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post #1981 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 01:34 PM
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How easy is it to switch between the 3 tuners? TivoHD has the "live TV" button, my motorola FIOS DVR has a button to do it, i believe it is the "last" button. Is there a button on the Moxi remote?
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post #1982 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue View Post

This is a bummer. I have an old HDTV that only has component inputs and I didn't want to give up the use of HDMI to my main TV by splitting component to both. I was planning to have the two mates in two other rooms, with the main moxi unit running both the master and the adjacent workout space (with the old HDTV in the workout space). It seems odd that they wouldn't be active at the same time like they are on my cable rented DVR.

That's how I'm using my current DirecTV set-up. I've read it has to do wit copywrite protection, but I'm not sure. It reallly sucks for me since this is likely a deal breaker for me since there's no reliable way to get HDMI to the distance the component cable is being run now.

Maybe MoxiGuy can help with this? Maybe they can change this sine many other DVR boxes have both active, including TiVO.

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Originally Posted by teeitup View Post

I can't confirm if they are both active at the same time, but last night I connected both HDMI and component to the same TV. When I cycled between inputs on the TV, both inputs from HDMI and component were working. So unless the component video output shuts off when the HDMI "handshake" occurs I would say they are both active at the same time. If I get some time I will try hooking up a second TV and test this out.

What's likely happening is, the HDMI port on the TV is being shut down when the component input is selected, thus allowing the Moxi to output Component.
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post #1983 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 03:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ciucca View Post

How easy is it to switch between the 3 tuners? TivoHD has the "live TV" button, my motorola FIOS DVR has a button to do it, i believe it is the "last" button. Is there a button on the Moxi remote?

I have the two tuner so someone else may be able to answer better for the three tuner. But the "Jump" button on the Moxi remote will cycle between the 2-tuners keeping the buffer on each channel. If one of the tuners is tied up recording a program, the "Jump" button will act like a "recall" or "last" channel button using a single tuner. It seems to me that Moxi tried to make it simple for the average user so you are not thinking about which tuner you are using. This Moxi remote also has a "live TV" button.
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post #1984 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ciucca View Post

How easy is it to switch between the 3 tuners? TivoHD has the "live TV" button, my motorola FIOS DVR has a button to do it, i believe it is the "last" button. Is there a button on the Moxi remote?

Here it is!



For any given monitor there are only two states: Live TV or Recorded (or networked) media regardless of the number of tuners.
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post #1985 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Operon View Post

Here it is!



For any given monitor there are only two states: Live TV or Recorded (or networked) media regardless of the number of tuners.

Please forgive me if I am wrong here, Operon, but with the Moxi, when not recording anything, the Moxi is always caching whatever station the tuners are set to, for an hour's worth, or hour and a half.

So, let's say I put on Channel 2 Live TV. Then I switch to Channel 4 Live TV, Channel 2 is still caching. So, I can switch back to Channel 2 and rewind to what I missed.

I am assuming that since the two tuner Moxi works this way, the three-tuner would do the same...so as long as the Moxi is not recording a program, the Moxi will be caching three channels always.

So, the original question was is there an easy way to toggle through the three active tuners that are always caching?

So, if I am correct, I hope you will retract your "um." If I am wrong, I will apologize in advance.
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post #1986 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midas89 View Post

Please forgive me if I am wrong here, Operon, but with the Moxi, when not recording anything, the Moxi is always caching whatever station the tuners are set to, for an hour's worth, or hour and a half.

So, let's say I put on Channel 2 Live TV. Then I switch to Channel 4 Live TV, Channel 2 is still caching. So, I can switch back to Channel 2 and rewind to what I missed.

I am assuming that since the two tuner Moxi works this way, the three-tuner would do the same...so as long as the Moxi is not recording a program, the Moxi will be caching three channels always.

So, the original question was is there an easy way to toggle through the three active tuners that are always caching?

So, if I am correct, I hope you will retract your "um." If I am wrong, I will apologize in advance.

I’m assuming the Moxi will buffer (cache) all three tuners as well. But there is no way to know which tuners are currently caching. A suggestion (see below) that I made awhile back to TheMoxiGuy was to show channels that are currently being cached as a different color on the guide listings.

It seems the Moxi defaults to cycling tuners when changing channels rather than just changing the channel on that tuner.

So (assuming no active recordings), if the last three channels I watched were 44, 104 and 210 those would be buffered channels. I could manually change back to any of those channels and keep the buffer. But once I change to a different channel (Channel 13 for example) I would lose the buffer on the oldest channel I watched. Could someone with a 3-tuner test this scenario? The next question would be if pressing the “Jump” button on the Moxi remote will cycle between all three channels (tuners) or just the most recent two.


Quote:
Originally Posted by teeitup View Post

@TheMoxiGuy
I have a few more suggestions for user control/management of tuners. I have a two tuner, but I believe this would be even more valuable in the three-tuner units.

1) Show which channels each tuner is currently tuned to. This could be done in the guide. When viewing guide listings, each channel which was already tuned by a tuner would show a different color on the channel number. Similar to the way it shows orange for the currently tuned channel now. This way I would know which channels may have a recorded buffer and not lose that by changing the channel.

2) It would make more sense to me if the Moxi would stay on the same tuner unless I opted to "swap" to a different tuner. That way I could "channel surf" on one tuner but be able to swap to a different tuner and still have it be on the same channel it was on. This way I could keep a recorded buffer and come back to that program, but still channel surf with one of the other active tuners. It appears the Moxi currently just swaps tuners each time you change the channel (unless a recording is in process which will keep that tuner).

3) Enable the Moxi to remain paused when swapping between tuners.

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post #1987 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 06:57 PM
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I've been looking into Moxi more and more. I have Time Warner Cable and the fact is, their boxes are so outdated. Personally, I think the picture quality is reduced using those set top boxes. Mine is connected via HDMI, however, the HDMI output in the back of the cable box is still version 1.1 vs my hd tv that is equipped with version 1.3. This might not mean much for some, but this goes to show that their boxes are very old. Has anybody had any problems with their cablecards not working properly with the Moxi box, example, dropped channels, losing channels or other issues?
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post #1988 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teeitup View Post

I'm assuming the Moxi will buffer (cache) all three tuners as well. But there is no way to know which tuners are currently caching. A suggestion (see below) that I made awhile back to TheMoxiGuy was to show channels that are currently being cached as a different color on the guide listings.

It seems the Moxi defaults to cycling tuners when changing channels rather than just changing the channel on that tuner.

So (assuming no active recordings), if the last three channels I watched were 44, 104 and 210 those would be buffered channels. I could manually change back to any of those channels and keep the buffer. But once I change to a different channel (Channel 13 for example) I would lose the buffer on the oldest channel I watched. Could someone with a 3-tuner test this scenario? The next question would be if pressing the Jump button on the Moxi remote will cycle between all three channels (tuners) or just the most recent two.

This all gets very confusing when you throw a couple of Mates in the mix. One user's expectation of what's being cached might not jive with reality when someone is channel surfing on a Mate. And cycling through the tuners might have unexpected results.

Picture this. Admittedly being totally unfamiliar with Moxi's parental controls, say the wife goes out to the local quilting bee and the child is upstairs watching Hanna Montana. You are safely ensconced in your man lair or whatever the current turn of phrase is for the converted room down in the basement. The game is a blow out and your mind, perhaps innocently, turns to some harmless fantasizing. (Oh blame it on the Tostito's commercial) To stimulate the imagination you turn to say, Hef's channel, occasionally jumping back to the hump QB who never shoulda been drafted in the first place. You are comfortable. You are relaxed. The wife is out and all is right with the world. At some point said kid discovers the magic button, scrolls through the tuner cache and is confronted with one of two things. One is decidedly bad. Lights out. Game over. And the other is well. The wife arrives back home and said angel innocently if not tenderly asks Mom, What does Enter Code to Unblock.' mean? Well, faster than a New York minute the wife is downstairs, foot tapping asking all sorts of confrontational questions. To which, sweat pooling in the small of your back, you are suddenly afflicted with a severe case of stuttering, Humina, humina, er, um. Well dear. Ditching the Kleenex is the least of your problems. And the next thing you know you're stepping off the plane in Pine Grove, Mississippi and rooming with Tiger. The horror. The horror. Wake me, wake me and tell me this is all a dream.
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post #1989 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Operon View Post

This all gets very confusing when you throw a couple of Mates in the mix. One user's expectation of what's being cached might not jive with reality when someone is channel surfing on a Mate. And cycling through the tuners might have unexpected results.

Picture this. Admittedly being totally unfamiliar with Moxi's parental controls, say the wife goes out to the local quilting bee and the child is upstairs watching Hanna Montana. You are safely ensconced in your man lair or whatever the current turn of phrase is for the converted room down in the basement. The game is a blow out and your mind, perhaps innocently, turns to some harmless fantasizing. (Oh blame it on the Tostito's commercial) To stimulate the imagination you turn to say, Hef's channel, occasionally jumping back to the hump QB who never shoulda been drafted in the first place. You are comfortable. You are relaxed. The wife is out and all is right with the world. At some point said kid discovers the magic button, scrolls through the tuner cache and is confronted with one of two things. One is decidedly bad. Lights out. Game over. And the other is well. The wife arrives back home and said angel innocently if not tenderly asks Mom, What does Enter Code to Unblock.' mean? Well, faster than a New York minute the wife is downstairs, foot tapping asking all sorts of confrontational questions. To which, sweat pooling in the small of your back, you are suddenly afflicted with a severe case of stuttering, Humina, humina, er, um. Well dear. Ditching the Kleenex is the least of your problems. And the next thing you know you're stepping off the plane in Pine Grove, Mississippi and rooming with Tiger. The horror. The horror. Wake me, wake me and tell me this is all a dream.

OH God! You have been caught haven't you This is funny but hopefully not a real worry!


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post #1990 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 09:05 PM
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Hopefully someone has run into this. I can't find any answers anywhere.

I've tried tversity and twonky media to stream divx and xvid files to my moxi mates and the actual moxi dvr but I'm getting wierd audio issues with each program. It's almost like a crackly echo.

All other video files play fine on the moxi and the divx files play fine on my computer. I've even tried a few different computers to host the files but I keep getting the same results.

Any ideas?

Thanks!
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post #1991 of 6304 Old 03-18-2010, 11:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Operon View Post


And the next thing you know you're stepping off the plane in Pine Grove, Mississippi and rooming with Tiger. The horror. The horror. Wake me, wake me and tell me this is all a dream.

ahhhhh... quality writing on the forums!

solution: no kid of mine touches a Moxi or Mate
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post #1992 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 01:59 AM
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I have had my Moxi 3-tuner since last weekend, and yesterday afternoon it spontaneously rebooted for the first time. I am not panicking, as I know DVRs do this from time to time (it had happened before with my TiVo Series 3) but I am wondering if my addition of an external hard drive the day before might have had something to do with it. The drive is a Western Digital 1 TB My DVR Expander, and I seem to recall from postings on various bulletin boards that the eSATA cable that comes with the drive is not the best.

Is it possible that a "bad" eSATA cable could have caused the reboot, and if I replace the cable, will I lose any recordings (the Moxi's internal storage was 22% full before I added the drive, and I do not know if any new recordings have been stored on the external hard drive)?
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post #1993 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 02:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Audio5oh View Post

Has anybody had any problems with their cablecards not working properly with the Moxi box, example, dropped channels, losing channels or other issues?

CableCards either work or they don't. If it installed fine it will stay that way unless it develops a fault.

Now a tuning adapter is totally at the mercy of whatever random update TWC decide to send it. That's when all of the above happen.


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post #1994 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 07:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teeitup View Post

I have the two tuner so someone else may be able to answer better for the three tuner. But the "Jump" button on the Moxi remote will cycle between the 2-tuners keeping the buffer on each channel. If one of the tuners is tied up recording a program, the "Jump" button will act like a "recall" or "last" channel button using a single tuner. It seems to me that Moxi tried to make it simple for the average user so you are not thinking about which tuner you are using. This Moxi remote also has a "live TV" button.

That is counter intuitive to those coming from cable co DVRs... their jump button swaps channels on the same tuner. To access each tuner, one has to use the PIP mode. Which does follow logically.

Time Warner NYC (Man North Head End) - 8742HD DVR ODN 5.2.0_9

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post #1995 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 07:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Operon View Post

And the next thing you know you're stepping off the plane in Pine Grove, Mississippi and rooming with Tiger.



If there are no text messages, there is nothing to worry about, lol.

But seriously, I think that is a valid question since I am looking at a 3-tuner and a 2-tuner with a mate. Which tuners/buffers will the mate use and can I set it to use only one?
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post #1996 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMoxiGuy View Post

It is really hard to describe the function of the Moxi button in a few words, but you can think of it as a back or “Home” button. It generally takes you back one major step in navigation. However, if you're in the channel guide, or anywhere on the main horizontal Moxi menu, pushing the Moxi button will take you to the current channel in the guide.


To further pile on about this topic, to which VisionOn and others have espoused on, I have to say that lack of a easy, clear explanation as to the function of a *critical* button is proof of really poor design... and I'm really at a loss to understand why this is hard for you (Moxi/Arris) to admit?

I get how it works - I do. But my wife, child nor any guest(no matter how bright) will not; and despite my understanding of it, I do not know what state it may be in when control of the remote changes hands. Therefore, I can never be sure what exactly will happen when I pick up the remote and press that darned button, nor might I be able to tell someone else what will happen. Besides, the idea that the single most common function of modern tv viewing (channel browsing/changing) should be a dynamic, changing procedure is just absurd and indefensible.

I'm confident that anybody who teaches Industrial Design, Ergonomics, or Software Development would give this function a big, fat "F". I'm also certain that a poll of actual Moxi owners - those of use who've already peeled off real money for your product, would vote this thing down by a 90% margin if we could (my apologies to you 10%).

TV remotes have been in common use for 30 years or so, and right or wrong, there are some generally agreed upon standards - why does Moxi feel the need to reinvent this particular wheel? (yes, I realize that channel guides are much newer - but it's the point that matters) Is there a nouvelle design philosophy at the Moxi Campus so deeply ingrained in the Engineering group that will not allow its principles to be compromised?


Mr. Moxi Guy - I love the Moxi; I really do, but can you convince me that the behaviour of the Moxi button is reasonable, justified, and preferential to the basic "take me to the channel guide", as I believe the vast majority of human beings and other sentient creatures expect? Can you at least try? 'cuz I'm open to persuasion - I just can't convince myself that it isn't something to be loudly protested!
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post #1997 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MitchTheD View Post

To further pile on about this topic, to which VisionOn and others have espoused on, I have to say that lack of a easy, clear explanation as to the function of a *critical* button is proof of really poor design... and I'm really at a loss to understand why this is hard for you (Moxi/Arris) to admit?

I get how it works - I do. But my wife, child nor any guest(no matter how bright) will not; and despite my understanding of it, I do not know what state it may be in when control of the remote changes hands. Therefore, I can never be sure what exactly will happen when I pick up the remote and press that darned button, nor might I be able to tell someone else what will happen. Besides, the idea that the single most common function of modern tv viewing (channel browsing/changing) should be a dynamic, changing procedure is just absurd and indefensible.

I'm confident that anybody who teaches Industrial Design, Ergonomics, or Software Development would give this function a big, fat "F". I'm also certain that a poll of actual Moxi owners - those of use who've already peeled off real money for your product, would vote this thing down by a 90% margin if we could (my apologies to you 10%).

TV remotes have been in common use for 30 years or so, and right or wrong, there are some generally agreed upon standards - why does Moxi feel the need to reinvent this particular wheel? (yes, I realize that channel guides are much newer - but it's the point that matters) Is there a nouvelle design philosophy at the Moxi Campus so deeply ingrained in the Engineering group that will not allow its principles to be compromised?


Mr. Moxi Guy - I love the Moxi; I really do, but can you convince me that the behaviour of the Moxi button is reasonable, justified, and preferential to the basic "take me to the channel guide", as I believe the vast majority of human beings and other sentient creatures expect? Can you at least try? 'cuz I'm open to persuasion - I just can't convince myself that it isn't something to be loudly protested!

I totally agree. I think the issue Moxi has with changing anything is that they feel that if it won an emmy it must be perfect. I believe that the when the interface was up for emmy nomination they submitted a video of the interface and that the emmy judges didn't actually have to use it. In a prepared video it is easy to make sure you don't show someone stumbling around the interface.

There are a few other areas where the interface is clumsy. Sometimes to enter into an option you can hit the right arrow. Sometimes it doesn't work. Make it work the same way every time! To see content on a DLNA server you have to hit OK to select the server and then once you have selected the server you are better off hitting the right arrow to navigate through the content. Pretty much every time I connect to a DLNA server I cursor down to it and then hit right arrow to select it which doesn't work!
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post #1998 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 08:12 AM
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I'm surprise at the amount of hate over a button! It must really be bad...
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post #1999 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Jon_c View Post

I'm surprise at the amount of hate over a button! It must really be bad...

It's just a really stupid design which would be easy to fix. They probably feel that they can't fix it because existing customers are used to how things work.
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post #2000 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 08:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Jon_c View Post

I'm surprise at the amount of hate over a button! It must really be bad...

Actually, I really do not think it is bad. I never think twice about it and I get use to it.

If I need to get to the menus, I hit the Moxi button, and then I scrolled through the cards to get to what I need. What is hard about that?
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post #2001 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acaoacao View Post

Actually, I really do not think it is bad. I never think twice about it and I get use to it.

If I need to get to the menus, I hit the Moxi button, and then I scrolled through the cards to get to what I need. What is hard about that?

It's not an issue of hard, it's an issue of speed and usefulness and making a button perform more presses than it needs to.

There is nothing "hard" about using any aspect of the Moxi, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved. That's why the grid guide exists, why the recording options are now in the recording list, why default series recording settings are in place now, etc. etc. There's nothing hard about managing recordings on the main unit instead of a Mate but that doesn't mean they shouldn't add that capability to the Mate to make it faster and more convenient.

In UI design you are supposed to eliminate unnecessary button presses to achieve the result and the Moxi button just adds them. The Moxi button repeats the functions of other buttons while failing to fulfill a role that no other button does - going straight to the channel list every time.


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post #2002 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 09:04 AM
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I've had my moxi for a week now and generally like it. However has anyone from moxi had to tell their families how to access the channel guide?? I mean really???

I still can't explain it. Why on earth would you have to push that diamond shaped button TWICE to get the guide??
And then sometimes when you press the MOXI button you get the guide and other times you don't?

I am not an idiot but this I cannot fathom. It is annoying beyond belief. A DVR has two functions. Watching TV live, for which you need a GUIDE button, and watching recorded shows, for which you need a SEPERATE button.
ANYTHING else is just fluff.

Truly you could take away all the other menus and features and I would be happy with a guide and my recorded shows.

How hard is that to understand?
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post #2003 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 09:05 AM
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Moxi Mate - Desired Features
-------------------------------------------

1 - Delete Moxi DVR shows from the Mate.

2 - Schedule Moxi DVR shows from the Mate.

3 - Implement Channel Grid Display on the Mate.
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post #2004 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 09:08 AM
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arghhhhh

Moxie bundles not shipping 'til next week. Which means I probably won't have them by next weekend. Which means I have to do yard work!!!!! Damn you Moxi and your high demand.

aaaarghhhhhh

Dave
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post #2005 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by kinsale View Post

I still can't explain it. Why on earth would you have to push that diamond shaped button TWICE to get the guide??

You would still need to press a button twice to get the grid guide purely because of the limitations of the original Moxi remote - the grid was a later addition to the Moxi. However, if they made the Moxi button go straight to the channel list every time and do nothing else then they could map the grid guide to that button and it would make far more sense.

Press Moxi once - current channel in list view
Press Moxi twice - current channel in grid view


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post #2006 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VisionOn View Post

You would still need to press a button twice to get the grid guide purely because of the limitations of the original Moxi remote - the grid was a later addition to the Moxi. However, if they made the Moxi button go straight to the channel list every time and do nothing else then they could map the grid guide to that button and it would make far more sense.

Press Moxi once - current channel in list view
Press Moxi twice - current channel in grid view

What would be better yet is if there is a setting in the moxi ui that allows you to choose what you want to use as the grid. Then press moxi once and it will give you your default, press it twice and it switches to the secondary.
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post #2007 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Derrick2020 View Post

What would be better yet is if there is a setting in the moxi ui that allows you to choose what you want to use as the grid. Then press moxi once and it will give you your default, press it twice and it switches to the secondary.

The only problem with that is then you have no jump directly to the main menu apart from the record list button.


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post #2008 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 10:44 AM
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I would think most Moxi users would be more frustrated by more important things than the fact you have to press the diamond button twice to get to the grid guide.

How about the fact the Moxi isn't more responsive when pressing the remote? I have had 4 Moxi's in my possession total now, and I can tell you each one acted the same when it comes to responding to the remote control. I would rate the responsiveness as very weak.

Often, especially when pressing the skip forward button (I have it set to skip forward 30 seconds at a time), the Moxi doesn't respond. Often, I have to it again. And I have to press hard.

Also, how about that I have had two Moxi's with hard drive problems right away? Yes, Moxi is at the mercy of Seagate when it comes to the health of the hard drives, but there has to be a better way for Moxi to handle the testing of these drives prior to them shipping the units?

And what about the many software bugs that Moxi should have ironed out months ago...such as the one where the Settings Menu disappears after doing Channel Mapping? I had to report this to Moxi last month, yet this bug has been around for a long time.

Is Moxi truly testing every aspect of their software and hardware? From my experience, the answer is absolutely not.

I love the Moxi and I love their customer service. What I want, though, is better quality control/testing when it comes to the hardware and software.

Oh, and I don't mind pressing the Diamond button twice to get to the grid guide. It's like double-clicking a Desktop icon on my computer.
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post #2009 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midas89 View Post

I would think most Moxi users would be more frustrated by more important things than the fact you have to press the diamond button twice to get to the grid guide.

How about the fact the Moxi isn't more responsive when pressing the remote? I have had 4 Moxi's in my possession total now, and I can tell you each one acted the same when it comes to responding to the remote control. I would rate the responsiveness as very weak.

Often, especially when pressing the skip forward button (I have it set to skip forward 30 seconds at a time), the Moxi doesn't respond. Often, I have to it again. And I have to press hard.

Also, how about that I have had two Moxi's with hard drive problems right away? Yes, Moxi is at the mercy of Seagate when it comes to the health of the hard drives, but there has to be a better way for Moxi to handle the testing of these drives prior to them shipping the units?

And what about the many software bugs that Moxi should have ironed out months ago...such as the one where the Settings Menu disappears after doing Channel Mapping? I had to report this to Moxi last month, yet this bug has been around for a long time.

Except not everyone has those issues, including myself. Whereas everyone has to deal with the same GUI.

As for software bugs I cannot remember the last time I saw one in daily use at all. The channel mapping problem you've seen isn't going to be experienced by the majority because most use a CC and mapping isn't relevant. I never encountered it when I was using the Moxi for a week without a CC so it could be a recent development.


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post #2010 of 6304 Old 03-19-2010, 11:10 AM
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For those that are frustrated by the remote, has anyone found a good way to get the behavior you really want with a Universal remote (Harmony, etc.)?
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