OLED TVs: Technology Advancements Thread - Page 439 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Baselworld is only a few weeks away. Getting the latest news is easy, Click Here for info on how to join the Watchuseek.com newsletter list. Follow our team for updates featuring event coverage, new product unveilings, watch industry news & more!



Forum Jump: 
 890Likes
Reply
Thread Tools
post #13141 of 13163 Old 07-06-2016, 01:17 PM
AVS Special Member
 
8mile13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,533
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1208 Post(s)
Liked: 609
I believe it was 2017 they said.
8mile13 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #13142 of 13163 Old 07-06-2016, 01:40 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 2,203
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1258 Post(s)
Liked: 1014
Quote:
Originally Posted by greenland View Post
The vice president forecast that its inkjet printers can be deployed at the OLED production lines of global display makers, including Samsung Display, in two years.

Some market experts expected Samsung Display to throw its hat in the large-size OLED display market as early as early 2017.
So I guess they're running about a year behind schedule, though the date forecast seems a bit incongruous (if the printers won't be deployed for another 2 years, how can Samsung deliver a panel in 2017?).
video_analysis is online now  
post #13143 of 13163 Old 07-06-2016, 03:47 PM
Member
 
DrBoogie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 117
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 57 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by wco81 View Post
What other technologies?
I had some LG OLEDs before and now a proud owner of 65 inch E6. While OLED PQ will be unbeatable for at least several years, all I am saying is that mass market can't bear 25k TV. Even 10K TV is too expensive for most enthusiasts. Average Joe will go for 75 inch LED Vizio/Samsung/Sony for 3-5K and call it almost as good using then current marketing pitch about FALD, quantum dots, etc.

Last edited by DrBoogie; 07-06-2016 at 03:56 PM.
DrBoogie is offline  
post #13144 of 13163 Old 07-07-2016, 05:10 AM
AVS Special Member
 
slacker711's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,000
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 365 Post(s)
Liked: 351
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrBoogie View Post
I had some LG OLEDs before and now a proud owner of 65 inch E6. While OLED PQ will be unbeatable for at least several years, all I am saying is that mass market can't bear 25k TV. Even 10K TV is too expensive for most enthusiasts. Average Joe will go for 75 inch LED Vizio/Samsung/Sony for 3-5K and call it almost as good using then current marketing pitch about FALD, quantum dots, etc.
From a unit standpoint, the 77" market is irrelevant. The size of the OLED television market will be determined by LGD's ability to bring down prices on the 55" and 65" panels. There just arent that many people buying 75"+ screens and that is regardless of price.
Weaselboy likes this.
slacker711 is offline  
post #13145 of 13163 Old 07-07-2016, 05:57 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Rich Peterson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: St Paul, MN
Posts: 2,967
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 128 Post(s)
Liked: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by video_analysis View Post
So I guess they're running about a year behind schedule, though the date forecast seems a bit incongruous (if the printers won't be deployed for another 2 years, how can Samsung deliver a panel in 2017?).
Yes, that's my question also. The report seems to be inconsistent. The printers go in in 2018 but Samsung has OLED TVs available in 2017?
Rich Peterson is offline  
post #13146 of 13163 Old 07-07-2016, 04:29 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
rogo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Stop making curved screens
Posts: 31,728
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1370 Post(s)
Liked: 1539
I love Kateeva (great people, great tech) but unless someone solved lifespan on soluble blue OLED -- and I've not seen any product announcement indicating this -- there is no mass produced OLED TV using inkjet printing.

And if it's a "franken-hybrid" that's partly printed and partly vapor deposited (yes, people have discussed this), there is scant evidence it will be meaningfully more efficient or cheaper than what LG can already do. Never mind what LG can do in 2018.

So really, it's hard to get excited about this kind of news unless it includes, "And Universal Display/insert real company has announced that their new soluble blue OLED material has a lifespan >10x any previous soluble blue."
video_analysis likes this.

And you may ask yourself well how did I get here?
And you may ask yourself am I right? Am I wrong?
And you may say to yourself: What have I done?!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Once you let the trolls run the bridge, you have a bridge run by trolls. I'll be back.
rogo is offline  
post #13147 of 13163 Old 07-07-2016, 05:49 PM
AVS Special Member
 
wco81's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 5,633
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 873 Post(s)
Liked: 328
Is Kateeva a startup?

Maybe their days are numbered unless their process can produce cheap OLED TVs fairly soon. Seems like they've been around long enough for an IPO, if they had revenues.

Or is someone using their printing process to produce OLEDs for mobile devices yet?
wco81 is online now  
post #13148 of 13163 Old 07-07-2016, 09:20 PM
Advanced Member
 
dnoonie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Seattle, WA area
Posts: 780
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 225 Post(s)
Liked: 185
dnoonie is online now  
post #13149 of 13163 Old 07-11-2016, 12:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Larry Hutchinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Beaverton,OR
Posts: 1,625
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
http://cen.acs.org/articles/94/i28/r...-displays.html

a few quotes:
Quote:
When it comes to blue, says a spokesperson for the Japanese OLED materials supplier Idemitsu, display manufacturers can only convert about 40% of the electricity used into visible color. For red and green, the efficiency is already at 100%, she adds.
Really? I might believe internal quantum efficiency but that quote seems to imply wall-plug efficiency.

Quote:
The cost of making OLED displays is another issue. The core compounds at the heart of OLED displays are often made with expensive substances such as iridium, a rare metal that sells for nearly $19 per gram.
then later:
Quote:
The high cost of display materials and the waste that occurs during mask cleaning will not hamper the growth of the OLED display market, DuFour adds. “One gram of an expensive metal may be used to make 3,000 displays,” she says. Meanwhile, PPG, Universal Display’s manufacturing partner, is developing techniques to reduce the materials loss, she says.
Not sure what size display they are talking about. Phone or TV?
Larry Hutchinson is offline  
post #13150 of 13163 Old 07-12-2016, 03:00 PM
Member
 
Matthias Hutter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 178
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 80 Post(s)
Liked: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Hutchinson View Post
http://cen.acs.org/articles/94/i28/r...-displays.html
Really? I might believe internal quantum efficiency but that quote seems to imply wall-plug efficiency.?
Yeah it's about internal quantum efficiency. The reason is that they are no market ready blue PHOLED yet.
Matthias Hutter is offline  
post #13151 of 13163 Old 07-13-2016, 07:42 PM
AVS Special Member
 
slacker711's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,000
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 365 Post(s)
Liked: 351
A bit OT.

An in-depth comparison between a ThinkPad X1 Yoga with an IPS LCD display and an OLED.

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Display....168753.0.html

The difference in picture quality between the current generation of LCD's in high-end laptops and OLED's seems much larger than in the smartphone and television markets. The question will be how quickly the OLED's can improve their power consumption when displaying white and whether they will be resistant to burn-in.
ChaosCloud likes this.
slacker711 is offline  
post #13152 of 13163 Old 07-13-2016, 09:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Wizziwig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: SoCal, USA
Posts: 1,942
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 770 Post(s)
Liked: 557
I played around with the Alienware version last month at E3. I could not detect any ABL effect at all. Even moving a full screen white window on and off the screen, it appeared to stay at constant brightness. Much better than the OLED TVs I've tested. But the numbers in that review suggest brightness should have dropped by 30%. The display I saw was rather dim though - maybe ABL doesn't kick in at low max brightness settings? Had similar motion blur to the LCD version next to it due to typical sample-and-hold refresh. Black crush was very noticeable compared to the LCD but maybe that can be calibrated out. I took some pics of viewing angles - I'll see if I can post those later. My main concern was outdoor usage but that review suggests it's not a problem. I saw no evidence of IR or BI.

Edit: Attached a couple pics. You can see that the gray sky turns a little green at extreme angles similar to the LG OLED. I also forgot to mention that I did open mspaint full-screen and filled the canvas with various shades of gray (5% and up). I did not notice any banding or vignetting but the environment was poor for critical viewing.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20160615_141123.jpg
Views:	57
Size:	105.3 KB
ID:	1546473   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20160615_141112.jpg
Views:	47
Size:	111.0 KB
ID:	1546481   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20160615_141102.jpg
Views:	49
Size:	104.0 KB
ID:	1546489   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_20160615_113619.jpg
Views:	48
Size:	173.5 KB
ID:	1546497  
ChaosCloud likes this.

Last edited by Wizziwig; 07-14-2016 at 02:42 PM.
Wizziwig is offline  
post #13153 of 13163 Old 07-14-2016, 02:44 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Wizziwig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: SoCal, USA
Posts: 1,942
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 770 Post(s)
Liked: 557
Updated post above with some pics and additional comments.
Wizziwig is offline  
post #13154 of 13163 Old 07-18-2016, 02:01 PM
AVS Special Member
 
slacker711's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1,000
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 365 Post(s)
Liked: 351
Some shipment numbers for the 65" and 75" markets. Both are growing fast, but the 65" market is 10x the size of the 75" market.


http://blog.ihs.com/60-inch+-tv-pane...ceed-5-in-2017

Quote:
In 2016, LCD TV display panel makers are aggressively supplying 60-inch and larger LCD TV panels to fill capacity of the less profitable 55-inch and below panels. Panel makers shipped 5.2 million 65-inch panels in 2015, a significant increase of 44% year-over-year. With a stable supply from six panel makers, shipments of 65-inch panels are estimated to reach a historic high of 6.58 million this year—an increase of 30% year-over-year. Another potentially successful LCD TV size could be 75 inches, and there are three suppliers that produce panels of this size. Panel makers shipped 490,000 75-inch panels in 2015, for a sharp increase of 90% year-over-year. And 75-inch panel shipments are expected to grow around 20% year-over-year each year through 2020. Sixty-five-inch and seventy-five-inch panels will play an increasingly important role in the LCD TV segment.
slacker711 is offline  
post #13155 of 13163 Old 07-19-2016, 05:59 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Rich Peterson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: St Paul, MN
Posts: 2,967
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 128 Post(s)
Liked: 140
LG Display doubles 65-inch OLED panel production in Q2

Source: Korea Herald

LG Display, the display-making unit of LG Group, has almost doubled production of its 65-inch organic light-emitting diode panels in the second quarter as more TV manufacturers are adopting the larger OLED display.

According to UBI Research, a local research firm specialized in OLED, the company shipped about 140,000 65-inch OLED panels in the March-June period, compared to some 28,000 units shipped in the first quarter.

The increased shipments of LG, the No. 1 player in the larger OLED market, indicates that the OLED TV market has started gaining momentum in sales and TV firms are also increasingly adopting larger panels.

More recently, German TV makers, including Loewe and Metz, have joined to adopt OLED displays. LG Display is also expected to supply 30,000 panels to China’s Skyworth this year.

“Consumers have been reluctant to purchase smaller OLED TVs due to the huge price gap with their LCD alternatives,” said UBI.

“But the price gap is reduced when it comes to larger premium models. That’s why LG Display is focusing resources into 60-inch plus panels.”

By Lee Ji-yoon (jylee@heraldcorp.com)
ChaosCloud likes this.
Rich Peterson is offline  
post #13156 of 13163 Old 07-19-2016, 04:21 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
rogo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Stop making curved screens
Posts: 31,728
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1370 Post(s)
Liked: 1539
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeBiker View Post
I have a feeling that the salesperson gets a larger commission for selling a Samsung than an LG.
Quote:
Originally Posted by slacker711 View Post
Some shipment numbers for the 65" and 75" markets. Both are growing fast, but the 65" market is 10x the size of the 75" market.


http://blog.ihs.com/60-inch+-tv-pane...ceed-5-in-2017
Not at all shocking. It was more than 20x just a couple of years ago (although 70-inch should not be ignored).

That the big sizes continue to grow is sort of one of those interesting/good signs. The 65-inch market is likely strengthening at the expense of the 60-inch market. The 75-inch market at the expense of the 65s, ironically enough.

With TV sales flat, this indicates a continued (albeit slow) shift to larger sizes. Still, we're a long ways away from even 1% of TVs being 75 inches.

65 and up, however is now >3% of the market.
thebishman and tgm1024 like this.

And you may ask yourself well how did I get here?
And you may ask yourself am I right? Am I wrong?
And you may say to yourself: What have I done?!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Once you let the trolls run the bridge, you have a bridge run by trolls. I'll be back.
rogo is offline  
post #13157 of 13163 Old 07-25-2016, 10:12 AM
Member
 
TheKnobber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 177
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Egg, meet Chicken.

Saying this is regardless of price is an assumption, not a fact. If the 77" was $3000 my assumption would be that they would sell a lot more than they do now. Sure not everyone has space for a 77", but usually if you can fit a 65, the 77" isn't that far off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by slacker711 View Post
From a unit standpoint, the 77" market is irrelevant. The size of the OLED television market will be determined by LGD's ability to bring down prices on the 55" and 65" panels. There just arent that many people buying 75"+ screens and that is regardless of price.
TheKnobber is offline  
post #13158 of 13163 Old Yesterday, 09:28 AM
AVS Special Member
 
irkuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: cyberspace
Posts: 3,643
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 140 Post(s)
Liked: 101
irkuck is offline  
post #13159 of 13163 Old Today, 12:02 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by irkuck View Post
Backlight master drive seems like the real deal. I suspect my next TV after the OLED will be one of these TVs once the prices come down. This line came as a shock to me...

"They all support HDR10 but not Dolby Vision."
Mike Willard is offline  
post #13160 of 13163 Old Today, 12:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 2,203
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1258 Post(s)
Liked: 1014
Beware press releases and manufacturer demos...

As for the lack of DV, Sony doesn't want Dolby mucking up their secret sauce X1 video processor.
video_analysis is online now  
post #13161 of 13163 Old Today, 02:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tgm1024's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 9,594
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2155 Post(s)
Liked: 2037
Quote:
Originally Posted by video_analysis View Post
Beware press releases and manufacturer demos...

As for the lack of DV, Sony doesn't want Dolby mucking up their secret sauce X1 video processor.
This is worrying me about a potential blu-ray vs. HD DVD war that left a lot of people with useless machines. Or beta vs. vhs, that kind of thing.

Keep the bottle. Most days I'd rather have the frontal lobotomy anyway.
tgm1024 is online now  
post #13162 of 13163 Old Today, 02:39 PM
AVS Special Member
 
wco81's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 5,633
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 873 Post(s)
Liked: 328
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post
This is worrying me about a potential blu-ray vs. HD DVD war that left a lot of people with useless machines. Or beta vs. vhs, that kind of thing.
Are there any indications that HDR content will be encoded with HDR10 or Dolby Vision but not both?
wco81 is online now  
post #13163 of 13163 Unread Today, 03:00 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 2,203
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1258 Post(s)
Liked: 1014
Yes, since there's still no UHD Blu-ray player available that has DV support, nor do I know if one is coming.
video_analysis is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply OLED Technology and Flat Panels General

Tags
Led Hdtv , Lcd Hdtv , Plasma Hdtv , Oled Tv , Lg , Samsung



Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off