Sony A1E 4K HDR OLED TV Thread (No Price Talk) - Page 132 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3931 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 06:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Ozymandis View Post


There's not a lot of HDR content, still. A few streaming shows, a few video games, UHD Blu-ray which doesn't have full studio participation yet if ever, and that's it.

Most people in 2017 are watching most of their content in SDR. That's not a controversial statement. Of course SDR should still be weighted heavily!
Yes, but most people do not drop $5000-6000 on a display every single year or two upgrading as often as the professional calibrators here, who need to keep up with all the current displays for their business. Lots of people that invest that kind of money in a flagship display expect to keep it for 5-7 years or even more.

So for some, it does make sense to weigh not only the current HDR environment, but where one expects HDR to be in the coming years. Displays that have much greater peak-brightness capability, do not suffer from image retention/uneven wear issues and color-volume dilution from a big fat white subpixel, could very well age like a fine wine and look better and better each year as bright dazzling HDR content becomes more commonplace, while burn-in or uneven wear on OLED could become an issue as a greater percentage of HDR content/gaming is viewed.

Might be better to get the cheaper 2017 LG OLED to save a chunk of change for upgrading in a year or two when OLED does HFR, HDMI 2.1, better HDR etc.

Anyway, I think the Z9D and the A1E are both overpriced. I only picked up the Z9D because I got mine used for 40% of MSRP. The thousands I saved not paying top dollar allow me to justify buying a 2017 OLED to go along with my Z9D.

I am not sure the Sony is worth the extra price. I may have to pick up the much more reasonably priced LG.

I am waiting for HDTVtest to give us the skinny on the A1E vs. the C7, since they have both in for review. They are the only ones I trust to give it to us straight, since they were not in denial about all the problems with 2016 LG OLED, but they did the best job of highlighting the weaknesses with 2016 LG OLED, when others completely missed or glossed over these real deal-breaking flaws.

If HDTVtest says the Sony OLED is no better or barely better than the LG, I will probably save money and get the 2017 LG OLED, unless a deal can be had on the Sony, since I would appreciate the superior acoustic surface sound feature, which would work well in the office or bedroom, where I do not want to bother with a full external sound system.

Still waiting for side by side review of A1E vs. Z9D with 1000+ nit content, not dull and lackluster content 500 nits or less.
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post #3932 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 07:04 AM
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Their reposting pictures doesn't negate the validity of their review. Don't jump to conclusions. Did CR also repost pix that made their reviews unreliable?
"Reposting" is a very kind way of putting it. You're missing something important: the fact is that the first picture in question is not even what they purport it to be (a C7), so that immediately does negate its validity.

And seriously, using stock pictures from the manufacturer is one thing, but you don't ever post pictures belonging to other review websites in any legitimate review you write without at least crediting them, period.

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You see this is what happens, the only 'reputable' reviews are those that support one's argument. Objective people take all the reviews and look for commonality (and there is commonality in several reviews).
Indeed...

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Originally Posted by Ken Ross
So here we have yet another review which supports what I've said...
Sony A1E 4K HDR OLED TV Thread (No Price Talk)

People can try and claim they're being objective all day long.

I will say this, it's pretty obvious what side of the line many people are on in this thread.
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post #3933 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 07:09 AM
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Originally Posted by zAndy12 View Post
Does anyone have lala land uhd bluray? Interested in what this scene looks like just after 17 mins, the pic is from my lg e6 oled. Can you get the A1 to look anything like this by adjusting the brightness or is it clean regardless of settings? On my E6 it's a mess of moving coloured bands either side of Emma Stone but I can make it look ok by reducing the brightness 2 clicks from my calibrated value of 51, I'm just interested whether the Sony can make it look this bad as well...
Attachment 2145466

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
Andy, I think that's indicative of some bit-starved content and how near black is manifested on the 2016s. I almost never see it on Blu-Rays, have never seen it on a UHD Blu-Ray (although I don't have LaLa Land), but are more likely to see it on some of the bit-starved satellite channels.

I believe this has been improved on the 2017s, and since Sony is using a 2017 LG panel, I'd expect to see these improvements on both the 2017 Sonys & LGs.
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post #3934 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by ValkyrieStation View Post
"Reposting" is a very kind way of putting it. You're missing something important: the fact is that the first picture in question is not even what they purport it to be (a C7), so that immediately does negate its validity.

And seriously, using stock pictures from the manufacturer is one thing, but you don't ever post pictures belonging to other review websites in any legitimate review you write without at least crediting them, period.

Indeed...

Sony A1E 4K HDR OLED TV Thread (No Price Talk)

People can try and claim they're being objective all day long.

I will say this, it's pretty obvious what side of the line many people are on in this thread.
And that kind of thing happens on both sides, doesn't it?
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post #3935 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by TVFanMTV View Post
You may also want to listen to people (some are over here) who have different opinion.

I am in a boat where I am deciding between 55" versions of LG C7, Sony A1E and LG E7. At this moment in my search I am leaning towards LG C7 because I keep wondering what is so drastically better in A1E over C7 for me to pay extra $1200.

I may get LG C7 this time and then wait for 2018 Sony OLED to see what versions come out and if Sony really addresses issues raised this year.

You should note Rtings suggestion is to buy cheaper one of C7 and A1E since there is nothing according to them that could justify paying $1200 or $1500 extra for A1E.

CNET has also choosen C7 as a TV to beat and will be comparing A1E against it soon. I am waiting for their, Caleb from digital trends and Scott Wilkinson's opinion before I pull the trigger sometime next month.

Now things could be different if I were to somehow get a $1500 best buy gift card.
It's interesting that some people are waiting for someone to tell them that the Sony is worth the extra $1,200 over the LG like something magical is going to appear The Sony is only worth the extra money if the differences in the sound, form factor, and PQ are important to you since the two sets are "essentially" the same. You just need to decide if you like Sony's or LG's picture processing better. If you are totally price driven, get the LG. If you are not, and the "overall" Sony PQ appears better to you as may owners are talking about after comparing the two in real life with different content, then the Sony is for you. Done
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post #3936 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 07:22 AM
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Originally Posted by zAndy12 View Post
Does anyone have lala land uhd bluray? Interested in what this scene looks like just after 17 mins, the pic is from my lg e6 oled. Can you get the A1 to look anything like this by adjusting the brightness or is it clean regardless of settings? On my E6 it's a mess of moving coloured bands either side of Emma Stone but I can make it look ok by reducing the brightness 2 clicks from my calibrated value of 51, I'm just interested whether the Sony can make it look this bad as well...
Attachment 2145466

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
On Blu-Ray.com a couple of people had similar issues with that scene on the 2016's. Have not heard about it on the 2017 models, maybe Al can take a pic for you?
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post #3937 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by dominica View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by zAndy12 View Post
Does anyone have lala land uhd bluray? Interested in what this scene looks like just after 17 mins, the pic is from my lg e6 oled. Can you get the A1 to look anything like this by adjusting the brightness or is it clean regardless of settings? On my E6 it's a mess of moving coloured bands either side of Emma Stone but I can make it look ok by reducing the brightness 2 clicks from my calibrated value of 51, I'm just interested whether the Sony can make it look this bad as well...
2145466

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
On Blu-Ray.com a couple of people had similar issues with that scene on the 2016's. Have not heard about it on the 2017 models, maybe Al can take a pic for you?
I'm in Covenant now and will be out with my guys for the day.. I'll look into it when I'm back at my A1.
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post #3938 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 08:04 AM
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Seen the Sony a1 side by side with the c7 -
Sony had better accurate colour out of box when compared to LG c7.
The motion was also better on sonys.
Viewed free view uk. and 4k demos ( not on vivid) and the picture on the Sony was better very hard to explain - it had more detail in areas where lg didn't. It's was clear who had the best overall picture and I believe it's due to sonys processing which has always been ahead of LG.
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post #3939 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 08:41 AM
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Yes, but most people do not drop $5000-6000 on a display every single year or two upgrading as often as the professional calibrators here, who need to keep up with all the current displays for their business. Lots of people that invest that kind of money in a flagship display expect to keep it for 5-7 years or even more.

So for some, it does make sense to weigh not only the current HDR environment, but where one expects HDR to be in the coming years. Displays that have much greater peak-brightness capability, do not suffer from image retention/uneven wear issues and color-volume dilution from a big fat white subpixel, could very well age like a fine wine and look better and better each year as bright dazzling HDR content becomes more commonplace, while burn-in or uneven wear on OLED could become an issue as a greater percentage of HDR content/gaming is viewed.
I get what you're saying, but it's still true that there's not a ton of HDR content yet, and it remains to be seen how quickly content providers will adopt HDR. For streaming and video games, I think adoption will be rapid. For other media, who knows? There's still far more SDR content out there, and OLED is the undisputed king of SDR.

You're right about the color volume dilution, of course. But it's a matter of "pick your poison". I saw the Q9/Q8 in-person, and while they are extremely bright, they washed out darker areas with maxed-out backlight to achieve that brightness. Clearly FALD TVs with many zones can do a better job of providing brighter highlights while preserving deeper colors with HDR, but it seems that FALD is going the way of the dodo bird

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Might be better to get the cheaper 2017 LG OLED to save a chunk of change for upgrading in a year or two when OLED does HFR, HDMI 2.1, better HDR etc.

Anyway, I think the Z9D and the A1E are both overpriced. I only picked up the Z9D because I got mine used for 40% of MSRP. The thousands I saved not paying top dollar allow me to justify buying a 2017 OLED to go along with my Z9D.

I am not sure the Sony is worth the extra price. I may have to pick up the much more reasonably priced LG.
That's the same choice I wrestled with. The A1E is gorgeous but so are the 2017 LGs.

Agreed 100% about the Z9D and A1E both being overpriced. That was my main criticism against the Z9D. It has a few flaws, but it's overall a great set (best LCD ever). The pricing was just too high. I think the A1E could stand to drop just a little more as well. Again, it's a gorgeous set, but just a little bit too pricey. edit- if you can get use out of the acoustic surface sound, then you should go with the A1E. It's probably worth the price difference. You won't find a better TV from a sound perspective this year.

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post #3940 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 09:04 AM
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Watching BvS last night with my very good buddy, duel and doomsday scenes.. He asked if I could turn down the brightness.. I told him would he believe there were people in a forum that believed the A1E wasn't bright enough.. I showed him these posts..

He didn't believe it.. guy is not a videophile so his reaction to the sentiment I wont share..
one possible reason is most hdr is mastered for 5nits ambient light, which is about the same as candle light.

Anyway it's good to get more perspectives so thanks for sharing that.
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post #3941 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 09:39 AM
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It's interesting that some people are waiting for someone to tell them that the Sony is worth the extra $1,200 over the LG like something magical is going to appear The Sony is only worth the extra money if the differences in the sound, form factor, and PQ are important to you since the two sets are "essentially" the same. You just need to decide if you like Sony's or LG's picture processing better.
That is it in a nutshell........
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post #3942 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 09:48 AM
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Speaking of @lalaland , check out the opening scene. Specifically, when the camera pans from 1 car to the next. I talked with @AlLeong about this as well. My neighbor has the W7, and no matter what we did in menu/motion, we could NOT get rid of the judder. A1E, with proper settings, resolves judder-free!!!

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post #3943 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 09:56 AM
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-snip So I'm assuming there's no way to separate the box as in the 77" LG OLED or is there?
I am not sure if anyone answered but from older posts this is not possible with the A1E. Maybe wait for 2018 when all OLED will look like the LG-W7, I hope!
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post #3944 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 10:23 AM
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Speaking of @lalaland , check out the opening scene. Specially, when the camera pans from 1 car to the next. I talked with @AlLeong about this as well. My neighbor has the W7, and no matter what we did in menu/motion, we could NOT get rid of the judder. A1E, with proper settings, resolves judder-free!!!
This talk about lala land and judder? We sure it's not the vomit about to come up watching this film??

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post #3945 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 11:01 AM
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I am not sure if anyone answered but from older posts this is not possible with the A1E. Maybe wait for 2018 when all OLED will look like the LG-W7, I hope!
Thanks Tanman, I hadn't heard that. That's too bad and really detracts from the beauty of wall-mounting. LG's approach is much better IMO. I doubt many people are going to buy a 77" and keep it on a stand. Personally I find that stand really ugly, but that's a subjective thing.

As for waiting until next year, I'd really like to bite the bullet this year. We'll see.
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post #3946 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 11:14 AM
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Just purchased the 65 inch for delivery on Tuesday at my local Best Buy. Looking forward to seeing the 'magic dust' I've read so much about haha. I'm coming from a 65EF9500 so it will be interesting to see how much better the A1E is compared to the 2015 LG OLED.
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post #3947 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 12:02 PM
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Just purchased the 65 inch for delivery on Tuesday at my local Best Buy. Looking forward to seeing the 'magic dust' I've read so much about haha. I'm coming from a 65EF9500 so it will be interesting to see how much better the A1E is compared to the 2015 LG OLED.
It's drastic!
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post #3948 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 12:56 PM
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It's drastic!
EF9500 is so right,there are major differences with the "old" LG...Sony A1 has marvellous pictures at the time,mine has got 5 days now
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post #3949 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 01:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by MrSniper1401 View Post
Just purchased the 65 inch for delivery on Tuesday at my local Best Buy. Looking forward to seeing the 'magic dust' I've read so much about haha. I'm coming from a 65EF9500 so it will be interesting to see how much better the A1E is compared to the 2015 LG OLED.
i had a 2015 LG OLED. I bought the Sony over the new LG because of the WAC factor and the need for table mount. If it hadn't been for the HDR feature, I would not have bought at all. Can't say the Sony is that different than the 2015 LG.
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post #3950 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by zAndy12 View Post
Does anyone have lala land uhd bluray? Interested in what this scene looks like just after 17 mins, the pic is from my lg e6 oled. Can you get the A1 to look anything like this by adjusting the brightness or is it clean regardless of settings? On my E6 it's a mess of moving coloured bands either side of Emma Stone but I can make it look ok by reducing the brightness 2 clicks from my calibrated value of 51, I'm just interested whether the Sony can make it look this bad as well...
Attachment 2145466

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
I placed my A1 in Cinema Pro mode as would be found out-the-box with ACE off.

I adjusted the black level from 50 (default) to 70 to match the specification one would be looking for to get maximum visibility of shadow details.
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post #3951 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by MrSniper1401 View Post
Just purchased the 65 inch for delivery on Tuesday at my local Best Buy. Looking forward to seeing the 'magic dust' I've read so much about haha. I'm coming from a 65EF9500 so it will be interesting to see how much better the A1E is compared to the 2015 LG OLED.
I came, firstly, from LG55EC9300, then secondly the 65b6. A1e, imho, is the best I've ever owned.

And once you download latest f/w upd8, just set to CinemaPro and good luck removing jaw from floor. It's that good
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post #3952 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 01:16 PM
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I came, firstly, from LG55EC9300, then secondly the 65b6. A1e, imho, is the best I've ever owned.

And once you download latest f/w upd8, just set to CinemaPro and good luck removing jaw from floor. It's that good
Here in Europe we still ain't got the update with Android 7...hope to try it soon
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Can anyone tell me what UC1 vs UC2 means? I've seen both on online sites, the UC1 or 2, coming in the model # after the A1E. For example, XBR-65A1E UC1.

Thanks
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post #3954 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 02:10 PM
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I placed my A1 in Cinema Pro mode as would be found out-the-box with ACE off.

I adjusted the black level from 50 (default) to 70 to match the specification one would be looking for to get maximum visibility of shadow details.
Both look bad for different reasons. I still see some near black issues on the Sony, but not as bad as the LG. However the Sony's color is much too hyped and too pink and the shadow level detail is worse on the Sony.

Andy's picture looks to be better calibrated. It also looks like Andy's picture is more zoomed than the Sony.
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post #3955 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 02:26 PM
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Both look bad for different reasons. I still see some near black issues on the Sony, but not as bad as the LG. However the Sony's color is much too hyped and too pink and the shadow level detail is worse on the Sony.

Andy's picture looks to be better calibrated. It also looks like Andy's picture is more zoomed than the Sony.
There is a difference in black level uniformity performance especially moving towards the left side of the picture. The user was focused on black level. Here the A1E clearly shows a difference between in-frame black levels and the darker black bar levels.

This is reference performance. When you can clearly see the difference in black bar performance and no blend/crush into in frame blacks. This is where there's a vast difference between what I see in black handling from the A1E and LG OLEDs.

Pinkish flesh tones and golden hair is also more prevalent.. less blue dress and leaning towards purple/blue, this is out-the-box performance with a LED black level-like setting. The A1E here looks more warm like Plasma where the E6 looks 100% OLED.

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post #3956 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 03:21 PM
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Does anyone have lala land uhd bluray? Interested in what this scene looks like just after 17 mins, the pic is from my lg e6 oled. Can you get the A1 to look anything like this by adjusting the brightness or is it clean regardless of settings? On my E6 it's a mess of moving coloured bands either side of Emma Stone but I can make it look ok by reducing the brightness 2 clicks from my calibrated value of 51, I'm just interested whether the Sony can make it look this bad as well...
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Hi

I tested La La land on BD and with brightness 51 i did not see anything like that on my B6,even brightness 52 was good,but 53 i could see the coloured bands but not so much as in your picture,to see it like your picture i need brightness 55.
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post #3957 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 03:30 PM
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Hi

I tested La La land on BD and with brightness 51 i did not see anything like that on my B6,even brightness 52 was good,but 53 i could see the coloured bands but not so much as in your picture,to see it like your picture i need brightness 55.
Not sure the BD has the same issue as the uhd, i meant to check tonight but didn't get round to it, thanks for checking it out anyway

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post #3958 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 04:01 PM
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Not sure the BD has the same issue as the uhd, i meant to check tonight but didn't get round to it, thanks for checking it out anyway

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The BD version doesn't have the same problem. I noticed the same thing on my set too on that very scene in HDR. I checked the scene on the BD and it didn't show it. I think it's something to do with the disc itself, although it just might be more visible on 2016 LG OLEDs?

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post #3959 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 04:02 PM
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The BD version doesn't have the same problem. I noticed the same thing on my set too on that very scene in HDR. I checked the scene on the BD and it didn't show it. I think it's something to do with the disc itself, although it just might be more visible on 2016 LG OLEDs?
Sorry what TV do you have? The E6 or the Sony? Cheers

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post #3960 of 6402 Old 05-19-2017, 04:04 PM
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sorry what tv do you have? The e6 or the sony? Cheers

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