Early 1080p adopters beware: CES 2006 does not look good - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by assJack1
Thanks. I realize cable card is only a few bucks, but "a few bucks" it all adds up across the household budget. You know insurance, phone, mortgage, cable, and yikes baby food! :)
Absolutly. And with TWC using SDV now....cable cards are worthless.
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post #92 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:08 AM
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D-Nice:

Have you come across anymore adoption info on HDMI v1.3? I read somewhere (not here) that the spec will be released around March. But the Silicon Image news is positive:

http://www.siliconimage.com/news/pre...se.aspx?id=349
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post #93 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by essogas
There's no denying that 1080P will offer the best PQ. My problem is waiting. WHEN will we have one that is reasonably priced and has all the bugs worked out? My guess is a decent 2 years, and that's too long for me too wait.

Moreover, 1080P content will dwell in the realm of recorder media and will NEVER rear it's head over broadcast. The broadcast standards are finalized and it's 1080i. The one reasurring thing is more and more content is being produced and originated at 1920X1080.

For me, I'm moving forward on a 720P 8th generation plasma that I know will look amazing with EVERYTHING I throw at it and I know it will never be obsolete. When I see 1080P plasmas that are at the price of current sets, I will upgrade again. Who knows though, in a few months when I go to buy, after the smoke has cleared we will all have a better view of HD landscape.
Yes, in a perfect world 1080p displays will render the best picture. BUT....this is the real world.

When BR and HD-DVD drop, what percent of the movies do you actually think will be pristine transfers? You can use DVD and D-Theater as reference points.

Will 1080p displays be able to "correctly" deinterlace a 1080i picture? Remember, some of the current 1080p ones (Westinghouse, Sharp) cannot.

If you have a satellite provider, do you really think you need a 1080p display (forgot about HD-Lite)?

I think these were some of the questions markrubin and Ken were trying to get across. If you think that you can take one of the CES 1080p displays home and enjoy the same reference quality pictures with your current HD capability and your future HD-DVD/BR player, you may need to goto rehab.

As the late Rick James would say:

"Cocaine is a helluva drug!!!"
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post #94 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by optivity
Does this mean our Cable providers will support Tivo HD time shift recording using a two-way CableCARD? Or are we buying another fancy toy that we can’t really use?
It appears that the new TiVo box will do everything you'd want to do with a HD DVR as a cable subscriber but have the usability of TiVo as opposed to the knock offs that the cable companies are offering today. For my money the Moto box I am renting offers a great set of features but the user interface is not TiVo. The box itself has many glitches that make it less than anjoyable to use. However, at this time it's all that is available for people that are cable subscribers that got used to time shifting programs and want to do that with HD content.

Click here to see the TiVo Series 3 Announcement
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post #95 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:18 AM
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As a reminder, primer, or refresher to some new folks here, I am cut and pasting some information and links about HDMI. This was originally posted by an AVS forum user holl_ands at hdtv.forsandiego.com. It's excellent information to know and have in your back pocket:






1. Backward compatibility with DVI defines the current "state of the art":
http://www.ddwg.org/lib/dvi_10.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dvi
Most (all?) current DVI implementations are limited to 8-bits per color channel (aka 24-bit color), single-link connector operations. Support for greater than 24-bit color is mentioned as a future expansion which would require a dual-link capability but was not included in the DVI 1.0 spec.

So DVI is limited to 24-bit color, which only requires single-link operation via Type A connector. Which pretty much means that any HDMI interface designed for backward compatibility with DVI, is also limited to 24-bit color.
[No, you can't just connect the single-link, 24-bit DVI interface to just one-half of a dual-link HDMI when it's operating with greater than 24-bit color.]




2. HDMI overviews:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI
Note this article claims Type B connector is intended to support resolutions higher than 1080i.
http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/...rfaceguide.php
He claims 165 Mpixel/sec bandwidth is sufficient for 1080p.
[BUT, that would be limited to 24-bit color and not the expanded color pallets expected with HD-DVD/BLU-RAY.]




3. HDMI v.1.0, v.1.1 and new v.1.2 specs currently describe (see section 4) two different connectors. Type A single-link with 19-pins (up to 165 MHz bandwidth) and slightly wider Type B double-link with 29 pins (above 165 MHz):
http://www.hdmi.org/pdf/HDMISpecInfo...nalVersion.pdf
http://www.hdmi.org/download/HDMI_Specification_1.1.pdf
http://www.hdmi.org/download/HDMI_Specification_1.2.pdf
HDMI specs allow for RGB mode with 8-bits per color channel (24-bit color) and YCbCr mode with either 8-bits, 10-bits or 12-bits per color channel (24-bit, 30-bit and 36-bit color). Unfortunately the spec doesn't calculate the bandwidth requirements for these modes, nor does it say that dual-link operations might be required.




4. The recently approved (23Aug05) HDMI Spec v.1.2 adds SACD and a few tweaks for computer interfaces, but does not increase interface bandwidth or change existing 1080p sections found in v.1.1:

http://www.hdmi.org/press/pr/pr_20050823.asp




5. Dolby Labs announced the upcoming HDMI Spec v.1.3 will include even more advanced audio codecs such as Dolby Digital Plus and lossless Dolby TrueHD:

http://www.dolby.com/professional/pr...hnologies.html
http://www.dolby.com/professional/pr...tions_dvd.html

(It should be noted that HDMI v1.2a was finalized at the end of Dec 05).




6. Silicon Image (HDMI chip supplier for Samsung, et.al) lists many HDMI chips that claim 1080p (requiring 150 to 165 MHz bandwidth). But when you check the individual brochures, clarification is (sometimes) found that 1080p only applies for display on PC (unencrypted) and not DTV (with HDCP encryption):
http://www.siliconimage.com/products...mily.aspx?id=1
http://www.siliconimage.com/docs/SiI-PB-0016.pdf
Note that listed 1080i chips only require 81 MHz.
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post #96 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by assJack1
D-Nice:

Have you come across anymore adoption info on HDMI v1.3? I read somewhere (not here) that the spec will be released around March. But the Silicon Image news is positive:

http://www.siliconimage.com/news/pre...se.aspx?id=349
Yeah, I saw that news release. It looks like they are ahead of schedule. Very good news.
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post #97 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
Yes, in a perfect world 1080p displays will render the best picture. BUT....this is the real world.

When BR and HD-DVD drop, what percent of the movies do you actually think will be pristine transfers? You can use DVD and D-Theater are reference points.

Will 1080p displays be able to "correctly" deinterlace a 1080i picture? Remember, some of the current 1080p ones (Westinghouse, Sharp) cannot.

If you have a satellite provider, do you really think you need a 1080p display (forgot about HD-Lite)?

I think these were some of the questions markrubin and Ken were trying to get across. If you think that you can take one of the CES 1080p displays home and enjoy the same reference quality pictures with your current HD capability and your future HD-DVD/BR player, you may need to goto rehab.

As the late Rick James would say:

"Cocaine is a helluva drug!!!"
I think you read my post too fast because I'm in complete agreement with you and the others. 1080P content is way too early and I think money invested in it now will go wasted.
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post #98 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by essogas
I think you read my post too fast because I'm in complete agreement with you and the others. 1080P content is way too early and I think money invested in it now will go wasted.
No, I wasn't trying to bash you. I just wanted to add on to what you said.
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post #99 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by essogas
... 1080P content is way too early and I think money invested in it now will go wasted.
I read your orignal post. If you realize that OTA, cable, and Sat will not be broadcasting 1080p content for eons and that BR or any other film based 1080i signal can get you 1080p then its not a waste. Also, don't forget about the horizontal increase in resoluition.
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post #100 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
Yes, in a perfect world 1080p displays will render the best picture. BUT....this is the real world.

When BR and HD-DVD drop, what percent of the movies do you actually think will be pristine transfers? You can use DVD and D-Theater are reference points.

Will 1080p displays be able to "correctly" deinterlace a 1080i picture? Remember, some of the current 1080p ones (Westinghouse, Sharp) cannot.

If you have a satellite provider, do you really think you need a 1080p display (forgot about HD-Lite)?

I think these were some of the questions markrubin and Ken were trying to get across. If you think that you can take one of the CES 1080p displays home and enjoy the same reference quality pictures with your current HD capability and your future HD-DVD/BR player, you may need to goto rehab.

As the late Rick James would say:

"Cocaine is a helluva drug!!!"
Where did you get the information that the Westinghouse can't deinterlace 1080i properly?

According to this review, the Westinghouse 37" does deinterlace 1080i properly:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=608670
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post #101 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rysa4
In short, I dont quite share the sit on the sidelines if you want to purchase a new 1080P display that Ken and Mark posted on. But the reason is that I think people should buy the best hardware ( if reasonably priced relative to options) if they have already decided to purchase. However, its obvious that the industry at each chain point is moving at different speeds. No surprise at all.
Of course you had the advantage of seeing these setups that I didn't. But, the rationale of visual acuity and added resolution in a 50" set still holds. Physics is what it is. My main points are a) what was the CONTENT you watched on these 1080p sets and b) did you see any of the material (D*/Dish) which will comprise the vast majority of viewing for many/most of this group.

I will contend that HD DVD/Blu-Ray will comprise a minority of the viewing time for most. As I stated in an earlier post, the Qualia 70" (which is still the best display I've seen FOR 1080p material) unquestionably looked better than my Fujitsu plasma WITH the Blu-Ray demo disc. However, once this unit was fed the SAME signal by plasma was fed, the picture was no longer better (to my eyes) than the Fujitsu....it looked worse.

So if I were to buy a new 1080p display today or in the near future, it damn well better produce AT LEAST as good a picture with TODAY'S material that my current plasma can. As we've read, the forecast for 1080p software to play on these new sets is very very bleak. It will be Blu-Ray/HD DVD and that's about it....yes, I'm not including gaming which I'm well aware some members are into big. For me that's a non-issue and is a factor that must be considered by other members for whom gaming is not important. Add to that the BIG unknown about how good 'everyday' Blu-Ray/HD DVD will be, and we have many unanswered questions. D-Theater has shown that regardless of format, inconsistency rules.
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post #102 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 10:58 AM
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Don't forget in the real world, gaming is also unlikely to be ever produced at 1080P for the PS3. It will come down to Blu-ray and HD-DVD which will also take longer to catch on than DVD as consumers will have to first decide what format to go with. Bleak.
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post #103 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by assJack1
As a reminder, primer, or refresher to some new folks here, I am cut and pasting some information and links about HDMI. This was originally posted by an AVS forum user holl_ands at hdtv.forsandiego.com. It's excellent information to know and have in your back pocket:






1. Backward compatibility with DVI defines the current "state of the art":
http://www.ddwg.org/lib/dvi_10.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dvi
Most (all?) current DVI implementations are limited to 8-bits per color channel (aka 24-bit color), single-link connector operations. Support for greater than 24-bit color is mentioned as a future expansion which would require a dual-link capability but was not included in the DVI 1.0 spec.

So DVI is limited to 24-bit color, which only requires single-link operation via Type A connector. Which pretty much means that any HDMI interface designed for backward compatibility with DVI, is also limited to 24-bit color.
[No, you can't just connect the single-link, 24-bit DVI interface to just one-half of a dual-link HDMI when it's operating with greater than 24-bit color.]




2. HDMI overviews:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI
Note this article claims Type B connector is intended to support resolutions higher than 1080i.
http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/...rfaceguide.php
He claims 165 Mpixel/sec bandwidth is sufficient for 1080p.
[BUT, that would be limited to 24-bit color and not the expanded color pallets expected with HD-DVD/BLU-RAY.]




3. HDMI v.1.0, v.1.1 and new v.1.2 specs currently describe (see section 4) two different connectors. Type A single-link with 19-pins (up to 165 MHz bandwidth) and slightly wider Type B double-link with 29 pins (above 165 MHz):
http://www.hdmi.org/pdf/HDMISpecInfo...nalVersion.pdf
http://www.hdmi.org/download/HDMI_Specification_1.1.pdf
http://www.hdmi.org/download/HDMI_Specification_1.2.pdf
HDMI specs allow for RGB mode with 8-bits per color channel (24-bit color) and YCbCr mode with either 8-bits, 10-bits or 12-bits per color channel (24-bit, 30-bit and 36-bit color). Unfortunately the spec doesn't calculate the bandwidth requirements for these modes, nor does it say that dual-link operations might be required.




4. The recently approved (23Aug05) HDMI Spec v.1.2 adds SACD and a few tweaks for computer interfaces, but does not increase interface bandwidth or change existing 1080p sections found in v.1.1:

http://www.hdmi.org/press/pr/pr_20050823.asp




5. Dolby Labs announced the upcoming HDMI Spec v.1.3 will include even more advanced audio codecs such as Dolby Digital Plus and lossless Dolby TrueHD:

http://www.dolby.com/professional/pr...hnologies.html
http://www.dolby.com/professional/pr...tions_dvd.html

(It should be noted that HDMI v1.2a was finalized at the end of Dec 05).




6. Silicon Image (HDMI chip supplier for Samsung, et.al) lists many HDMI chips that claim 1080p (requiring 150 to 165 MHz bandwidth). But when you check the individual brochures, clarification is (sometimes) found that 1080p only applies for display on PC (unencrypted) and not DTV (with HDCP encryption):
http://www.siliconimage.com/products...mily.aspx?id=1
http://www.siliconimage.com/docs/SiI-PB-0016.pdf
Note that listed 1080i chips only require 81 MHz.
AssJack1 - Thanks much. :cool:
Question: Is this worthy of a "Sticky" for a future reference point since this does impact on many variables and other decisions?
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post #104 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross
Of course you had the advantage of seeing these setups that I didn't. But, the rationale of visual acuity and added resolution in a 50" set still holds. Physics is what it is. My main points are a) what was the CONTENT you watched on these 1080p sets and b) did you see any of the material (D*/Dish) which will comprise the vast majority of viewing for many/most of this group.

I will contend that HD DVD/Blu-Ray will comprise a minority of the viewing time for most. As I stated in an earlier post, the Qualia 70" (which is still the best display I've seen FOR 1080p material) unquestionably looked better than my Fujitsu plasma WITH the Blu-Ray demo disc. However, once this unit was fed the SAME signal by plasma was fed, the picture was no longer better (to my eyes) than the Fujitsu....it looked worse.

So if I were to buy a new 1080p display today or in the near future, it damn well better produce AT LEAST as good a picture with TODAY'S material that my current plasma can. As we've read, the forecast for 1080p software to play on these new sets is very very bleak. It will be Blu-Ray/HD DVD and that's about it....yes, I'm not including gaming which I'm well aware some members are into big. For me that's a non-issue and is a factor that must be considered by other members for whom gaming is not important. Add to that the BIG unknown about how good 'everyday' Blu-Ray/HD DVD will be, and we have many unanswered questions. D-Theater has shown that regardless of format, inconsistency rules.
Thanks for the response. Pioneer has 50 inch displays that look better today than last years because they changed their pixel cell depth and plastered their color filter on the first layer of glass due to decreased heat generation. Their panels look better. Panasonic, as they stated to me, also changed the physical structure of their pixels in creating a 50 inch 1080P display. While not a "new technology", this type of change can change the PQ relative to a different type of pixel on a previous display. This type of change indicates that the chance of an identical PQ occurring is small at best. BUT granted, the feed was from a hard drive and not a bluray disc, and certainly not Comcast/sat etc. That would be a laugh no doubt and I get your point clearly. Non High def signals could look awful on a 1080P display. Boy aint that the truth!!!

AS far as "most people" I would argue that a significant minority set up home theaters for DVD playback. For me its 100%. And Comcast etc will NEVER carry a 1920 x 1080 signal. It IS largely about bluray/HD-DVD for a LOT of people!! The format "war" unfortunately is a huge loser for all of this. Like I said, if 1080P players were out there at 400 bucks and hi def DVDs sold for about what they cost today, a 1080P display quickly becomes an easier transition, as everyone is used to DVDs and players as a matter of course. AS it stands, it will be awhile. Thats the real problem from my perspective.
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post #105 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rysa4

AS far as "most people" I would argue that a significant minority set up home theaters for DVD playback. For me its 100%. And Comcast etc will NEVER carry a 1920 x 1080 signal. It IS largely about bluray/HD-DVD for a LOT of people!! The format "war" unfortunately is a huge loser for all of this. Like I said, if 1080P players were out there at 400 bucks and hi def DVDs sold for about what they cost today, a 1080P display quickly becomes an easier transition, as everyone is used to DVDs and players as a matter of course. AS it stands, it will be awhile. Thats the real problem from my perspective.

In the race to the "new" DVD standard, does that mean the for playback purposes of what we already own, that they would be incompatible, or backwards compatable or totally incompatable? Would we need to maintain two dvds (one for the old format and one for the new) so that we do not have to rebuy all of the old ones in our personal libraries?

Would the powers that be consider producing a "dual" dvd (old and new) within one unit since the cost of the current (old, still in use dvd) has dropped so much in cost?

If this became the policy, does it then create that much of a problem for the upward migration once the intial fallout transition takes place?

Would it then be a workable fit into the 1080 display scene? or is it also a money issue?
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post #106 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvdmonster
I don't get this "we don't really need 1080p" bs at all.
I suggest you re-read this thread. That is NOT what we are saying. We ARE saying that we need sufficient 1080p software/broadcasts and better interfaces for the hardware. That's quite different than saying 'we don't really need 1080p' don't you think?
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post #107 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 11:38 AM
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The newly announced Toshiba HD-DVD player supports DVD and CD:

Details:
» plays HD DVD high-definition discs (selectable 720p/1080i output available through HDMI output only — HDMI cable included)
» plays DVD-Video, DVD-R & DVD-RW, and DVD-RAM
» plays CD, audio CD-R & CD-RW, and MP3 and WMA CD-R & CD-RW
» selectable 720p/1080i video upconversion for DVD (upconverted video available through HDMI output only)
» built-in audio decoding for Dolby® Digital, Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby TrueHD lossless (2-ch.), DTS® and DTS-HD lossless
» HDMI digital output (combines video and multichannel audio with HDCP copy protection)
» 1 set of A/V outputs (composite video, S-video, and 480i/480p component video)
» stereo and 5.1-channel audio outputs
» coaxial and optical digital audio outputs
» Ethernet port for access to Internet-based content
» remote control (multibrand for TV)
» 216MHz/11-bit video D/A converter
» multichannel 192kHz/24-bit audio D/A converters
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post #108 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by essogas
For me, I'm moving forward on a 720P 8th generation plasma that I know will look amazing with EVERYTHING I throw at it and I know it will never be obsolete.

And I think that's the key point. We know a 720P plasma will look great with everything, but how will a typical 1080p display look with NON 1080p material? That's the crux of my argument. Based on my observations of the Qualia, it's no slam dunk.
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post #109 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snappa
It appears that the new TiVo box will do everything you'd want to do with a HD DVR as a cable subscriber but have the usability of TiVo as opposed to the knock offs that the cable companies are offering today. For my money the Moto box I am renting offers a great set of features but the user interface is not TiVo. The box itself has many glitches that make it less than anjoyable to use. However, at this time it's all that is available for people that are cable subscribers that got used to time shifting programs and want to do that with HD content.

Click here to see the TiVo Series 3 Announcement
As such, the Tivo then acts as an additional tuner(s) with better quality/ability to use the 720 or 1080 output onto the plasm? Also does that then require additional HDMI inputs or other sources to then be sent into the Monitor?

From the Series 3 link above it says:
Quote:
The Series3 will include two tuners, combining NTSC, ATSC and QAM. That means that both SD and HD video can be recorded from over-the-air sources or via cable. By adding CableCard support, the Series3 will be able to record protected HD content from premium channels, including HBO HD, ESPN HD, and more.
Does this mean it bypasses the encription (ergo no $ for the cable co??), or that it will allow you to then be able to record the premium channel if you subscribe to the Cable Co for that additional priviledge?
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post #110 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adm
In the race to the "new" DVD standard, does that mean the for playback purposes of what we already own, that they would be incompatible, or backwards compatable or totally incompatable? Would we need to maintain two dvds (one for the old format and one for the new) so that we do not have to rebuy all of the old ones in our personal libraries?

Would the powers that be consider producing a "dual" dvd (old and new) within one unit since the cost of the current (old, still in use dvd) has dropped so much in cost?

If this became the policy, does it then create that much of a problem for the upward migration once the intial fallout transition takes place?

Would it then be a workable fit into the 1080 display scene? or is it also a money issue?
HD- DVDs can be stamped with the HD dvd on one side and the regular DVD type on the other. Both will play in the HD-DVD compatible machines. It is my understanding that all new players will play the old formats as well.
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post #111 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross
And I think that's the key point. We know a 720P plasma will look great with everything, but how will a typical 1080p display look with NON 1080p material? That's the crux of my argument. Based on my observations of the Qualia, it's no slam dunk.
One of the interesting things to come out of this discussion is that in a year or two we could have 1080P displays that are awesome with high def DVDs but with no comparable signal partner on the cable satellite side. Then folks will have to choose based on their own usage patterns.
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post #112 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 01:06 PM
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Thanks Rysa4
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post #113 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by snappa
Thanks for all the replies. I think I have my answer.

Can anyone with a solid 1080i 50 inch (or even a 60 plus inch) HD display actually say that they feel they're missing something? I've seen Plasma, LCD, DLP, and CRT RPTV at 1080i and never have I felt there to be anything lacking. Granted each of those technologies have their pros/cons but image sharpness when fed a good source signal has never been an issue I've ever seen.

I know this is a subjective thing and theory is that twice the resolution would give you a crisper picture. If that's true, great. I'll wait till there's source material before considering an upgrade based soley on the fact that the display can show 1080p.

Seeing the first TV capable of displaying a 480p signal was incredible. The clarity of the image and the detail was obvious. Seeing an HD signal on that same set was equally impressive.

I have see some of these 1080p displays and honestly have not seen the image quality increase. It could be that this is because there's no source material to really drive it. However, at this point in time it sounds like 1080p has reached the point of diminishing returns.

That said, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

I couldn't have said it better. I've been second guessing my decision to go ahead and pull the trigger on a Panny 50" ever since I bought it. But I ask myself that same question, can it get any better? I don't think that it can. I bought by PDP from CC, and they had the display model right next to an SXRD. I had to look REALLY hard to notice any difference, and in my opinion, it wasn't worth waiting for a 1080p PDP. It's tough to go by your eyes vs. the numbers, but that's what I've decided to do, and this thread confirms my decision.

If there is not much of a difference between SD and ED, ED and HD, and HD and 1080p, is there really that much of a difference between SD and 1080p?
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post #114 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Rysa4
On HDMI, I still don't get what HDMI 1.3 is going to add. SOmeone let me know. I thought HDMI 1.0 was video spec, 1.1 added audio, and 1.2 allowed certain menus to pass through. Someone educate me on this please.
People have been loosely substituting HDMI 1.3 for what in their minds means 1080p support. In reality HDMI 1.0 could support 1080p, just 1080p was an optional video format which many manufacturers did not support (some did). With HDMI 1.3 we have been told that more folks are including 1080p support so theoretically you should see more displays supporting 1080p input. There's more to 1080p than just the HDMI interface though, as there are internal video processing circuitry that may need to be upgraded also. Personally I wouldn't use HDMI 1.3 as a indicator of 1080p support. I would use the manufacturer's specs saying 1080p support as and indicator of 1080p support.

The main published feature HDMI 1.3 adds is newer multichannel audio formats. There is some talk of increased bit depth (but IMO the manufacturers aren't properly taking advantage of the current bit depth, let alone deeper bit depths) and better PC connectivity.
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post #115 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfhub
People have been loosely substituting HDMI 1.3 for what in their minds means 1080p support. In reality HDMI 1.0 could support 1080p, just 1080p was an optional video format which many manufacturers did not support (some did). With HDMI 1.3 we have been told that more folks are including 1080p support so theoretically you should see more displays supporting 1080p input. There's more to 1080p than just the HDMI interface though, as there are internal video processing circuitry that may need to be upgraded also. Personally I wouldn't use HDMI 1.3 as a indicator of 1080p support. I would use the manufacturer's specs saying 1080p support as and indicator of 1080p support.

The main published feature HDMI 1.3 adds is newer multichannel audio formats. There is some talk of increased bit depth (but IMO the manufacturers aren't properly taking advantage of the current bit depth, let alone deeper bit depths) and better PC connectivity.
Thank you.
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post #116 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 06:15 PM
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Here's a 1080p panel that was paired with a Blu-ray player to display 1080p native material at CES.
http://www.cnet.com/4831-11405_1-6412639.html?tag=img
The article doesn't say what version of HDMI the panel provides but it's my understanding that HDMI 1.3 isn't available yet so wouldn't this panel be a real life example to show that 1.3 is not being necessary for viewing 1080p DVDs over HDMI?
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post #117 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 06:20 PM
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Here's a 1080p panel that was paired with a Blu-ray player to display 1080p native material at CES.
http://www.cnet.com/4831-11405_1-6412639.html?tag=img
The article doesn't say what version of HDMI the panel provides but it's my understanding that HDMI 1.3 is not available yet so wouldn't this panel be a real life example showing that 1.3 is not necessary for viewing 1080p DVDs over HDMI?
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post #118 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 06:43 PM
 
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Originally Posted by D-Nice
TWC, the cable co that Optivity has, no longer provides the cable card at that price. They increased the price by 56% in December to $3.14 per month.
I didn't realize you were a spokesman for Albany Time Warner Cable :p

"How much will CableCARDâ„¢ cost?

The devices will be offered on a leased basis for $1.75 per month."
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post #119 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by optivity
I didn't realize you were a spokesman for Albany Time Warner Cable :p

"How much will CableCARDâ„¢ cost?

The devices will be offered on a leased basis for $1.75 per month."

I think you need to CHECK YOUR BILL.
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post #120 of 261 Old 01-08-2006, 06:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfhub
People have been loosely substituting HDMI 1.3 for what in their minds means 1080p support. In reality HDMI 1.0 could support 1080p, just 1080p was an optional video format which many manufacturers did not support (some did). With HDMI 1.3 we have been told that more folks are including 1080p support so theoretically you should see more displays supporting 1080p input. There's more to 1080p than just the HDMI interface though, as there are internal video processing circuitry that may need to be upgraded also. Personally I wouldn't use HDMI 1.3 as a indicator of 1080p support. I would use the manufacturer's specs saying 1080p support as and indicator of 1080p support.

The main published feature HDMI 1.3 adds is newer multichannel audio formats. There is some talk of increased bit depth (but IMO the manufacturers aren't properly taking advantage of the current bit depth, let alone deeper bit depths) and better PC connectivity.
HDMI v1.2 couldnt do 1080p w/ HDCP that means PC output only. Atleast that is what I have read. The main feature of v1.3 is increasing bandwidth to 225Mhz as opposed to 165Mhz.
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