LCD or Plasma? Plasma or LCD? and why those Black Bars? Discuss it here only Please - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 1452 Old 10-06-2007, 08:18 AM
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Hi, I have been looking at a hdtv for some time. I have a pretty bright room that is 15ft long and need to see the tv from a 25 degree angle(from the kitchen). Plasma seems to be the best for me, but I am slightly worried about the half life issue. I have heard the 30,000 hr is the number, is that about right, that would be 15+ years for me. I watch dvd's and network programs mostly. with a football game on Sunday afternoon. I will upgrade my dish to hd, but the networks have not went hdm yet.All that said I think a 60+ in plasma probably is my best choice, but am looking for other peoples counsle.

thanks
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post #452 of 1452 Old 10-06-2007, 11:21 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danfred View Post

have heard the 30,000 hr is the number, is that about right

No. 100,000 hours seems to be the new number. Not that it matters, even 60,000 was far longer than CRT's half life, and not many people complained about that.
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post #453 of 1452 Old 10-06-2007, 02:37 PM
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I was seeking advice as to how the 42" Toshiba Rezga (42HL67) stacked up against the Hitachi 42" Plasma HD1080 Plasma (P42H401).

I'm not really sold on LCD v. Plasma, i'm just looking for the best performing TV (i.e. best picture and best options for my price range). I will mainly be watching sports, SD DVDs, HBO and playing the Wii.

I was originally sold on the Toshiba based on the high marks it has generally received, but just started reading up on the Hitachi Plasmas which are also in my price range. Sounds like the Hitachi has a native resolution of 1080i and that matches the majority of the HD signals out there.

Also, how big of a deal is motion blur on LCDs that have an 8 ms response time? I watch a lot of sports. At the end of the day, i thought i was sold on the Rezga, but the Hitachi has crept into the picture. Any thoughts either way?
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post #454 of 1452 Old 10-06-2007, 04:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moytoy12 View Post

Sounds like the Hitachi has a native resolution of 1080i and that matches the majority of the HD signals out there.

No plasma or LCD has a native resolution of 1080i. The i is for interlaced, like a tube TV. Plasmas and LCDs are, by nature, a progressive (p) format.

That Hitachi set will display 1080i signals, as will any modern HDTV. All modern HD sets scale incoming sources to match their native resolution. Hitachi has some unique native resolutions, different from other manufacturers, which I don't know enough about to address. But they've been getting good reviews, I think.

Plasmas are probably your best bet, especially for watching sports and minimizing motion blur. Plasmas also have better contrast ratios than LCDs, which the Imaging Science Foundation says is the primary determinant of image quality.
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post #455 of 1452 Old 10-06-2007, 04:15 PM
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Thanks for clearing up my confusion. Still learning with a long way to go. Based on my research, it seems that a plasma is probably the best route for me. thanks for your input.
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post #456 of 1452 Old 10-09-2007, 03:25 PM
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I was actually wondering about that Hitachi 42" as well. I can get it for $750 right now, which sounds like an amazing deal. Only thing is the resolution seems strange, and I have to drive about an hour just to go see it. Has anyone seen or used it? Only things I heard were that the resolution is 'strange' and that it gets very hot
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post #457 of 1452 Old 10-10-2007, 10:21 AM
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I'm currently considering the same 42" Hitachi. Heat wise comparing to LCD's was mildly hotter - not enough I think to matter. Resolution as explained by the Sears guy is not standard, they tweak it between a 720p and 1080p I think, something like that. For me and my limited a/v knowledge I think it is a good buy. There are several posts in the Plasma section regarding this set. Nelson
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post #458 of 1452 Old 10-12-2007, 04:28 PM
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I have a 50" toshiba plasma and a 37" samsung lcd. I like them both a lot. To me there is no diffrence in the pic. I put them side by side and the greens are exactly the same. No blur image on either one.
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post #459 of 1452 Old 10-15-2007, 10:28 PM
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I have a question about motion blur.

I like my new Sharp LC-52D64U with it's 4ms screen (the black levels are another topic) because I do not see motion blur (as far as I can see) even though it is a 60hz screen.
Now today I took a look at the new Samsung LCD (the shiny screen one) and they had a demo showing half of the screen at 60hz and the other half at 120hz.
The 60hz side looked like sh*t and the 120hz side was silky smooth. Now, my LCD at 60hz looks no where near as bad as the 60hz side of the Samsung. It looks more like the 120hz side. So what's the deal? Did they jimmy up the demo to make the 60hz side look worse so the 120hz side look better or is it just the Samsung unit performs poorly at 60hz?

Very strange. But I must say the colors and super deep blacks did pop out at me. It felt like I was getting the brightness of an LCD with the color saturation and super deep blacks of a plasma.

I must say that I do not care for Samsung products at all since I have had issues with them in the past but looking at that display did make me feel like I want one.
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post #460 of 1452 Old 10-16-2007, 12:49 PM
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Yet another which is better question,

Through my airmiles reward program i finally got enough miles to get my TV.

these are my options:

Panasonic TH-50PX75 plasma or


JVC LT-47X788 LCD


so is one particularily better than the other, or is it simply another Plasma , LCD debate.

The main thing i want is a good picture for watching hockey.

any help would be great

(my wife says she likes the plasma better because of the better side view, is that right?)


thank you for any input you have.

Mike
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post #461 of 1452 Old 10-21-2007, 05:38 AM
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my 7 year old 60" mitsu rear project. tv died yeaterday.

Need to replace ASAP. We are in florida so i can use either lcd or plasma.Only a 50" to 52" will fit. We watch mostly cable and some dvd's.

I own a new samsung 46" #4661 lcd in colorado. had no choice 9000'. It's ok, not much HD alv.

My queation is which is better for my use? Would like to keep it in the $2000 to $2500 range. Any suggestion on what costco carries?

Thanks
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post #462 of 1452 Old 10-21-2007, 10:51 PM
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Upgrading my Sony GWIII RPTV to a flat panel - I want something 52 inches and up and I don't want to pay more than $4000. I was looking VERY closely at the Panasonic TH-58PZ700U but then I learned it doesn't do picture-by-picture nor 1080p over component and VGA. I read a little bit about the Samsung FPT5884 being that it has more features, and I also considered some of hte 1080p Pioneer's but I think they are out of my price range. I even checked out the Sony XBR4 as I am not locked to using plasma or LCD, but my ultimate qualifier is QUALITY of picture.

Between the Panny, the Sammy and the Sony, which of these would provide the best image? I've yet to see all of these side by side so I'm hoping some else has and con comment. I mostly watch HD movies and play HD games, and this display will go in a bright room. Thanks for any help!
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post #463 of 1452 Old 10-22-2007, 03:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homer1973 View Post

Yet another which is better question,

Through my airmiles reward program i finally got enough miles to get my TV.

these are my options:

Panasonic TH-50PX75 plasma or


JVC LT-47X788 LCD


so is one particularily better than the other, or is it simply another Plasma , LCD debate.

The main thing i want is a good picture for watching hockey.

any help would be great

(my wife says she likes the plasma better because of the better side view, is that right?)


thank you for any input you have.

Mike

They are both fine sets. I believe you would be happy with either. Your wife is correct though, plasmas do offer better off axis viewing than most LCDs. I've not seen the particular JVC model you reference so I can not give you an absolute answer on this. However, I can point out that since you will be living with the wife, I believe your choice is easy.
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post #464 of 1452 Old 10-23-2007, 05:44 PM
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I think I have finally got it narrowed down. I like shopping at Costco and I can get either one by mail order, or the Sammy from the store:

Samsung 42" around $1200
Panasonic 42" around $1200

Sammy 10W per channel audio.
Panny 2 x 20W speakers.

The Panny TH-42PC77U has anti-glare coating.
The website says the Sammy HP-T4234 has "FilterBrightâ„¢ anti-reflection filter", funny I didn't notice that in the store (?)

The Sammy would fit a little better in my place because it is not quite as wide (the Panny speakers are to the side of the screen).

I might hook it up to a little stereo system, but I like decent sound -- does the 10W x 2 vs 20W x 2 speaker setup make much difference?

Both can be seen on Costco website.



Thoughts?
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post #465 of 1452 Old 10-23-2007, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zzdocxx View Post

I think I have finally got it narrowed down. I like shopping at Costco and I can get either one by mail order, or the Sammy from the store:

Samsung 42" around $1200
Panasonic 42" around $1200

The Panny has anti-glare.

The Sammy would fit a little better in my place because it is not quite as wide (the Panny speakers are to the side of the screen).

Both can be seen on Costco website.

Thoughts?


Both are fine plasma sets and produce similar pictures. The Sammy has more inputs than the Panny but if you have a problem with light in the room you might want to go with Panny. I had both sets for 3 weeks and compared them and went with the Panny, but you'll be pleased with either set plus your getting it from Costco and you can always bring one back.
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post #466 of 1452 Old 10-23-2007, 09:35 PM
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Hi folks.

My wife and I want to move into the HD realm. We mainly watch:
- Network dramas (LOST, House, etc...). Will all be available in HD through Rogers Cable.
- Hockey. 90% of it is NOT available in HD for my team.
- some DVD's but not many... maybe 2/month.

My main concerns are as follows:

- need good SD rendering of hockey (fast motion, small details). I was watching SD soccer on a Sony Bravia 42" today and it looked like a bunch of square people were playing... it was awful. HD was MUCH better here. Is this only really a problem with LCD rendering of SD, or do plasmas suffer this as well?

- need good HD picture (obviously!) but we are NOT leading-edge people. We're currently using a 27" Sanyo CRT with a whining flyback transformer. Happy with the size (a bit bigger doesn't hurt), happy with the picture (not entirely but it's decent for SD), but NOT happy with the whining, so that's why we want something nice but not extravagant this time.

- need to keep it under $1000 if possible. Willing to wait for sales. Located in Canada but considering we're 40 minutes from Ogdensburg, NY, we can buy it in the US and drive it back across

I MIGHT be able to get the LG 42PB4D for around $1100 at some point in the near future from a staff-sale through a guy I know. Although we already have a DVR and plan to get the HD-DVR (LOVE IT!), having a DVR on the TV itself will be useful when the 2-year free 'trial' of our DVR runs out in about 11 months time.

Please let me know some models to look for, and I'll research the prices.

Thanks a lot!
Eric
PS: How are "Prima" and "Vizio" and "Westinghouse" brands overall? Good bang for the buck, or stay away and go with a 1st-tier name brand like LG, Panasonic, etc...?
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post #467 of 1452 Old 10-25-2007, 09:59 PM
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Thanks for the quick response badmeng!

Naturally, another option has appeared on the horizon, namely I saw the thread on the newer Panny 1080p plasma sets. lol that's what I get for reading too much.

At Sears, the 1080p set is only a couple hundred bucks more than the 720p set at Costco (I am talking 42" here). BTW I am not really a videophile or anything, rent DVDs now and then, don't own a blu-ray or HD DVD nor to I anticipate buying one -- perhaps an upconverting DVD player though.

Can someone explain to me about warranties? Costco extends the manufacturer's warranty to two years, at Sears you can buy a 3 year plan for $400(!) but it includes in-home service. Looks like they may be two different things altogether.

Looks like the the aftermarket online ones are best value and provide in-home service.

Probably there is a thread about whether these add-on service plans are worth it, I will look for it.

OK found the thread about warranties: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...nded+warrantee
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post #468 of 1452 Old 10-27-2007, 09:25 PM
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Havn't visited the site for a while, I've had my set about 6 months. I find it funny reading all the new posts about burn in. I too was a bit nervous but now realize it is a thing of the past. My son and I plays games on the plasma for hours, image retention might exist for a few minutes after extended play on a high picture setting and hardly exists at all at a lower setting which is preferable anyway. Retention which can only be seen by switching to a totally black screen in a dark room goes away in several minutes. Burn in is a thing of the past and really shouldn't even be discussed. Anyone new here looking for a TV should not worry about burn in on the new plasma's. Just base your decision on lighting conditions is what I would recommend. Plasma's for rooms with low light or controlled lighting to the sides, High light or lighting that can't be controlled go with the LCD.

Panasonic 600U 50" Plasma
Maintenance Menu Adjusted (Perfectionist)
Mode Vivid,Standard,Cinema
Picture +20
Brightness +6
Color -3
Tint -6
Sharpness +10
Temp Warm
Everything Else Off
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post #469 of 1452 Old 10-30-2007, 07:52 AM
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Hello all.

Just here to give minor detail of my plans for TV's in my new home and I hope that if anyone has anything to suggest they will do so. I'm a movie buff and will watch all movies, good, bad and ugly. In my bedroom I plan to have a Samsung or Pioneer (full HD) 50" plasma. I will be purchasing whatever the "best" is at the time of purchase. The TV will be mainly used for DVDs (about 90%) and the rest will be regular TV viewing). The viewing distance will be a constant and steady 10' or 11' from directly in front of the TV in a room that will be dark.
In the living room I plan to have a 40" (or so) LCD (most likely Samsung(Full HD)). This TV will be used for basic TV watching of cartoons, and whatever else happens to be on cable. There will be a DVD player connected as will a came console (I have a 4.5 year old that likes to play wii). This TV will be viewed straight-on and will be in a semi-dark, but lit room. I chose LCD due to the game system to be used on it.
My daughter will have a 32" Samsung LCD TV (720 HD) in her room and this will be mainly for cartoon and kid's movies (3D and traditional animated movies). Again, the viewing angle will be straight-on and the room can be both light or dark.
There was a time when I would not even think about an LCD. But in a home where there is more than one TV, I'm sure that the TVs play different roles and require different thought.
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post #470 of 1452 Old 10-30-2007, 02:41 PM
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To me it is now official, LCD or Plasma? It makes NO DIFFERENCE.

I'm used to the LCDs of 2 years ago, or I'm used to the LCD's by Vizio. BUT I just got back from Ken Cranes, and I was looking at the latest generation brand new 120hz LCD's from Samsung and Sony, and what can I say?

Motion blur doesn't really exist any more, and the blacks are BLACK.

I also checked out the 1080P Panny Plasmas, with the anti glare coating, and they were awesome as well.

The point is, if you get the latest generation of either LCD or Plasma from a Major name brand, then you will be very very happy with either a Plasma or LCD.
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post #471 of 1452 Old 10-31-2007, 05:36 PM
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The current Panasonic Plasmas are supposed to be good to 9100' of altitude. I'm at a mile high so it's not a big deal to me, though.

After doing a lot of lurking on different forums, I've decided to go with the 42" Panny 42PX75U. I saw it side by side with the 77U at Sears (who has both at the same price), and I actually liked the 75U better. It lacks the new anti-reflective coating, but whatever Panasonic has been doing for a while seems to be working--the Panasonics have less glare than some of the LCDs I saw. I can't say the same for Samsungs, which I found to be annoyingly like mirrors. Keep in mind everything has been in overly-bright big box stores.

I've been using my 26" Olevia LCD for over a year and have been quite pleased with the performance. It just feels like "baby HD" and I want to get the full HD effect. The only reservation I have with going with a Plasma is that all the 1080p content (actually everything) will have to be scaled by the internal processor. It's probably not something I'll notice on a mid-size TV at 10'.

I agree that the new LCDs look pretty good, but in order to really get the plasma-level performance with blacks and colors, you have to spend about $500 more still to get into a Sony. IMHO the Sony LCDs are heads and shoulders above the other LCDs at this point, and the Pioneer and Panasonic Plasmas are right there.
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post #472 of 1452 Old 11-10-2007, 11:33 AM
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Great thread. I have been looking for a second tv for our home. Currently, my Sony KD34XBR910 is the center piece in our living room. Not huge, but a good size for the room. This tv has also made it difficult to select a new set for a family room downstairs as nearly everything I look at when going to Best Buy or something similar looks like crap compared to the CRT. The benefit for the new tv would be that I can control the light in the basement a lot better. I'm not looking for anything too huge, 42"-50" and I'm looking to spend less than $2000 (closer to $1000 would be awesome, but trying to be somewhat realistic). Should I have any hope? I'm leaning towards plasma right now. The tv would be used mostly for Xbox 360 and DVD movies, although I would probably add a DishHD receiver at some point. Thanks for the help and keep up the great work!
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post #473 of 1452 Old 11-14-2007, 01:34 PM
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Plasma has a better picture quality but LCD has some advandages: it is lighter than a plasma. It's easier to hang on a wall. Its lifespan is higher too. For video games, lcd is better cause it doesn't burn in the screen. You can find some information here: lcd vs plasma comparison.
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post #474 of 1452 Old 11-16-2007, 09:21 PM
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Hi everyone, I am an independent filmmaker already shooting HD working on a HD 23" Apple Cinema Display, but looking to update my television. I would like this to be a multi-purpose unit to connect my computer to as well as watch high-definition content, specifically Blu-Ray or HD-DVD. Somewhere down the line I might also return to some console gaming which is why I am leaning more toward LCD than plasma, however, I am current looking at both the Sony KDL-40XBR4 and the Panasonic TH-42PZ700U. What advice does everyone have in dealing with this? Does the Sony still get the pixillation/motion artifacts with Blu-Ray in high-speed scenes, or is this nearly as crisp as the images of the Panasonic?
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post #475 of 1452 Old 11-19-2007, 11:51 AM
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According to Consumer Reports Mag:


Why to buy a Plasma, and why to buy an LCD



Why buy a plasma TV?
To get more screen for your money. Inch for inch, plasma offers more bang for the buck than an LCD TV, so the same budget can buy you a bigger screen. Most of the 50-inch plasma sets we recommend cost $1,500 to $2,000. The 47-inch LCD Quick Picks cost $2,300 to $2,600, and the 52-inch sets cost $3,800 to $4,000. (Prices were current at press time but might drop this fall.)

To enjoy a movie-theater experience. A good plasma TV's deep black levels and high contrast can do justice to almost anything you watch, including movies and TV programs with dark scenes. The strong contrast and realistic, accurate colors can result in rich, natural-looking images, especially in dim lighting. Most LCD sets have trouble displaying the same strong, dark blacks as plasma sets. On certain LCD sets, uneven brightness from the backlight can create cloudy areas that can be distracting in dark scenes.

For a wide viewing angle. With a plasma TV, as with the familiar picture-tube set, the images onscreen look the same from almost any angle. That's a big plus if a TV will be watched by a number of people sitting around a room.

It's a different story with LCD TVs. (See Why buy an LCD TV?) Though some newer models have gotten better, most LCDs still look their best only from a limited sweet spot in front of the screen. As you move off to the side, the picture quality deteriorates, appearing increasingly washed out or dim. Vertical position also matters--say, if you're sitting on the floor or watching an LCD set that's mounted above a mantelpiece.

On some TV sets, those problems can be obvious, especially with indoor scenes and flesh tones. The degradation is less noticeable with bright images and vivid colors such as those you'd see in a football game. Because TVs in retail showrooms often display sporting events, you might not notice a problem with viewing angle when looking at a TV in a store. Picture settings also minimize the effect of viewing angle on picture quality. TVs are usually set to vivid or dynamic mode, which pumps up brightness and color to a level that looks great under fluorescent lights but unnatural in a typical home. Ask a salesperson to reset a TV to normal or standard mode and tune in nonsports programming to get a better idea of how a TV might look at home, especially from an angle.




Why buy an LCD TV?
You have a very bright room. LCDs are generally brighter than plasma TVs, and their screens are less reflective. That makes them better for daytime viewing in rooms with lots of windows or for night-time use in rooms with bright lighting. Some plasma TVs can look a bit dim in bright lighting when set to the normal or standard mode, which we generally recommend for home use. You can switch to the vivid mode or raise the brightness control to compensate, but the picture quality might suffer. Another issue with most plasmas is that the glass screens are subject to reflections and glare. If you have the lights on while watching dark scenes, you might see mirrorlike reflections on a plasma set.

For heavy use with video games or as a PC monitor. Both types of flat panels can do the job, but with an LCD, there's no chance static images will burn in. With a plasma TV, burn-in is a concern with video games, computer programs, and TV programming that has fixed images onscreen for a long time. That includes station logos, news tickers, even the bars alongside standard-def pictures. Many plasma sets have screen-saver features to minimize risk, but burn-in is still possible.

With either an LCD or plasma TV, consider a screen with 1080p resolution for use with a computer. The higher resolution will let you see more content onscreen with greater clarity and finer detail than on a 720p set. (You might have to connect your computer to the TV via an HDMI input to get 1080p resolution and to avoid having outer edges of the image cut off, otherwise known as overscan.)

For somewhat lower electric bills. LCDs tend to use less power than comparably sized plasma TVs. It doesn't appear that the differences would affect your electric bills by more than a few dollars a month in many cases, so that might not be a major factor in your decision. But there is obviously an environmental advantage to using a less power-hungry TV.


http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/e...-tvs-0v2_1.htm
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post #476 of 1452 Old 11-22-2007, 11:56 PM
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Burn in with plasmas is still a problem. I know a guy that just bought a LG 50" Plasma from circuit city a couple weeks ago. It got burned in badly in just a few weeks. He took it back and went with a dlp rear projection. Hopefully that will be better, but someone stated above that burn in is not an issue anymore with plasmas and that's not the case. Just wanted to share.
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post #477 of 1452 Old 11-23-2007, 07:40 AM
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Am a newbie to the forum here, but have a question that I can't seem to find an answer to. I want to buy a plasma for our cottage. What I'm concerned about is that it is a 4 season cottage, heated by a wood fireplace in the winter & cold weather etc. Am out there most weekends, but the cottage is at ambient season/winter temperatures when not occupied.

Can a plasma withstand temperatures that can easily fall to probably -35c during the winter months (normal Manitoba winter) without causing any damage? It would be brought up to normal room temp of course, before any use. I sure hope so, but not holding my breath on this one.

Thanks for any advice on this issue.

Dave
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post #478 of 1452 Old 11-24-2007, 06:15 PM
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lcd
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post #479 of 1452 Old 11-25-2007, 10:01 PM
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plasma is nicer, but lcd is better for the money.
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post #480 of 1452 Old 11-26-2007, 05:58 AM
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Hi, I wanted to bring this up and get some expert thoughts.

To start, I would like to say that I have been leaning heavily towards a 50" plasma, but after what I saw, I am not sure.

I was in a local Circuit City yesterday and I saw the

- Sony KDL-52XBR4 running on a BlueRay Demo disc. It looked amazing. Detail and brightness was amazing.

- The Panasonic 58" 1080p plasma looked horrible running the same demo disc off of the same BR player. The 1080p portion of the demo looked very grainy, unlike the Sony. The Sales person noticed it as well, so I know that it was not me.

Can anyone explain why?

Like I said earlier, I have been leaning towards plasma, but after what I saw, I wanted to see if the new 120Hz, Top of line LCD's where actually better then Plasma>

Also, I was unable to compare the Sony to a Pioneer so maybe that is the difference. We have to compare apples to apples.

Comments are appreciated!!!!

Thanks, Dave
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