when brightness is set so high.

Last edited by Tyrindor; 08-29-2014 at 09:34 AM.
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post #680 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:34 AM
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Thanks, I got the CIE chart up and i'm doing a cont. measurement. There's colors I simply cannot get right.

Green for example should be x0.3, y0.6, Y0.7152. I assume that's Saturation, Tint, Luminance respectively. This is as close as I can get green, which is pretty pathetic for an OLED if i'm understanding this correctly. Any advice? Am I suppose to do grayscale before or after doing colors?
Basic's for calibration... (and logic order)

  1. Reset the picture mode
  2. Set gamma target using the gamma control (I recommend 2.2)
  3. Turn off all enhancements
  4. Put up a 50% white window pattern. Put your software in continuous read mode. Change color temp setting, find which setting is closest to 6500k (D65)
  5. Set brightness/contrast
  6. Adjust white balance, 2pt (just get it close) then 20pt
  7. Adjust gamma (using 20pt white balance)
  8. Adjust color
  9. Go back through steps 5-8 and verify one thing didn't mess up another

It looks like you are targeting 100% saturation...

* Use smaller window patterns around 10% in size; do not use full screen patterns
* Use the same size pattern for gamma
* Try 75% patterns for color (also use same size pattern here)
* Check color tracking when you are done adjusting the CMS, this will really tell you what is going on.
* If gamma is sloping on one side; remove any gamma you may have adjusted in the 20pt (rest & redo white balance). Then try adjusting the 2pt white balance controls evenly up and down for coarse gamma adjustments. Just remember to keep re-checking gamma fully as one point will effect the other. Basically view the 2pt as coarse gamma control; then follow up using the 20pt fine control.

If you set color using 100% patterns on a TV which is perfect this is OK (almost no TV is like this). When watching TV you will rarely ever watch anything at 100% saturation, so it makes more sense to calibrate for 75%. Also, If you check color tracking you can try tweaking things to get tracking more uniform.

Please post the color tracking when you are done too
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Last edited by SiGGy; 08-29-2014 at 01:42 PM.
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post #681 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by SiGGy View Post
Basic's for calibration... (and order)

1. Set brightness/contrast
2. Adjust white balance, 2pt and 20pt
3. Adjust gamma
4. Adjust color
5. Go back through steps 1-4 and verify one thing didn't mess up another

It looks like you are targeting 100% saturation...

* Use smaller window patterns around 10% in size, do not use full screen patterns
* Use the same size pattern for gamma
* Try 75% patterns for color (also use same size pattern here)
* Check color tracking when you are done adjusting the CMS, this will really tell you what is going on.

If you set color using 100% patterns on a TV which is perfect this is OK (almost no TV is like this). When watching TV you will rarely ever watch anything at 100% saturation, so it makes more sense to calibrate for 75%. Also, If you check color tracking you can try tweaking things to get tracking more uniform.

Please post the color tracking when you are done too
Thanks, you are right I was using 100% patterns. I'll try another fresh calibration. My i1 display pro is really having issues with 5% and 10% gray scale on this set. It claims it pushes a ton of blue (-37 to get it right, etc), but if I adjust it everything turns very green. The other %s look fine. This a normal problem with calibrating gray scales? Any suggestion?

Last edited by Tyrindor; 08-29-2014 at 09:43 AM.
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post #682 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Tyrindor View Post
Thanks, you are right I was using 100% patterns. I'll try another fresh calibration. My i1 display pro is really having issues with 5% and 10% gray scale on this set. It claims it pushes blue, but if I adjust it "correctly" the bars are completely green. The other %s look fine. This a normal problem with calibrating gray scales? Any suggestion?
NP, I updated my post with some more details. Save you even more frustrations (hopefully)

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post #683 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:52 AM
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Well local best buy has one more in stock so just going to exchange after work tonight unless someone else can confirm they have the same black/brightness issues. I use the AVS calibration disc, but honestly any disc that shows a grayscale will do. Connect a laptop or computer to the OLED and drag the pattern around, it gets completely crushed on the left and right sides of the display for me. I also have to turn brightness up to nearly 60 before I can see the 2-3 shades of gray above reference.

Default settings with a gamma of 2.4 and a brightness of 50 I can literally see 0 bars on the AVS disc gray scale. With 100% default on ISF1 I see 2 bars on the gray scale.
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post #684 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Tyrindor View Post
Thanks, you are right I was using 100% patterns. I'll try another fresh calibration. My i1 display pro is really having issues with 5% and 10% gray scale on this set. It claims it pushes a ton of blue (-37 to get it right, etc), but if I adjust it everything turns very green. The other %s look fine. This a normal problem with calibrating gray scales? Any suggestion?
Calibrate with room pitch black. Move meter 1-3" away from the screen. That might help. Another trick is to move the meter around slowly with a 50% white pattern until you peak out all RGB. Some meters can be touchy depending on where they are placed and or angle to the screen.
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post #685 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Tyrindor View Post
Well local best buy has one more in stock so just going to exchange after work tonight unless someone else can confirm they have the same black/brightness issues. I use the AVS calibration disc, but honestly any disc that shows a grayscale will do. Connect a laptop or computer to the OLED and drag the pattern around, it gets completely crushed on the left and right sides of the display for me. I also have to turn brightness up to nearly 60 before I can see the 2-3 shades of gray above reference.

Default settings with a gamma of 2.4 and a brightness of 50 I can literally see 0 bars on the AVS disc gray scale. With 100% default on ISF1 I see 2 bars on the gray scale.
Return it, then follow my steps above. See if it's any better.

Only other thing I can think of...

What mode do you have your BR player's HDMI out in?

YCbCr #:#:#
or
RGB?

* IMO 2.4 is too dark; shoot for 2.2. If that looks too dark on most material I would try a BT.1886 gamma. If you do change gamma after you have calibrated; you will need to re-do your calibration for the new gamma target.

-SiGGy

Last edited by SiGGy; 08-29-2014 at 10:43 AM.
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post #686 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 10:49 AM
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How accurate is this review and info > http://televisions.reviewed.com/cont...ew/the-science
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post #687 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 11:02 AM
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Standing in front of this set right now at best buy.

Insane color detail, blacks are very impressive. However 2 really negative things stood out to me watching the demo loop -
Horrible motion handling. Juddering like crazy during camera pans.

Real bad aliasing on the lines. Don't know if it was over sharpening, the content itself, or what, but it was so bad it just stood out as artifacts.

Also, bc I'm used to 4K it was too easy to resolve the pixels from about 2 feet away. Not a realistic viewing distance, but when you see the 4K loops running on the samsung and Sony 4K sets it looked weak in comparison.

The Sony 950B looks most impressive to me in this store environment.



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post #688 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 11:03 AM
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i am having a LG rep see if the DNR was updated, should hear back within 72 hrs
We would be happy to review your case for you. Feel free to contact us through private message.
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post #689 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Hisma View Post
Standing in front of this set right now at best buy.

Insane color detail, blacks are very impressive. However 2 really negative things stood out to me watching the demo loop -
Horrible motion handling. Juddering like crazy during camera pans.

Real bad aliasing on the lines. Don't know if it was over sharpening, the content itself, or what, but it was so bad it just stood out as artifacts.

Also, bc I'm used to 4K it was too easy to resolve the pixels from about 2 feet away. Not a realistic viewing distance, but when you see the 4K loops running on the samsung and Sony 4K sets it looked weak in comparison.

The Sony 950B looks most impressive to me in this store environment.



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Try to get a hold of the remote. Turn OFF Trumotion. Try to change to Cinema or one of the ISF modes,even Standard. Adjust from there. See if that helps.
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post #690 of 3002 Old 08-29-2014, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Peterson View Post
I think we can all agree the soundbar isn't really worth $600, that's to make the freebie sound better. And the Rewards Dollars are just an in-store credit for future purchases. That's why I think your calculations are a little optimistic.

Having said that, I do think the BB pre-football HDTV promotions going on right now are pretty good and in fact if members are on the fence about this TV, they might want to jump while they still have these two items included. I have 45 days to return so that takes me out to around October 12th and by then I'm hoping the 4K TVs are out somewhere and I can compare and exchange for an upgrade if desired.

Of course I don't know what promotions they might be running next week so who knows really?

OK, gotcha (and agree, though I might have used the word 'inflated' rather than 'optimistic' :-)

I thought you might have meant that I was unreasonably hopeful that that deal would continue...
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