LG UHD/4K OLED TVs to Hit the Market This Year - Page 5 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #121 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by igreg View Post
I've never read where the reason for the curve was structural limitations. Can you cite a source? Thanks.
I don't remember for sure but Rogo alluded to it a few posts above. He mentioned "elsewhere" but I think I read it within the last 5 days or so somewhere on this forum or one of the three threads regarding the VE shootout. I think it was referring to a curved very thin panel being less prone to bending and easier to utilize a stand. I could see a three point stand working well for a curved 65" display.
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post #122 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 04:54 PM
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Sign me up for the 65"! Anyone know if these are wall mountable?

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post #123 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 04:57 PM
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I've got a Gateway plasma sitting over on my coffee table that my son uses to play video games, it's from 2002/03, while it is prone to image retention, still has no burn in, neither does my Kuro, my parents Vizio, my son's Samsung, my Zentih and only the Gateway was ever broke (I garbage picked it with some bad caps over 2 years ago). I think a lot is read into a problem that plagued very early sets and carried the stigma with the technology.

That being said I wouldn't rule out an OLED as a result. I'd be more concerned about some Chinese company like Hisense, Changhong, Seiki etc. suddenly announcing they have one at a fraction of the cost. I got one of those Seiki 4k 55" sets back in February when Sears had them for $599. You can't rule out the possibility, and there is no way of knowing for certain. If Hisense dropped one one the marked at $1999 you'd probably more regret spending that much on the LG, particularly if it performs well, and be more likely to buy it on impulse.

When I bought the 55" Seiki 4k, I didn't need it, but the novelty of experimenting with a 4k set for $600 was worth it alone.
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post #124 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 05:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
The interpixel spacing and screen door effect on the 55EC9300 is noticeably worse than on a 55" LED/LCD - if that spacing has not been reduced by at least 50% on the 4K screens, it could be a problem and a further reason to hold off for another generation or two.
Didn't someone at LG make claims that the 4K models were brighter? That would be hard to achieve if an equal area of each pixel was occupied by the black grid like on the 1080p models. If they can improve fill factor, that alone should boost brightness significantly without any other changes to the panel.
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post #125 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Riddle View Post
Sign me up for the 65"! Anyone know if these are wall mountable?
Yes they are, Tom.
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post #126 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 05:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

Several owners reported trouble with their sets.
If I had to guess, I'd say about 50%-75% of the reported problems were from Vegas Oled. If you've read the threads that Vegas has posted in (and the many sets he's owned within the last couple of months from different techs), you'd understand what I'm trying to say. I don't see these 'problems' as prolific in number or severe in magnitude.

If you want to see problems in terms of both magnitude & frequency, visit the 'mature' tech threads like Sony LCDs. In fact almost any thread from any display will show many complaining about something. Because it's OLED, it gets put under the microscope.

Nope, sorry, I think this is a very overstated issue by those not looking all that closely. I've read every post in every OLED thread and I think I have a pretty good handle on what's going on and it really doesn't frighten me in the least.
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post #127 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by igreg View Post
Could add another: the presence of DNR that cannot be turned off. At least Samsung got that right in its plasmas recently. Will the new OLED's from LG have the capability to tur DNR off? Thanks.
Sorry, that's already been fixed according to owners. Back to the drawing boards to find another. Perhaps the color of the stand?
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post #128 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post
Sorry, that's already been fixed according to owners. Back to the drawing boards to find another. Perhaps the color of the stand?
I've only seen owners talk about an owner that proved this . Can you link to the source owner of that information please?
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post #129 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 05:30 PM
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^ That's really mean, you should be ashamed!

Seriously though, it's pretty plausible that LG simply gave users the 'on/off' switch. It's not rocket science, so it really could be what happened.
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post #130 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 05:59 PM
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Why do you like the curve? If it imparted more of a realistic view I could see it, but doesn't seem to reflect reality; further, it decreases viewing angles.
No it doesnt decrease viewing angles. Thats simply bs. Sorry man. Its just why would it decrease the viewing angle?
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post #131 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 06:29 PM
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I agree wholeheartedly with the postings by Ken Ross and Rogo.
I am looking to buy a 4K UHDTV in the coming months but i would never consider a LG OLED set until it is at least in its 4th manufacturing generation, the company can unequivocally guarantee that all OLED pixels have an estimated MTBF of at least 30.000 hours (preferably 50.000 hours) without any limitation on "DOA OLED pixel" for exchange/return, and the company does something to improve the odds against image retention/permanent image burn.
It is my understanding that image retention/permanent image burn is an intrinsic problem with CRTs, plasma and OLED displays because of their use of emissive light sources and all we can do to minimize its effects is to carefully monitor the first initial 200 hours of use and afterwards the length of onscreen paused images (especially high contrast) and those nasty/nasty bright station logos that stay ON continuously.
If i remember correctly there were at least one or two owners reporting on the LG OLED thread of their units acquiring a faint but permanent image burn after watching the same cable sport channel for an entire weekend without changing channels due to that bright white station logo !
Meanwhile, Sound & Vision magazine tested the LG 55EA9800 OLED set in its June issue and the reviewer confirmed that after calibration the unit achieved that reported "infinite/unmeasurable" contrast ratio with its brightness control set to "51" (i imagine the range being from "0" to "100" ?) BUT raising it one step to "52" for improved gray image visibility raised the black level to a quite noticeable 0.0074 ft-L thus dropping the full-on/full-off contrast ratio to 4,014:1, figures comparable to an IPS LCD panel.
The reviewer also noticed that dark grays weren't perfect with poor gray level uniformity marred by significant streaking...
I am just not ready to drop $6,000.00 on a technology that as far as i am concerned is still in its infancy; All the best to current owners and thank you all very much for being the proverbial "canary in the coal mine".
I played that game before plenty of times in my 40 year career of being an "audiophile/videophile" and now i feel it is time for the dilletant to pick up the slack, ah.
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post #132 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Mrorange303 View Post
No it doesnt decrease viewing angles. Thats simply bs. Sorry man. Its just why would it decrease the viewing angle?

The far side is more viewable (less off-angle) but the near side is quite a bit less viewable (more off-angle).


Taken to the extreme, a viewer can line themselves up with the near side of the screen so that they are gazing right along the plane of the screen (and so cannot see it) and then as the curve progresses, they can see the screen at a less sharp and less sharp of an angle until the far edge of the screen which will be the least off-angle.


Now take a snapshot of that viewing situation and replace your curved TV with a standard flat TV - the entire screen will be visible.
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post #133 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Mrorange303 View Post
No it doesnt decrease viewing angles. Thats simply bs. Sorry man. Its just why would it decrease the viewing angle?
It depends on the size of your room and placement of seating. In my living room, I have a couch that sits 3 centered on the TV, about 9 feet from the screen, and a chair along the wall at the right end of the couch, angled to face the TV. Because the TV faces the middle of the couch (the sweet spot), this means that the chair along the wall is about 35 degrees off center. With my current flat panel, the picture is still pretty darn good from that angle. When I was at Best Buy the other day, I took a look at the Sony and Samsung UHD TV's and moved around to see what the view would be like from the different seating positions in my living room. While I thought the HU9000 had very good PQ from the sweet spot, it has enough of a curve that the majority of the right half of the screen would be unviewable from where the chair on the side wall is located. So, if I ever have more than 3 people watching the TV at one time, at least one person is going to get a lousy seat. The only way around that would be to temporarily set a chair or two up behind the couch. With a flat screen, I don't have that problem.
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post #134 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 07:20 PM
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fafrd this is from rtings the Samsung curve viewing angle is only 18° https://www.rtings.com/reviews/tv/lcd-led/samsung/h8000


The viewing angle is quite poor. As soon as you are off axis, the colors lose saturation. The curved screen also diminishes the experience off-axis.


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post #135 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 07:33 PM
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I don't like curve but seriously I can live with the Sony and oled curve.
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post #136 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 07:55 PM
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Originally Posted by losservatore View Post
fafrd this is from rtings the Samsung curve viewing angle is only 18° https://www.rtings.com/reviews/tv/lcd-led/samsung/h8000


The viewing angle is quite poor. As soon as you are off axis, the colors lose saturation. The curved screen also diminishes the experience off-axis.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jc84qH_CWSY

Totally agree. In addition, if you look at 81 degrees, you see the situation I was referring to - it would be very compressed an off angle, but at that viewing angle, a flat screen would be completely viewable, while the curved screen is not.

In addition, there is the off-axis color shift that you are referring to.

To claim a curved screen improves off-axis viewing is nonsense.
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post #137 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Totally agree. In addition, if you look at 81 degrees, you see the situation I was referring to - it would be very compressed an off angle, but at that viewing angle, a flat screen would be completely viewable, while the curved screen is not.

In addition, there is the off-axis color shift that you are referring to.

To claim a curved screen improves off-axis viewing is nonsense.
WHo said it improves it. I can assure you that those test are looking foe the issue. Who watches their tv from that angle? I do. And i own one and i dont have issues. Of course im not watching dark knight frim the side of the set.

Also those sights do not use the picture settings i do. So you cant say my set acts exactly like that one.

You guys should just avoid curved screens then. OBVIOUSLY you watch in pitch black rooms and only the test films given. There is no chance for a good side performance.

Of coursenwhen i get home i can post pics. But why when you guys believe anything out there.
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post #138 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 08:17 PM
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"We did find one advantage: due to the limited viewing angle of LCD panels the angle from viewing the right side of the panel from the left, or the left side of the screen while sitting on the right, has less severe artifacts in the form of brighter blacks and darker white thanks to the curve. Considering we measured off-axis viewing of just 15º for each side (30º total) before the contrast drops off (and quickly, at that), we consider this a benefit over comparable UHD 4K flat panels, since they’ll likely have an even narrower viewing cone. More on the curve further down."

http://hdguru.com/samsung-un65hu9000-uhd-4k-tv-review/

There is plenty more i will be posting. People see things differently. Reviewers too. One site is not the gospel.
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post #139 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 08:34 PM
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"Any distortions imposed by the curve are minute, and not likely to be picked up on by the average viewer. Those video enthusiasts who look for that sort of thing have likely already taken a position on the curve anyway"

Read more: http://www.digitaltrends.com/tv-revi...#ixzz3BYmIqdWs
Follow us: @digitalT rends on Twitter | digitaltrendsftw on Facebook
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post #140 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 08:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrorange303 View Post
"We did find one advantage: due to the limited viewing angle of LCD panels the angle from viewing the right side of the panel from the left, or the left side of the screen while sitting on the right, has less severe artifacts in the form of brighter blacks and darker white thanks to the curve. Considering we measured off-axis viewing of just 15º for each side (30º total) before the contrast drops off (and quickly, at that), we consider this a benefit over comparable UHD 4K flat panels, since they’ll likely have an even narrower viewing cone. More on the curve further down."

http://hdguru.com/samsung-un65hu9000-uhd-4k-tv-review/

There is plenty more i will be posting. People see things differently. Reviewers too. One site is not the gospel.

Within the viewing cone, the curve does improve off-axis viewing (single-viewer sweetspot is improved from close in). From outside the viewing cone, one side is improved but the other side is degraded.


Depends if you are purchasing your curved screen to watch alone or with others...
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post #141 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
Within the viewing cone, the curve does improve off-axis viewing (single-viewer sweetspot is improved from close in). From outside the viewing cone, one side is improved but the other side is degraded.


Depends if you are purchasing your curved screen to watch alone or with others...


Things like material matter. Like with kids movies there is little to no issues.

But that's not tested. I have kids. So I watch a lot of kids movies.
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post #142 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 09:08 PM
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I'm just pointing out many factors count here. I have had more time to really dig into this. It's not at all bad. Sorry to disappoint so many.


I just don't have off angle issues with my curved set.
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post #143 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 09:48 PM
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viewing angle


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post #144 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 09:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by losservatore View Post
I don't like curve but seriously I can live with the Sony and oled curve.
"It's all about viewing angles. A long-held fear is that using a curved screen will make the picture uncomfortable to watch for anyone not sat in the perfect place - directly in front of, and at exactly the right distance from, the TV.
But due in part to the fact that the curve isn't actually very severe, the viewing 'sweet spot' issue isn't nearly as limiting as you may have feared. In fact, in some ways the UE65HU8500 actually supports off-axis viewing better than Samsung's flat TVs."

http://www.techradar.com/us/reviews/...articleContent


"Another benefit of the larger screen is that the area within which you can sit before the curve starts to seriously upset the image’s geometry is expanded, making it easier to accommodate more viewers in the enlarged ‘sweet spot’."

Read more at http://www.trustedreviews.com/samsun...ysEYKp7XBQT.99


This one agrees it's not the best but not outside the norm for the tech


"Our horizontal viewing angle test measures the contrast performance of a TV at 0° (head-on viewing), and then by 10-degree increments to either side. The HU9000 isn't the best choice if you want to be able to view from very extreme angles—but that's the norm for LCD TVs. I measured a total viewing angle of 31°, or ±15.5° from the center to either side of the screen."

http://televisions.reviewed.com/cont...ew/the-science


"Color and contrast do fade when viewing from off center though much more subtly than I expected. The curve of the screen is supposed to make the ideal viewing angle wider. We only saw minimale improvements thanks to the shape of the screen. Early models of the 4K TVs from Samsung did not look this good from the side and were more in line with standard HD LED TVs. "


http://reviews.lcdtvbuyingguide.com/...n65hu9000.html
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post #145 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted by losservatore View Post
viewing angle


What were the settings on that set? I own one I can tell you what happened. What's the settings? Oh you don't know and can't say.

I know one setting that easily doubles the angles. Did they use it? I don't know.
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post #146 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 10:05 PM
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What were the settings on that set? I own one I can tell you what happened. What's the settings? Oh you don't know and can't say.

I know one setting that easily doubles the angles. Did they use it? I don't know.

We are talking about two different things - color shift and geometric distortion.

On color shift (typical for any LCD off-angle), it is largely a matter of taste and how sensitive you are to it. The curve absolutely does not improve upon it (outside of the sweetspot viewing cone, but t is very much 'in the eye of the beholder.'

Geometric distortion is another thing and not subject to debate. Look at the picture. Look at the width of the door on the right hand side of the screen. Enough said.

If it doesn't bother you or those viewing with you, fine. But don't say it doesn't introduce more geometric distortion that a flat screen when viewed off-angle.
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post #147 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 10:14 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post
We are talking about two different things - color shift and geometric distortion.

On color shift (typical for any LCD off-angle), it is largely a matter of taste and how sensitive you are to it. The curve absolutely does not improve upon it (outside of the sweetspot viewing cone, but t is very much 'in the eye of the beholder.'

Geometric distortion is another thing and not subject to debate. Look at the picture. Look at the width of the door on the right hand side of the screen. Enough said.

If it doesn't bother you or those viewing with you, fine. But don't say it doesn't introduce more geometric distortion that a flat screen when viewed off-angle.
Listen fafrd I appreciate your contributions to this website. I've learned stuff from your post not just here bu in the 4k threads too.

Please stop saying I'm claiming an improvement, I'm saying it's not an issue. I'm using reviews that show a variance in findings.

There is a setting that helps black tones and depth. That's does also help when your viewing from the sides.

It helps. Not improves. I'm saying I don't have the level of issue that's being claimed.

Lossvator is famous for attacking my post. Please refrain from posting something I'm not saying.

I'm not claiming an improvement . Thanks.
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post #148 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 10:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post
Sorry, that's already been fixed according to owners. Back to the drawing boards to find another. Perhaps the color of the stand?



I don't think so. The HDTV shootout had the LG - 55" Class (54-5/8" Diag.) - OLED - Curved - 1080p - Smart - 3D - HDTV that debuted at Best But this week. The set has DNR that cannot be turned off. It's mentioned with disdain at the shootout.
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post #149 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 10:24 PM
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It helps but it doesn't improve?
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post #150 of 322 Old 08-26-2014, 10:25 PM
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Listen fafrd I appreciate your contributions to this website. I've learned stuff from your post not just here bu in the 4k threads too.

Please stop saying I'm claiming an improvement, I'm saying it's not an issue. I'm using reviews that show a variance in findings.

There is a setting that helps black tones and depth. That's does also help when your viewing from the sides.

It helps. Not improves. I'm saying I don't have the level of issue that's being claimed.

Lossvator is famous for attacking my post. Please refrain from posting something I'm not saying.

I'm not claiming an improvement . Thanks.

I don't want to be famous and I don't want to post something your not saying.

The curve introduces worse geometric distortion from off-angle viewing outside of the viewing cone. You either agree with this statement or you do not.

You can say you agree but it is not that big of a deal and does not bother you, and we are good.

You can say you do not agree and then we still have an issue.

That picture says it all (on geometric distortion - color shift is another discussion).
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